ktachiya
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Future Of AC B767-200/300

Wed Feb 28, 2007 9:43 pm


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On a.net, I have read numerous posts about the new 777 and retiring A340-300.

I have also read that the A340's would be the first ones to go after the introduction of the 777s and hence, no cabin upgrades. However, what I haven't heard about is the future status of the 767-200/300. In the original contract with Boeing when AC first ordered the 777 and then cancelled it, I think it was stated that the B767 series would get winglets in the interim. Is this project still on-going with the cabin upgrades?

In Japanese aviation magazines, The AC B767-300ER have been mentioned a couple of times. I think they are the current operator that flies the 767-300ER on the longest route (YYZ-NRT seasonally a couple of years ago, and the YVR-PVG/PEK route). It seems that the company is making profits with this ac, so would it stay in the fleet in the next decade?

On a side note, I was tracking AC35/36 flying into KIX yesterday and today. Man, it arrived at 17:33 local time and the boarding bridge was undocked at 18:20. I wonder how the ground crew was able to get the plane cleaned, cater, un-load and re-load the luggage and cargo in just 50 minutes on a long-haul international flight?

Yesterday too, the plane docked into the gate at 17:00 and left the gate at 17:56!!!!
Flown on: DC-10-30, B747-200B, B747-300, B747-300SR, B747-400, B747-400D, B767-300, B777-200, B777-200ER, B777-300
 
ktachiya
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Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:54 am

RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Wed Feb 28, 2007 9:44 pm

Just simply amazing!!!

 bigthumbsup 
Flown on: DC-10-30, B747-200B, B747-300, B747-300SR, B747-400, B747-400D, B767-300, B777-200, B777-200ER, B777-300
 
aircanada014
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Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 2:24 pm

RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Wed Feb 28, 2007 10:40 pm

Quoting Ktachiya (Thread starter):
think it was stated that the B767 series would get winglets in the interim. Is this project still on-going with the cabin upgrades?

I don't think the winglet program is happening on the B767s however some of the 200s and 300s are getting upgrade for cabin interiors. 767s will be around for at least until 787s arrive.
 
drgmobile
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Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2006 3:06 am

RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Wed Feb 28, 2007 10:58 pm

The 767s are to be replaced by the Boeing 787s. In the interim, they are to get a cabin upgrade that includes in-seat back television. I have never heard of anything about winglets.
 
beechnut
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RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Wed Feb 28, 2007 11:27 pm

I think the future of the -200s is seriously in doubt, but the -300s will be around for quite a while and they are getting the interior refurb. Incidentally the second picture above lists fin 659 as a B767-333ER and this is false. Only fins 631-636 are -333ERs originally ordered by Air Canada. Fin 659 is a 767-36NER leased from GECAS (see www.canairradio.com).

The -300s came late to Air Canada, most of them were acquired when AC bought Canadi>n, and therefore they are -375ERs, with many other variants acquired through leases. The -300ER is simply a money printing press for AC, a very flexible aircraft, capable of reasonably long ranges with a full load, but also capable of making money on high-density transcon flights or even on one-hour Rapidair shuttles YUL-YYZ-YUL. The turn-around times you list are pretty impressive for a long-haul flight but then this is a smaller widebody aircraft which helps to get them unloaded and reloaded quickly.

The 767, especially the -300ER, is truly a fine airliner, a real winner by Boeing.

Beech
 
ACA77LFAN
Posts: 28
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RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Thu Mar 01, 2007 2:36 am

Any chance that we might see some of the 762's converted to freighter versions? It would be good for AC Cargo not to have to rely so heavily on wet leased MD-11s from Gemini and World Airways.
 
bmacleod
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RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Thu Mar 01, 2007 3:26 am

No doubt the 20-24 year-old 767-200ERs will be the first to go. The 767-300ERs will stay around for a while longer.

The 6 ordered 767-333s only came to AC in 1997-98 after a five year delay. (Former CEO Hollis Harris deferred delivery as he was focused on ordering A319s to replace the DC-9s and A340s to replace the 747-100s and 747-200s). Then the 767-375ERs were assimilated into the fleet after the CP takeover.
"What good are wings without the courage to fly?" - Atticus
 
Viscount724
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Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Thu Mar 01, 2007 9:58 am

Quoting Bmacleod (Reply 6):
The 6 ordered 767-333s only came to AC in 1997-98 after a five year delay.

They must have had at least a few of their own 763s before 1997 as I flew on one YYC-ZRH on July 4, 1996. It was deffinitely a 763, not a 762. They operated nonstop YYC-ZRH 2 or 3 times a week then (codeshared with Swissair). That route only lasted a year or two. It was dropped when the Star Alliance was launched in 1997.
 
aircanada014
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Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 2:24 pm

RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Thu Mar 01, 2007 10:29 am

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 7):
They must have had at least a few of their own 763s before 1997

Yes they did have few B767-300ERs in early 90s, approx 1993.
 
blsbls99
Posts: 341
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 5:07 pm

RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Thu Mar 01, 2007 11:02 am

The latest issue of Air Transport World had an article on Aviation Partners Boeing, which stated that unannounced customers are lined up for winglets for the 767-300ER, MD-80, and 777-200ER. I wonder if AC is the customer for the 767-300ER with winglets?
319 320 313 722 732 733 735 73G 738 739 742 752 763 772 CRJ D9S ERJ EMB L10 M88 M90 SF3 AT4
 
EnviroTO
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RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Thu Mar 01, 2007 12:03 pm

I think those are mostly for the AA fleet.
 
MCOflyer
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Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2006 5:51 am

RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Thu Mar 01, 2007 12:08 pm

Quoting EnviroTO (Reply 10):
I think those are mostly for the AA fleet.

I agree and think AC wants winglets on there 767 fleet.

MCOflyer
Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
 
ktachiya
Posts: 1503
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:54 am

RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Thu Mar 01, 2007 5:10 pm

Quoting MCOflyer (Reply 11):
I agree and think AC wants winglets on there 767 fleet

I am pretty sure that in the first agreement between Boeing when they ordered the T7 for the first time (union later objected and it got cancelled) that Boeing would do the winglet works on the existing 767 fleet. But then the union cancelled the order and I don't know what happened to this project.

Quoting BeechNut (Reply 4):
very flexible aircraft, capable of reasonably long ranges with a full load, but also capable of making money on high-density transcon flights or even on one-hour Rapidair shuttles YUL-YYZ-YUL

Also on the YVR-YYZ flight. I have heard from somebody while I was spotting that the 767's were money makers for Air Canada..... I don't know if this is true.

It was interesting in a Japanese aviation magazine it introduced the shortest route on the 767, NH flying their -300 from Osaka Itami to Matsuyama (160 nm) and the longest was AC's YVR-PVG route.
Flown on: DC-10-30, B747-200B, B747-300, B747-300SR, B747-400, B747-400D, B767-300, B777-200, B777-200ER, B777-300
 
HB-IWC
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Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2000 1:09 am

RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Thu Mar 01, 2007 5:27 pm

Quoting Ktachiya (Thread starter):
On a side note, I was tracking AC35/36 flying into KIX yesterday and today. Man, it arrived at 17:33 local time and the boarding bridge was undocked at 18:20. I wonder how the ground crew was able to get the plane cleaned, cater, un-load and re-load the luggage and cargo in just 50 minutes on a long-haul international flight?

Japanese airports are know the world around for their efficiency in ground services. I visited a couple of those airports a bit over a year ago as part of an airline delegation, and the handling company could guarantee to turn around a full inbound A333 in no more than 60 minutes blocks on to blocks off. I've meanwhile seen many instances during which they did it in under an hour, and the great thing about is that the cabins are usually cleaner than during longer turn arounds at other airports.
 
MCOflyer
Posts: 7071
Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2006 5:51 am

RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Thu Mar 01, 2007 5:34 pm

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 13):

Amen to that. I've heard similar instances from neighbor who used to fly the T7 for UA.

MCOflyer
Never be afraid to stand up for who you are.
 
yow
Posts: 2125
Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2001 2:47 pm

RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Fri Mar 02, 2007 1:17 am

Quoting AirCanada014 (Reply 8):
Yes they did have few B767-300ERs in early 90s, approx 1993.

Yes indeed. Fins 631-636 are the original AC 763s.
 
Viscount724
Posts: 19046
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

RE: Future Of AC B767-200/300

Fri Mar 02, 2007 6:29 am

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 13):
Japanese airports are know the world around for their efficiency in ground services. I visited a couple of those airports a bit over a year ago as part of an airline delegation, and the handling company could guarantee to turn around a full inbound A333 in no more than 60 minutes blocks on to blocks off.

I have seen CO turn a 762 around at GVA in less than 60 minutes when the inbound flight was late. The scheduled turnaround is 90 minutes, relatively short for a longhaul widebody, although 762 obviously should be faster than larger types.

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