yhmfan
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Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 6:07 am

See link:

http://www.cnn.com/2007/TRAVEL/01/27/thailand.airport.ap/index.html

How is it that an Airport is deemed officially unsafe and yet the Government allows it to operate?
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PanAmOldDC8
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 6:30 am

Quoting Yhmfan (Thread starter):
How is it that an Airport is deemed officially unsafe and yet the Government allows it to operate?

If it was North America or Europe they would not be able to operate. However seeing it is Thailand, anything goes. It is a shame that they were so many cases of fraud, I am sure that some people there are very wealthy after this airport opens
Bangkok is a nice airport, the one I remember from 1965, when I went there on R&R from Vietnam
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zeke
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 7:04 am

Quoting Yhmfan (Thread starter):
How is it that an Airport is deemed officially unsafe and yet the Government allows it to operate?

I operated into BKK not long after it opened, I thought it was working very well. I never went out of the aircraft, so I cannot comment about inside the terminal, airside it seemed better than every airport I have operated into the USA.

Runway and taxiway works are common, every time I go to SIN more taxiway and runway works are in progress. Many of the newer airports in SE asia that have been built recently have experiences settling and cracks, we dont get the same sensational stories hitting the press about them.
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warreng24
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 9:00 am

Quoting PanAmOldDC8 (Reply 1):
Bangkok is a nice airport, the one I remember from 1965, when I went there on R&R from Vietnam

You were at the old airport. We're talking about the NEW airport that just opened.
 
PanAmOldDC8
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 9:14 am

Quoting Warreng24 (Reply 3):
You were at the old airport. We're talking about the NEW airport that just opened

Note my words"the one I remember". I didn't say anything about this one
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utapao
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 9:55 am

Sad thing is... despite all the people posting in here about the inside of the airport... especially those who have never transited or been within 1000 miles of Suvarnabhumi, on the inside it is a great airport.

Said it before, but been through there now 7 round trips, and it "ain't that bad" on the inside.

Taxiways.... aprons.... politicians buying swamp land... King Power... yada yada.... that should end up in a court of law, including bringing the biggest offender back from London, or wherever his multi-millions have enabled him to hide. People say "lack of restrooms" yet there are more there than Don Muang. Lack of facilities.. yet more "food options" than Don Muang.

History of this political fiasco will be interesting.
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malaysia
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 10:23 am

I entered Thailand 29 times at Don Muang, I still wonder when I will enter Thailand at Suvarnabhummi, that would be number 30.

Technically I landed at Don muang probably a lot more than 29 due to domestic flying, but 29 for entering the country.

I wonder if I will go to Suvarnabhummi soon maybe in 2-3 months if its open Big grin
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AirNZ
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 11:51 am

Quoting PanAmOldDC8 (Reply 1):
However seeing it is Thailand, anything goes

That's a bit of a brash, and somewhat, pointless statement. Why, because it's Thailand, do you assume 'anything goes'?????
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CX Flyboy
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 3:26 pm

I have both operated into the new airport, and flown in as a passenger several times and although there are teething problems, I would not even consider them to be anything more than that. At no time would the word unsafe even enter my mind. Yes several taxiways have been dug up for works but so what? As Zeke mentions this is not uncommon and although it is a bit silly that such a new airport should have these issues, I would definately not give them more than a passing thought. When compared to the old airport there is just no way that you cannot say that there has not been an improvement in all areas apart from the fact it is a fair distance from our crew hotel!
 
sqpax
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 4:14 pm

Here's a more succinct descripition of the Safety Certificate situation from today's "Bangkok Post"

http://bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/breakingnews.php?id=116356

More disturbing from today's "Post" is the following article suggesting that subsidence is occuring under the main terminal building

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/breakingnews.php?id=116365

On the outside, the airport appears to be a jewel. Stunning architecture, great facilities inside. I found immigration and baggage claim to be so much superior to the old airport at Don Muang. The issue of subsidence is, however, quite troublesome and I'm sure all the finger pointing will be in the direction of the deposed Mr. Thaksin and his regime.
"One night in Bangkok makes a hard man humble, not much between despair and ecstasy" - Murray Head 1984
 
malaysia
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 4:20 pm

Quoting Utapao (Reply 5):
that should end up in a court of law

I doubt it, especially with the Thai culture and corruption.

You could not even bring up a job discrimination suit in a Thai court of law.

No such laws for that.

Perhaps the court of law might be different if Isaan was a country itself though.
There Are Those Who Believe That There May Yet Be Other Airlines Who Even Now Fight To Survive Beyond The Heavens
 
PanAmOldDC8
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 7:16 pm

Quoting AirNZ (Reply 7):
That's a bit of a brash, and somewhat, pointless statement. Why, because it's Thailand, do you assume 'anything goes'?????

Yes
Barbados, CWC soon, can't wait
 
Elite
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 8:13 pm

I read in a TIME magazine that the workers within the airport were scared because there were "rumors" of rape and mugging in the areas where it is not well lit (there are many dark corners and places at BKK).
 
brettbrett21
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 10:34 pm

Quoting Elite (Reply 12):
I read in a TIME magazine that the workers within the airport were scared because there were "rumors" of rape and mugging in the areas where it is not well lit (there are many dark corners and places at BKK)

Oh, great! I'm planning on sleeping at BKK through the night until my connecting flight to Melbourne the next day, doesn't sound like too good a plan!
i'm so excited i wish i could wet my pants!
 
Pe@rson
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 10:41 pm

Flying into and out of BKK again tomorrow - seems like my millionth time in the last 3 months.

As a passenger, it does what I expect it to. I particularly liked how the gate worker took our boarding cards while we sat down (for BKK-SIN) rather than the normal queue-up. Never had that before.

[Edited 2007-01-28 14:42:57]
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cjh2007
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Sun Jan 28, 2007 11:45 pm

Hmmm... isn't Bangkok airport designed by the same planning firm that was also involved in designing and constructing Munich airport... at least i faintly recall something like this.

Anyways, I am not too pleased about these news, as I'm going to fly to Bangkok in the summer for a 3 night stopover, and was actually looking forward to the new airport after having been mildly disappointed by Don Muang.

Also, has anyone visited the star alliance/ LH or AUA business lounge in Suvarnabhumi? If so, how is the quality of these lounges...?
Furthermore I have a connection flight to Phuket after the three days of my visit in Bangkok, and i wondered if there was a separaterncheck in area dedicated only for premium passengers, after having readrnsuch on the Thai air website... "Royal First Class and Royal Silk Classrnpassengers for International flights should enter Entrance 1 forrncheck-in at Royal Orchid Premium area: Rows A-B"

Has anyone experienced these services, and if so, could you let me know if this really provides for shorter waiting times?

A lot of questions, i know... but I'm new here... and eager to learn  Smile

Thanks guys...

Yours Humbly,

Cjh
Is it the kerosene, or is it just me...
 
steeler83
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Mon Jan 29, 2007 1:29 am

I'll feel sorry for anyone who loses their landing gear on one of those cracks/holes... That has "equipment write off" written all over it!

I cannot comment on the aesthetics of the new facility, though, as I have not been there. I haven't even been out of North America for cryin out loud...
Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
 
777fan
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Mon Jan 29, 2007 2:34 am

I posted this blurb (with link) in the older BKK thread yesterday but nobody seemed to notice!

777fan

Quoting 777fan (Reply 33):
Wow! Things have really deteriorated (pardon the pun). Check out the pic on this CNN article from January 27th. Suvarnabhumi has been open for a matter of months and the taxiways are already buckling.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/TRAVEL/01/27/thailand.airport.ap/index.html


777fan
DC-8 61/63/71 DC-9-30/50 MD-80/82/83 DC-10-10/30 MD-11 717 721/2 732/3/4/5/G/8/9 741/2/4 752 762/3 777 A306/319/20/33 AT
 
cjh2007
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Mon Jan 29, 2007 2:54 am

Smells like corruption...

Cjh
Is it the kerosene, or is it just me...
 
goldorak
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Mon Jan 29, 2007 3:16 am

Hi everybody. I'm just coming back from BKK (1st time in Suvarnabhumi) and here's my experience/feeling to share with you. My routing was CDG-BKK on AF and then a few days later BKK-REP on PG, and finally straight REP-BKK-CDG (just connecting at BKK between PG and AF).
- I found the new airport very modern and very nice. The shopping area is huge and probably one of the best I know with SIN. AF and the other skyteam airlines use the skylounge which is very pleasant and well equipped for computers.
- immigration : although there were numerous counters open, it took forever to go through (about 1 hr). There were a lot of PAX but it was very long per passenger. I never waited so long at Don Muang. I thought may be it was related to the recent terrorist attacks in Bangkok.
- In general, signs really need to be improved. Everything is poorly indicated (eg, when you're just connecting and don't have yet your 2nd boarding pass and looking for the transfer desk and gate of your next flight, you have only screens for arriving flights (indicating bagage claim) but no screen for departing flights). So you may walk "kilometers" sometimes before realizing you're in the wrong direction.
- boardings are really messy (it reminded me CDG for a lot of things Big grin  Big grin ) due to a lack of space at the gates (the waiting area are designed for 100 to 200 pax) so when you board a full 744 with 400 pax...). It will be even worse with the A380. Also another thing which reminded me CDG : the boarding by bus !! For my flight BKK-REP, we boarded by bus to reach our PG B717 who was parked at another jetway at the other end of the terminal !! So we had to climb the stairs of the jetway to reach the A/C. On the way back, REP-BKK, we landed on one runway, then taxied during 15-20 minutes to the other end of the airfield, parked in the middle of nowhere and then we crossed again the entire airport with the bus to reach our arrival gate  banghead . It seems really strange that for a new airport, they are already short of gates with direct access to planes by jetways.

So that's my experience. Nice airport but need some improvements and some of them are not difficult to implement (signs, immigration, etc). I will be able to confirm or not this first impression very soon as I will stop again in BKK in april/may on my way to Vietnam (AF flights to HAN and SGN are making a stop in BKK)
Cheers
Goldorak
 
jfr
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Mon Jan 29, 2007 3:37 am

Quoting Cjh2007 (Reply 15):
Hmmm... isn't Bangkok airport designed by the same planning firm that was also involved in designing and constructing Munich airport... at least i faintly recall something like this.

Helmut Jahn was the architect for the "Munich Airport Center", and had nothing to do with the planning of the airport or the design of the terminal. His is the Air to Ground interface element: terminal to cars, trains, hotel, offices, etc.

He also designed the United Airlines terminal 1 at O'Hare and was architect for the American Airlines terminal at JFK until he was replaced. (The finished product at JFK bears no relation to his original design.

His company won the design at Suvarnabhumi as a partner in the MJTA Consortium: Murphy-Jahn / TAMS / ACT. The other two shortlisted firms were Aeroports de Paris and the Fentress Bradburn / McClier team which designed the Terminal at Incheon.
 
707lvr
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Mon Jan 29, 2007 4:05 am

The one safety standout in the article, ".. Safety Committee .." says it all. People who go in and review stuff and do reports LOVE committees, and you cannot have too many of them, or too many committee meetings either!

I'm not too sure about to impact of too-few restrooms and lumpy skybridges upon the safety of flight, but I'm sure there must be one.
 
sqpax
Posts: 73
Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2003 8:52 pm

RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Mon Jan 29, 2007 4:53 am

Quoting Goldorak (Reply 19):
It seems really strange that for a new airport, they are already short of gates with direct access to planes by jetways.

The CNN article at the beginning of this thread references 11 of the 51 gates being non-useable. As such, that results in a/c being parked at remote stands, a very common occurence in the past at DMK.
"One night in Bangkok makes a hard man humble, not much between despair and ecstasy" - Murray Head 1984
 
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OA260
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Mon Jan 29, 2007 5:26 am

It really is a total mess and embarrasement!!! This was tipped to be the flagship airport of Asia and all those ads on CNN and hype. If part of the Terminal is indeed sinking then it is a messy process and would require a shut down of the entire terminal and concrete being pumped under neath if that solution is viable!!! I bet loads of people have done very nicely out of it and their companies may not exist anymore!!!

Corruption is normal day life in Thailand but when it comes to thousands of people being at risk from possible danger due to bad workmanship and or short cuts then thats another story. Representatives from USA and EU aviation should be out there inspecting the airport and if it is deemed unsafe then US and EU carriers should suspend flights to it !!!

What if the building is unsafe and it collapses??? Or the runway causes a major accident with a loaded 747!!!!
 
6thfreedom
Posts: 2615
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Mon Jan 29, 2007 6:23 am

Quoting Cjh2007 (Reply 15):
"Royal First Class and Royal Silk Classrnpassengers for International flights should enter Entrance 1 forrncheck-in at Royal Orchid Premium area: Rows A-B"

Has anyone experienced these services, and if so, could you let me know if this really provides for shorter waiting times?

I used these facilties last week, and I must say, it seems to work.

Instad of having normal check in counters, TG pax sit down at the premium check in area, which the hole thing more relaxed. I didn't travel at the peak midnight time, but I think it worked well..
 
mham001
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RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Mon Jan 29, 2007 8:58 am

I had a transfer through it last month and the place is incredibly large. They warned us about the long walk and they weren't kidding. Don't plan on making tight connections, they will funnel you through every shop imaginable to get to your gate. Wear your walking shoes.
 
BigTom
Posts: 516
Joined: Sun Dec 10, 2006 6:51 pm

RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Mon Jan 29, 2007 11:38 pm

Thailand holidays face airport threat

http://www.theage.com.au/news/world/...reat/2007/01/29/1169919273221.html

Quote:
Cracks in the runway at Suvarnabhumi Airport, South-East Asia's biggest air hub, already a serious safety issue, could play holiday havoc with tourists arriving in Thailand.

With 11 of 51 gates at the new airport closed because of subsidence in aircraft parking areas, Transport Minister Thira Haocharoen announced last night he would seek cabinet approval to reopen the old airport for some domestic flights.

Domestic flights without direct international connections would return to Don Muang airport. But thousands of tourists who transit through Bangkok and use smaller airlines for connections to tourist spots such as Koh Samui, Luang Prabang in Laos and Siem Reap in Cambodia would have to battle Bangkok traffic for more than an hour between the two airports.

Bangkok Airways chief Prasert Prassarttong-Osoth told The Nation newspaper that the only way to fix the runway cracks would be to lay new foundations, at an estimated cost of 50 billion baht ($A1.9 billion).

The Government is keen to point out the airport can operate without the Aerodrome Certificate because Suvarnabhumi operates under a local licence. The certificate is a recent attempt by the International Civil Aviation Organisation to standardise airport operations around the world.

Looks like more problems
 
cjh2007
Posts: 247
Joined: Sun Jan 28, 2007 11:06 pm

RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Tue Jan 30, 2007 1:46 am

heres another link... god... the situation there seems to be pretty awefull

http://breakingnews.iol.ie/news/stor...island.asp?j=208658300&p=zx8659xx6
Is it the kerosene, or is it just me...
 
soups
Posts: 3220
Joined: Thu Jun 03, 2004 6:41 pm

RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Tue Jan 30, 2007 3:03 am

I hope it gets better cause im flying there in 11days and connecting on Tiger Airlines to SIN
Next destinations, Suarabaya, beirut, paris, Accra
 
Pe@rson
Posts: 16001
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2001 6:29 pm

RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Tue Jan 30, 2007 4:32 pm

Well, yesterday I flew PEN-BKK and connected with BKK-CNX. Flown to and from BKK a fair number of times in the past couple of months.

And I'm flying CNX-BKK tomorrow on OX - and hopefully I'll get one of their 742s.  Big grin

As well as the dire lack of chairs in public areas - not to mention at each gate - I was utterly surprised by there not being one cafe/coffee shop in the domestic airside area at BKK.

Quoting Soups (Reply 28):
I hope it gets better cause im flying there in 11days and connecting on Tiger Airlines to SIN

I flew BKK-SIN with TR on 22nd Dec.

[Edited 2007-01-30 08:47:28]
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
CX Flyboy
Posts: 6007
Joined: Sun Dec 26, 1999 6:10 pm

RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Wed Jan 31, 2007 12:03 am

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 29):
As well as the dire lack of chairs in public areas - not to mention at each gate - I was utterly surprised by there not being one cafe/coffee shop in the domestic airside area at BKK.

Actually there is quite a nice cafe in the area...next to Boots if my memory serves...opposite a shop selling magazines.
 
christao17
Posts: 902
Joined: Sun Apr 17, 2005 12:14 pm

RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Wed Jan 31, 2007 12:33 am

Quoting Malaysia (Reply 10):
I doubt it, especially with the Thai culture and corruption.

You could not even bring up a job discrimination suit in a Thai court of law.

No such laws for that.

You're painting with too broad a brush: You most certainly can sue for job discrimination in a Thai court of law, but only for the types of discrimination that are prohibited by Thai law. These laws, like those in most Asian countries, aren't as comprehensive as in North America and Europe.

Is your implication that "Thai culture and corruption" result in there being no justice? The current government has already started legal actions against members of the previous government who profited from corruption and investigations continue, including against former Prime Minister Thaksin.

Quoting Brettbrett21 (Reply 13):
Quoting Elite (Reply 12):
I read in a TIME magazine that the workers within the airport were scared because there were "rumors" of rape and mugging in the areas where it is not well lit (there are many dark corners and places at BKK)

Oh, great! I'm planning on sleeping at BKK through the night until my connecting flight to Melbourne the next day, doesn't sound like too good a plan!

Take that with a grain of salt. There were a few reports immediately after the airport opened of some construction workers accosting female employees. Security in those areas have been improved, including redesigning them so they are not isolated. You will be safe during your transit, I'm sure.

Quoting Cjh2007 (Reply 15):
Also, has anyone visited the star alliance/ LH or AUA business lounge in Suvarnabhumi? If so, how is the quality of these lounges...?

The THAI lounge, which serves as the Star Gold lounge, is nice. A bit dark for my taste and I think the food selection could be better, but it is modern, clean and comfortable.

Quoting Goldorak (Reply 19):
boardings are really messy (it reminded me CDG for a lot of things ) due to a lack of space at the gates (the waiting area are designed for 100 to 200 pax) so when you board a full 744 with 400 pax...). It will be even worse with the A380. Also another thing which reminded me CDG : the boarding by bus !! For my flight BKK-REP, we boarded by bus to reach our PG B717 who was parked at another jetway at the other end of the terminal !! So we had to climb the stairs of the jetway to reach the A/C. On the way back, REP-BKK, we landed on one runway, then taxied during 15-20 minutes to the other end of the airfield, parked in the middle of nowhere and then we crossed again the entire airport with the bus to reach our arrival gate . It seems really strange that for a new airport, they are already short of gates with direct access to planes by jetways.

Cracks in apron areas is forcing airlines to use remote stands or remote gates.

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 29):
As well as the dire lack of chairs in public areas - not to mention at each gate - I was utterly surprised by there not being one cafe/coffee shop in the domestic airside area at BKK.

There is a very nice food court in the domestic airside area at BKK; I ate there in November. In fact, it has a nice view of the large garden next to the main terminal. Sorry you missed it.

As for lack of chairs at each gate, I've flown through the airport a number of times and have yet to find a gate without enough chairs for the passengers.
Keeping the "civil" in civil aviation...
 
jfr
Posts: 136
Joined: Mon Feb 07, 2005 8:16 am

RE: Bangkok Airport Officially Unsafe

Wed Jan 31, 2007 3:39 am

Quoting 6thfreedom (Reply 24):
Quoting Cjh2007 (Reply 15):
"Royal First Class and Royal Silk Classrnpassengers for International flights should enter Entrance 1 forrncheck-in at Royal Orchid Premium area: Rows A-B"

Has anyone experienced these services, and if so, could you let me know if this really provides for shorter waiting times?

I used these facilties last week, and I must say, it seems to work.

Instad of having normal check in counters, TG pax sit down at the premium check in area, which the hole thing more relaxed. I didn't travel at the peak midnight time, but I think it worked well..

Thanks, I led the team that did the TG Premium facilities.

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