MAH4546
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Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 7:51 am

Delta is pulling the plug on LaGuardia-Salt Lake City service, which operates Saturday-only due to LaGuardia's perimter rule. Launched in late 2005, the last flight is 14 April 2007. Delta operates a Saturday-only 757 on the route.

Many airline have attempted to fly Saturday-only flights from LaGuardia to cities in the West Coast and US territories, when the perimeter rule is not in effect, but most have been unsuccesful. This includes ATA to San Francisco; US Airways to Las Vegas, San Juan, and St. Thomas; and, most recently, Delta to Las Vegas and Los Angeles, in addition to Salt Lake City.
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SLCUT2777
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 8:23 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Thread starter):
Delta is pulling the plug on LaGuardia-Salt Lake City service, which operates Saturday-only due to LaGuardia's perimter rule. Launched in late 2005, the last flight is 14 April 2007. Delta operates a Saturday-only 757 on the route.

Many airline have attempted to fly Saturday-only flights from LaGuardia to cities in the West Coast and US territories, when the perimeter rule is not in effect, but most have been unsuccesful. This includes ATA to San Francisco; US Airways to Las Vegas, San Juan, and St. Thomas; and, most recently, Delta to Las Vegas and Los Angeles, in addition to Salt Lake City.

While this will no doubt be a blow to business travelers that need quick and easy access to the financial district in mid-town Manhattan, you're very correct that SLC-LGA service was very spotty at best forcing some who were spending an entire week there to fly in on a Saturday and go home on a Saturday and utilize up to 3 additional nights in a hotel. Not a very good plan for the one shot deal. Hopefully DL will make plenty of adjustments to schedules going into ATL and CVG for a connection since many continue to tell me getting to mid-town Manhattan in NYC from JFK is a royal pain.
That said, I do think DL can better utilize their aircraft for more profitable mainline routes, especially a 752.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
MAH4546
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 8:29 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 1):
While this will no doubt be a blow to business travelers that need quick and easy access to the financial district in mid-town Manhattan, you're very correct that SLC-LGA service was very spotty at best forcing some who were spending an entire week there to fly in on a Saturday and go home on a Saturday and utilize up to 3 additional nights in a hotel. Not a very good plan for the one shot deal. Hopefully DL will make plenty of adjustments to schedules going into ATL and CVG for a connection since many continue to tell me getting to mid-town Manhattan in NYC from JFK is a royal pain.

Huh? It didn't force anything. If you wanted to fly home on another day, a traveler would book from JFK or EWR. They are coterminals, so there was rarely, if ever, a penalty for flying SLC-LGA/JFK-SLC
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mariner
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 8:30 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Thread starter):
Many airline have attempted to fly Saturday-only flights from LaGuardia to cities in the West Coast and US territories, when the perimeter rule is not in effect, but most have been unsuccesful.

Any thoughts as to why?

I'm not surprised about LGA-SLC, but, theoretically, LGA to the big leisure destinarions should work - LGA-LAS, for example - but it seems not.

Is a puzzlement.

mariner
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spinkid
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 8:39 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 1):
While this will no doubt be a blow to business travelers that need quick and easy access to the financial district in mid-town Manhattan,

I've never really thought it was THAT much easier to get to LGA rather than JFK from Manhattan, especially the financial district. Maybe others disagree with me on that.

Quoting Mariner (Reply 3):
I'm not surprised about LGA-SLC, but, theoretically, LGA to the big leisure destinarions should work - LGA-LAS, for example - but it seems not.

I think most people know they can't normally fly non stop to the west coast from LGA so they are used to booking from JFK or EWR. Also, not everyone flys Saturday to Saturday. Many people will go away say Saturday through Tuesday or something like that and if you have to fly out of LGA and back into JFK to go non stop both ways, it is often easier to go to JFK and park your car there for the whole duration.

I do however think the flight to SLC would helpewith connecting traffic that might otherwise normally connect in Atlanta or Cincinatti. Apparently not.
 
gigneil
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 8:39 am

What I don't understand is the efficacy of the rule itself.

Airlines fly daily services on domestic routes, there should be no less traffic on the field on Saturday and Sunday than any other day of the week. Why allow these extra sections on those two days at all?

NS
 
boswashsprstar
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 8:46 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 1):



Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 1):
you're very correct that SLC-LGA service was very spotty at best forcing some who were spending an entire week there to fly in on a Saturday and go home on a Saturday and utilize up to 3 additional nights in a hotel.

Well . . . not exactly . . . there are a couple of other airports hanging around not too far from Manhattan, all of which offer flights to SLC any day of the week. The LGA flight was just an added convenience for those happening to be traveling on a Saturday. (Getting to JFK isn't great, but it's just a problem of congested highways, not strange back streets or poor access. Getting to EWR is no problem, really, other than that it's farther away.)

Is the LGA-LAX service staying for now?
 
panamair
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 9:08 am

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 5):
Airlines fly daily services on domestic routes, there should be no less traffic on the field on Saturday and Sunday than any other day of the week. Why allow these extra sections on those two days at all?

Actually many LGA flights to business destinations do not operate on Saturdays so there is less traffic and capacity on Saturdays. For example, the DL Shuttle to BOS/DCA only has 5 flights in each direction as opposed to hourly service on week days (up to 15-16 flights a day for each city). The extra flights are only allowed on Saturdays, not on Sundays. While Sunday mornings are slow in terms of capacity, afternoon and evenings are back to business as usual as airlines operate their full schedules again...

Quoting BosWashSprStar (Reply 6):
Is the LGA-LAX service staying for now?

LGA-LAX was dropped some time ago already....LGA-LAS lasted longer but is also gone now..
 
SJCRRPAX
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 9:21 am

If you are willing to do a one stop, there are all kinds of choices... , ATA has three daily through Chicago, and AA has one that takes 5 hrs 40 minutes. If you try another airport I probably couldn't count the choices. WN has four one stops to ISP, Jet blue has a non stop daily to JFK... etc.... etc.... I guess the problem is if you want to leave SLC at 9:00 AM and get a full work day in NY its kind of tough. No reason to stay overnight in NY on returning though.
 
boswashsprstar
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 10:05 am

Quoting Mariner (Reply 3):
Any thoughts as to why?

I'm not surprised about LGA-SLC, but, theoretically, LGA to the big leisure destinarions should work - LGA-LAS, for example - but it seems not.

Is a puzzlement.

I think that part of it is that people simply don't realize the flights exist. If someone does a search for flights from New York to Las Vegas and they check a few different dates and see that nearly all LGA flights are one-stop but there are non-stops from JFK and EWR, they're probably going to stop looking at LGA options, not realizing that there are special flights on Saturday.

And, on top of that, the rule is lifted on Saturday because there are fewer flights then. There are fewer flights then because there are fewer fliers then. There are fewer fliers on rule-exemption Saturday flights because there are fewer fliers on most Saturday flights.
 
MaverickM11
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 10:07 am

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 5):
Airlines fly daily services on domestic routes, there should be no less traffic on the field on Saturday and Sunday than any other day of the week.

Domestic demand drops off a cliff on Saturdays; it's easily the worst day of the week for anything that isn't overtly tourist driven (ie LAS, MCO, MYR, ACY, SJU, etc).

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 1):
While this will no doubt be a blow to business travelers that need quick and easy access to the financial district in mid-town Manhattan

I can't imagine there were many business travelers on a Saturday only LGA/SLC flight, which is probably a major part of the problem that resulted in its demise. Leisure traffic on its own is not likely going to support a flight to SLC of all places.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
MAH4546
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 1:20 pm

Quoting BosWashSprStar (Reply 9):
I think that part of it is that people simply don't realize the flights exist. If someone does a search for flights from New York to Las Vegas and they check a few different dates and see that nearly all LGA flights are one-stop but there are non-stops from JFK and EWR, they're probably going to stop looking at LGA options, not realizing that there are special flights on Saturday.

Except when flying to/from New York City, many people, especially leisure travelers, will type in NYC, not JFK or EWR. If they are departing on a Saturday and returning on, say, a Tuesday, they will have the option of booking LGA-SLC-JFK.
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WesternA318
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 1:49 pm

Quoting Mariner (Reply 3):
Any thoughts as to why?

I'm not surprised about LGA-SLC, but, theoretically, LGA to the big leisure destinarions should work - LGA-LAS, for example - but it seems not.

Is a puzzlement.

Lga is more of a Businessman's airport, I'll bet ANYTHING if this was a redeye flight on a weekday from SLC to LGA, DL wouldve asked for a second rotation. Weekends justare not good for traffic into/out of LGA.


Quoting SJCRRPAX (Reply 8):
I guess the problem is if you want to leave SLC at 9:00 AM and get a full work day in NY its kind of tough.

With CO you can catch the Sunday night redeye nonstop to EWR, then hop on a helicopter from the EWR gates to the financial district and then catch a flight at 6:45PM'ish back to SLC.
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isp
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 3:42 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Thread starter):
US Airways to Las Vegas, San Juan, and St. Thomas;

While announced, the US LGA-LAS service never actually began. It was to be operated with an A321, however there were concerns that the A321 would not have the legs for this journey on the 7,000 foot LGA runway.
 
jkudall
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Thu Feb 22, 2007 4:06 pm

The LGA-SLC discontinuation is only seasonal. It will return. LGA-RSW is also being seasonally discontinued in April.
 
slcdeltarumd11
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Fri Feb 23, 2007 11:59 pm

Quoting Spinkid (Reply 4):
I've never really thought it was THAT much easier to get to LGA rather than JFK from Manhattan, especially the financial district. Maybe others disagree with me on that.

I disagree with you. the airtran makes getting to JFK nice, but in a car LGA is much much easier JFK can be much longer away because the TRAFFIC


This flight will come back for the winter of next year its just seasonal. i think it did very well during ski season and if delta could I'm sure they would operate it daily but the mileage restriction out of LGA. I saw this plane boarding at LGA twice and it was oversold once and looked packed the second day. Alot of ski vacationers out west going to SLC, JAC, HDN, DRU etc. leave and return on saturdays so its not that bad for them and if you want to return any other day you just need to add a connection in ATL.
 
FoxBravo
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Sat Feb 24, 2007 12:13 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Thread starter):
Many airline have attempted to fly Saturday-only flights from LaGuardia to cities in the West Coast and US territories, when the perimeter rule is not in effect, but most have been unsuccesful.

It's true. In fact, the only one I can think of that has been a success year after year is AA's LGA-EGE nonstop on Saturdays during ski season.

I think the reason is simply that most people don't know these flights exist. Most New Yorkers just assume that they if they're flying to LAX, LAS, etc. they need to go from JFK or EWR, because that's how they've always done it in the past. AA's EGE flight, by contrast, was initially the only nonstop from the NY area to EGE, and consequently developed a loyal following among New Yorkers who like to ski at Vail, Beaver Creek and even Aspen.

UA also operated LGA-EGE on Saturdays for a couple of seasons in the late 90s, but even that didn't last.
Common sense is not so common. -Voltaire
 
Curiousflyer
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Sat Feb 24, 2007 12:18 am

One problem I always had with the DL website is that it is unable to handle the 3 NYC airports. You cannot ask for a trip from NYC to, say, SLC, the system will ask you to precise whether it will be LGA, JFK or EWR, and thus you cannot easily combine eg LGA-SLC on a Saturday, coming back SLC-JFK on a Tuesday. That's completely stupid and always annoyed me as I am always interested in all the options, and UAL or CO (and also Orbitz, Expedia and Travelocity) have no problem dealing with that...
 
EXAAUADL
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Sat Feb 24, 2007 12:28 am

Waas this flight just for Ski Season?
 
panam330
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Sat Feb 24, 2007 12:38 am

Hopefully it will indeed return. It was nice to see a semi-unique flight being operated from LGA. What is Delta's frequency from SLC-NYC?
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Sat Feb 24, 2007 1:06 am

Quoting PanAm330 (Reply 19):
Hopefully it will indeed return. It was nice to see a semi-unique flight being operated from LGA. What is Delta's frequency from SLC-NYC?

Should be twice daily each to EWR and JFK, mostly on 757s, but during certain months also 738s.
 
panam330
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Sat Feb 24, 2007 1:21 am

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 20):
Should be twice daily each to EWR and JFK, mostly on 757s, but during certain months also 738s.

Not too bad. They cover NYC well, it seems.
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Sat Feb 24, 2007 3:24 am

Quoting PanAm330 (Reply 21):
Not too bad. They cover NYC well, it seems.

They sure do. And I need to correct, it's currently thrice daily service to JFK, actually, all on 757s.
 
WesternA318
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Sat Feb 24, 2007 11:34 am

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 22):
And I need to correct, it's currently thrice daily service to JFK, actually, all on 757s

Shoot me, but i miss seeing the daily 763's doing SLC-JFK...
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DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Sat Feb 24, 2007 9:40 pm

Quoting WesternA318 (Reply 23):
Shoot me, but i miss seeing the daily 763's doing SLC-JFK...

No need to shoot you, most of us have our widebody routes that we miss  Wink . Personally, I still miss HAM-ATL...
 
WesternA318
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Sun Feb 25, 2007 11:44 am

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 24):
No need to shoot you, most of us have our widebody routes that we miss . Personally, I still miss HAM-ATL...

LOL, the real widebody I DO miss out of SLC though would have to be the beautiful Western DC-10's and occasional TWA L-1011.  cloudnine 
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bigphilnyc
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Sun Feb 25, 2007 6:57 pm

Quoting Spinkid (Reply 4):
I've never really thought it was THAT much easier to get to LGA rather than JFK from Manhattan, especially the financial district. Maybe others disagree with me on that.

By cab, it's MUCH quicker to get to LGA than to JFK.

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 5):
What I don't understand is the efficacy of the rule itself.

Airlines fly daily services on domestic routes, there should be no less traffic on the field on Saturday and Sunday than any other day of the week. Why allow these extra sections on those two days at all?

The rule exists to allow the other NYC airport to maintain the distance niche. Sunday is busier than Saturday because everyone is coming home from their weekend trips or leaving to business trips on Monday. Saturday is by far the slowest day at the airport.

I agree with what other people said, though, that many don't know about that lone flight.
Phil Derner Jr.
 
gigneil
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Sun Feb 25, 2007 7:30 pm

Sure it might be slow inside, but I honestly am doubtful that the number of movements on the field drops off THAT significantly.

Really, the only flights that wouldn't operate might be some of the shuttle schedule. I would be very interested to see a breakdown of the LGA movements on a Friday versus a Saturday.

NS
 
AmtrakGuy
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Mon Feb 26, 2007 12:28 am

Did ATA at one time flew LGA to SJU on Saturdays? I recalled they flew this route for long time. What happened? If the route was money-making, you think ATA would try again under new owner/management?
 
A330323X
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Mon Feb 26, 2007 8:12 am

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 27):
Really, the only flights that wouldn't operate might be some of the shuttle schedule. I would be very interested to see a breakdown of the LGA movements on a Friday versus a Saturday.

Here's US Airways' schedule for next Friday and next Saturday:

ACK 2 1
ALB 5 2
AUA 0 1
BOS 16 6
BTV 8 3
BUF 9 6
BWI 9 5
CHO 3 2
CHS 2 3
CLT 10 10
CMH 6 2
DAY 4 2
DCA 16 7
FPO 0 1
GSO 6 3
GSP 3 1
ILM 3 3
IND 7 3
ITH 6 3
LEB 4 3
MHT 8 3
NAS 0 1
ORF 8 6
PHL 10 10
PIT 7 5
PVD 6 3
PWM 6 3
RDU 7 2
RIC 8 3
ROA 3 1
ROC 7 3
SAV 0 1
SDF 3 0
SYR 10 7
Total 202 115
I'm the expert on here on two things, neither of which I care about much anymore.
 
gigneil
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Mon Feb 26, 2007 8:13 am

Well there you go then.

NS
 
bigphilnyc
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Tue Feb 27, 2007 2:58 am

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 27):
I honestly am doubtful that the number of movements on the field drops off THAT significantly.

It's really dead there on Saturdays, as any spotter can tell you as well.

Quoting AmtrakGuy (Reply 28):
Did ATA at one time flew LGA to SJU on Saturdays?

I don't know about SJU, but I know they did SFO for a while.

Also, Denver is an exception, having been grandfathered in.

As for SLC, Delta went to the Supreme Court to fight the Perimeter Rule in the 80s, but lost.
Phil Derner Jr.
 
timz
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Tue Feb 27, 2007 3:00 am

Quoting BigPhilNYC (Reply 31):
As for SLC, Delta went to the Supreme Court to fight the Perimeter Rule in the 80s, but lost.

Or maybe Western?
 
WesternA318
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Tue Feb 27, 2007 7:26 am

Quoting Timz (Reply 32):
Or maybe Western?

Both airlines tried to fight the ruling for service to SLC
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panam330
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Tue Feb 27, 2007 7:32 am

Quoting WesternA318 (Reply 33):
Both airlines tried to fight the ruling for service to SLC

Any chance that DL will try again to get a perimeter exemption a la DEN? It would be nice to see daily service to LGA.
 
beertrucker
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Tue Feb 27, 2007 8:03 am

Quoting Jkudall (Reply 14):
The LGA-SLC discontinuation is only seasonal. It will return. LGA-RSW is also being seasonally discontinued in April.

I agree that it will only be seasonal. Sat-Sat would be a great trip to all those NYC ski bums out there that want to get away for a week. April is when most ski resorts do start shutting down depending on where they are located. I think you will see LGA-SLC back again for all the NYC ski bums who love the Rocky Mountains and all the fresh powder. And i do mean real powder and not the Ice slopes of the northeast.

I not trying to be mean to the northeast ski slopes. I am from New England and have ski a lot of them there. But in my eyes none of them was as great as out west. I do miss my March skiing at Vail I used to do every year.
Fly HI
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Tue Feb 27, 2007 8:22 am

Quoting PanAm330 (Reply 34):
Any chance that DL will try again to get a perimeter exemption a la DEN? It would be nice to see daily service to LGA.

Doubt that, though perhaps if DL instead offered to discontinue use of, say, 5-10 of their RJ slots at LGA to help ease congestion  Silly ...
 
ss278
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Tue Feb 27, 2007 1:25 pm

End of the ski season. It will probably be back next winter
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:57 am

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 22):
They sure do. And I need to correct, it's currently thrice daily service to JFK, actually, all on 757s.

Also EWR is on 752s as well, being code-shared with CO.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
MAH4546
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Wed Feb 28, 2007 4:57 pm

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 38):
Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 22):
They sure do. And I need to correct, it's currently thrice daily service to JFK, actually, all on 757s.

Also EWR is on 752s as well, being code-shared with CO.

Unless something has changed recently, CO and DL are not allowed to codeshare on routes between hubs. Only for through traffic, so you can buy, for example, BUR-SLC-EWR on a *CO ticket, but not EWR-SLC.
a.
 
slcdeltarumd11
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RE: Delta Ending LGA-SLC

Mon Mar 05, 2007 9:58 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 39):
Unless something has changed recently, CO and DL are not allowed to codeshare on routes between hubs. Only for through traffic, so you can buy, for example, BUR-SLC-EWR on a *CO ticket, but not EWR-SLC.

I called the continental 800 num and purchased a ewr-slc on co and a return slc-ewr on delta a few moths ago because i didnt want the red-eye co return and had no problems over the phone but i dont think you can do it online. interesting co lists the dl non stops on the electronic timetable, but DL does not list COs seperately only with connections ????