blast
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AF Or KL First With The 787

Thu Jan 11, 2007 5:52 am

Who could be the most likely one to order/operate the 787 first? KLM, or Air France? KLM haven't placed any orders so far. However, I definitely see them ordering the Dreamliner in the future. At the same time, Air France have operated Boeings for a long time as well. They seem to have an order policy which defies the (possibly huge) pressure to order Airbus only. So they are a likely candidate for the 787 in my view. Does anybody know more, or have ideas on this issue?

By the way, I did a little search, couldn't find any related topics/threads..

Korneel
 
OHLHD
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RE: AF Or KL First With The 787

Thu Jan 11, 2007 5:55 am

Maybe neither of them.....  Yeah sure
 
NYC777
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RE: AF Or KL First With The 787

Thu Jan 11, 2007 6:28 am

I think both are excellent prospective 787 operators.
That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
 
ebj1248650
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RE: AF Or KL First With The 787

Thu Jan 11, 2007 6:33 am

Quoting Blast (Thread starter):
Who could be the most likely one to order/operate the 787 first? KLM, or Air France? KLM haven't placed any orders so far. However, I definitely see them ordering the Dreamliner in the future. At the same time, Air France have operated Boeings for a long time as well. They seem to have an order policy which defies the (possibly huge) pressure to order Airbus only. So they are a likely candidate for the 787 in my view. Does anybody know more, or have ideas on this issue?

By the way, I did a little search, couldn't find any related topics/threads..

Korneel

KLM would replace 767s with Dreamliners, but what would Air France replace with them?
Dare to dream; dream big!
 
LY777
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RE: AF Or KL First With The 787

Thu Jan 11, 2007 6:35 am

KL 767s are already replaced by A332s, am I wrong?
Flown:A3B2,A320,A321,A332,A343,A388,717,727,732,734,735,738,73W,742/744/748,752,762/2ER/763/3ER,772/77E/773/77W,D8,D10,L
 
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TK787
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RE: AF Or KL First With The 787

Thu Jan 11, 2007 6:38 am

Quoting LY777 (Reply 4):
KL 767s are already replaced by A332s, am I wrong?

Actually some are still flying the JFK-AMS route.
 
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Stitch
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RE: AF Or KL First With The 787

Thu Jan 11, 2007 6:40 am

Quoting EBJ1248650 (Reply 3):
KLM would replace 767s with Dreamliners, but what would Air France replace with them?

The 787-8 would make an excellent A332 replacement for AF.
The 787-9 would make an excellent A343 replacement for AF.
The 787-10 would make an excellent 772ER replacement for AF.

Quoting LY777 (Reply 4):
KL 767s are already replaced by A332s, am I wrong?

KL does have six A332s in service or on order with five 763ERs, so that may be the case... The 787-9 and 787-10 would work as a 772ER replacement, however...
 
paneuropean
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RE: AF Or KL First With The 787

Thu Jan 11, 2007 8:17 am

Quoting Stitch (Reply 6):
KL does have six A332s in service or on order with five 763ERs, so that may be the case... The 787-9 and 787-10 would work as a 772ER replacement, however...

First widebody to be replaced by KL is the M11 which will be in service at least until 2012.

I doubt it that KLM either Air France will order the 787 soon. Probably the 350 is an aircraft more likely to be ordered.
 
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Stitch
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RE: AF Or KL First With The 787

Thu Jan 11, 2007 12:06 pm

Quoting Paneuropean (Reply 7):
I doubt it that KLM either Air France will order the 787 soon. Probably the 350 is an aircraft more likely to be ordered.

I am inclined to believe that it will depend, especially in AF's case, how well the A350X compares to the 787 (especially once the 787 enters service and starts to improve) and how bad waiting for the A350X hurts profits and marketshare against 787-operating competitors vs. what the A350X will bring to the table.
 
runway23
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RE: AF Or KL First With The 787

Thu Jan 11, 2007 12:12 pm

Any longhaul aircraft order for AF/KL will be done as a group. You won't see one part order an A350 and the other 787.

AFKL aren't in a hurry to order a longhaul replacement as their respective fleets are still quite young. I am sure they are looking into both aircraft and probably have a good idea of which one is more suitable.
 
blast
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RE: AF Or KL First With The 787

Fri Jan 12, 2007 3:30 am

Thanks all for your insights!

Quoting Paneuropean (Reply 7):
First widebody to be replaced by KL is the M11

This would make sense.
But as for AF, I am not familiar enough with their operations as to see how the 787 or the A350 would fit in to their network.

Quoting Runway23 (Reply 9):
Any longhaul aircraft order for AF/KL will be done as a group

Is this really true already?
 
paneuropean
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RE: AF Or KL First With The 787

Fri Jan 12, 2007 6:45 am

Quoting Blast (Reply 10):
Is this really true already?

Not sure, but it is much more efficient for both to standardise both fleets. This doesn't mean that they have to order aircraft at the same time.
If KL or AF will order the 787 either the A350 first, I don't really know. However, I guess KLM wouldn't be flying the A330 if it still were an independent airline.

At this moment I favour the Boeing 787, however the A 350 is winning more of my sympathy. Let's see.........

Quoting EBJ1248650 (Reply 3):
KLM would replace 767s with Dreamliners, but what would Air France replace with them?

KLM's replacement plan for the 767 is almost done. KLM will never use 5 widebody types at once, neither will Air France.

Air France has a few older A340' s to be replaced.
 
FCKC
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RE: AF Or KL First With The 787

Fri Jan 12, 2007 10:10 am

AF CEO told some weeks ago , both AF and KL are NOT in a hurry to order either 787 or A350XWB.
He just mentionned , that will probably be a common order.
I guess we should have to wait for 2008 to know the winner.......