georgiabill
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MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 12:16 am

In the April 14th edition of the Manchester Unionleader(aka onionleader, aka uselessleader) in an article written by John Whitson it appears airport manager intends to promote MHT as the choice for Ryanair New England gateway. As much as I would like to see it and I am glad that airport manager Kevin Dillion is pursuing this, I believe it is highly unlikely to happen. I am sure in this case BOS would be the preferred option assuming the costs of operating from BOS were not to high. If BOS was to high I would have to say PVD with it's larger population base or BDL would be considered before MHT. It was noted that the next terminal expansion will include custom facilities. However no time frame for this terminal expansion was given. I think Mr. Dillion should concentrate on obtaining non stop service from MHT to FLL, DEN and PHX or LAX.
 
Poitin
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 12:39 am

Quoting Georgiabill (Thread starter):
In the April 14th edition of the Manchester Unionleader(aka onionleader, aka uselessleader) in an article written by John Whitson it appears airport manager intends to promote MHT as the choice for Ryanair New England gateway

MHT is a far better choice to fly in and out of Boston than BOS if you don't live in Boston. The moment you have to get into a car to drive to BOS, MHT becomes a much better choice, particularly if you live north of Boston.

And it does have a number of airlines servicing it.

http://www.flymanchester.com/airlines/serving.php

With a surprising number of cities it goes to

http://www.flymanchester.com/flightinfo/

And this is nothing new, for when I worked for DEC in Nashua NH, I used MHT for most of my flights. With the advent of ETOPS aircraft, I would use it for going to Europe, particularly if I miss that mess in BOS.

Now, will MHT take much from BOS, it is hard to say, but I for one would use it.
Now so, have ye time fer a pint?
 
toltommy
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 12:50 am

I would imagine that BWI would be higher on the radar than MHT for a long haul LCC.
 
PVD757
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 12:54 am

Quoting Georgiabill (Thread starter):
I am sure in this case BOS would be the preferred option assuming the costs of operating from BOS were not to high.

Michael O'Leary from Ryanair clearly stated they would serve "secondary" airports, so I'd argue BOS is out. They also specifically mentioned PVD, BWI, and ISP as examples of airports they will look at. The media around here has been all over the story and I have already heard that people from the BOS area have been calling the PVD airport information booth looking for information on how they can book the new service from PVD (silly, silly people). I'm sure the PVD airport folks will be agressively pursuing this too. I think PVD with it's existing integrated FIS (gate 8), soon to be complete terminal improvements, and future rail connection to both Providence and Boston migh have a great chace to get the new flights...
 
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chrisnh
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 1:03 am

The model that Ryanair proposes cannot work by flying into and out of Boston. Logan would charge Ryanair whereas Manchester would subsidize it just to get them in there. First, the folks at MHT have to get on the radar screen of Ryanair and others of their type. PVD has that visibility; MHT doesn't (yet). MHT has to counter the train service to Boston that PVD has.

In the end, unless Ryanair goes out and places firm orders for 787s or A350s, this is nothing but a great fantasy tale. I'm nowhere near being convinced that this is all actually going to happen. If I were a little Irish airline looking to get acquired by Aer Lingus I suppose I'd hatch this little Trojan Horse, too.

Chris in NH
 
cloudboy
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 1:47 am

I would think Providence stands in a better position to win Ryan Air service, as it can draw in a lot more people in it's area (not only Massachusetts but much of Connecticut). It also already has work going on to connect the airport with Boston (wake up, New Hampshire! You already have the tracks to do this, get moving on it!)

However, there is one big holdup- does Providence have the runway length to support that kind of flight? I know they are talking already about extending the runway because they can't even do direct East to West coast flights, so I don't know if they could do transatlantic without a runway extension, and they aren't getting full approval for that yet.

In reality, now that we are getting to open skies with England, they are not going to be the only ones. Heck, i don't think some of their marketing tactics are even likely to fly in the US anyways, so I don't even think they will be the most successful ones. But cheap transatlantic is coming, and Manchester has to get it's act together!
"Six becoming three doesn't create more Americans that want to fly." -Adam Pilarski
 
EI321
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 1:59 am

Just want to point out, its written as Ryanair, not Ryan Air or RyanAir.
 
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chrisnh
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 2:14 am

Some people in New Hampshire have 'woken up' with regard to rail service--at least connecting Nashua with Lowell. But NOTHING has happened. And even there, tracks are already in place!!! Railroads are THE most difficult transportation infrastructure to implement. Look at how LONG it took the now-successful Downeaster to get rolling between Boston and Portland, Maine. There was NO END to the bickering and backstabbing and territorialism and approvals process that the whole thing needed to go through. It was AWFUL, simply because you've got some small railroad fiefdoms (read: Guilford Transportation, owners of Pan Am...need we say more?) that claimed the tracks as theirs and have run roughshod over everything having to do with 'their' tracks.

Good and well-meaning people have 'woken up' to the need for the extension of rail service from Lowell up to Nashua...for YEARS. DECADES, even! But for reasons mentioned above, they've been stonewalled at every turn. Sometimes by Guilford and 'their' track-ownership. Sometimes by pure local and/or state politics. And in the situation of Lowell to Nashua, we're talking about Massachusetts and New Hampshire. And then Nashua can never seem to agree WHERE the station will go.

It could be argued very easily that PVD will win service like this because of their existing and operational rail link. It could just as easily be argued that MHT will lose service like this because NOTHING exists for rail service. Transportation is a total interconnected infrastructure. A good link between an incoming plane and an outgoing train (and vice versa) works to attract air service. The folks at MHT are whistling by the graveyard if they don't agree that a lack of rail/air coordination will cost them. I guarantee you: The first European carrier that chooses PVD over MHT will get people up here in a lather about 'Why?' and 'What can we do?' They had better start cranking this whole railroad initiative into higher gear, if it is seen as a differentiator. You have to remember that in Europe, railroads rule. Trains are a VERY integral part of the transportation networks over there. So, if PVD can market that side of themselves while Dillon at MHT says, 'Uhhhhh...we'll have to get back to you on that,' the horse has already left the barn. We are trying to market to Europeans who KNOW the value of rail service...and we have NO answer. No tracks. No plan. No coordination. Maybe an article in the newspaper every nine months about how a 'study' ought to be done on the feasibility of rail service. Then another article nine months after that saying how a study ought to be done. We've seen this movie before.

9,250 feet of concrete. That's what we have in MHT. Dillon had better HOPE that this is what Ryanair cares about. Like was said earlier, if Ryanair turns out to be a Trojan Horse (I believe it will) there will be another...and another...and another. Open skies is like an uncorked genie bottle, and no one up here is near ready for it.

Chris in NH

[Edited 2007-04-15 19:16:03]
 
rineanna
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 2:20 am

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 4):
If I were a little Irish airline

You call 40m+ PAX in 2006 little?

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 4):
looking to get acquired by Aer Lingus

It's the other way around. FR are looking to acquire EI.
 
PVD757
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 3:08 am

I'm faitly certain that the 787 and the 350 will have the range from PVDs 7166 foot runway to make it to Western Europe. PVD-SNN, DUB, STN should easily be reached, never mind that the PVD runway expansion should be much closer to happeing by then. I can't imagine the runway won't be expanded to at least 8000 feet...
 
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chrisnh
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 3:12 am

Quoting PVD757 (Reply 9):
It's the other way around. FR are looking to acquire EI.

Ooops! I guess we have some learnin' to do with respect to the Irish aviation scene. That's OK...I'm sure there are people over there who are clueless about where Providence & Manchester are!
 
walter747
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 3:42 am

Quoting TOLtommy (Reply 2):
I would imagine that BWI would be higher on the radar than MHT for a long haul LCC.

They are looking for a New England destination. BWI is no where near New England. They are looking for a BOS alternative.
Hussel, Hussel, Husel, Grind, Grind, Grind
 
EI321
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 3:55 am

Quoting PVD757 (Reply 9):
I'm faitly certain that the 787 and the 350 will have the range from PVDs 7166 foot runway to make it to Western Europe. PVD-SNN, DUB, STN should easily be reached, never mind that the PVD runway expansion should be much closer to happeing by then. I can't imagine the runway won't be expanded to at least 8000 feet...

I think we can forget about SNN. If they are serious about the business class, there wont be much of a market for it at Shannon. The likes of Stanstead or Hahn and maybe Dublin will be the important cities.
 
B752OS
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 5:34 am

Quoting Georgiabill (Thread starter):
In the April 14th edition of the Manchester Unionleader(aka onionleader, aka uselessleader) in an article written by John Whitson it appears airport manager intends to promote MHT as the choice for Ryanair New England gateway. As much as I would like to see it and I am glad that airport manager Kevin Dillion is pursuing this, I believe it is highly unlikely to happen. I am sure in this case BOS would be the preferred option assuming the costs of operating from BOS were not to high. If BOS was to high I would have to say PVD with it's larger population base or BDL would be considered before MHT. It was noted that the next terminal expansion will include custom facilities. However no time frame for this terminal expansion was given. I think Mr. Dillion should concentrate on obtaining non stop service from MHT to FLL, DEN and PHX or LAX.

I think PVD stands the best out of the secondary New England airports. Not only is PVD larger than MHT, but they local population base is greater in Providence/Fall River/ New Bedford than New Hampshire. BOS already has decent service to Ireland and Europe for that matter so bringing in a LCC would only hurts things. Also, PVD is closer to great tourist destinations such as Newport and Cape Cod.

Quoting Poitin (Reply 1):
MHT is a far better choice to fly in and out of Boston than BOS if you don't live in Boston. The moment you have to get into a car to drive to BOS, MHT becomes a much better choice, particularly if you live north of Boston.

I think that point can be argued. BOS is not the mess that the lame MHT airport commercials would portray. I live about 24 miles south of Boston and I make it to Logan in under 45 minutes. MHT does not cater to the Boston area business travelers nearly as good as BOS does itself.
 
georgiabill
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 6:29 am

I totally agree at the moment PVD has the clear advantage over MHT. As much as I would like to see this happen, MHT clearly has to address several issues. One being the timing for expansion of the terminal to include customs and a plan to to improve mass transit from MHT to the greater Boston metropolitan area. I am not sure if the express bus service is still running between MHT and Boston. Personally as stated earlier as much as I would love to see international service from MHT, I believe Mr. Dillon's time could be better spent adding additional domestic destinations from MHT such as DEN.
 
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chrisnh
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 7:03 am

The thing about Dillon--and I don't want to come down too hard on him--is that he's the tail, not the dog. He can put together marvelous Powerpoint presentations and wine-and-dine airline execs. But at the end of the day, he's less in control of the fortunes at his airport than he'd probably like to be...with respect to new airlines and/or service. All he can do is be an enabler, which is true for just about all Airport Directors.
 
funflyer
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 9:04 am

Quoting Georgiabill (Thread starter):
It was noted that the next terminal expansion will include custom facilities

MHT has customs on-site.
Who cares about status?
 
PVD757
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 9:44 am

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 10):
Quoting PVD757 (Reply 9):
It's the other way around. FR are looking to acquire EI.

Ooops! I guess we have some learnin' to do with respect to the Irish aviation scene. That's OK...I'm sure there are people over there who are clueless about where Providence & Manchester are!

that's weird, you quoted an earlier post - but it wasn't me that posted it!!!

this happened the other day too in another thread, hhhmmm....
 
walter747
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 9:54 am

Quoting Funflyer (Reply 16):
MHT has customs on-site.

So does PVD. We already have 2 international routes. AC to YYZ and Sata International to Ponta Delgada. Obviously needing a customs building.
Hussel, Hussel, Husel, Grind, Grind, Grind
 
Logos
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 10:34 am

If I understand the proposal correctly, it will not be Ryanair that directly serves the US, but rather a new "affiliate" that they're hoping to start with 787 or 350 equipment. Unless they can parlay whatever pull they have with Boeing into some early delivery slots for the 787, this isn't going to happen until 2012 or so. If they'll settle for some other kind of equipment (at least initially), then it could be sooner. So, this is likely to be a while coming.

As I stated in another thread, I would give this a pretty good chance of succeeding. I doubt MOL will start it if he doesn't have a good to excellent shot of success.

Cheers,
Dave in Orlando
Too many types flown to list
 
georgiabill
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Mon Apr 16, 2007 11:20 am

ChrisNH, I think we are on the same page. I just want Mr. Dillon to concentrate on adding to MHT domestic flights. Yes I would love International services, I think Icelandic would be a more realistic hope than Ryanair!
 
funflyer
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Tue Apr 17, 2007 12:29 pm

If this new service did come to light, what gate would they use, the only one availible is gate 10 and I am almost positive you can only fit an RJ in there.
Who cares about status?
 
afitch7881
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Wed Apr 18, 2007 3:04 pm

Quoting Cloudboy (Reply 5):
(not only Massachusetts but much of Connecticut)

I guess Eastern Connecticut has had a huge population boom since I last visited in March. PVD really only gets passengers from New London/Mystic and eastern Windham counties, not much else.

[Edited 2007-04-18 08:04:46]
 
airbazar
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Thu Apr 19, 2007 2:00 am

I said it here before that when MHT does build their FIS/Customs facility to support international flights without pre-clearance overseas, it would make a great secondary market to Britain. I think the potential catchement area for MHT is grossly underestimated. BOS's International terminal is very space limited especially for the typical European rush-hour. I don't agree that PVD has a clear advantage. PVD's international traffic demand is predominantly to Portugal which is why Sata is the only airline offering trans-atlantic service from there. MHT has the advantage of being within easy access of a much more affluent region of New England.

Quoting Poitin (Reply 1):
MHT is a far better choice to fly in and out of Boston than BOS if you don't live in Boston. The moment you have to get into a car to drive to BOS, MHT becomes a much better choice, particularly if you live north of Boston.

Maybe to you but to me it's been exaclty the opposite. I live on the MA/NH border, exactly 40 miles from both MHT and BOS and have yet to use MHT. Why? Cost. Fares seem to always be much higher from MHT than they are from BOS and almost always require a change of planes somewhere else. I just returned last night from a 1 week vacation in the Caribbean, and the cost of flying from MHT was about $200 higher per person. Multiply that by a family of 3 or more and I'll gladly deal with the extra driving time at rush-hour and the higher parking costs. My outbound flight was at 9:15am. I left my house at 6:30am and was at the check-in counter before 8am. Even factoring in the high price of parking ($176 for 8 days in the Central parking garage), I still saved over $400 compared to what I would have paid for the same trip from MHT. Bottom line is, BOS may not be as convenient as MHT for some people, but as long as the total trip cost continues to be significantly cheaper, my family and I will continue to use it.
 
airbazar
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RE: MHT Hopes To Add Ryanair Service

Thu Apr 19, 2007 2:00 am

I said it here before that when MHT does build their FIS/Customs facility to support international flights without pre-clearance overseas, it would make a great secondary market to Britain. I think the potential catchement area for MHT is grossly underestimated. BOS's International terminal is very space limited especially for the typical European rush-hour. I don't agree that PVD has a clear advantage. PVD's international traffic demand is predominantly to Portugal which is why Sata is the only airline offering trans-atlantic service from there. MHT has the advantage of being within easy access of a much more affluent region of New England.

Quoting Poitin (Reply 1):
MHT is a far better choice to fly in and out of Boston than BOS if you don't live in Boston. The moment you have to get into a car to drive to BOS, MHT becomes a much better choice, particularly if you live north of Boston.

Maybe to you but to me it's been exaclty the opposite. I live on the MA/NH border, exactly 40 miles from both MHT and BOS and have yet to use MHT. Why? Cost. Fares seem to always be much higher from MHT than they are from BOS and almost always require a change of planes somewhere else. I just returned last night from a 1 week vacation in the Caribbean, and the cost of flying from MHT was about $200 higher per person. Multiply that by a family of 3 or more and I'll gladly deal with the extra driving time at rush-hour and the higher parking costs. My outbound flight was at 9:15am. I left my house at 6:30am and was at the check-in counter before 8am. Even factoring in the high price of parking ($176 for 8 days in the Central parking garage), I still saved over $400 compared to what I would have paid for the same trip from MHT. Bottom line is, BOS may not be as convenient as MHT for some people, but as long as the total trip cost continues to be significantly cheaper, my family and I will continue to use it.

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