jimyvr
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Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 5:13 am

http://biz.yahoo.com/pz/070213/113682.html

Beginning in May, Delta will expand its summer schedule to include new nonstop service between Atlanta and:

* Fort Smith, Ark. (effective June 7)
* Halifax, Nova Scotia (effective June 7)
* Kalispell, Mont. (effective June 9)
* Newburgh, N.Y. (effective May 7)
* State College, Penn. (effective June 7)
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RL757PVD
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 5:19 am

Food news for small airports like FSM.... maybe TXK can be next
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
stirling
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 5:23 am

Quoting Jimyvr (Thread starter):
Fort Smith, Ark. (effective June 7)

Thats interesting....I'd heard that with XNA nearby, FSM had become almost a ghost town.
Are there incentives involved on this route?
Delete this User
 
RL757PVD
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 5:28 am

FSM does manage to hold their own with AA and NW (all RJ/S340's) providing a stable level of enplanements. I believe they had somewhere between 90,000 and 100,000 annual enplanements last year.

XNA probably doesnt pull that much because they dont have an LCC (yet)
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
PanAm747
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 5:31 am

Quote:
Thats interesting....I'd heard that with XNA nearby, FSM had become almost a ghost town.

That would probably have been from me here: http://www.airliners.net/discussions...eneral_aviation/read.main/3246825/

All the business traffic that is going to Northwest Arkansas heads to XNA and has left FSM almost a ghost town. Five daily round-trips to DFW and three a day to MEM is sad when compared to the explosive growth at XNA and even LIT down I-40.

I am glad that the market is there and that FSM will be connected to ATL - congratulations!!

You can also include to that the fact that FAT is getting 4x weekly service to ATL...temporarily (?) to test the waters.
Pan Am:The World's Most Experienced Airline - P(oor) S(ailor's) A(irline): San Diego's Hometown Airline-Catch Our Smile!
 
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deltadawg
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 5:58 am

Great News...at least for me. Direct service to FSM, fantastic. I have two customers right in Fort Smith, Planters & Hiram Walker. Now, if I could convince them that an MD-88 will be better than those d*mn CRJ's.
GO Dawgs, Sic' em, woof woof woof
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 6:13 am

Good news, 2 returning markets (FSM, SWF), and 2 new markets from ATL (FCA, YHZ). Though I'd bet $20 that once ATL-SCE starts, CVG-SCE will be history.
 
jetlanta
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 6:48 am

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 6):
Though I'd bet $20 that once ATL-SCE starts, CVG-SCE will be history.

You'd likely lose that bet. Unlike a lot of the other CVG markets added since 9/11, this one is actually good. The only reason you haven't seen ATL service prior (Like ERI and BGM) is because they didn't want to damage the strong performance at CVG.

No, this is a CVG bread and butter market now. I don't think it will be going anywhere.
 
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ERJ170
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 6:53 am

Quoting Jimyvr (Thread starter):
Beginning in May, Delta will expand its summer schedule to include new nonstop service between Atlanta and:

* Fort Smith, Ark. (effective June 7)
* Halifax, Nova Scotia (effective June 7)
* Kalispell, Mont. (effective June 9)
* Newburgh, N.Y. (effective May 7)
* State College, Penn. (effective June 7)

You forgot New Bern, NC (effective May 7)
Aiming High and going far..
 
OOer
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 7:59 am

What are they uaing on the ATL - FCA run? A CRJ-700/705 or an E170 or mainline?
 
Danairbus
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 8:11 am

Quoting OOer (Reply 9):
What are they uaing on the ATL - FCA run? A CRJ-700/705 or an E170 or mainline?

Boeing 737-800
 
Noise
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 8:20 am

Wow ATL-YHZ eh? With the CRJ-900! That's not a big market...hope it works!
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 8:25 am

Quoting Noise (Reply 11):
Wow ATL-YHZ eh? With the CRJ-900! That's not a big market...hope it works!

They could actually make this one work year around since DL has many more destinations and frequencies in the Caribbean than does AC or the charters. Just dealing with U.S. Customs enroute back to YHZ.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
jetlanta
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 10:16 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 12):
They could actually make this one work year around since DL has many more destinations and frequencies in the Caribbean than does AC or the charters. Just dealing with U.S. Customs enroute back to YHZ.

YHZ has U.S. Customs pre-clearance. It will be a fine market.
 
BigGSFO
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 10:23 am

Well I keep thinking there aren't many runways left east of the Mississippi that doesn't see DL/DL Connex. What's next? ATL-Target's parking lot?

It's an interesting study - the ATL hub has reached such a critical mass that very small communtities with virtually no O&D to the city of Atlanta itself will get non-stops.
 
Iloveboeing
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 10:26 am

I think they're restarting service to SWF in response to FL.
 
TokyoNarita
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 11:20 am

Halifax needs to be on a CRJ700. There is no way a CRJ200 can pull that trip. It does not have the range. Either way, it's a discustingly long way to be on n the regional jet.
 
Delta787
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:07 pm

Quoting TokyoNarita (Reply 16):
Halifax needs to be on a CRJ700. There is no way a CRJ200 can pull that trip. It does not have the range. Either way, it's a discustingly long way to be on n the regional jet.

Its on a CRJ900.
Fly Delta!
 
FATFlyer
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:24 pm

Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 14):
Well I keep thinking there aren't many runways left east of the Mississippi that doesn't see DL/DL Connex. What's next? ATL-Target's parking lot?

Its why they are now going west of the river.

Fresno-ATL should be announced in the next few days. Also Spokane-ATL.
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
 
MCOflyer
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:35 pm

I have a good friend who will like FCA as he has family there. Can someone give me updates on deparrture times for these cities please.

MCOflyer
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JAAlbert
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 12:48 pm

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 3):
enplanements

"Enplanements"?? Good heavens, what happened to the passengers? lol!
 
copaair737
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 1:03 pm

What other routes out west could they start flying out west?
BIL maybe?
Extend BOI to year round?

-Copa
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RL757PVD
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 1:34 pm

Quoting JAAlbert (Reply 20):
"Enplanements"?? Good heavens, what happened to the passengers? lol!

Enplanements if the OFFICIAL term used by the FAA, and the unit in which commercial service airport are categorized!

Enplanements + Deplanements = Total passengers
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
steeler83
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 2:24 pm

How about State College? Is that going to be a Delta Connect flight by Atlantic Southeast or something of the type?
Do not bring stranger girt into your room. The stranger girt is dangerous, it will hurt your life.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 2:39 pm

ATL-SCE will be operated by ASA with a CRJ

This route has been in the works for a while as the airport officials at SCE/UNV had been pushing for a flight to a more southerly hub, to either CLT or ATL. With the huge power of ATL, this route should have no problem. However, it may eventually mean that SCE-CVG loses a frequency in the future. For right now it will still be 3 daily flights to CVG, but I could see it being cut to 2. CVG is important as a lot of the traffic out of SCE is headed for the Midwest/Upper Great Lakes region, hence the need for flights to DTW & CVG.

Flights
DL 4797 SCE-ATL Dep. 7:30am Arrive 9:48am CRJ-100 Operated by ASA
DL 4796 ATL-SCE Dep. 8:00pm Arrive 9:50pm CRJ-100 Operated by ASA

Bring service now to include US-PHL, NW-DTW, UA-IAD, DL-CVG & ATL. Not a bad service offering. This may be what leads to the new terminal construction that has been on the drawing board for some time now. However, other than when all the RONs leave after first thing in the morning, the airport is pretty sleepy for the rest of the day.
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 2:42 pm

Also some returning seasonal non-stop flights will resume from ATL. YVR-ATL returns June 7th and runs through September 30th on a 752. SLC-YVR continues year around 1x on 738 mainline and 2x on CRJ.
BOI-ATL returns May 13th and runs through Sept. 3rd. Also SLC-YYJ is scheduled to resume on March 18th and tentatively appears to be year around from here on out, even though it will probably go down to 3-4 days per week during the slower season.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
unitedMSY
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 5:21 pm

Now we need SCE-ORD on United Express CRJ-200's, and we will have everything set for these midwestern travelers  Smile
 
Rookinla
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 6:07 pm

Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 14):
Well I keep thinking there aren't many runways left east of the Mississippi that doesn't see DL/DL Connex.

True...but there are still some viable markets left that DL has not yet touched.

Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 14):
the ATL hub has reached such a critical mass that very small communtities with virtually no O&D to the city of Atlanta itself will get non-stops.

I completely agree. DL feeds so many flights through ATL that more markets become viable with time. I do think that at least a few of the remaining potential DL ATL markets are ones that have lost all air service for one reason or another. Some communities have really grown up and are now ready to support air service. Will DL be willing to take a risk on them and very possibly find hidden gems? Also, what is very small? There are still communities east of the Mississippi with metro areas of 200K or more with NO air service.
 
TWA902fly
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 6:21 pm

I think it would be interesting if ATL-HST (homestead, Florida) was a possible new route. seems like a good amount of populations south of miami that could benefit from this service. Although, i am unaware of any commercial airline facilities at homestead airport. just a thought.

'902
life wasn't worth the balance, or the crumpled paper it was written on
 
Rookinla
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 6:47 pm

Quoting TWA902fly (Reply 28):
I think it would be interesting if ATL-HST (homestead, Florida) was a possible new route.

You never know about the future but I think that DL has bigger fish to fry in the shorter term, including 2 to 3 potential new cities in Florida. Homestead would be way down the list unfortunately. I think you could see OCF, VRB or SGJ at some point in the (hopefully) not too distant future.
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 6:48 pm

Quoting Noise (Reply 11):
Wow ATL-YHZ eh? With the CRJ-900! That's not a big market...hope it works!

It's only Saturday-only service for now, so DL doesn't take a big risk with the route, and can easily increase frequency if the demand proves to be there.

Quoting MCOflyer (Reply 19):
I have a good friend who will like FCA as he has family there. Can someone give me updates on deparrture times for these cities please.

All times are found in the linked PR.

Quoting SCE" class=quote target=_blank>PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 24):
However, it may eventually mean that SCE-CVG loses a frequency in the future. For right now it will still be 3 daily flights to CVG, but I could see it being cut to 2.

Better just a frequency cut than having it dropped completely  Wink .
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 8:09 pm

Quoting UnitedMSY (Reply 26):
Now we need SCE-ORD on United Express CRJ-200's, and we will have everything set for these midwestern travelers

That was the other airport on the wish list in SCE/UNV as it is one of the top 5 O&D cities from SCE, however I highly doubt United is going to throw a CRJ and ORD slots at a small route such as SCE, especially since United still flies Saabs to IAD. With the exception of the O&D the number of passengers that can't make a single connection in IAD is very slim.
 
Rookinla
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 8:15 pm

Quoting SCE" class=quote target=_blank>PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 31):
I highly doubt United is going to throw a CRJ and ORD slots at a small route such as SCE, especially since United still flies Saabs to IAD.

You never know...UA serves both IAD and ORD from DAB with a CRJ. However the ORD service was Saturday-only seasonal and ends this Saturday while IAD stays on the schedule through April. These days it's all about the Benjamins...Throw some cash at the airline and you may well get what you ask for...until the subsidy runs out.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 10:49 pm

Well DAB & SCE are apples and oranges. DAB is a significantly larger market with a large amount of tourist traffic. SCE is an isolated college town with a small but growing business/research market. The business community doesn't have the deep pockets to subsidize air service to the extent that is possible for a market such as DAB with the tourist industry. Plus a SCASD grant would be hard to come by when you already have 4 airlines flying to 5 hubs with about 16-18 flights on a mix of props & RJs. They've also learned to be careful not to irritate the incumbant carriers.

United just hasn't shown a tendancy to want to grow the market in SCE, is far behind US & DL. Its possible but I just don't see it happening while ORD is so capacity constrained.
 
jetlanta
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Wed Feb 14, 2007 11:30 pm

Quoting SCE" class=quote target=_blank>PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 33):
Well DAB & SCE are apples and oranges. DAB is a significantly larger market with a large amount of tourist traffic. SCE is an isolated college town with a small but growing business/research market. The business community doesn't have the deep pockets to subsidize air service to the extent that is possible for a market such as DAB with the tourist industry. Plus a SCASD grant would be hard to come by when you already have 4 airlines flying to 5 hubs with about 16-18 flights on a mix of props & RJs. They've also learned to be careful not to irritate the incumbant carriers.

Plus UA is pulling out of DAB after the Spring.
 
coleplane
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Thu Feb 15, 2007 4:55 am

Quoting Jimyvr (Thread starter):
State College, Penn. (effective June 7)

Wow, a daily frequence? I'd like to know what DL's rationale is. Surely it's not just PSU.
"About a nine on the tension scale there Rupe."
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Thu Feb 15, 2007 7:34 am

Quoting Coleplane (Reply 35):
Wow, a daily frequence? I'd like to know what DL's rationale is. Surely it's not just PSU.

Don't underestimate the traffic that the university generates. The majority of passengers, except around breaks, are not students. You have conferences at the university, administration related travel, faculty traveling to other conferences, research related travel, faculty & their families traveling for leisure, students being flown out for on-site job interviews, a decent sized retirement population (the #1 spot to retire in PA, the local business community which heavily favors high tech/research fields, university sports teams (only football & sometimes basketball fly on charter, the others like soccer, track, softball, etc. fly commercial). And so on. State College is relatively isolated with a 3 hr drive to PIT, 3+ hrs to PHL (plus horrendous traffic in Philly area + the turnpike + Harrisburgh area, BWI is around 3 hours, and MDT is 1.5 hrs and doesn't provide significantly more than SCE. There are a number of people that need to travel and won't drive multiple hours to fly. Plus people in communities such as Williamsport, Altoona, and all over Central PA use SCE. Its a transient community where the large university creates all this other traffic, not just the students (who often are too poor to fly and often drive to BWI to catch WN and save $100, but in the end nets out the same with parking & gas & value of your own time).
 
MAH4546
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Thu Feb 15, 2007 7:39 am

Quoting Rookinla (Reply 29):

You never know about the future but I think that DL has bigger fish to fry in the shorter term, including 2 to 3 potential new cities in Florida. Homestead would be way down the list unfortunately. I think you could see OCF, VRB or SGJ at some point in the (hopefully) not too distant future.

Homestead makes way more sense than any of those, except for the fact it doesn't, to my knowledge, have commercial facilities. All those are small, lesiure markets with no commercial service close to major airports. Homestead is close to a major airport, but it is not a leisure market and it's in a region of over 1,000,000 people. If marketed right, offering three daily CRJs to Atlanta, they could get some great yielding business traffic. That being said, I don't think any of the four would happen.
a.
 
skibum9
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Thu Feb 15, 2007 9:23 am

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 30):
Better just a frequency cut than having it dropped completely Wink .

Seriously, does it really matter at this point. CVG is down to 60 mainline flights and 200+ RJs. At what point do you stop calling it a hub, and start calling it a focus city? With the build up of ATL it makes more sense to run more frequency through there as it has more options for those out of SCE.
Tailwinds!!!
 
coleplane
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Thu Feb 15, 2007 10:18 am

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 36):
Don't underestimate the traffic that the university generates.

Excellent points.
"About a nine on the tension scale there Rupe."
 
Delta787
Posts: 306
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Thu Feb 15, 2007 11:06 am

Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 38):
Seriously, does it really matter at this point. CVG is down to 60 mainline flights and 200+ RJs. At what point do you stop calling it a hub, and start calling it a focus city? With the build up of ATL it makes more sense to run more frequency through there as it has more options for those out of SCE.

CVG is still a hub with plenty of connecting opportunities. In my opinion, its still to large to call a focus city.
Fly Delta!
 
CIDFlyer
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Thu Feb 15, 2007 12:24 pm

Quoting Skibum9 (Reply 38):
Seriously, does it really matter at this point. CVG is down to 60 mainline flights and 200+ RJs. At what point do you stop calling it a hub, and start calling it a focus city? With the build up of ATL it makes more sense to run more frequency through there as it has more options for those out of SCE.

I thought it had heard the CVG hub still has over 400 daily flights, granted more are are RJ's but that is still a large amount of flights to be called a focus city, its still definitely a hub.
 
skibum9
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Thu Feb 15, 2007 1:23 pm

In this weeks enquirer they, during the ice storm, they said delta cancelled 40, or nearly 2/4rds of its 60 flights, and I forget how many connection flights they cancelled, but they stated on a normal day that CVG had around 230 flight, IIRC. They were probably only counting departures, but it is still a large cutback from where they were a few years ago.
Tailwinds!!!
 
JAAlbert
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Thu Feb 15, 2007 2:28 pm

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 22):
Enplanements if the OFFICIAL term used by the FAA, and the unit in which commercial service airport are categorized!

Enplanements + Deplanements = Total passengers

My English teacher must be turning in his grave!
 
FlyDeltaJets87
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Thu Feb 15, 2007 2:45 pm

Quoting ERJ170 (Reply 8):
You forgot New Bern, NC (effective May 7)

I'd say they're going after military traffic at Camp Camp Lejeune, but they already serve Jacksonville, NC as well as a couple other cities in the near area.

Quoting Delta787 (Reply 40):
CVG is still a hub with plenty of connecting opportunities. In my opinion, its still to large to call a focus city.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but a lot of focus cities don't have international service. CVG does.

Quoting Jetlanta (Reply 34):
Plus UA is pulling out of DAB after the Spring.

Damn. I knew they were leaving, but I thought it was because they were offering seasonal service and would be back in the fall. Oh well.
"Let's Roll"- Todd Beamer, United Airlines Flight 93, Sept. 11, 2001
 
floridaflyboy
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Thu Feb 15, 2007 2:51 pm

Quoting Jimyvr (Thread starter):
* Kalispell, Mont. (effective June 9)

I'm hoping it's only a matter of time before we see BIL-ATL. Billings is by far the largest city in Montana, and a fast-growing business center. Plus, considering BZN and FCA both have ATL non-stops now, I'm hoping for one in BIL within a few years. They did CVG back when that hub was big for a short while, and the loads were outstanding.
Good goes around!
 
fewsolarge
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Thu Feb 15, 2007 11:38 pm

On my watch list for new nonstop service from ATL. Some of these are a real stretch, and some would require runway upgrades, but I at least find them worth considering.

* seasonal
^ try again

FPR
SGJ
OCF
LAL
HTS^
CKB^
HGR
SBY
DAN
ECG
PGV
TCL
MSL
PIB
GLH
BPT^
HUF
GYY
TXK
TYR
CLL
AMA
JBR
PAH
COU
LNK
RAP*
DLH
RST
RFD
YNG
UCA
ORH^
HVN
LGB
SCK
YQB*
YEG
YWG
YXU
GDT
PAP
CUR
BON
GND
VER
PBC
MZT

FAR (it would be cool to have the 50th state with nonstop service, but only if it makes good business sense, which I doubt at this time)
 
avconsultant
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Fri Feb 16, 2007 12:29 am

Quoting Delta787 (Reply 40):
CVG is still a hub with plenty of connecting opportunities. In my opinion, its still to large to call a focus city.

CVG will stay a hub and DL might place more of a focus now AA is building up its operation and snagging DL largest corporate client, Procter and Gamble.
 
floridaflyboy
Posts: 1500
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Fri Feb 16, 2007 7:17 am

Quoting Fewsolarge (Reply 46):
RAP*

I think you'll definitely see developing business markets in fast-growing cities like BIL and MSO occur before you'll see cities like RAP.
Good goes around!
 
gregarious119
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RE: Delta Adds 5 New Routes Out Of Atlanta

Fri Feb 16, 2007 9:21 am

One thing that suprised me about SCE this week while I was humming around on flight gear is that it doesn't have a control tower (or at least a posted control tower freq.).

Does anyone know how far away that is for SCE? I can imagine that could set up some goofy scenarios with these RJ's coming in behind a C152 at 160 knots and only having a CTAF to sort things out. Is there a set number of average movements (commercial + GA) that an airport needs to be above in order to justify the cost of building a tower/staffing/etc?

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