XA744
Topic Author
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Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Sun Feb 18, 2007 3:12 pm

Fellow A. Netters:

Three months have passed since the inaugual flight of Aeromexico to Tokyo on November 18, 2006. I have conducted an intensive search for information on this particular operation, but to my regret I could only come up with more questions and no answers at all. Roughly, 90 days have elapsed since flights 057/058 took to the skies, and theoretically it could be possible to evaluate, at this time, any premilinary results obtained by AM on their MEX-TIJ-NRT v v sectors.

Have checked Aeromexico´s Japan website but the information provided there has remained pretty much the same since the introduction of the flight. Have looked for other sources and for info even in Japanese, but it seems there is nothing relevant or worth it to be mentioned here. Have emailed JTB ( Japan Travel Bureau ), Japan´s largest travel agency and tour operator, but they only came back to me with schedules and published fares. It looks like no tour operator in Japan is using AM to market their tours and programs to Mexico. Have also contacted what seems to be a GSA for Aeromexico in Tokyo, as it looks like the airline has no representation of its own in Japan, but so far no reply yet received. Lastly, I went to the Mexican Embassy in Japan but they corteously turned me down by redirecting my request to Aeromexico´s headquarters.

To make it real short, does anyone out there have any interesting and outstanding info on the above ? What about you guys in Japan... Carpethead, Centrair, NaritaFlyer ?

Best regards

P.S. Why no photo of Aeromexico´s T7 at Narita in the data base ?
No matter how you fly...just never get your wings clipped !
 
Carpethead
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Sun Feb 18, 2007 4:11 pm

First of all, most of the tourist destinations in Mexico can easily be covered any major US carrier on a daily basis or US gateway, like LAX, and then on MX or AM. Mexico isn't like Papeete or Noumea which has very little alternatives in flight routing. Thus making the two weekly service by AM, very unattractive from a flexibility standpoint.

Quoting XA744 (Thread starter):
Why no photo of Aeromexico´s T7 at Narita in the data base ?

There's not many Japanese photographers period on this site.
I am old school and still use slides and prints.
 
KLM685
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Sun Feb 18, 2007 6:34 pm

IMHO, Although a preliminary result of AM's operations might good to see the time and season for your request is still to premature. You can count on the DGAC's statistics regarding people entering the country preceeding from Japan as the AM flight would certainly increase it.

Also take into acount that a really good view of the route success comes from a larger period and from a heavier season. The winter months are the worst for every airline in the North Hemishpere as travel tends to decrease. IF and only IF AM has very good summer months in this year, then we will see AM as a well established airline in Japan. I think is too soon for them to open an office and to establish in a country in which they might not be a success and get out soon. As this will require an enourmous amount of money which will be very very bad spent if they rush to create a well established base in an unsuccesful route. They are now being smart by doing outsourcing and minimizing their risk with the route.


Also it's not the right time for Japanese tour operators to be having Aeromexico as none of the 2 countries are in a vacation period which will make the spend in publicity feasible. Although they should start negotiations for the summer season.

Anyway, keep up looking for the information. Probably a travel agency could tell you better how this flights have been doing and probably generalize a little bit regarding the information given.


Good luck!

Alonso
KLM- The Best Airline in the World!
 
centrair
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Sun Feb 18, 2007 7:54 pm

Quoting Carpethead (Reply 1):
There's not many Japanese photographers period on this site.
I am old school and still use slides and prints.

Very old school. Who makes slides anymore?

Note this is the reason there are few NGO photos as well. I guess Some of our A.net photographers need to spend more time in Japan.
My name is Centrair but HND is closer. Let's Japanese Aviation!
 
juventus
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Sun Feb 18, 2007 9:31 pm

Quoting Carpethead (Reply 1):
First of all, most of the tourist destinations in Mexico can easily be covered any major US carrier on a daily basis

This has been my argument all along. Flying from Asia to Mexico, its easy for airlines to connect passengers at LAX or SFO. Same goes for the European traffic, ORD, EWR, ATL and MIA are right on the way. Hopefully things change.
 
danild
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Sun Feb 18, 2007 9:55 pm

Hey!

I was just in Tokyo 2 weeks ago and although I was looking for AM's Flight the only thing I could see was the display on the monitors. The flight is operating. Although according to Sabre there is only one seat occupied on the TIJ-NRT segment for the 19th of February, which means they are not doing so well. I did come across 2 guys from Sao Paulo that were flying NRT-ORD-GRU when they could have done Aeromexico's service. I initially thought that AM's flight was going to be better on time but it turns out that it's the same... or even more. Flying time is exactly the same but with 3 stops via NRT-TIJ-MEX-GRU and total travel time is more as the conection in MEX is a lot longer than United's so you'd have to leave a lot earlier and you would arrive Sao Paulo later than United. I really don't understand Aeromexico's rational but if they were going after the brazilian market this IS NOT the way to do it.

I'll be in Tokyo tomorro earlier although I don't think that Aeromexico flies the Tokyo route tomorrow. I'll keep you posted.

Here is the comparison in travel time straight from Sabre.

FLIGHT DATE SEGMENT DPTR ARVL MLS EQP ELPD MILES SMD
1 UA 882 19FEB NRT ORD 1755 1423 DL 744 11.28 6286 N
DEP-TERMINAL 1 ARR-TERMINAL 5 INTERNATIONAL
STAR ALLIANCE
2 UA 843 19FEB ORD GRU 2101 1130 ‡1 DS 763 10.29 5214 N
DEP-TERMINAL 1 ARR-TERMINAL 1
STAR ALLIANCE
3 AM 57 21FEB NRT TIJ 1455 0800 DR 777 10.05 5582 N
DEP-TERMINAL 1
TIJ MEX 0935 1435 DR 3.00 1422 N
4 AM 14 21FEB MEX GRU 2330 1235 ‡1 777 9.05 4612 N

Here are some pics I got for the flight information TVs at Narita.


Tokyo departure tv with Aeromexico Flight in it
Tokyo


[Edited 2007-02-18 13:58:32]
Danild
 
juventus
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 12:18 am

Quoting Danild (Reply 5):
I really don't understand Aeromexico's rational but if they were going after the brazilian market this IS NOT the way to do it.

I don't think this was the main reason. Many things were factored in , the ever increasing number of Asian tourists in Mexico, the large market between Souhtern Cal and Japan, plus the always profitable cargo. AM is giving it time, if it doesn't work, drop the route and send the aircraft somewhere else. I wonder if the 777 could fly to NRT directly from MEX, would this flight do better?
 
adriaticus
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 12:59 am

Quoting Danild (Reply 5):
I really don't understand Aeromexico's rational but if they were going after the brazilian market this IS NOT the way to do it.

Agree. AM couldn't get the NRT slots they wanted, but took what NRT could give them. Therefore, connecting times ended up beingless than desireable. Would things be different had they settled for NGO?

Quoting Juventus (Reply 6):
I wonder if the 777 could fly to NRT directly from MEX, would this flight do better?

The B772ERs AM has can't due strong headwinds and H&H takeoff restrictions. A B777LR would do.

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SKY1
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 1:23 am

I think there's a small risk to see AM being tempted to forget the Japanese market, increase code-share with other SkyTeam partners via USA/Canada to fly Japan/Asia and using these 777's to reinforce MAD and/or CDG if needed.

Just like IB did 8 years ago: Using planes to serve a plain, sure market with an assured profitability. IB calls this "servir un mercado natural" --and forget outlandish adventures, they shoud adding  Silly --

Anyhow, I wish luck to AM, and I'd like to see AM in the Japanese market for years.
Time flies! Enjoy life!
 
JJJM
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 5:43 am

Hi Everyone

I can tell you that AM's Flights to Japan, has been much better that expected....regarding load factors.

Theres is two scenarios here.

On Clase Premier loads have been very poor, less that 20%, on the other had on Tourist class loads have been:

Load factors on the MEX-TIJ flights are over 80% on both AM 58 and AM 57

Loads factors on TIJ-NRT are on 65%....Not bad at all

On March 29 trhe flight is over booked.....yes due to Easter week....I'm sure these flight will go out 100%

I've been on this flight twice, And I can tell you it's smoother to trave to Asia via Tijuana than via LAX, ORD, SFO or the US in general. Time spent in TIJ is aprox. 1 hour 20 minutes, immigration is hassle and worry free.

On my second flight on my way back, there was aprox 60 passengers conecting to LIM, SAO and SCL. Many mexicans had also connections from TIJ to GDL, MTY, HMO and many other cities in Mexico,. Comments in general were satisfactory on this new service. Also there was many japanese going to Los Cabos, those were connecting in MEX, where i thought it was awfull. I thing AM needs urgently a flight from TIJ to SJD.

Last week I flew SCL-MEX and there was a group of more than 20 passengers which their final dsetination was NRT.

Can't tell about cargo or tour operator group blocks factors....but for regular load factors, I think there are doing pretty well.

I'll try to get some load factors stats for upcoming flights, and post them for everyone.

I'm sure this new service will be totally succesfull during summer, and maybe we will see the 3rd flight weekly flight.

Regards JJJM
 
centrair
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 9:30 am

Quoting Adriaticus (Reply 7):
Would things be different had they settled for NGO?

Hard to tell. NGO has a lot of business travelers, good cargo and could fill a plane with South Americans. But AM was lucky to get a slot at NRT. You can bet that there are a dozen airlines that would have bent over for NAA just to get slots. In the long run, if AM can secure a later slot on the 2nd runway (being extended and available for slots in 2009), they could do a little better. But...

Quoting Adriaticus (Reply 7):
A B777LR would do.

This is actually what they need. If they had non-stop to MEX, they could fill the plane in all seats and be competative with the US carriers that have shorter connection times, more connections to South and Central America and maybe lower fares.

AM needs 772LRs to really make Asia work. They need to use TIJ to capture SoCal and a beach market. But they need a non-stop to MEX to get business, industry, O&D and good efficient transfers. An LR could let them expand further into Asia as well...China...Korea.

P.S. When the rumor started that AM was going to serve Japan. IT was centered around them flying into NGO, which had slots, low landing/ops fees and could fill the plane in all sections. But Tokyo granted them coveted NRT slots and so they took it. If they had operated into NGO, the only ways they could have captured the NRT market would have been to make a codeshare for the NRT-NGO-(SPN) flight operated by NW which is considered an International flight. The other one is with JL for domestic and NRT connection flight (like NW's is considered an International flight).
My name is Centrair but HND is closer. Let's Japanese Aviation!
 
EddieDude
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 9:40 am

Quoting JJJM (Reply 9):
I can tell you that AM's Flights to Japan, has been much better that expected....regarding load factors.

Theres is two scenarios here.

On Clase Premier loads have been very poor, less that 20%, on the other had on Tourist class loads have been:

Load factors on the MEX-TIJ flights are over 80% on both AM 58 and AM 57

Loads factors on TIJ-NRT are on 65%....Not bad at all

On March 29 trhe flight is over booked.....yes due to Easter week....I'm sure these flight will go out 100%

It is a shame that Premier seats are not being filled... I guess it is true that businesspeople appreciate, above all else, flexibility. In any case, even though C is what brings profit and not Y (unless it is full-fare), if AM is filling the cargo compartment, these poor loads in C might not be such a grave issue.

I agree that 65% load factor is not bad at all, but I am not sure whether it is enough. Let's hope this number will increase steadily to a more desirable level.

Quoting JJJM (Reply 9):
Also there was many japanese going to Los Cabos, those were connecting in MEX, where i thought it was awfull. I thing AM needs urgently a flight from TIJ to SJD.

Good to know! Los Cabos is a destination that AM should definitely be promoting in Japan big time. And Sectur, Fonatur and the local government of Baja California Sur should help AM in this. Since Cabo is a fairly expensive vacation spot, it is in the government's best interest to attract high-yield tourism, and definitely AM can be the vehicle (provided that, as JJJM says, AM opens TIJ-SJD-TIJ).

One last thing. Has anyone seen AM's latest billboards? They are offering a promotion that consists of selling a second MEX-NRT-MEX ticket for half the price of the first one. Under this promotion, if you want to travel with a travelmate to Japan with AM, you'd be paying around U.S.$1,100 to U.S.$1,200, and your travelmate would pay something like U.S.$720. It is very attractive, but to me that is a sign that the load factors are not as great as expected.
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
XA744
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 9:46 am

Everyone, thank you for your inputs.

Quoting Danild (Reply 5):
I'll be in Tokyo tomorro earlier although I don't think that Aeromexico flies the Tokyo route tomorrow. I'll keep you posted.

Can you feel the presence of AM at Narita ? I mean, is there any kind of info, posters, banners, anything that could tell people Aeromexico is there ?

Quoting JJJM (Reply 9):
I'm sure this new service will be totally succesfull during summer, and maybe we will see the 3rd flight weekly flight.

Yes, might get a lot more interesting in the summer. Now, about a 3 x weekly, it would all depend on the introduction of a fourth T7 in the fleet. So far there are no news in this regard. We still don´t know if former RG´s PP-VRB will actually be acquired by AM.

Quoting JJJM (Reply 9):
Load factors on the MEX-TIJ flights are over 80% on both AM 58 and AM 57

Loads factors on TIJ-NRT are on 65%....Not bad at all

Well, MEX-TIJ as a heavily travelled domestic sector comes to no surprise at all, but it amazes me to see the transpac NRT-TIJ sector at this PLF. This is a wonderful achievement. Would be great to know the market composition of this loads. BTW, where did you get this info from ?

Quoting Carpethead (Reply 1):
There's not many Japanese photographers period on this site.
I am old school and still use slides and prints.

Fair enough

Best regards
No matter how you fly...just never get your wings clipped !
 
EddieDude
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 10:44 am

Quoting XA744 (Reply 12):
We still don´t know if former RG´s PP-VRB will actually be acquired by AM.

The last update I read on this was a post by LipeGIG who mentioned that PP-VRB was undergoing maintenance in Brazil and that it was quite likely that it would join AM soon. I truly hope it happens. Otherwise, the fourth 772ER will arrive closer to the end of the year (a new-build).
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
centrair
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 12:32 pm

Just out of curiousity...
What are the estimates on H&H conditions for the 787-8? I believe they have some on order via lease. If they are better than the 772ER, they could use them for a MEX-NRT non-stop.
How many new build 777s do they have on order?
My name is Centrair but HND is closer. Let's Japanese Aviation!
 
anthsaun
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 12:39 pm

Every time I go to Cancún, I get to see hundreds of Japanese tourist. Even the Fiesta Americana Coral Beach has Japanese speaking hostesses and waiters as well as a Japanese TV channel. How do these tourists get to Cancún?... They fly through LAX.

We are talking about AM capturing Southern Cal travellers, but, What's AM doing to get their attention? Are there any ads on San Diego about AM's flights to NRT? Are Californians actually flying AM?

Believe, I really want AM to stay at NRT and get more slots.
Over 80 years in business say a lot about success
 
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LAXintl
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 12:48 pm

While its great to see a Latin American airline cross the Pacific, I would say its very doubtfull the service has much of a chance turning a profit under the current conditions.

Only a token twice weekly presence by far hurts the routes attractiveness to the business traveller. In addition the poor slot times make the flight not the most beneficial for connectivity.

The fact that Mexico City along with many major Mexican cities can be reached on a daily one-stop basis via a host of US airlines and their hubs.. whether its AA, CO, UA they all provide a daily and competitive product with onward connections to Mexico and other parts of Latin America will always be hanging over AM's head.

Also another point to keep in mind, even if the day comes with AM being allowed daily service to Japan, that does not guarantee profitability. Remember Varig provided such service and even with decent loads experienced heavy loses on the route as the carrier was stuck carrying primarily lower yield traffic, with marginal left over premium traffic. The marketing effectiveness of the US big boys, and premier Asian airlines cannot be under estimated.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
JRDC930
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 12:49 pm

Regarding connecting at LAX, i hate it. I Live in San Bernardino CA and have flown to NRT several times via LAX, i also live about 90 miles from TIJ, and id rather drive to TIJ and fly from there to NRT than LAX any day and at almost any other price. Do you know what a hell it is to drive to LAX ? Even if you live in LA the drive is horrible. I dont know the numbers, but I'm guessing theres a lot of people in CA that feel the same way i do. whether or not that justifies AM's venture to japan I dont know. I guess cargo has been a big factor as well. Anyways i hope it all goes well for AM, i would hate to see Mexican air travel reliant on stupid connections in the US when they can fly non stop to certain destinations. I think its great that Mexican aviation is breaking away from being a puppet to US airlines regarding intercontinental travel.

Mis dos centavos.
U.S. Legacy carriers,STILL leaders in lowering industry standards...
 
EddieDude
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 12:54 pm

Well, only one more new-build 772ER is scheduled to join the fleet. That will be late this year. I don't know if AM has the option of asking ILFC to lease more 772ERs.
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
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LAXintl
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 12:56 pm

Quoting Anthsaun (Reply 15):
Are there any ads on San Diego about AM's flights to NRT? Are Californians actually flying AM?

I can't even imagine why San Diego or SoCal residents would consider the twice weekly TIJ-NRT service when they have multiple daily options via LAX on several carriers and alliances.

While heading down to TIJ might be a breeze, coming back across the border is no picnic and take quite a while. I'll take my added flights options and a AA Eagle or UA Express flight to LAX any day over sitting at the border trying to cross.

Quoting Anthsaun (Reply 15):
Believe, I really want AM to stay at NRT and get more slots.

With time AM should be eligible for more slots, however I dont believe the flight will be much of a performer until they figure out a way to link it nonstop to MEX and avoid the added TIJ stop.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
JRDC930
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 1:01 pm

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 19):
I can't even imagine why San Diego or SoCal residents would consider the twice weekly TIJ-NRT service when they have multiple daily options via LAX on several carriers and alliances.

Try Driving the 405 of the 10 or the 5 freeway almost any time of day and tell me you still cant see why!  crowded 
U.S. Legacy carriers,STILL leaders in lowering industry standards...
 
DL777LAX
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 1:30 pm

Quoting JRDC930 (Reply 20):
Quoting Laxintl (Reply 19):
I can't even imagine why San Diego or SoCal residents would consider the twice weekly TIJ-NRT service when they have multiple daily options via LAX on several carriers and alliances.

Try Driving the 405 of the 10 or the 5 freeway almost any time of day and tell me you still cant see why! crowded

Oh, come on, i live in LA. I can safely say that driving on the 405, 10, or the 5 is not THAT bad to make you drive the other way to TIJ. And, to the person who lives in San Bernardino, well, Why would you want to deal with the border crossing back into the country? It can take hours sometime.

Lets face it. If you live in Los Angeles or anywhere else in the southland, your not going to be able to escape traffic when traffic is due ESPECIALLY at rush hour.

You know you could just take a commuter flight too, UA offers nonstops between LAX and ONT, PSP, and SAN.

Anyway, AM is probably trying to cater to the Latin-American customer over Southern-Californian. No visa troubles for a flight through the US.
Blindly following anything is bad, unless of course your blind and your following a guide dog.
 
XA744
Topic Author
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Mon Feb 19, 2007 1:32 pm

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 16):
Remember Varig provided such service and even with decent loads experienced heavy loses on the route as the carrier was stuck carrying primarily lower yield traffic, with marginal left over premium traffic. The marketing effectiveness of the US big boys, and premier Asian airlines cannot be under estimated.

Quite right about it, no doubt. However, I believe Aeromexico´s management must be having in mind three things in order to make the Tokyo flight feasible:

1.- Addition of frequencies in the short-medium term

2.- True connectivity at MEX to and from markets in Latam

3.- Non stop capabilities to and from MEX

Aeromexico has no choice but to go truly global. The room to profit from the domestic market has just shrunk with the advent of so many LCCs out there.

Best regards
No matter how you fly...just never get your wings clipped !
 
LatinPlane
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Tue Feb 20, 2007 11:08 am

Hello all,

I think it is important to bring up to this discussion that there is a high probability that Japan Airlines might withdraw its own twice weekly Mexico service leaving AM to capture all of the market between Japan and Mexico.

Japan Airlines has indicated in its most recent restructuring plan that it plans to concentrate on its high-yielding markets only; dropping all other services that do not return an acceptable return on investment from its first/business class service. While it is known that Japan Airlines service to Mexico is to a certain extent in service for political reasons, it is reasonable for us to assume that perhaps it is not a very profitable operation because JL has never, or has no intention on increasing its twice weekly status despite the heavy rise in Japanese traffic to Mexico.

If this were to happen, we can certainly expect that AM twice weekly service will automatically start achieving load factors in the high 80 percentile due to the absorbption of the Japanese passengers that would normally fly on JL. This would also theoretically warant the need to up the service to thrice weekly making it a more attractive flight for all markets AM is targeting.

If this may be the case, and I suspect that we will find out soon, I can only forsee AM's service to Japan becoming a very profitable route by this summer.

Any thoughts anyone?

 Smile LatinPlane
Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
ghost77
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Tue Feb 20, 2007 11:39 am

Interesting input LatinPlane. IMHO, JL has served MEX for over 4 decades, MEX is a money maker! Despite they haven't increased frequencies, it's because they haven't wanted it. But over the last years, they have increased its offer of seats, we have to remember when JL served MEX with their B741s to now, its B744s. I think, Mexico can support AM's 3X if they ever increased the frequencies with additional 2X JL service.
Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!
 
danild
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Tue Feb 20, 2007 2:06 pm

Quoting XA744 (Reply 12):
Can you feel the presence of AM at Narita ? I mean, is there any kind of info, posters, banners, anything that could tell people Aeromexico is there ?

I just got back from Tokyo and the answer sadly is NO, other than the pictures that I attached earlier there are no obvious signs promoting Aeromexico. Altough I didn't see ads for other airlines eaither... I'm not sure about Tokyo City because I just conected through NRT.

I really hope that this flight works but I just don't see it as a great flight I think Aeromexico should be trying to exploit the strong Europe-CUN market that is currently being taken advantage of by Condor, LTU, Martinair, and others. I think they should follow a strategy simmilar to Vietnam Airlines. They are trying to offer good products for a reasonable price for the tourist visitors into Vietnam from Europe, Germany, Russia. Etc.

I'll be posting a trip report for my Vietnam, Honkong, Thailand trip lots of good pictures and videos!. Great experience on Thai's first class and I hated arriving into the new BKK airport but the departures area is AMAZING!

See ya!
Danild
 
Marcus
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Wed Feb 21, 2007 4:57 am

I live in TIJ and go to the US at least once a week, there is absolutely no marketing of this flight in Southern California, and if there is I have never seen it.

What I do see each time that I'm at TIJ is that this flight is delayed about an hour every single time I'm at the airport, does anyone know why this is?

Also, the last time I was at TIJ this past Friday there was a group of about 20 Chinese nationals waiting to take the TIJ-NRT leg of this flight, the Chinese population in TIJ and MXL is huge and not all of them have a US to take a flight from SAN or LAX, of course the population is not big enough to sustain this flight by itself but it doesn't hurt.
Kids!....we are going to the happiest place on earth...TIJUANA! signed: Krusty the Clown
 
LatinPlane
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RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Wed Feb 21, 2007 8:22 am

Hey Ghost,

I agree with you that MEX had to report small profit margins, or at least be braking even all this time considering that MEX is just a tag along to its Vancouver flight, but I doubt that JL can sustain its operations now that AM has started its own service, something that wasn't the case in the past.

Unless the Japanese government steps in and dictates to JAL to keep operating into MEX, I really see this being axed because JAL's report specifically states that it will concentrate only to those destinations where it can fill up its business class cabins. As you may have heard, they are going full force with this plan and penetrating those markets by increasing frequencies to LAX and JFK, clearly targeting those high paying business travelers with more frequency options. They are getting rid of all the 747s, and thus will not have enough aircraft for all routes currently in operation. This means that they will need to maximize fleet usage, which would most likely mean getting rid of tag-along routes.

I am not claiming to be an insider, I am simply looking at the way things are evolving and making an educated guess, so please don't flame me if it turns otherwise.

 Smile LatinPlane
Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
CX Flyboy
Posts: 6056
Joined: Sun Dec 26, 1999 6:10 pm

RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Wed Feb 21, 2007 4:17 pm

Does anyone know which 777 departed NRT today?
 
mjt909
Posts: 32
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2005 2:26 am

RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Wed Feb 21, 2007 5:31 pm

I can safely say that there is NO marketing of this flight in the San Diego region.

My partner and I were looking at taking this flight in August. I have a cousin who lives in Japan, and it seemed reasonable considering that I cross into Tijuana at least twice a month for shopping/dentist/veterinarian/flights to central Mexico, etc. The fact is, yes, the border line is excrutiating. However, I would still rather go through TIJ than drive to LAX.

However, when we went to the AM ticketing office at Plaza Rio in Tijuana about a month ago, the agent there seemed to have no idea about this flight...she told me that the flight was only going once a week (even though the AM website and Orbitz still showed it twice a week), and she said that the fare we were getting was only promotional (not true, as far as I can tell).
 
ElPelon
Posts: 114
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2003 3:59 am

RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:35 am

Quoting Marcus (Reply 26):
What I do see each time that I'm at TIJ is that this flight is delayed about an hour every single time I'm at the airport, does anyone know why this is?

I friend of mine, just took this flight like 3 weeks ago, and he told me that the flight was delayed about 1.5 hr. They were told that this delay was on porpouse, because if they departed on time, they would arrive before schedule time to NRT, so they delayed the flight, in order to get exact on time to destination.

I wonder if this has something to do with the lack of slots at NRT, that they avoid to arrive before scheduling time.
ElPelon
 
orbis
Posts: 199
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 2:15 pm

RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Thu Feb 22, 2007 2:46 pm

Quoting ElPelon (Reply 30):
friend of mine, just took this flight like 3 weeks ago, and he told me that the flight was delayed about 1.5 hr. They were told that this delay was on porpouse, because if they departed on time, they would arrive before schedule time to NRT, so they delayed the flight, in order to get exact on time to destination.

I wonder if this has something to do with the lack of slots at NRT, that they avoid to arrive before scheduling time

NRT has a curfew that ends at 0600 local time. Most flights arriving around that time have to enter into a waiting pattern over Tokio til NRT is open. That might be the case for AM058
we should live our lives as if we were really alive!!! H.M.
 
Marcus
Posts: 1666
Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2001 5:08 am

RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Fri Feb 23, 2007 12:45 am

If that is the case then why not take off from MEX one hour later?.......on the stopover at TIJ everyone gets off the plane and they have to wait on the less than adequate boarding gate areas at TIJ.
Kids!....we are going to the happiest place on earth...TIJUANA! signed: Krusty the Clown
 
Avianca
Posts: 5283
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Fri Feb 23, 2007 1:24 am

Quoting Centrair (Reply 3):
Very old school. Who makes slides anymore?

well there are still enough arround do there work on slides.
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
abrelosojos
Posts: 4050
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 6:48 am

RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Fri Feb 23, 2007 1:45 am

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 11):
Has anyone seen AM's latest billboards? They are offering a promotion that consists of selling a second MEX-NRT-MEX ticket for half the price of the first one. Under this promotion, if you want to travel with a travelmate to Japan with AM, you'd be paying around U.S.$1,100 to U.S.$1,200, and your travelmate would pay something like U.S.$720.

= In Monterrey, the ads were all over local radion stations.

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 11):
It is very attractive, but to me that is a sign that the load factors are not as great as expected.

= Agreed. However, this is lean season.

Cheers,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
BA0242
Posts: 54
Joined: Sun Mar 05, 2006 3:27 am

RE: Aeromexico In Japan - Part Two

Fri Feb 23, 2007 4:22 am

Quoting JJJM (Reply 9):
On my second flight on my way back, there was aprox 60 passengers conecting to LIM, SAO and SCL.



Quoting JJJM (Reply 9):
Last week I flew SCL-MEX and there was a group of more than 20 passengers which their final dsetination was NRT.

That's the point!

I think South and Central America (LIM, SCL, GRU and why not? maybe codeshares with MX for CCS, BOG, EZE, SJO, GUA, PTY etc) could be one of the strongest feeders for AM flights to Japan, if they know how to exploit this in an intelligent way. Take into account that for all Latin Americans it is definetly more convenient to fly to Asia via Mexico than the US, since they avoid all those annoying US-migration controls, and reach their far east destination with a company that speaks their language and has a very similar culture to their own one.

It would be excellent if they could work together with MX to offer NRT from most of their Latin American destinations Ah! And It would be really sad to see JL leaving MEX, but honestly I think the NRT-YVR-MEX-YVR-NRT has many chances to survive even if AM does outstanding with the 057/068.

[Edited 2007-02-22 20:27:37]
Favourite visitors at MEX: British Airways B747-400 and Japan Airlines B747-400.

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