kl911
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What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Tue Apr 24, 2007 6:03 pm

Like the title says, what would be a new ( major ) airline starting services from AMS?
If the open skies deal gets confirmed word is that VS wants to fly AMS - USA.

On the other hand, with smaller point to point planes arriving soon, would we see SA, EK, QR etc at AMS soon?

KL911
 
Joost
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Tue Apr 24, 2007 6:08 pm

I've heard rumours that TG is looking at AMS for 2008. It wouldn't surprise me as South-east Asia tourism is very strong, however they would be the 4th airline on AMS-BKK.

I see SA coming too. They are already heavily marketing their South Africa service (via FRA) in the Netherlands (radio commercials in autumn, for winter vacations) and I wouldn't be surprised for a AMS-JNB.

What about an Indian carrier?
 
PHKLM
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Tue Apr 24, 2007 6:23 pm

Quoting Joost (Reply 1):
I see SA coming too. They are already heavily marketing their South Africa service (via FRA) in the Netherlands (radio commercials in autumn, for winter vacations) and I wouldn't be surprised for a AMS-JNB.

There have been talks for a long time about SA serving the Netherlands. KLM has a monopoly on the South Africa routes and is able to charge high fares year round, as there is no real "low-season".
South Africa is holding the number 3 position of all Dutch long-haul destinations (behind the US and SE-Asia), so I think SA will be easily be able to break this market open and drives prices down.
The only advantage KLM will have is the ability of open-jaw returns AMS-JNB / CPT-AMS and vice-versa, so you can cut the CPT-JNB leg in South Africa; which is what the majority of the tourists seem to do.
KLM is pricing these open-jaw returns as being a round-trip AMS-CPT / AMS-JNB which is pretty neat if you ask me; though the fares in general could be cut quite a bit.
 
Joost
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Tue Apr 24, 2007 6:30 pm

Quoting PHKLM (Reply 2):
The only advantage KLM will have is the ability of open-jaw returns AMS-JNB / CPT-AMS and vice-versa, so you can cut the CPT-JNB leg in South Africa; which is what the majority of the tourists seem to do.

A thanks, I didn't know that. In that case, SA can even respond to this be opening 'open-jaws' with a transfer in JNB from every airport in the country they serve. Okay, it involves one flight change, but then you can also make a trip Johannesburg-Durban, or Cape Town-Bloemfontein or whatever. And besides that, when they're only 50 euros cheaper they can lure the travel agencies for the package tours easily.
 
HB-IWC
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Tue Apr 24, 2007 10:28 pm

I wouldn't count on either SA or TG to reopen AMS services any time soon. Both have closed AMS not so long ago, and neither are in a financial position to venture into new territory. SA is about to embark on a program of route evaluation that has already seen ZRH get the axe, and the planned ORD services put on ice. TG is suffering as well, is also planning network changes and would need to compete with CI and BR on the relatively low yielding BKK AMS sector.

As it goes, KLM has a stranglehold on the Dutch market and the airline clearly believes that it has its home market cornered. AMS is low yielding compared to such centers as London, Paris and Frankfurt, so I guess the best AMS can hope for is an expansion of existing services. Surely, KLM and NW will take care of that, but I could also see the likes of MH and CO further build their presence at Schiphol.
 
DALCE
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Wed Apr 25, 2007 3:22 am

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 4):
but I could also see the likes of MH and CO further build their presence at Schiphol.

Didn't MH sort of announce that they will bring the A380 to AMS?


I think JJ has a chance of becoming the next new player on the AMS market, RG used to fly AMS-CDG-GRU. So why shouldn't JJ try this?
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,E75,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,753,744,77W,788,319,320,321,333,AB6.
 
PHKLM
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Wed Apr 25, 2007 3:30 am

Quoting DALCE (Reply 5):
So why shouldn't JJ try this?

TAM is a world class airline with a large premium cabin, I don't think there is any chance they will be successful with this concept on the Dutch market.
LAN's flights to AMS for example are all about cargo, and I think Varig went to AMS mainly for cargo reasons as well.
Brazil is very well served from the Netherlands, with AF thru CDG and a direct flight AMS-GRU by KLM, that supposedly is being upgraded to a 77W service as of 2008.
Apart from that, JJ and KL are having a kind of gentleman's agreement or so it seems, KL codeshares on JJ in South America and JJ used KL's ground services at LHR. When I was at T4 at LHR and saw the JJ signs at the KL transfer desk I must say I already envisioned the Skyteam logo behind the TAM brand name  Wink
 
kl911
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Thu Apr 26, 2007 1:30 am

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 4):
but I could also see the likes of MH and CO further build their presence at Schiphol.

MH can only increase capacity, where as CO can add destinations. Or do you mean MH will use AMS to 'jump' to other destinations like they do now with ARN-EWR?

KL911
 
KL577
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Thu Apr 26, 2007 1:57 am

Quoting KL911 (Reply 7):
Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 4):
but I could also see the likes of MH and CO further build their presence at Schiphol.

MH can only increase capacity, where as CO can add destinations. Or do you mean MH will use AMS to 'jump' to other destinations like they do now with ARN-EWR?

KL911

I flew MH from KUL to AMS yesterday and the 747 was completely full, could AMS be a potential A380 destination for MAS?
 
DALCE
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Thu Apr 26, 2007 3:32 am

Quoting KL577 (Reply 8):
I flew MH from KUL to AMS yesterday and the 747 was completely full, could AMS be a potential A380 destination for MAS?



Quoting DALCE (Reply 5):
Didn't MH sort of announce that they will bring the A380 to AMS?
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,E75,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,753,744,77W,788,319,320,321,333,AB6.
 
OOer
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Thu Apr 26, 2007 4:00 am

could F9 or B6 do a bos/jfk to ams on the a320 or a319???
 
DALCE
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Thu Apr 26, 2007 4:12 am

Quoting OOer (Reply 10):
could F9 or B6 do a bos/jfk to ams on the a320 or a319???

Only with extra fueltanks
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,E75,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,753,744,77W,788,319,320,321,333,AB6.
 
MEACEDAR
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Thu Apr 26, 2007 4:40 am

As soon as MEA gets their new planes in about a year or so, I bet you will see them in AMS. I say this because the KLM flight that left AMS-BEY was canceled. Plus, a pilot at MEA told me that they are seriously looking at AMS and BRU.
 
KL577
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Thu Apr 26, 2007 6:46 am

Quoting DALCE (Reply 9):
Quoting KL577 (Reply 8):
I flew MH from KUL to AMS yesterday and the 747 was completely full, could AMS be a potential A380 destination for MAS?



Quoting DALCE (Reply 5):
Didn't MH sort of announce that they will bring the A380 to AMS?

Maybe I should the read the posts more carefully next time  embarrassed 
 
OOer
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Thu Apr 26, 2007 11:40 am

Quoting DALCE (Reply 11):
Only with extra fueltanks

The great circle mapper has BOS-AMS at 3457 miles. Airliners.net has the A319 with a range of 4254 miles...why would it not be possible???
 
kappel
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Thu Apr 26, 2007 4:49 pm

Quoting Joost (Reply 1):
I've heard rumours that TG is looking at AMS for 2008. It wouldn't surprise me as South-east Asia tourism is very strong, however they would be the 4th airline on AMS-BKK.

TG had announced restarting the AMS route back in 2005 IIRC with the a346. It was even on their website that they were planning to reopen the route. So far nothing however. Who knows if TG orders the 787 or a350 they might reopen the route, but it looks like it won't happen shortly. And as HB-IWC mentioned, it is a low yielding route with lots of competition already (CI, BR,KL)

Quoting DALCE (Reply 5):
Didn't MH sort of announce that they will bring the A380 to AMS?

Not sort of, they did and would be flying the route with the a380 next year IIRC (or was it 2009?). We will have to wait and see now though...
L1011,733,734,73G,738,743,744,752,763,772,77W,DC855,DC863,DC930,DC950,MD11,MD88,306,319,320,321,343,346,ARJ85,CR7,E195
 
TruemanQLD
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Thu Apr 26, 2007 4:55 pm

BA will make up a lcc
 
HB-IWC
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Thu Apr 26, 2007 5:25 pm

Quoting KL911 (Reply 7):
MH can only increase capacity, where as CO can add destinations. Or do you mean MH will use AMS to 'jump' to other destinations like they do now with ARN-EWR?

MH has in the past year several times hinted at a capacity increase at its main European gateways, including CDG and AMS. I wouldn't be surprised at all to see a westbound daylight KUL AMS flight added to the MH schedule, and positioned in MH's early morning departure bank at KUL. Such a flight would get into AMS early evening, in time to catch the last KL European departure bank and return to KUL in KL's late evening longhaul departure bank, in direct competition with the existing KL809 AMS KUL rotation.
 
DALCE
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RE: What Would Be The Next New Airline From AMS?

Thu Apr 26, 2007 6:47 pm

Quoting OOer (Reply 14):
The great circle mapper has BOS-AMS at 3457 miles. Airliners.net has the A319 with a range of 4254 miles...why would it not be possible???

At what weight restriction? How many seats?
I don't see this happen
flown: F50,F70,CR1,CR2,CR9,E75,143,AR8,AR1,733,735,736,73G,738,753,744,77W,788,319,320,321,333,AB6.