Marcus
Topic Author
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SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Tue Jan 09, 2007 8:44 am

When Volaris started their shuttle service from TIJ to SAN, OK not really SAN but the Santa Fe train depot in downtown San Diego a 5 minute drive from SAN; I was sure they would soon start services from TIJ to other more apealling destinations to potential passengers north of the border.......and sure enough TIJ-SJD service is to start on February 8th, with fares of about $250RT with all taxes included, does anyone know the loads of AM's SAN-SJD service? are we to see a fare drop on this route from AM? would SAN travellers be willing to take the shuttle to TIJ in order to save some money?

www.volaris.com.mx

[Edited 2007-01-09 00:46:20]
Kids!....we are going to the happiest place on earth...TIJUANA! signed: Krusty the Clown
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Tue Jan 09, 2007 8:47 am

Quoting Marcus (Thread starter):
When Volaris started their shuttle service from TIJ to SAN, OK not really SAN but the Santa Fe train depot in downtown San Diego a 5 minute drive from SAN; I was sure they would soon start services from TIJ to other more apealling destinations to potential passengers north of the border.......and sure enough TIJ-SJD service is to start on February 8th, with fares of about $250RT with all taxes included, does anyone know the loads of AM's SAN-SJD service? are we to see a fare drop on this route from AM? would SAN travellers be willing to take the shuttle to TIJ in order to save some money?

San Diego pax have no interest in using the TJ airport in a meaningful way. There was a survey done on this about a year ago.
 
Bicoastal
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Tue Jan 09, 2007 10:01 am

Quoting Marcus (Thread starter):
would SAN travellers be willing to take the shuttle to TIJ in order to save some money?

Airline passengers are notoriously cheap. If they can get what they think is a cheap fare, they will ignore the costs of time and travel to a distant airport in order to save $10.

Get used to TIJ. San Diegans need to and will get over their predjudices. Viva mis compadres Mexicanos! TIJ is San Diego's additional, not replacement, airport of the future.
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DCAYOW
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Tue Jan 09, 2007 12:49 pm

Quoting Bicoastal (Reply 2):
Airline passengers are notoriously cheap. If they can get what they think is a cheap fare, they will ignore the costs of time and travel to a distant airport in order to save $10.

However, once they realize that they have to buy a $20 interior Mex visa (which is generally included in fares from SAN) before they can leave TIJ for SJD - it may not seem so attractive after all.

The problem with the Volaris scenario is the person who lives in Encinitas will have to drive (and park) at Santa Fe station (where do you do this?). Then take the dedicated Volaris bus to TIJ airport. Those two steps will result in a lot more time it takes to drive and park at SAN and then step on the plane.

On the way home, you will arrive at TIJ, wait for the bus. Bus goes through border crossing, you get off schlep your bags from the bus walk through the immigration / customs turnstyle and then get back on the bus to arrive at Santa Fe station to get your car to drive back to Encinitas. This is BIG hassle to the average Cabo pax.

I am not saying you won't get some people taking it, but it requires Volaris invest money in educating the average SAN passenger how the process works and the process is more complex than the average pax is willing to learn.
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DCAYOW
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Tue Jan 09, 2007 12:51 pm

Loads on SAN-SJD as follows:

Annual LFs...

Alaska: 79% (includes some through pax)
Aeromexico: 78%
America West: 71%
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juventus
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Tue Jan 09, 2007 1:06 pm

Vey important month for Volaris. in January 2007, Volaris takes delivery of 8 Airbuses. They will increase services on excisting routes and open new routes. Starting to look like Volaris will become the premier LCC airline in Mexico.

Its usually the Mexican inmigrants who drive to TIJ for a cheaper fare.
 
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SANFan
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Tue Jan 09, 2007 7:05 pm

It will be interesting to see how the TIJ-SJD flight does. Seems to me that's the first such service (or at least the first in quite some time) so apparently AM didn't see much potential for it.

I don't think it will pull much away from the SAN flights. I used to have many clients who would regularly make their way to LAX for flights (both domestic and int'l) that were slightly less than from SAN but very few would want to deal with the int'l border crossing unless they had to (i.e., the only flights to their destination in Mexico were from TIJ.)

bb
 
wedgetail737
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Tue Jan 09, 2007 10:09 pm

Quoting Bicoastal (Reply 2):
Get used to TIJ. San Diegans need to and will get over their predjudices. Viva mis compadres Mexicanos! TIJ is San Diego's additional, not replacement, airport of the future.

Given the fact that the US Government will require a passport to enter the US...will that affect this approach, since it's another pain in the butt process on the burden of passengers?
 
Bicoastal
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Tue Jan 09, 2007 11:14 pm

Quoting Wedgetail737 (Reply 7):
Given the fact that the US Government will require a passport to enter the US...will that affect this approach

No. We put up with government requirements every day of our life. If people
don't have the where with all or organizational ability to get a passport before a trip, then I don't have much sympathy. Travel to most parts of the world and you're constantly whipping out your passport. If the demand and need develops at TIJ, market forces will do what it takes to make it work and be accessible....and get the money flowing.
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EddieDude
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Wed Jan 10, 2007 1:15 am

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 1):
San Diego pax have no interest in using the TJ airport in a meaningful way.

If a San Diego passenger needs to fly to a city within Mexico that is not served non-stop from SAN by AM, but that is served non-stop from TIJ by Volaris or A Volar, I am sure he/she will opt to cross the border to TIJ and take the Volaris or A Volar flight. The other options are probably less appealing and definitely more expensive: flying SAN-LAX-XXX, SAN-DFW-XXX, SAN-IAH-XXX or SAN-MEX-XXX.

On the other hand, someone wondered if this might steal sales from AM's flights to SAN and I am sure this is the case. Many people I know don't mind flying to TIJ where they take a cab or have a driver waiting for them to take them to SAN.
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Wed Jan 10, 2007 6:44 am

Quoting Bicoastal (Reply 2):
Get used to TIJ. San Diegans need to and will get over their predjudices. Viva mis compadres Mexicanos! TIJ is San Diego's additional, not replacement, airport of the future.



Quoting Bicoastal (Reply 8):
No. We put up with government requirements every day of our life. If people
don't have the where with all or organizational ability to get a passport before a trip, then I don't have much sympathy. Travel to most parts of the world and you're constantly whipping out your passport. If the demand and need develops at TIJ, market forces will do what it takes to make it work and be accessible....and get the money flowing.

You're really out of touch on this issue. Enjoy your sustainable two airport SAN and Miramar airport system in 20 years.

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 9):
If a San Diego passenger needs to fly to a city within Mexico that is not served non-stop from SAN by AM, but that is served non-stop from TIJ by Volaris or A Volar, I am sure he/she will opt to cross the border to TIJ and take the Volaris or A Volar flight. The other options are probably less appealing and definitely more expensive: flying SAN-LAX-XXX, SAN-DFW-XXX, SAN-IAH-XXX or SAN-MEX-XXX.

AM will add flights to SAN which will be a deterant. AM can draw higher yields from SAN and going across the border to save a buck or two isn't worth the time and energy spent to the US traveler.

[Edited 2007-01-09 22:46:54]
 
PanAm747
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Wed Jan 10, 2007 7:07 am

TIJ has flights to virtually all parts of Mexico, so for those Americans flying to the interior (to places not served from SAN), TIJ is a very viable option.

But for those travelling to the beaches of Puerta Vallarta or San Jose del Cabo, SAN will be the preferred option. Why? The joy of crossing the border at San Ysidro or Otay mesa. Into Mexico isn't usually a huge back-up (unless it's a holiday weekend), but coming back is usually a nightmare.

Unless there's a VERY significant cost savings for tourists, don't expect to see throngs of tourists at TIJ.
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EddieDude
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Wed Jan 10, 2007 7:22 am

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 10):
AM will add flights to SAN which will be a deterant. AM can draw higher yields from SAN

Will they really? I think their strategy at SAN has been rather erratic up until now, and I do not think they have big plans for that station. If they want to grow in the U.S. there are several other cities that offer better prospects. I think we will continue to see seasonal non-stop service between MEX and SAN (not daily) plus flights originating in MEX with stopovers at SJD and PVR... that's it.

Of all the battles that AM has to fight against Mexican low cost carriers, SAN does not seem to be one they want to spend energy on.
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
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SANFan
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Wed Jan 10, 2007 8:23 am

Unfortunately, I don't think SAN can ever count on any consistency out of AM -- hasn't happened in the past and I don't count on it in the future. Here we are in the dead of winter (I can tell 'cause the temp in SAN dropped below 70 the other day!) and where is AM's PVR flight? Loreto? Service disappeared during 2006, as did the MEX n/s (it barely reappeared before the year ended and appears to be gone again just in time for Spring...)

The one bright ray has been SJD (which, coincidentally, AM does NOT serve from TIJ) flying daily now for many years. Plus, they go head-to-head with AS's daily shot and, well who knows, HP/US and their rapidly disappearing entry into the SAN-Mexico market. And I again say that I don't think the Volaris service out of TIJ will affect anything from SAN.

So out of all of the Mexican market possibilities, there is one that has real competition with both a US and a Mexican carrier flying daily and with very decent loads. But not MEX, not GDL, not PVR, not MZT. Go figure...

bb
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Wed Jan 10, 2007 8:31 am

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 12):
Will they really? I think their strategy at SAN has been rather erratic up until now, and I do not think they have big plans for that station.

Stay tuned.
 
EddieDude
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Wed Jan 10, 2007 8:39 am

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 14):
Stay tuned.

It will be a very pleasant and welcome surprise if AM designs and implements a more aggressive -but especially a winning- strategy at SAN. I will indeed stay tuned Boeing7E7... and you keep us informed of any info you come across please! Sadly, many of us are skeptic and we believe AM will conform itself with being a niche player as SANFan eloquently put it.
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
DCAYOW
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Wed Jan 10, 2007 11:55 am

Quoting SANFan (Reply 13):
Loreto?

The SAN-LTO route has been transferred to Aerolitoral. They had to go through the bureaucratic process of switching the authority from Aeromexico to Aerolitoral with the DOT. They should be inserting ERJ service into schedule soon. But then again - who knows when?
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Marcus
Topic Author
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:21 am

I agree that getting accross the border is a pain in the a$$ most of the time, so this is definetly a deterrent for people from SAN to use TIJ......but everytime I fly out of TIJ (every 2 weeks) I not only see the locals and Mexicans living in the US using the airport, but the number of US nationals is definetly more than what it used to be.

I guess we will see how the loads turn out on this route, maybe Volaris is going after the local TIJ market and not neccesarily the SAN, since there are no TIJ-SJD flights only SAN-SJD, locals from TIJ do not really visit SJD that often, people preffer to go to MZT, CUN and PVT.

$10US for a RT ticket TIJ-SJD..............not bad at all.

[Edited 2007-01-10 17:28:31]
Kids!....we are going to the happiest place on earth...TIJUANA! signed: Krusty the Clown
 
ptugarin
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:37 am

Off-topic, but figured it's better to ask here than start another thread:
I am planning a road trip TIJ - MEX, and then would like to fly MEX - CUN, should I book my flight now (for March 14) or wait until I am in Mexico? Looks like fares are between 130 (Aerolineas Azteca) and 200 (Aeromexico) right now.
 
EddieDude
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Thu Jan 11, 2007 3:44 am

Are those numbers for one-way or return flights? In any case, book now! Check out Volaris and Interjet ex-TLC too.
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
Marcus
Topic Author
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Thu Jan 11, 2007 4:03 am

It.....WAS.......RT, I logged in again and the seats at that rate already ran out......it is now back to $250RT with all taxes included.

I will go and kick myself in the head now.....don't wait up.
Kids!....we are going to the happiest place on earth...TIJUANA! signed: Krusty the Clown
 
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SANFan
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Thu Jan 11, 2007 5:33 am

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 14):
Stay tuned.

Aw, come on now 7E7, that's not fair!  crying  It sure sounds like you know something. As Eddie said, please keep us all informed as soon as you can.

Seriously, as I've commented before here on A.net, there are many disappointments in the SD aviation scene. But to me, the poor, sketchy Mexican service history has been amongst the worst.

Since the days of Western's beautiful daily 720B n/s to MEX (at least into the early 80s), our service to Mexico has had lots of potential but little else. When I think of SEA and its gateway status to Alaska and the Orient and Florida as a Caribbean gateway, I keep wondering how those in charge of marketing and route procurement (at the Port District and/or Lindbergh) let Mexico completely get away!

I realize we've had TIJ as competition, the geography is different than the examples mentioned above, and of course there's always the LAX-factor, but still, we should have more to show than we do today. There is, after all, a huge Hispanic population in SD and the int'l border crossing, especially these days, is at best an inconvenience, at worst, a nightmare -- real in many cases and just perceived in others -- which a LOT of people just don't want to deal with.

7E7, you've given me a bit of hope that some of this is going to be fixed. All I ask is for someone (Mexican cx, US cx, or both?) start something decent with reasonable pricing, and just give it a chance! If it still doesn't work, OK, at least a real attempt was made and I was just wrong...

7E7, this is me staying tuned:  hyper 

bb
 
juventus
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Thu Jan 11, 2007 6:19 am

Quoting SANFan (Reply 21):
course there's always the LAX-factor

this is a huge factor. Cheaper fares and many more choices, its worth the 2 hour drive.
 
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SANFan
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RE: SAN-TIJ Shuttle And New Flight To Cabo

Thu Jan 11, 2007 8:08 am

Quoting Juventus (Reply 22):
Quoting SANFan (Reply 21):
course there's always the LAX-factor...

This is a huge factor. Cheaper fares and many more choices, its worth the 2 hour drive.

Absolutely correct, Juventus. My point is that it wasn't always that way; years ago SAN should have worked harder to get a lot of those flights from Lindbergh instead. (Altho I think that 2 hour drive is dangerously close to a 3 hour drive these days PLUS parking, PLUS 2-3 hour advance check-in...)  Wink

bb

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