8herveg
Topic Author
Posts: 1103
Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 2:01 am

Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Sun Jan 21, 2007 10:46 am

Does anyone know of any future long - haul expansion from Birmingham Airport, UK? (BHX). A few services were dropped to the US, either due to 911 or simply because of poor loads. Do you think there is a chance any of them will return? Particuarly the AA service to Chicago?

I would like to see the following services in the next few years:

American Airlines - New York (JFK), Chicago (Both with B757) - daily

US Airways - Philadelphia (B757) - 5 x weekly

Air Canada - Toronto (B762) - 5 x weekly

Virgin Atlantic - Orlando - 3/4 x weekly, Barbados - 2/3 x weekly (Both with A343)

Air India - Mumbai (B787, when it arrives!) - 3/4 x weekly

Pakistan International Airlines - Lahore, Karachi (Both with A310) - 3/4 x weekly

Qatar Airlines - Doha (A330) - daily


Anyone think any of these services could work?
 
bhxforever
Posts: 549
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2001 6:40 am

RE: Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Sun Jan 21, 2007 11:43 am

Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
American Airlines - New York (JFK), Chicago (Both with B757) - daily

I don't think we will be seeing AA back at BHX

Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
US Airways - Philadelphia (B757) - 5 x weekly

Possible, maybe summer 2008?

Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
Air Canada - Toronto (B762) - 5 x weekly

Not a chance

Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
Virgin Atlantic - Orlando - 3/4 x weekly, Barbados - 2/3 x weekly (Both with A343)

No chance direct, runway restrictions at BHX. Maybe an MCO service via another UK airport if the new GLA route is successful.

Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
Air India - Mumbai (B787, when it arrives!) - 3/4 x weekly

Very much doubt it, unless its a stopping off in BHX on the way over the atlantic. The current AI 777 service is bascially a glorified fuel stop with only around 30pax on average originating or destined for BHX.

Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
Pakistan International Airlines - Lahore, Karachi (Both with A310) - 3/4 x weekly

Tried and failed in the past.

Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
Qatar Airlines - Doha (A330) - daily

A matter of time...
 
PlymSpotter
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RE: Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Sun Jan 21, 2007 11:56 am

Quoting Bhxforever (Reply 1):
No chance direct, runway restrictions at BHX.

Yes, would be interesting seeing a A343 fueled up and full of pax trying to make it off from BHX during the summer...

Mahan Air may well be expanding it's current twice weekly route I have been told, it's almost always full with many pax continuing to India and Pakistan. Similarly, Air Slovakia I think are re-inventing themselves under a new owner so may add flights.

I'm surprised you say that the AI 777 has poor loads, several times I've got caught up with the pax coming off and there has been a lot more than 30 on all occasions, more like 100 at least. They have rights to the Birmingham-Toronto leg, so with fares being about £270rtn you have no chance of AC serving the same route as stated previously.

I think I recall that Jet Airways were interested in serving BHX, but I'm not sure if anything more will come of it, especially if they were thinking of using A343's.

Dan Smile
...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
 
LHRjc
Posts: 1348
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RE: Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Sun Jan 21, 2007 5:52 pm

Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
Virgin Atlantic - Orlando - 3/4 x weekly

There was also supposed to be a new start up airline called Flywho operating BHX - SFB with either an A300, Tristar or 767 IIRC but they seem to have disappeared off the face of the map in the last few months. They were investigated by BBC TV's Watchdog programme for selling tickets for a service that didn't exist. http://www.bbc.co.uk/consumer/tv_and..._and_travel/holiday_20061121.shtml

Presumably they did their research and thought there would be sufficient loads for a BHX - Florida route so maybe VS could make this work.

JC
"Our 319's are very reliable. They get fixed very quickly."
 
8herveg
Topic Author
Posts: 1103
Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 2:01 am

RE: Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Sun Jan 21, 2007 8:12 pm

Quoting Bhxforever (Reply 1):
Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
Virgin Atlantic - Orlando - 3/4 x weekly, Barbados - 2/3 x weekly (Both with A343)

No chance direct, runway restrictions at BHX.

How come? If a loaded (Emirates) B777 can take off, surely an A343 can?

Are BHX planning on extending the runway? Because not many long-haul carriers would be able to operate there and BHX will not be able to expand!
 
kaitak
Posts: 9033
Joined: Wed Aug 18, 1999 5:49 am

RE: Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Sun Jan 21, 2007 8:30 pm

The 777, being a twin engined aircraft, has very considerably better performance than the A340 (in fact, let's face it, almost anything has), but a twin engined aircraft must have better performance because if it has an engine failure on t/o, it will lost 50% of its power, whereas a quad will only lose a quarter of its power. Hence, twin engined aircraft will be able to use shorter runways than the four engined machines.

For this reason, I don't see 747s or A340s using Birmingham.

However, there is light at the end of the tunnel; with US carriers shifting more capacity onto European routes, I can see Delta flying its newly reconfigured ex-TWA 757s on European routes; if AA doesn't fly BOS-BHX or JFK-BHX, Delta could do so.

More Middle East flights are certainly a possibility; if not Qatar, then Etihad and it wouldn't surprise me if one of the new Indian airlines started flying to Birmingham - Jet has taken delivery of its first few A330s and Kingfisher is likely to do so soon (later this year); AI's 787s don't arrive until September of 2008.

So, don't be downcast, Birmingham! The future holds some very considerable riches to look forward to!
 
Humberside
Posts: 3224
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2006 12:44 am

RE: Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Sun Jan 21, 2007 9:14 pm

I think BHX is underserved for US flights. A second route would be good, ideally not to NYC to offer more choice for passengers

Quoting Bhxforever (Reply 1):
Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
Air Canada - Toronto (B762) - 5 x weekly

Not a chance

Air India, and to a lesser extent Air Transat and soon GSM, take care of that market

[Edited 2007-01-21 13:30:57]
Visit the Air Humberside Website and Forum
 
cardiffairtaxi
Posts: 298
Joined: Sun Mar 26, 2006 5:08 pm

RE: Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Sun Jan 21, 2007 9:37 pm

Quoting 8herveg (Reply 4):

I was thinking the same thing.
Just a query,how did the Highland Express 747's manage to take off fully laden???
 
User avatar
LHRBFSTrident
Posts: 555
Joined: Wed Nov 15, 2006 3:38 pm

RE: Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Mon Jan 22, 2007 5:52 am

Quoting Cardiffairtaxi (Reply 7):
Highland Express 747's manage to take off fully laden?

I don't think they were 'fully-laden' with fuel for the sector to PIK...
 
cardiffairtaxi
Posts: 298
Joined: Sun Mar 26, 2006 5:08 pm

RE: Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Mon Jan 22, 2007 6:01 am

Quoting LHRBFSTrident (Reply 8):

I thought they operated in from PIK?
 
David_itl
Posts: 5993
Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2001 7:39 am

RE: Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Mon Jan 22, 2007 6:05 am

They operated from STN. And had 1 weekly STN-BRU service I believe when they sent it to SN for maintenance.
 
rdwootty
Posts: 689
Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2005 4:28 am

RE: Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Mon Jan 22, 2007 6:14 am

I think it may be better to send all Long Haul flights from BHX to BHXeast (EMA) which has the runway and availability of landing slots!! (only joking but it does show that BHX should have extended the runway years ago as planned and sunk the Coventry road and all would be well. Since then loads of houses have been built in the area so they will all shout against it now.
 
Lite
Posts: 269
Joined: Wed Jan 03, 2007 1:53 am

RE: Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Thu Jan 25, 2007 4:56 am

Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
American Airlines - New York (JFK), Chicago (Both with B757) - daily

American Airlines' main reason for serving the UK's second city, Birmingham, was not only to expand their impressive network out of O'Hare, but also because British Airways were able to provide decent feeder services to fill up the flight, which over the years I flew on extensively with DC-10s and Boeing 767s, and I'm pretty sure the MD-11. The flights always did well, but AA's immediate decision to axe the route post-9/11 indicates the assets could have been better utilised elsewhere, and this seems to be the case. JFK was a BA route for a number of years on the B757, but Continental now seem to adequately serve this market from BHX into EWR.

Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
US Airways - Philadelphia (B757) - 5 x weekly

I don't really see what a Philadelphia route would bring to BHX that we can't already get through transferring at EWR. Five times weekly isn't frequent enough for a flight to a hub, though I do very much like their new livery, it's not enough reason for them to launch a flight! I can't imagine this is a big O&D market, and US already serves PHL well at Manchester.

Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
Air Canada - Toronto (B762) - 5 x weekly

Any Canadian expansion will be from either flyglobespan, Zoom or Air Transat. BHX is simply not on the radar for Air Canada, and doubt it will be.

Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
Air India - Mumbai (B787, when it arrives!) - 3/4 x weekly

With the large Asian population, flights to more Indian cities non-stop make a lot of sense, though I agree it would have to be part of a multi-stop trip to make it worthwhile.

Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
Pakistan International Airlines - Lahore, Karachi (Both with A310) - 3/4 x weekly

As above, hopefully the large Asian community might support such a route, and BHX management seem to have a good relationship with PIA.

Quoting 8herveg (Thread starter):
Qatar Airlines - Doha (A330) - daily

Highly touted route, Emirates have a real stranglehold on the Midlands - Middle East market and beyond, so can imagine Qatar wanting to cash in on it.
LCC Lover Lite
 
David_itl
Posts: 5993
Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2001 7:39 am

RE: Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Thu Jan 25, 2007 5:50 am

Quoting Lite (Reply 12):
which over the years I flew on extensively with DC-10s and Boeing 767s, and I'm pretty sure the MD-11

Don't think AA flew DC10s to BHX or MAN. I remember them using them at GLA as MAN once had one divert in from there. MD11s were MAN fare for a while.

Quoting Lite (Reply 12):
BHX is simply not on the radar for Air Canada, and doubt it will be.

It once was...1987 they operated YYZ-MAN-BHX 2 weekly! Never say never...
 
BHXFAOTIPYYC
Posts: 1442
Joined: Sat Jun 25, 2005 5:47 am

RE: Future Long - Haul Expansion From Birmingham, UK?

Thu Jan 25, 2007 6:07 am

This is a historical issue as well. Even though B'ham is the second largest city in the UK it is geographically too close to MAN and LON. The huge expansion at MAN and the LON airports in the 60s/70's just never happened at BHX.
Breakfast in BHX, lunch in FAO, dinner in TIP, baggage in YYC.

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