panamair
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Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 12:04 pm

Due to the anticipated weather problems in the Northeast U.S. on Friday March 16, DL16 which normally routes ATL-JFK-BOM will go nonstop instead from ATL to BOM, skipping the JFK stop. The return on March 18 is still scheduled to go BOM-JFK-ATL as the weather should be better on Sunday....ATL-BOM is 7,395 nm but given the favorable eastbound winds currently, it shouldn't be a problem. They need to get the plane over there as the return BOM-JFK on Sunday is quite oversold...
 
DL WIDGET HEAD
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 12:21 pm

WOW! Thank God for the favorable winds. I guess nonrevs can forget about getting on this flight.
 
Nimish
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 2:40 pm

Wow - excellent opportunity for DL to test the waters for a non-stop ATL-BOM Big grin!

However - what happens to the passengers ticketed to board at JFK? Do they get a free ride to ATL or do they get sent by the next available service?
Latest Trip Report - GoAir BLR-BOM-BLR
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 5:39 pm

ATL-BOM nonstop on 772, holy damn! Full power for the Jetstream then. How long would the flight time be for that flight, 17 hours or so?
 
albird87
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 6:22 pm

I just hope DL got the right timings and wind speed and strength!!! Dont want to be on that flight deck when the wind shifts or drops and then the pilots are looking for a tech stop somewhere in the Middle East!!
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 6:53 pm

Quoting Albird87 (Reply 4):
I just hope DL got the right timings and wind speed and strength!!! Dont want to be on that flight deck when the wind shifts or drops and then the pilots are looking for a tech stop somewhere in the Middle East!!

If the flight takes the most direct route, it shouldn't get anywhere close to the Middle East unless you count Pakistan.
 
IADLHR
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 7:02 pm

Wonder how many pax were booked ATL-BOM.
 
Norcal773
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 7:12 pm

Quoting Panamair (Thread starter):
7,395 nm

Reason why they have the 772LR coming their way  biggrin 
If you're going through hell, keep going
 
albird87
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 7:55 pm

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 5):
If the flight takes the most direct route, it shouldn't get anywhere close to the Middle East unless you count Pakistan.

Excuse me if im worng but wouldnt the direct route take it over Iran and onto into India?? So the flight will have to cross the Middle East at some point!!
Unless anybody can show me a map of the route!
 
9V-SPJ
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 8:15 pm

Amazing. 2nd longest 772ER flight ever after SIN-LAX (when SQ had to once substitute the B772ER for an A345 gone tech).

9V-SPJ
 
mtsubshe
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 8:25 pm

i believe from atlanta ,it flies east towards spain, then cross the mediterranean sea, into jordan , to saudi arabia, to oman then to bombay, any way it will be a long flight,
 
VictorKilo
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 8:45 pm

Quoting Albird87 (Reply 8):
Unless anybody can show me a map of the route!

Here's the great circle mapper map of the route. If it had to do a tech stop, it's going to be KEF, LED, or maybe SVO, but not DXB or MAD.
 
bobnwa
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 8:50 pm

Quoting Mtsubshe (Reply 10):
i believe from atlanta ,it flies east towards spain, then cross the mediterranean sea, into jordan , to saudi arabia, to oman then to bombay, any way it will be a long flight,

That aircraft won't come anywhere near Spain, as that would be way out of the way.
 
cricket
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 8:52 pm

Oh man, this is going to be one hell of a flight, favorable winds or not, DL should hope for minimal congestion at BOM.
A300B2/B4/6R, A313, A319/320/321, A333, A343, A388, 737-2/3/4/7/8/9, 747-3/4, 772/2E/2L/3, E170/190, F70, CR2/7, 146-3,
 
mtsubshe
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 8:59 pm

how about they take the same route as they fly to tel aviv from atlanta,then to jordan, to saudi, then oman ,to bombay
 
DL787932ER
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 9:12 pm

Quoting Mtsubshe (Reply 14):
how about they take the same route as they fly to tel aviv from atlanta,then to jordan, to saudi, then oman ,to bombay

That's hundreds of nm out of the way:



Northern route is ATL-BOM, southern route is ATL-TLV-AMM-RUH-MCT-BOM. There's no reason to take such a circuitous route, especially when the aircraft is already pushing endurance limits.
F L Y D E L T A J E T S
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 9:15 pm

Quoting Mtsubshe (Reply 14):
how about they take the same route as they fly to tel aviv from atlanta,then to jordan, to saudi, then oman ,to bombay

Such a routing would add 400nm to the flight, not a good option.
 
brightcedars
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Fri Mar 16, 2007 9:31 pm

If I'm not mistaken, 400nm more isn't that much considering the overall distance.

Let's not forget that if the winds are favorable it may be more on the proposed route that the most direct route as winds usually go around an emisphere, not via the top.

Average 80nm winds for 15hrs would still give you an added 1200nm range, wouldn't it? Minus the 400 that's still a full 800nm more. Not to mention the winds can be faster and the flight block longer.
I want the European Union flag on airliners.net!
 
EWRCabincrew
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 12:15 am

Did DL's BOM-JFK flight come in this morning? Why not use that aircraft for the scheduled JFK-BOM flight and just cancel the JFK-ATL-JFK segments?

Are any other DL international flights cancelling? Very interesting.
You can't cure stupid
 
jacobin777
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 12:15 am

Quoting Albird87 (Reply 4):
! Dont want to be on that flight deck when the wind shifts or drops and then the pilots are looking for a tech stop somewhere in the Middle East!!

.....any particular reason ?
"Up the Irons!"
 
AirTranTUS
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 12:50 am

Quoting VictorKilo (Reply 11):
Here's the great circle mapper map of the route. If it had to do a tech stop, it's going to be KEF, LED, or maybe SVO, but not DXB or MAD.

The direct Great Circle route doesn't take the winds into account, which DL is counting on for the nonstop to work. The winds for today show the jet stream blowing across the Atlantic just south of Iceland and across Africa and the Middle East, which is south of the GCR.

http://squall.sfsu.edu/gif/jetstream_norhem_00.gif
I love ASO!
 
avi8tir
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 2:02 am

So, what are they doing with the passengers that were to go JFK-BOM? are they flying them to ATL or are they just screwed. I would think that JFK-BOM segment would make the majority of passengers, not the ATL-JFK-BOM passengers.
*Long live the Widget*
 
RobertS975
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 2:08 am

Quoting Avi8tir (Reply 21):
So, what are they doing with the passengers that were to go JFK-BOM? are they flying them to ATL or are they just screwed. I would think that JFK-BOM segment would make the majority of passengers, not the ATL-JFK-BOM passengers.

Many, many flights out of JFK are cancelled today... snowstorm. Nonetheless, they need to get the plane to BOM for the return flight.

As for a tech stop, my bet is MAN... that seems to be where the westbound flights have been pulling in. Maybe nonstop... the flight should be relatively light without the JFK pax, luggage and cargo.
 
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spinkid
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 2:23 am

quite likely will be a very empty flight going ATL-BOM. I imagine they pick up most traffic as O & D from JFK and those passengers weren't rerouted through ATL instead.
 
EA772LR
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 2:23 am

Is this the route DL is planning to put the 77L on? that would be an easy route route for the 77L

And why did DL not purchase more 772ER's?

And would DL ever purchase the 773ER or just possibly wait for the 787-11?? in about 8 years or so??
We often judge others by their actions, but ourselves by our intentions.
 
RL757PVD
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 2:24 am

Quoting Avi8tir (Reply 21):
. I would think that JFK-BOM segment would make the majority of passengers, not the ATL-JFK-BOM passengers.

I flew on the ATL-JFK portion of this flight before x-mas (connecting to PVD) and i was suprised at just how many people were continuing onward to BOM, id estimate it was probably 50%.

Connecting pax have probably been rebooked to connect in ATl rather than JFK. If people are able to get out of JFK, they can probably get down to ATL for thr flight. Id imagine 75-80% of the total BOM bound pax will be accomodated.
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 2:28 am

This is just one more reason why DL's 777 order should include even more 772LRs, not to mention perhaps a 773ER or two.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
rwsea
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 2:44 am

Quoting EA772LR (Reply 24):
Is this the route DL is planning to put the 77L on? that would be an easy route route for the 77L

And why did DL not purchase more 772ER's?

And would DL ever purchase the 773ER or just possibly wait for the 787-11?? in about 8 years or so??

All of these questions have been answered very recently on A.net - do a search and you'll find all the information you could ever want.
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 3:02 am

Quoting 9V-SPJ (Reply 9):
2nd longest 772ER flight ever after SIN-LAX (when SQ had to once substitute the B772ER for an A345 gone tech).

slight correction:
that would've been the longest 772ER flight operated with commercial paying pax

Both BA and MH's aircraft have bested that; with non-commercial pax and no pax, respectively.

Quoting EA772LR (Reply 24):
And why did DL not purchase more 772ER's?

Pay dispute with DALPA, among other issues.

Quoting EA772LR (Reply 24):
And would DL ever purchase the 773ER



Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 26):
not to mention perhaps a 773ER or two.

... if you two held your breath until they did, there's a fairly good chance you'd survive  Wink
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
RDUDDJI
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 3:14 am

Quoting Cricket (Reply 13):
Oh man, this is going to be one hell of a flight, favorable winds or not, DL should hope for minimal congestion at BOM.

I think they'll be fine. Remember, they are leaving a good amount of pax behind at JFK. They should be able to put a ton of juice on that bad boy. This should also help them clear their backlog of BOM cargo at ATL (if they have one...)
Sometimes we don't realize the good times when we're in them
 
EWRCabincrew
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 3:18 am

Any DL people here to answer this:

Quoting EWRCabincrew (Reply 18):
Did DL's BOM-JFK flight come in this morning? Why not use that aircraft for the scheduled JFK-BOM flight and just cancel the JFK-ATL-JFK segments?

Are any other DL international flights cancelling?

Thanks in advance.
You can't cure stupid
 
N839MH
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 3:35 am

DL 17 arrived from BOM this morning in JFK @ 08:22 at the gate. Now 17 is out of the gate and headed
for Atlanta...now showing off the ground yet!
Solodude!
 
RL757PVD
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 3:37 am

Actually it shows a delay in JFK for the ATL return flight, due into ATL just before 6pm (sched for around noon)

My guess it they were able to caputure some of the JFK-BOM pax this way

Essetnally they "flipped it" from BOM-JFK-ATL-JFK-BOM to BOM-JFK-ATL-BOM, practically a direct routing for JFK-BOM via ATL. when the 77s are maxed out as much as DL's are its a smart move to limit the risk of a 777 getting stuck somewhere...
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
EWRCabincrew
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 3:39 am

Quoting N839MH (Reply 32):
DL 17 arrived from BOM this morning in JFK @ 08:22 at the gate. Now 17 is out of the gate and headed
for Atlanta...now showing off the ground yet!

Thank you. Couldn't DL have sent that plane out tonight to BOM and save the inconvenience of those with no flight tonight? Just cancel the JFK-ATL-JFK legs, especially since international is the bread winner.

Just wonder what the logic is involved with this decision. Just curious.
You can't cure stupid
 
UpperDeck79
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 3:42 am

Quoting VictorKilo (Reply 11):
Here's the great circle mapper map of the route. If it had to do a tech stop, it's going to be KEF, LED, or maybe SVO, but not DXB or MAD.

I'm 99 % sure they would pick HEL over LED...
AY and ANA rock!
 
airmailer
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 3:58 am

Quoting EWRCabincrew (Reply 34):
Thank you. Couldn't DL have sent that plane out tonight to BOM and save the inconvenience of those with no flight tonight? Just cancel the JFK-ATL-JFK legs, especially since international is the bread winner.

Just wonder what the logic is involved with this decision. Just curious.

That's a very good question, the only logical answer that I can guess at is that there must be more people in ATL trying to get to BOM than in JFK.... I know, I know, some would say that's impossible because Ney York is so special; but there are a lot of companies in Atlanta that work with companies in India so it's at least plausible.
 
EWRCabincrew
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:04 am

Quoting AirMailer (Reply 36):
the only logical answer that I can guess at is that there must be more people in ATL trying to get to BOM than in JFK.... I know, I know, some would say that's impossible because New York is so special; but there are a lot of companies in Atlanta that work with companies in India so it's at least plausible.

I thought about that too, but our DEL flight is always full (based on that, I would suspect DL's BOM would follow suit), so I can only imagine a handful of people originating (and connecting through) in ATL.

Anyone else to shed light on this?
You can't cure stupid
 
mandargb
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:13 am

Hi,
If they can do ATL-BOM non-stop (8510 Mi)
Why dont they do SFO-BOM non-stop (8406) on great circle mapper.
Regards.
 
RL757PVD
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:15 am

Quoting EWRCabincrew (Reply 37):
Anyone else to shed light on this?

see my above post... it was significantly delayed in JFK....i imagine some of the JFK-BOM pax were able to make the JFK-ATL flight then continue on to BOM, connecting pax to BOM can easily be re routed via ATL as well, meaning most people will be able to be accomodated.

Essentially todays flight was JFK-ATL BOM as opposed to ATL-JFK-BOM. since they had advance notice, perhaps they were able to nofitysome/all pax to get them to go earlier and go via ATL...
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
positiverate
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:20 am

Quoting Mandargb (Reply 37):
If they can do ATL-BOM non-stop (8510 Mi)
Why dont they do SFO-BOM non-stop (8406) on great circle mapper.

Why would they? DL's presence in SFO, while not negligible, certainly doesn't warrant flying SFO-BOM. It makes far more sense to fly it out of a place like JFK or ATL.
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:21 am

Quoting Mandargb (Reply 37):
Why dont they do SFO-BOM non-stop (8406) on great circle mapper.

Why should DL fly SFO-BOM?!?
 
cba
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:30 am

Quoting BrightCedars (Reply 17):
If I'm not mistaken, 400nm more isn't that much considering the overall distance.

Considering that the flight is already pushing the limits of the 772ER, 400nm extra is a hell of a lot of extra distance.
 
EWRCabincrew
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:41 am

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 38):
see my above post... it was significantly delayed in JFK

I did. We must be missing each other. For the BOM-JFK-ATL connects, the JFK-ATL was delayed.

What I mean is cancel the 777 service to ATL from JFK, let it sit (the 777) in JFK till this evening for the scheduled JFK-BOM flight. No need to cancel it. With regards to the originating ATL-JFK people, rebook them on other DL (or whomever) flights to JFK or whomever to get there (to BOM).

Quoting RL757PVD (Reply 38):
Essentially todays flight was JFK-ATL BOM as opposed to ATL-JFK-BOM. since they had advance notice, perhaps they were able to nofitysome/all pax to get them to go earlier and go via ATL...

I understand that as well, but why go to ATL, when there was a perfectly good 777 in JFK this morning, with a crew base at JFK, that could have been readied for tonight's flight as scheduled. Albeit a few less passengers from the ATL-JFK sector.

It seems a bit strange to fly the JFK-BOM people to ATL to go non-stop (I can only assume the majority of the people were originating out of JFK). Since this is DL's only 777 flight out of JFK, wouldn't DL be better pressed to let the arrival this morning from BOM be tonight's flight?
You can't cure stupid
 
worldtraveler
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:42 am

No airline wants to have a plane sitting on the tarmac for hours waiting for takeoff clearance and deicing but you certainly don’t want it on a flight that is operating near maximum duty time for the crew. The people in NYC will wait for the weather to clear to get on lots of flights…. For now, DL keeps its BOM operation running. 17 BOM-JFK for tomorrow is already in the air so if the NE is still a mess, DL will have to think fast to find to a place to set 17 down. The westbound segment is the one that pushes the 777ER to its limits, not going eastbound.
 
cba
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:47 am

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 43):
The westbound segment is the one that pushes the 777ER to its limits, not going eastbound.

Yeah, there's no way the westbound BOM-ATL could be done without a fuel stop (or severely reduced payload) by a 772ER, which is why they're flying via JFK on the way back.

For DL this is a perfect opportunity: test the waters of a nonstop ATL-BOM (potential 77L route when they get them) and skip the weather mess in JFK.
 
Thenoflyzone
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:47 am

My money's on a tech-stop in HEL of ARN !!!

7395nm, even with the tail winds, that's pushing it for a fully laden 772ER. Dont forget, that plane needs extra tonnes of fuel to do an approach at BOM, overshoot, hold for 30 minutes, go to the alternate and land, + 5 or 10%. That's a lot of fuel !!!

Thenoflyzone

[Edited 2007-03-16 21:55:37]
us Air Traffic Controllers have a good record, we haven't left one up there yet !!
 
positiverate
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:52 am

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 43):
No airline wants to have a plane sitting on the tarmac for hours waiting for takeoff clearance and deicing but you certainly don’t want it on a flight that is operating near maximum duty time for the crew. The people in NYC will wait for the weather to clear to get on lots of flights….

ESPECIALLY in the shadow of what happened at JFK a few weeks ago with B6. DL also got bad press from keeping pax on the airplane at the gate with the door open and folks free to come and go. No one wants a repeat of that.

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 43):
For now, DL keeps its BOM operation running.

And, they minimize the inconvenience for as many pax as possible...
 
mtsubshe
Posts: 65
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:53 am

what is the departure time for this flight from atlanta to bombay, any one knows about it
 
RL757PVD
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:54 am

Quoting EWRCabincrew (Reply 42):
I understand that as well, but why go to ATL,

1) Having flown DL 16 ATL-JFK id estimate 50% of the BOM pax were on the ATL leg to start

2) Any connecting pax from non-JFK cities can be re-routed to connect in ATL with no change in their schedules drom orional departure to orional arrival times.

3) Any potential crew schedling and mx issues, esp with the winter storm.

With most people probably being able to get to BOM, and currently its sched in for nearly the same time as the JFK arriva; (arr BOM 15 min late), its not really an inconvenience, just a unique schedule adjustment.
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
worldtraveler
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RE: Delta To Go ATL-BOM Nonstop On March 16

Sat Mar 17, 2007 4:55 am

9.50 pm dept. from ATL; 10.20 pm arrival in BOM; they are obviously trying to arrive close to their assigned slot time in BOM.

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