kaitak
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The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 4:04 am

Will you join in our crusade
Who will be strong and stand with me.
Beyond the barricade
Is there a world you long to see!

Forgive me a little exuberance, but what a way to end an old thread and start a new one! New dawn, new challenges, new opportunities. After so many long years, the shackles we imposed on ourselves are being cast aside and finally, Ireland will begin to achieve its potential as an entrepot between Europe and North America. The US this week, then Canada - hopefully - later this year.

Lots of things to look forward to: either this week or next, we should be seeing the flight times for the new routes. We could see the fleet decision being made sometime next month. As I've said before, I've often thought that one of the major hold-ups was the lack of certainty as a result of the stopover and the continuing EU/US negotiations, which made forward planning - for the interim fleet - very difficult. Now, with that out of the way, EI knows when it can offer new routes and when it will need new aircraft.

Who knows what next year will bring? Only one thing is certain: if you think Dublin Airport is bad now ... Wait 'till next year; it's going to be a zoo! However, it will be good to see United and Northwest (did I really say that? "good to see" and "Northwest" in the same sentence? I really need to get out more!)

Hopefully, the Cork Airport Authority will be able to go across to the US and start pitching to airlines; I strongly believe there is potential there for a 757 operation to the NE, either NYC or BOS.

The future looks very bright, all of a sudden!
 
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shamrock350
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 4:18 am

What a week and hopefully it will reflect what a year it's going to be!

Quoting Kaitak (Thread starter):
Hopefully, the Cork Airport Authority will be able to go across to the US and start pitching to airlines; I strongly believe there is potential there for a 757 operation to the NE, either NYC or BOS.

I really think CO or DL would be interested in ORK. I believe ORK has lots of potential but it is a shame about the debt and limited space at the moment.
CO or DL have expressed interest in ORK but they wanted O/S and the new terminal out of they way I think. So now they are both out of the way hopefully they will still be interested because I dont think EI will be sending any A330s down there  Wink
 
COEI2007
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 4:45 am

I love the Evening Heralds reporting. Apparently, North Western airlines is interested in flying from Dublin to detroit and cinncinnatti!!!!

On a side note, does anybody work for, or has worked for Excel/ XL airways?? Even anybody who know's somebody who's worked there!!! I'm interested to know what they're like to work for, as they're looking for DUB based CC, and i'm sick of EI not calling me, so XL seems appealing!
 
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shamrock350
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 4:59 am

There are some new pictures of Dublin's future projects such as Pier D and the new walkway. Looks good and sorry if you have seen them before.

http://www.dublinairportauthority.co...nt/Pier_D/pierD_image_gallery.html

I can't wait to see it open but will it be mainly FR there?
 
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OA260
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 6:38 am

Quoting COEI2007 (Reply 2):
On a side note, does anybody work for, or has worked for Excel/ XL airways?? Even anybody who know's somebody who's worked there!!! I'm interested to know what they're like to work for, as they're looking for DUB based CC, and i'm sick of EI not calling me, so XL seems appealing!

All I know is that they have nice AC . Sure what have you to loose , id go for it . XL on your CV will look good even if you only do it for the summer season.
 
BrianDromey
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 7:24 am

Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 1):

I really think CO or DL would be interested in ORK. I believe ORK has lots of potential but it is a shame about the debt and limited space at the moment.

ORK certainly has bags of potential, and I agree that the debt/terminal move have been a big distraction to the CAA. Now its time to move on. Space at ORK is not that limited, all that is required are a few busses/covered walkways to the more remote stands. For commercial flights ORK has some stands available at pretty much any time of the day, it just needs to use the stands it has more efficiently. As for biz-jets and the like, things would be pretty tight.

Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 1):
So now they are both out of the way hopefully they will still be interested because I dont think EI will be sending any A330s down

I agree, unless perhaps the aircraft could be 'shared' with SNN, routing SNN-JFK-ORK-JFK-SNN. There would be no need for SNN/DUB crews to operate ORK-JFK, or vice-versa. I think 11 services a week for SNN split between JFK/BOS on 333 metal would suffice, initially, at least.

Brian
Next flights: MAN-ORK-LHR(EI)-MAN(BD); MAN-LHR(BD)-ORK (EI); DUB-ZRH-LAX (LX) LAX-YYZ (AC) YYZ-YHZ-LHR(AC)-DUB(BD)
 
kaitak
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 1:01 pm

Quoting Kaitak (Thread starter):
The US this week, then Canada - hopefully - later this year.

They've obviously taken delivery of a big consignment of pep pills in Kildare Street, because with the ink hardly dry on the EU/US agreement, the minister has announced that Ireland and Canada will be doing an open skies deal, along the lines of the British one, later this year. Terrific news!

Here's the link; unfortunately, it's a subscription site, but the gist of it is that the govt will be looking to conclude a deal next year which removes all limitations and frequency restrictions, including - of course - the Shannon stopover.

EI has said it "could be interested" in flights to Canada and would focus on Montreal. There could be scope for ski charters to Calgary and perhaps flights to Vancouver and Montreal.

http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/finance/2007/0324/1174528536763.html
 
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OA260
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 5:20 pm

Hi all, Well just wondering if anyone read the ''Travel Extra'' newspaper. There are some interesting articles in this issue.

DAA are in talks with MH/SQ/TG for possible airlinks to Dublin. I wish them well with this . Dublin seems to be on a roll at the moment so heres hoping.

Area 14 dilemma solved. The €17m facility will be used by long haul airlines other than EI. So I guess EY/GF/DL/CO/AA will all move down there in due course.

Vision Air has been looking for a direct service from DUB to LOS to get more use from its 767!!! It has been looking for access to STN but could choose DUB!!!! (cant wait)!!!

Cityjet will not launch any new route from Dublin until the DAA improve infrastructure according to its chief executive Geoffrey O'Byrne.

And to my suprise there was a big write up in this issue on the Azores!!!! And yours truly is in one of the photos!!!!

Have a good weekend .
 
smokeyrosco
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 6:05 pm

Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 3):
I can't wait to see it open but will it be mainly FR there?

Doubt it, I'm sure it will take up the traffic from the C Pier when it closes (Or Half Closes) but also the extra capacity thats been coming on stream increasing had no place to go. But Time will tell I guess.
John Hancock
 
BrianDromey
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 6:16 pm

Quoting OA260 (Reply 7):
Area 14 dilemma solved. The €17m facility will be used by long haul airlines other than EI. So I guess EY/GF/DL/CO/AA will all move down there in due course.

Is this really solving anything though? Most of these airlines have flights in the mornings, with few flights in the evenings and late afternoons (EY are the only ones who spring to mind). I think it will still be a zoo at DUB at most times of the day. The only real problems at DUB are are around the FR check-ins the rest may be busy, but they are definitely as chaotic or as conjested as the FR areas.

Quoting Smokeyrosco (Reply 8):
Doubt it, I'm sure it will take up the traffic from the C Pier when it closes (Or Half Closes) but also the extra capacity thats been coming on stream increasing had no place to go. But Time will tell I guess.

Pier D is designed as a "low-cost" area for DUB, for swift turnarounds and short haul aircraft. There will not be any air bridges AFAIK and the DAA have already announced that PierD will be mainly used by FR.

Who knows where the a/c at Pier C will go....perhaps to the new remote stands?

Brian.
Next flights: MAN-ORK-LHR(EI)-MAN(BD); MAN-LHR(BD)-ORK (EI); DUB-ZRH-LAX (LX) LAX-YYZ (AC) YYZ-YHZ-LHR(AC)-DUB(BD)
 
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OA260
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 7:00 pm

Quoting BrianDromey (Reply 9):
Is this really solving anything though? Most of these airlines have flights in the mornings, with few flights in the evenings and late afternoons (EY are the only ones who spring to mind). I think it will still be a zoo at DUB at most times of the day. The only real problems at DUB are are around the FR check-ins the rest may be busy, but they are definitely as chaotic or as conjested as the FR areas.

I still think FR should be forced to area 14 as it would seperate the LCC from the others and cause alot less congestion, also a seperate security area should be set up for the LCC also. It makes sense and would free up the main terminal for new carriers.
 
rineanna
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 7:39 pm

Quoting OA260 (Reply 10):
I still think FR should be forced to area 14 as it would seperate the LCC from the others and cause alot less congestion, also a seperate security area should be set up for the LCC also. It makes sense and would free up the main terminal for new carriers.

I know we're along way away from even having terminal two operational, but could the DAA not take a leaf out of Marseille airport's book and look into building a dedicated 'no-frills' terminal like the mp2 one Marseille built. I mean, the McEvaddy brother's were proposing to build their own terminal at the other side of thew airport, so surely the DAA could look into building a facility away from the existing Terminal 1 and 2 area which would facilitate what Brian described Pier D to be:

Quoting BrianDromey (Reply 9):
for swift turnarounds and short haul aircraft

...it wouldn't have to be a 'Taj-Mahal' of a terminal, as MOL likes to call terminal two, it would just have basic facilities and a simple and efficient method of processing large volumes of PAX (security, baggage, etc) utilising low-cost airlines. It would obviously have to have lower charges in order to entice any of the LCCs over there. If you think about it, it would mean Ryanair (who in fairness, as OA260 pointed out, are one of the top two contributors to the current congestion),SkyEurope, Centralwings, Germanwings and FlyBE would have lower cost facilities, and facilities better equipped to facilitate tight-turnarounds.

Terminal one could then be used to facilitate the charter airlines, Full-service short-haul & long-haul carriers (including the expected arrival of NW and United birds); Terminal two would then facilitate EI's short-haul and long-haul aircraft, along with the aircraft of its partners. I'm not sure of the stands available for long/short haul aircraft for both T1 and T2, so i'm not sure if the afore mentioned is operationally possible, but i'm merely surmising.

[Edited 2007-03-24 12:41:00]
 
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OA260
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 8:05 pm

Quoting Rineanna (Reply 11):
I know we're along way away from even having terminal two operational, but could the DAA not take a leaf out of Marseille airport's book and look into building a dedicated 'no-frills' terminal like the mp2 one Marseille built. I mean, the McEvaddy brother's were proposing to build their own terminal at the other side of thew airport, so surely the DAA could look into building a facility away from the existing Terminal 1 and 2 area which would facilitate what Brian described Pier D to be:

Yes well that would be the ''sensible'' option but it is DAA we are talking about . One thing I can never understand about this country is the mind set of the way they do business here, it seems like they FIX things when they break rather than replace. If its gonna last us for another 5 years even though its under pressure then do nothing. I really find it weird for a country thats supposed to be one of the richest in EU. Where is all the money going????

Wouldnt it be great if DAA said ok we will flatten Dublin airport and build a airport like AMS all under on roof with a high speed rail link to Dublin city centre. One big terminal with 40 air bridges and 20 security scanners that all work at peak hours to reduce queing times. In turn you would attract top class airlines and boost Irish tourism and transit traffice as a mini hub.
 
bx737
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 9:17 pm

First of all great news about open skies. The potential is there to make it really work in EIs favour. It is great to see the new routes being announced and hopefully it will lead to further l/h expansion at EI.

My one gripe at the moment is transfers. Why do transfer pax have to go out and clear security again at Dub. It is a pain to have to explain to pax where they have to go for their onward connection. It adds to the mayhem at Dub and from talking to pax it is annoying for them. As EI cabin crew passengers say it is my fault that they have to do this  irked . I remember a few years ago there was a transfer lounge airside in Dub. This was very good for pax and made Dub a good place to transit. Dub has the advantage of immigration clearance but is let down by the requirement to go landside, clear security to come back airside to board your onward flight. I was speaking with a pax who was going BCN-DUB-JFK and vv who said he would never go through Dub again, Iberia, who he hated with a passion, was better than flying through Dublin. I believe something has to be done about this. If there is a need to clear security in Dub, why not set up somewhere airside that would mean transfer passengers not going landside.


Going back to the red dots on the seats  duck  it was asked in the previous forum why some of the never aircraft EI-DEB and DEF were mentioned have the big meatball and CVB has the minimeatball, a possible reason is that CVA-CVD were refitted from 159 to 174 seats after the initial deliveries of the DEx aircraft and by that stage EI had cutback on the meatballs they served. I do also agree that green seats would be preferable to blue. The BAe146 were fitted with green leather seats in 2002. They looked very well. I believe that was an experiment to see the durability of leather over material seat covers. It cost them €150,000 (iirc) to recover the material seats with leather for the fleet of 146s and they had recouped that in a very short time through reductions in cleaning costs of the material seats.
 
kaitak
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 9:18 pm

Quoting OA260 (Reply 12):
Wouldnt it be great if DAA said ok we will flatten Dublin airport and build a airport like AMS all under on roof with a high speed rail link to Dublin city centre. One big terminal with 40 air bridges and 20 security scanners that all work at peak hours to reduce queing times. In turn you would attract top class airlines and boost Irish tourism and transit traffice as a mini hub.

I've always thought the best option would be to have a new T3 facility at the far side of the airport and this is already planned by Fingal CC; however, because the DAA isn't likely to be operating it, they're planning to get 100% of the airport's operations confined to "their" side of the airport. Unfortunately, because the govt seems have to give the DAA its head and not interfere too much ... hence we're unlikely to see this for quite a while.

My solution:
The DAA is relieved of its terminal operator status, but is given responsibility for overall airfield operations, for the entire property. Individual terminals - pax and cargo - would be operated by reputable, well known operators and will pay rental and service charges to the DAA. The DAA will be responsible for fire/emergency services, public transport management, security, grounds maintenance, airfield/navaid maintenance etc.
 
bx737
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 9:27 pm

Kaitak, that is a great idea...........which is why it won't happen
 
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OA260
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 10:37 pm

Quoting Kaitak (Reply 14):
I've always thought the best option would be to have a new T3 facility

Build T3 and T2 with an underground shuttle between them then knock down the current embarrasement and WOW we have a new airport with top class facilites.


Another thing I read in the ''Travel Extra'' was the following::

''Aer Lingus has completed its upgrade of the business product on their long haul aircraft to Dubai and the USA. The refit involves a new business cabin,new carpets,new lighting,new covers and electronic seating in Premier seats,power points for laptops in Premier,upgraded inflight entertainment facilities including hande held Panasonic DVD players in Premier. The make over will be completed by April 1st''

So is this it then ???? They are just putting new seat covers on and no new flatbed seats???? Im confused!!!!
 
COEI2007
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sat Mar 24, 2007 10:50 pm

Quoting OA260 (Reply 7):
Area 14 dilemma solved. The €17m facility will be used by long haul airlines other than EI. So I guess EY/GF/DL/CO/AA will all move down there in due course.

I'm pretty sure DL, CO and AA wont
 
EI787
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 3:24 am

I notice that the Shannon ATC link is working again on http://www.liveatc.net. It's been down for some while now and it's great to see it back up again!!
 
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shamrock350
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 7:17 am

Quoting OA260 (Reply 16):
So is this it then ???? They are just putting new seat covers on and no new flatbed seats???? Im confused!!!!

They want Premier to be relaunched by April but from what DM said last week the "cocoon" seats are still being installed on new aircraft EI-DUO and EI-DUZ.
 
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OA260
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 7:30 am

I wonder if they will every use the new AC on the DUB to AGP run when they are not being used. Would be nice to see it. Failing that a long haul trip may be on the cards.


Irish Summertime starts in a few hours , dont forget to move your clocks FORWARD an hour !!! Time to throw out the old timetables.....

[Edited 2007-03-25 00:32:08]
 
kaitak
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 12:16 pm

Apparently, significant announcements are to be made in the coming week ... the 787 order and the new EI base. Word has it that it's going to be ... London! I can't say I'm too happy about that ...
 
rineanna
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 6:53 pm

Quoting Kaitak (Reply 21):
London! I can't say I'm too happy about that ...

YOU WHAT?! Oh no. Well it can't be LHR unless they sacrifice some of their SNN/ORK/DUB flights; They wouldn't dare enter Stansted, would they? Luton also has both EZY and RYR in large portions, so that leaves LGW. There's a significant EZY presence there with RYR just on the Dublin, Shannon and Cork routes. I've heard slots aren't exactly easy to come by either, well, the RIGHT slots, with a few carriers like Helvetic after moving their operations to Luton to secure the optimum times. Not quite sure what EI are going to do here. Unless they shock us all and buy a few Avros and launch a base at LCY or Southend!! (Joking of course)
 
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shamrock350
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 7:22 pm

Quoting Kaitak (Reply 21):
Apparently, significant announcements are to be made in the coming week ... the 787 order and the new EI base. Word has it that it's going to be ... London! I can't say I'm too happy about that ...

So we are sure it's going to be a 787 order then? Either way I'm happy!

London? That would be a bad move, at every airport you have LCCs apart from LHR where you have BD and BA who would be pretty annoyed to have EI taking them on but if EI can offer lower fares than BA and BD who knows! Also dont EI have unused slots at LHR, they are the fourth largest slot holder arent they?
 
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OA260
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 7:40 pm

Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 23):
London? That would be a bad move, at every airport you have LCCs apart from LHR where you have BD and BA who would be pretty annoyed to have EI taking them on but if EI can offer lower fares than BA and BD who knows! Also dont EI have unused slots at LHR, they are the fourth largest slot holder arent they?

Hmm well EI always had an un official base at LHR . In the old days they had a big presence in T1 and handled many other airlines in T3 and T2. It would be nice to see them big at LHR again, those slots are gold dust.
 
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shamrock350
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 7:49 pm

Quoting OA260 (Reply 24):
Hmm well EI always had an un official base at LHR . In the old days they had a big presence in T1 and handled many other airlines in T3 and T2. It would be nice to see them big at LHR again, those slots are gold dust.

I remember watching the program "Airport" on BBC1 and Aer Lingus was all over the place, they had staff in T2 and T3 we saw EI handling other airlines such as African and Gulf carriers. The only time we saw EI operations was when there was a small party being held for the new A321 arriving at LHR. That must have been in the summer of 1998!
 
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OA260
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 7:59 pm

Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 25):
The only time we saw EI operations was when there was a small party being held for the new A321 arriving at LHR. That must have been in the summer of 1998!

Yep I was on one of the first A320 flights !!! God thats going back. I used to be on EI every few weeks between DUB and LHR back then in the nice Premier class. I remember seeing the A320 for the first time , it really was class and in EI livery and cabin interior. Those were the days!!! They had a piper greet the first arrival and it was shown on ''Airport''. I watch the program on UKTV Gold at the moment. Siobhan is on it and always had problems with the PIA passengers and the excess bags. I remember flying back from BJS to LHR with Air China and being 8 hours delayed and missed my EI flight to DUB. I was Gold Circle with them and they handled Air China also which was lucky. I got a free night at the Hilton and re booked the next morning even on two seperate tickets.

Also EI used to check in our flights at T2 and we had great craic with the EI staff there.
 
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shamrock350
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 8:31 pm

My first EI A320 flight was probably between LHR-SNN and it was strange, I had no idea why it seemed bigger and why it had triangles on the tips of the wing, I later found out they were winglets. All my EI flights before that were on 737-500s or 400s. Although I find A320s way more comfortable than the 734s I do miss them, they were the good days of EI.
Aer Lingus, British Midland and BA were everywhere in the 90s, maybe EI will join BD and BA again as the big airlines at LHR again.
 
EI321
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 8:40 pm

Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 27):
My first EI A320 flight was probably between LHR-SNN and it was strange

The A321s came first

[Edited 2007-03-25 13:53:19]
 
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shamrock350
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 8:51 pm

Quoting EI321 (Reply 28):
The A321s came first

I know. I hadn't been on an A321 before I didn't even know what they were I would have only been 7 or 8 years old. Did Aer Lingus send the A321 on the LHR-SNN route back then, I assumed it was an A320, it wasn't a 737 that's for sure and it would have been either 1999 or 2000.
 
EI321
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 8:55 pm

Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 29):
Did Aer Lingus send the A321 on the LHR-SNN route back

I think so, but not 100% sure. The A321s were bought specifically for LHR, so I presume some were/still are actually based there. More a case of EI sending an A321 to SNN from LHR.
 
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OA260
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 8:56 pm

I actually prefer the A320's . Although I had many a good flight on the 737's.
 
Shamrock330
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 8:57 pm

Quoting Kaitak (Reply 21):
Word has it that it's going to be ... London! I can't say I'm too happy about that ...

Say it isn't so!

Good grief, in the week that EI are finally starting to make progress in the routes department along with substantial increases in their share price, this to me,.....would be a tragic announcement.

Even still, I would bet against LHR being revealed as a base. There are too many deterrents and indications that IMO point to an "underserved" airport either in the UK midlands (BHX, Coventry?) or somewhere in Eastern Europe.

Why did EI bother with the labour court and substantial hassle involved with securing the rights to hire cheaper labour for an overseas base? I would imagine that LHR is anything but cheap! It doesn't make sense.

No offence meant Kaitak, but I hope to God you're wrong.  

Good to hear the news on a 787 order!

Just another point on LHR. EI operate from that special republic of Ireland cow shed, because of some free travel area agreemnet with the UK ( excuse my iognorance on this subject), but for arguments sake, if LHR is chosen, would EI operate from that specially designated part of T1, or would it be forced to move to say, T3? Would that be a huge stretch on resources not to mention costs for such a small airline?


Edited for AC

[Edited 2007-03-25 14:11:24]
 
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OA260
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 9:20 pm

Quoting Shamrock330 (Reply 32):
Just another point on LHR. EI operate from that special republic of Ireland cow shed, because of some free travel area agreemnet with the UK ( excuse my iognorance on this subject), but for arguments sake, if LHR is chosen, would EI operate from that specially designated part of T1, or would it be forced to move to say, T3?

They would not be allowed to operate from these gates 86-90 something. This is indeed only for flights between the UK and Ireland. They would have to operate from international section of Terminal 1. It would not really affect the ticket desk or check in process so i do not think it will increase costs. Just going through a different part of the terminal.
 
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shamrock350
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 9:35 pm

I think Aer Lingus want a base where they can start both short and long-haul operations. Bx737 and a few others have said that Aer Lingus will move to T3 even though it wont be in OW anymore, probably because of it's close links with AA and BA. I cant see EI basing 14 widebodies in DUB and SNN alone but I dont think it would be wise to base widebodies at LHR. Obviously this is thinking well ahead after they have sorted out the DUB long-haul expansion but I really dont think DM wants all those A350s/787s based in Ireland, I think a few would be better in BHX or somewhere similar along with the A320s from 2008 onwards.

There's no doubt EI want to up their presence in LHR and the UK, the amount of advertising going on is proof that EI wants to get their name out there in the UK and where better to start then at their biggest UK operations, LHR.

Quoting EI321 (Reply 30):
I think so, but not 100% sure. The A321s were bought specifically for LHR, so I presume some were/still are actually based there. More a case of EI sending an A321 to SNN from LHR.

Thanks for the info EI321, I was probably on an A321 if that's the case.
 
EI321
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 9:53 pm

Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 34):
Quoting EI321 (Reply 30):
I think so, but not 100% sure. The A321s were bought specifically for LHR, so I presume some were/still are actually based there. More a case of EI sending an A321 to SNN from LHR.

Thanks for the info EI321, I was probably on an A321 if that's the case.

Its difficult to tell, but the first A320 arrived in june 2000, and the second arrived in Feb 2001.
 
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shamrock350
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 9:58 pm

Quoting EI321 (Reply 35):
Its difficult to tell, but the first A320 arrived in june 2000, and the second arrived in Feb 2001.

My flight would have been either summer 1999 or 2000 so there is a possibility that it could have been either the 320 or 321.
 
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OA260
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 10:08 pm

Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 34):
There's no doubt EI want to up their presence in LHR and the UK, the amount of advertising going on is proof that EI wants to get their name out there in the UK and where better to start then at their biggest UK operations, LHR.

Also there is a large Irish population in London and so maybe they would choose to fly EI but im not sure they would be that loyal. If you live in the West getting to STN or LTN for the LCC is a pain so LHR is the best option.
 
BrianDromey
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 10:23 pm

Quoting OA260 (Reply 26):
Yep I was on one of the first A320 flights !!!

My first Airbus flight was an A321 ORK-FAO. It was a red-eye charter on behalf of Budget Travel. Late June in the summers of 1998 and 1999. I didnt realise it at the time bur those A321s were not around long at all. I remember the scriptive writing that I could never read and the convertible seats which stretched most of the way down the cabin. As my father did a lot of trups to LHR at that time we were usually seated in the front section with those wider seats. The crew usually recognised him as well. (In those days it was premier for him!).

Bx737you might be able to answer this question, did EI cabin staff ever check-in flights? I seem to remember that the check-in girls would appear from nowhere carrying their EI sinage in full EI uniform. Maybe Im wrong, I would ahve been pretty young at the time.

Quoting Shamrock330 (Reply 32):
Just another point on LHR. EI operate from that special republic of Ireland cow shed, because of some free travel area agreemnet with the UK ( excuse my iognorance on this subject), but for arguments sake, if LHR is chosen, would EI operate from that specially designated part of T1, or would it be forced to move to say, T3? Would that be a huge stretch on resources not to mention costs for such a small airline?

I think EI are moving to T3 when the space becomes free. If EI can get more slots at LHR, then the base could work quite well, and might explain the amount of avertising around London at the minute. I THINK that EI has rights to more slots that it currently does not use, or are these slots leased to other carriers? Perhaps DUB-LHR might also be reduced a bit, but the LHR-ORK seems to do quite wll at all times of the day.

Brian.
Next flights: MAN-ORK-LHR(EI)-MAN(BD); MAN-LHR(BD)-ORK (EI); DUB-ZRH-LAX (LX) LAX-YYZ (AC) YYZ-YHZ-LHR(AC)-DUB(BD)
 
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 10:43 pm

Quoting BrianDromey (Reply 38):
Bx737you might be able to answer this question, did EI cabin staff ever check-in flights? I seem to remember that the check-in girls would appear from nowhere carrying their EI sinage in full EI uniform. Maybe Im wrong, I would ahve been pretty young at the time.

I've also noticed some staff in DUB will be boarding a flight one week, and the next week they're cabin crew!
 
Shamrock330
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 10:49 pm

Quoting BrianDromey (Reply 38):
I THINK that EI has rights to more slots that it currently does not use, or are these slots leased to other carriers?

Thats quite interesting, firstly I never knew that slots could be leased. Secondly, if EI has more slots than it currently uses, then who are these slots leased to? Presumably, slots are leased for a fixed period so EI couldn't take them back as and when they feel appropriate.

I seem to remember ( correct me if I'm wrong ) that a LHR slot is worth £5-10 million. Didn't Qantas pay £25 million per slot a couple of years back?

If Aer Lingus could get decent frequencies on new routes out of LHR, then perhaps it could work but I'm still a skeptic.

Quoting BrianDromey (Reply 38):
Perhaps DUB-LHR might also be reduced a bit

I always thought that ten frequencies a day was overkill.
 
David_itl
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Sun Mar 25, 2007 10:54 pm

Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 34):
There's no doubt EI want to up their presence in LHR and the UK, the amount of advertising going on is proof that EI wants to get their name out there in the UK and where better to start then at their biggest UK operations, LHR.

Well they did well enough out of MAN on their 5th freedom services up to the mid 1970s for BA to get them scaled back by appealing to the UK Government so as to make it uneconomic for those routes to continue (and I'm pretty sure one of their marketing slogans was "Manchester's our second home")! We'll forget about their attempts from 1988 to 1993 when they ran a futher batch, including the unusual 5th freedom route to Milan where the Italians did not allow them to pick up passengers!
 
Toulouse
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Mon Mar 26, 2007 12:22 am

Quoting Kaitak (Reply 21):
the 787 order and the new EI base

What 787 order Kaitak? Is this just wishful thinking on your behalf, have I missed a major announcement, is it a typo or do you have some information we don't have??
Long live Aer Lingus!
 
COEI2007
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Mon Mar 26, 2007 12:35 am

Quoting Shamrock330 (Reply 40):
I always thought that ten frequencies a day was overkill.

I think 10 is enough. Remember, EI doesnt serve any other London airports, like it did in the past (LCY, LGW and STN). I think its important to maintain those frequencies to attract business pax. Maybe 8/9 could be sufficient, and the remaining slots could be sold.
 
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Mon Mar 26, 2007 12:40 am

Quoting Toulouse (Reply 42):
What 787 order

I think its just a rumour , albeit from a reliable source, over on PPrune.
 
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Mon Mar 26, 2007 1:07 am

Quoting Shamrock330 (Reply 44):
I think its just a rumour , albeit from a reliable source, over on PPrune.

Thanks Shamrock, I just checked pprune (except I have forgotten my password and can't retrieve it as I set up my account there on an email address I no longer have and couldn't be bothered doing it again, at the moment), but I see the "repetition" of this rumour come from somebody who has only made 5 posts (as I can't log-in I couldn't check their profile), so how reliable if this person? Do we know?
As another poster who is a lot more familiar says this is just a rumour that's been goinga round for months.
Anyway, I'm really hoping for a 350 order, but I'll be happy to see EI progress with whatever they order.
Long live Aer Lingus!
 
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shamrock350
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Mon Mar 26, 2007 1:29 am

Quoting OA260 (Reply 37):
If you live in the West getting to STN or LTN for the LCC is a pain so LHR is the best option.

It's that way with me. I live in Harrow, which is only 30 minutes from LHR (on a good day) getting to LTN or LGW isnt too bad but STN is too far away and not worth it.
The next month will be interesting, a long-haul order, new base announcement, probably more routes and we may find out whats going on with EI and B6.
 
rineanna
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Mon Mar 26, 2007 1:47 am

Quoting Toulouse (Reply 45):
I just checked pprune

That same thread on pprune says that Today FM reported a US base for EI!!! I think somepeople are getting carried away with all the excitement of late! Big grin Next we'll hear that EI have ordered 50 A380s, with 800+ seats!
 
Shamrock330
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Mon Mar 26, 2007 2:07 am

Quoting Toulouse (Reply 45):
As another poster who is a lot more familiar says this is just a rumour that's been goinga round for months

Exactly, its crucial to remember that it is the professional pilots RUMOUR network. There is a hell of a lot of bull on there that never came to pass.

Quoting Rineanna (Reply 47):
That same thread on pprune says that Today FM reported a US base for EI!!! I think somepeople are getting carried away with all the excitement of late!

I'm no expert but even I know that that is B.S

Honestly, I think on the website in question there are a few reputable users and then you get the rest who like to throw their "ideas" in the ring and pass them off as properly investigated and reliable inside information.

I commented here a good year and a bit ago that Airbus and Boeing reps had visited EI HQ with their respective applications for the tender. I also was informed that orders were imminent and yet here we are still waiting for the order.

I got my info from a relative who holds a fairly high posiiton in EI and doesn't tend to B.S. I trusted that the info was accurate which I believe to this day that it was, however nothing came to fruition.

It probably made me look like an attention whore but still I stand by what I said.
 
BrianDromey
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RE: The New Dawn! Irish Aviation Thread 14/07

Mon Mar 26, 2007 2:19 am

Quoting Shamrock330 (Reply 40):
Thats quite interesting, firstly I never knew that slots could be leased. Secondly, if EI has more slots than it currently uses, then who are these slots leased to? Presumably, slots are leased for a fixed period so EI couldn't take them back as and when they feel appropriate.

I think there is a 'grey' market in slots. I saw somewhere that UA have some leased to VS, but Im not too sure if thats correct or not. I wonder wihere EY and EK ahve gotten all of their slots from, EY inperticular.

Quoting Shamrock330 (Reply 48):

It probably made me look like an attention whore but still I stand by what I said.

Its pretty well accacpted that EI are close to an order, so I wouldnt say attention seeker. At the end of the day Im not a perticularly big fan of the 787 or XWB, I think IE should not be in any great rush to secure either of the new jets, as the new 330s and the 332s, with a little bit of spit and polish, would do the job just fine untill the end of the next decade.

What EI needs is long haul capacity, and most, if not all, of it will be new builds. Neither the XWB or the 787 are available till ~2014. I think they should follow BA's lead and order aircraft which will stand the test of time, and generate profit, but saleable in a decade or so.

Brian
Next flights: MAN-ORK-LHR(EI)-MAN(BD); MAN-LHR(BD)-ORK (EI); DUB-ZRH-LAX (LX) LAX-YYZ (AC) YYZ-YHZ-LHR(AC)-DUB(BD)

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