slcdeltarumd11
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DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 2:00 am

Yesterday was a great day," Grinstein said Tuesday. "At 10:20 in the morning, it was almost as a switch had gone off and Delta emerged from Chapter 11, and out of bankruptcy, and free at last."
As Grinstein spoke, the employees who had gathered inside Delta's cavernous hangar at Salt Lake City International Airport for a two-hour party cheered and clapped. Outside, a Boeing 757 airliner painted with Delta's new red, blue and white colors gleamed in the sunlight.
"And then we unveiled the new logo. It was an exciting moment for all of us because it symbolized passage and the fact that we had moved so far," an emotional Grinstein said.


Later, Grinstein said the Salt Lake hub is poised to grow further. A nonstop route to Europe is probably two years away. Holding Delta back from launching the first trans-Atlantic route from Salt Lake are a lack of aircraft and landing rights in London or Paris, he said.
"Passenger demand is there. It's doing very well," Grinstein told The Salt Lake Tribune

http://www.sltrib.com/business/ci_5797367


Lets all hope for many good years for DL at Salt Lake City
 
MAH4546
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 2:05 am

Quoting SlcDeltaRUmd11 (Thread starter):
Holding Delta back from launching the first trans-Atlantic route from Salt Lake are a lack of aircraft and landing rights in London or Paris, he said.
"Passenger demand is there. It's doing very well," Grinstein told The Salt Lake Tribune

They lack so many planes that they can start niche routes like Atlanta-Vienna and New York City-Pisa while ignoring such a "huge" market like Salt Lake City-Paris? Not really.
a.
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 5:54 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 1):
They lack so many planes that they can start niche routes like Atlanta-Vienna and New York City-Pisa while ignoring such a "huge" market like Salt Lake City-Paris? Not really.

Would you expect him to say anything different? "Yeah, well, we have the planes for an SLC-Europe, but we just think O&D and yields for such a flight would svck." Certainly not the things the folks in SLC would want to hear.
 
LGAtoIND
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 5:56 am

They have "lack of landing rights" at CDG?
 
deltal1011man
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 6:56 am

good news for SLC and DL

i wonder where SLCUT2777 is at?????
New airliners.net web site sucks....
Also the mods want to kill free speech and prevent people from saying things like the above. Better say nothing about awesomeness for this place or else!
 
jfk787nyc
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 7:05 am

They must start a daily SLC-CDG I am sure it would do very well with connection from Air France.
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 7:26 am

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 2):
Would you expect him to say anything different? "Yeah, well, we have the planes for an SLC-Europe, but we just think O&D and yields for such a flight would suck." Certainly not the things the folks in SLC would want to hear.

Interesting that Grinstein added one more year to 2009, when many here have been lead to believe they might try it next year. Perhaps Grinstein is just eluding to the fact that a LGW/LHR flight would have 2-3 times the O&D demand that a CDG flight would have to/form SLC, and by 2009 DL just might have a few more new 772LR's to free up a 763ER to give this venture (how ever ill advised some think it is or will be) a try, no matter how po-dunk a market SLC is!  biggrin 

Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 4):
good news for SLC and DL

i wonder where SLCUT2777 is at?????

I'm here!  biggrin 

Quoting JFK787NYC (Reply 5):
They must start a daily SLC-CDG I am sure it would do very well with connection from Air France.

Despite the SkyTeam/AF connection at CDG, this one would more than likely fall flat on its face, or need subsidizing for a number of years to really work.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
B4REAL
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 7:32 am

I think SLC-CDG will be attempted, but agree with others that it will not work. Further US-FR open skies takes care of any landing rights, and there are available aircraft should they really want to operate the route.

Further, once new aircraft arrive into DL's fleet, I'd actually think SLC may be poised for an Asia flight more soon than a Europe flight. Not sure where in Asia - but not NRT - maybe ICN/HKG/SIN.... A cautious selection due to the LAX growth.
B4REAL, spelled like it sounds
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 7:40 am

Quoting B4REAL (Reply 7):
Further, once new aircraft arrive into DL's fleet, I'd actually think SLC may be poised for an Asia flight

That will NEVER happen from a market like SLC without a stop in LAX first on the way. While SLC might have a good feed, they lack the overall O&D to support any destination to Asia. On the whole, I think you'll see DL support international service in and out of SLC to Canada, Mexico. In the future at least seasonally to the Caribbean is a real possibility.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
B4REAL
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 7:48 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 8):
That will NEVER happen from a market like SLC without a stop in LAX first on the way.

That is the summary of a conversation I had with a 15+ year flight attendant based in JFK. I think that way of SLC-Europe, but SLC-Asia may work if there is no competition and DL does the feed right, IMHO. Or does ATL-SLC-AsiaSpot (Like ATL-JFK-BOM - but JFK has good enough O&D for JFK-BOM).
B4REAL, spelled like it sounds
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 7:57 am

Quoting B4REAL (Reply 9):
That is the summary of a conversation I had with a 15+ year flight attendant based in JFK. I think that way of SLC-Europe, but SLC-Asia may work if there is no competition and DL does the feed right, IMHO. Or does ATL-SLC-AsiaSpot (Like ATL-JFK-BOM - but JFK has good enough O&D for JFK-BOM).

The furthest point west of SLC longitude wise DL will serve from SLC directly will be HNL @158 degrees (ANC is 150 degrees).
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
FlightShadow
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Fut

Thu May 03, 2007 7:58 am

It was a fun little party - I enjoyed listening to the speakers (Jerry Grinstein, Rocky Anderson, some DL VPs) and festivities were cool (flyby, water cannon, food, touring the plane). I came away from the speeches disliking US Airways, and liking Rocky Anderson - I don't know what that's all about.

DL757MD was also there - he got much better pictures and can provide much better insight (he also got me in, for which I am extremely grateful  Smile ).

I'll post some pictures though, in case anyone's interested. I have to say though, DL's new livery looks MUCH better up close and in person than in a photograph.

The new logo!


Tail close-up


The Water Cannon Salute (horribly backlit, sorry)


Delta Executives de-planing


Jerry Grinstein giving a speech


Rocky giving a speech


Message to Jerry Grinstein
"When the tide goes out, you can tell who was skinnydipping."
 
WesternA318
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 8:02 am

WOW, talk about a wolf in the midst of the sheep...looking atteh crowd pics, I see several of my friends from HP/US in there!
Check out my blog at fl310travel.blogspot.com!
 
blackknight
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 8:08 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 8):
That will NEVER happen from a market like SLC without a stop in LAX first on the way

It will happen someday. Never is too finite. My bet is within 10 years. 10 years must be forever for you, wait until you are older 10 years and the term never will be nothing to you.
BK
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 8:09 am

Quoting FlightShadow (Reply 11):
I came away from the speeches disliking US Airways, and liking Rocky Anderson - I don't know what that's all about.

Rocky Anderson might be one of the most liberal mayors in America, in a region that is dominated by ultra-conservatives, but he knows good business plans when he sees it. As for US, thankfully that stupid idea is now long in the tank, and I'm sure Lee Moak and others had fun taking shots at them still, and getting everyone all riled up (too bad Vega & other US cheerleaders weren't there to take a turn on the dunking stand!  laughing  ). I really wish I could have pried myself away from my desk to go out and see it.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 8:14 am

Quoting BlackKnight (Reply 13):
It will happen someday. Never is too finite. My bet is within 10 years. 10 years must be forever for you, wait until you are older 10 years and the term never will be nothing to you.

Do you really see SLC passing DEN or PHX in population? I didn't think so. Passing SFO or SEA would be a pre-requisite to gaining such a flight from SLC.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
pizzaandplanes
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Fut

Thu May 03, 2007 8:17 am

That seems ridiculous that DL can't even get an aircraft to do a seasonal trans-atlantic flight. SLC is a little awkward with travelers leaving to the rest of the world in the summer and then a huge skiing season in the winter.
A real man lands where he wants to
 
deltairlines
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 8:32 am

Quoting Pizzaandplanes (Reply 16):
That seems ridiculous that DL can't even get an aircraft to do a seasonal trans-atlantic flight. SLC is a little awkward with travelers leaving to the rest of the world in the summer and then a huge skiing season in the winter.

Leisure fares do not equate to the strong yields...I think part of the problem is not enough year-round business travel up front to support this route.
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 8:34 am

Quoting Pizzaandplanes (Reply 16):
That seems ridiculous that DL can't even get an aircraft to do a seasonal trans-atlantic flight. SLC is a little awkward with travelers leaving to the rest of the world in the summer and then a huge skiing season in the winter.

How big a ski market is SLC and Utah compared with Colorado and DEN? Perhaps one-quarter of it being generous.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
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CV880
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 8:48 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 15):
Do you really see SLC passing DEN or PHX in population? I didn't think so. Passing SFO or SEA would be a pre-requisite to gaining such a flight from SLC.

Since the SF Bay Area Metro Pop is over 7M (including SJC/OAK), don't think that SLC will ever surpass that...maybe SFO should get a "token" flight....funny how SQ/UA always went full to HKG, now there's CX in the market. I suppose the Bay Area doesn't have a large enough Asian population to support more US carriers?
 
WesternA318
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 8:54 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 18):
How big a ski market is SLC and Utah compared with Colorado and DEN? Perhaps one-quarter of it being generous.

I'd say about half. Theres sucha HUGE ski/snowboard industry here its insane. Granted not on the scale of CO, but hey, at least the majority of resorts are less than an hour away...
Check out my blog at fl310travel.blogspot.com!
 
blackknight
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 9:55 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 15):
Do you really see SLC passing DEN or PHX in population? I didn't think so. Passing SFO or SEA would be a pre-requisite to gaining such a flight from SLC.

No I do not, but I do see more creative point to point, point to hub, and hub to hub flying. The world of open skies is just starting. By the way why all the negativity? Millions can tell you what won't happen be unique and focus on the possibilities. SLC is Deltas western hub right or wrong? If it is their hub then why not utilize transfer passenger traffic in the world of the 787, and A350 to fly overseas? They could funnel passengers from all western markets with the benefit of on time departures and arrivals in SLC and the smaller plane size to gain passenger preference. There are many airports that use this system. The hub already exists reguardless of O&D traffic. Delta needs to focus on the possibilities and ways to make it better while not doing the me too routes everyone else is. If you could get a less expensive flight from LAX or SFO to Asia via SLC would you refuse? Many of us from the SLC area fly to PHX to go to the north east USA or LAX to fly to South America. Why would those along the coast not do the same if the price was right? The cost of operation and employes are less at SLC than any airport on the coast. This would be reflected in the cost of tickets if needed to gain acceptance. It is possible thus it should be considered. I am really looking for facts why it will not work versus just opinions. It is a research project I have been assigned to do and yes I am getting paid for it. If you have data send it my way.
BK
 
rwsea
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 2:19 pm

Quoting BlackKnight (Reply 21):
If it is their hub then why not utilize transfer passenger traffic in the world of the 787, and A350 to fly overseas? They could funnel passengers from all western markets with the benefit of on time departures and arrivals in SLC and the smaller plane size to gain passenger preference.

Because all major (LAX, SFO, SEA) and semi-major (PHX, LAS, PDX) markets that would feed through SLC already have at least one daily flight to a European hub. Thus, the flight from SLC wont' do them any good. They'll still have the same number of stops regardless of where they go. And for the larger western cities without direct flights to Europe (e.g. SAN and SMF) it's easier to drive to another airport that has them (LAX or SFO, respectively), or connect through ATL/JFK. So a direct flight from SLC isn't really better for anyone except SLC-based O&D passengers. And how many people in SLC are flying to LON or CDG? Not enough to fill a plane. With respect to other western cities (like GEG, FAT, etc.) that only have flights to SLC, in most cases they have flights to other hubs (DEN, SEA, SFO, etc.) that have nonstops to Europe. So they really aren't any better off.

Until SLC can profitably provide O&D feed to fill 75% of the plane or so, they'll never be able to support nonstops to Europe. With only a shrinking number of 763s and 764s in DL's fleet, niche routes to Europe, South America, and Africa (and maybe Asia) have a lot more profit potential.

Quoting BlackKnight (Reply 21):
Why would those along the coast not do the same if the price was right?

But if the price is right enough to convince people in LAX, SFO, SEA, PHX, PDX, or LAS to skip the nonstops, then it's probably two low for DL to make any money.
 
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CV880
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 2:39 pm

How many people in SFO/SJC/OAK/SEA/PDX are going to fly to SLC to go to HNL/OGG just because the fare is cheaper (which it isn't), unless they're on FF free tickets? It adds at least 5 hours to the flight time including the connecting time....same analogy for Asia. It's bad enough to transfer in LAX for these destinations.
 
rwsea
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Thu May 03, 2007 2:42 pm

Quoting CV880 (Reply 23):
How many people in SFO/SJC/OAK/SEA/PDX are going to fly to SLC to go to HNL/OGG just because the fare is cheaper (which it isn't), unless they're on FF free tickets? It adds at least 5 hours to the flight time including the connecting time....same analogy for Asia. It's bad enough to transfer in LAX for these destinations.

 checkmark 

And if the fare is that much cheaper, DL would obviously be doing something wrong.
 
flyorski
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Fri May 04, 2007 2:30 am

Quoting WesternA318 (Reply 20):
I'd say about half. Theres sucha HUGE ski/snowboard industry here its insane. Granted not on the scale of CO, but hey, at least the majority of resorts are less than an hour away...

And the snow is really great! SLC is famous internationally (at least since the 2002 Olympics) for having GREAT SNOW, and the proximity of the resorts from the city center. Even here in Europe, I would guess that more people think of skiing in SLC than in DEN. Also many inclusive tours offer a week in DEN and then another in SLC. People come back chanting "Ski SLC! Ski SLC!"

Utah has GREAT snow, and ppl respect that. I think DL would do great on an CDG and a LHR flight..........
"None are more hopelessly enslaved, than those who falsly believe they are free" -Goethe
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Fri May 04, 2007 2:35 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 1):
They lack so many planes that they can start niche routes like Atlanta-Vienna and New York City-Pisa while ignoring such a "huge" market like Salt Lake City-Paris? Not really.

Its called high and hot + aircraft range. 777-200ER/LR and 787 can do it. 767's and 757's can't.
 
rwsea
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Fri May 04, 2007 3:14 am

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 26):
Its called high and hot + aircraft range. 777-200ER/LR and 787 can do it. 767's and 757's can't.

I would challenge that theory, given that DL flies JNB-DKR on a daily basis using the 763. JNB is hotter and higher than SLC, and the flight to DKR is only a few hundred miles shorter than SLC-LGW/CDG.
 
MAH4546
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Fri May 04, 2007 3:57 am

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 26):
Its called high and hot + aircraft range. 777-200ER/LR and 787 can do it. 767's and 757's can't.

If a 767 can't do Salt Lake City-Europe, then Salt Lake City-Europe isn't happening. Delta isn't wasting a 772 on such a route. That being said, a 763 can do SLC-Europe. Not ideal, but it can be done.
a.
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Fri May 04, 2007 5:58 am

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 26):
767's and 757's can't.

752s can make any route to Hawaii from SLC, but not Europe for DL. They can only be used from NYC-JFK or BOS:
Big version: Width: 481 Height: 241 File size: 5kb
Salt Lake City-Kauai 3039 miles

DL 763ERs can easily do SLC-Europe, but the question is can they generate the passenger loads and yields to make such a route profitable?

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 28):
If a 767 can't do Salt Lake City-Europe, then Salt Lake City-Europe isn't happening. Delta isn't wasting a 772 on such a route. That being said, a 763 can do SLC-Europe. Not ideal, but it can be done.

DL will likely try it. Theoretically SLC-LGW/LHR has the base O&D to do it, SLC-CDG does not, and if DL attempts the latter and utilize the AF/SkyTeam connections at CDG, this will be something that will likely require community subsidies for awhile, which is why I don't see it happening. For the most part as I've eluded to above, SLC as a hub for DL will be largely focused on North American operations from Hawaii-New England and from Alaska to Mexico and perhaps the Caribbean.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
Evan767
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Fri May 04, 2007 6:12 am

Quoting CV880 (Reply 23):
How many people in SFO/SJC/OAK/SEA/PDX are going to fly to SLC to go to HNL/OGG just because the fare is cheaper (which it isn't), unless they're on FF free tickets?

Uhmm.. that's why there are direct flights SFO-HNL, and why there are flights from SJC-LAX, OAK-LAX, SEA-LAX, and PDX-LAX, to connect to LAX-HNL/OGG...
The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
 
777captain
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Fri May 04, 2007 6:19 am

Delta will begin flying SLC-Europe when Boeing makes a 100 seat aircraft that has a range of 6,000nm and uses peanuts for fuel. And even then, it will be 3x/week.

cheers
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Fri May 04, 2007 6:57 am

Quoting BlackKnight (Reply 21):
If it is their hub then why not utilize transfer passenger traffic in the world of the 787, and A350 to fly overseas?

....because the same plane could be used more profitably from more powerful and better positioned hubs, regardless of any advance in efficiency.
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
slcdeltarumd11
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Fri May 04, 2007 11:47 am

You can say what you want about almost anything to me, but when people are wrong on utah skiing it really burns my biscuits  Wow! I know this is off topic, but i started the topic and people are dead WRONG and this the subject i care about most


you cant compare pure skiier numbers even though they use the term "visits" that means the skiiers skiing per day. colorado has many more people so OF COURSE their numbers of skiiers will be stronger when you know what the numbers mean. That number represents the lift tickets sold each day and season pass holders that go each day. Those numbers have NOTHING to do with visitors that come to ski especially the ones that fly by air. A higher precentage of people in colorado ski also. Colorado has skiiing in every part of the state utah really only has ski areas near SLC. Colorados ski season is much longer so those numbers are unfair to compare total skiier days to anything related to visitors.

Utah gets alot of europeans especially. They saw the olympics on tv and LOVE to ski in utah. Anyone that skis in utah sees europeans all the time on "holiday". I remember at the canyons(park city, ut) they claim that around ten percent of visitors that fly in come from outside the USA-pretty impressive in itself. If the canyons is pushing out around ten percent then im sure deer valley is at least 10 percent as well. These are not low far paying coach vacationers theses are pretty wealthy skiiers who pay the premium for a non-stop from LHR and im sure you would be surprised the amount of business elite seats sold. these people are buying fifteen million dollar homes and million dollar condos in park city (the fourteenth richest county in the country) im sure you would be surprised the amount of business elite seats sold in the winter from LHR the reason i think DL will start from LHR and i think in time for the 2008-2009 ski season. The skiiers alone would not fill the plane, but they will definitly help out alot at filling it up along with the connecting traffic, and o&d this 767-300ER will actually make money which is the primary goal.

lets all hope for many more good years to come at DL

I was at sundance this year on a full fare F paid seat along with alot of people there and i can tell you there were so many europeans whos film companies would all pay for the business elite seats for three weeks all fare paying passengers. that alone would dramatically give a huge boost to the flights profit potential, im not saying thats a reason to fly it, but i know it would be a huge boost to its profitability. I know that deltas jfk-nice non-stop makes a REDICULOUS amount of money for three weeks before during and after cannes off the bussiness elite seats so much it helps the route thru some really really really tough months. I have been meaning to write a trip report about that trip, but i have been really busy recently as ski season is over now i will hopefully remember too. How many routes sell that well in F ever, its a nice boost. slc does amazing on F cabin fare paying passengers for three weeks during sundance its a nice boost to all flights and im sure helps delta ALOT I couldnt get a seat on any of deltas ewr or jfk to slc flights in f at all when i needed to get to sundance had to give my money to united and i know they were filled lots of paying customers

[Edited 2007-05-04 05:07:35]
 
WesternA318
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Fri May 04, 2007 1:16 pm

Quoting Flyorski (Reply 25):
And the snow is really great! SLC is famous internationally (at least since the 2002 Olympics) for having GREAT SNOW, and the proximity of the resorts from the city center. Even here in Europe, I would guess that more people think of skiing in SLC than in DEN. Also many inclusive tours offer a week in DEN and then another in SLC. People come back chanting "Ski SLC! Ski SLC!"

Utah has GREAT snow, and ppl respect that. I think DL would do great on an CDG and a LHR flight..........

Amen to that! Last time I was in Greece I found out my family there had owned a mountain that gets A LOT of snow during the winter and have started planning out a ski resort there, with the help of the Greek Tourism Office. Al becasue oif one trip they took out here to see the Olympics live in SLC.


Quoting SlcDeltaRUmd11 (Reply 33):
You can say what you want about almost anything to me, but when people are wrong on utah skiing it really burns my biscuits

*pulls the biscuits out of the fire and grabs the butter and knife* I think theyre quite done, lol.
Check out my blog at fl310travel.blogspot.com!
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Fri May 04, 2007 2:31 pm

Quoting RwSEA (Reply 27):
I would challenge that theory, given that DL flies JNB-DKR on a daily basis using the 763. JNB is hotter and higher than SLC, and the flight to DKR is only a few hundred miles shorter than SLC-LGW/CDG.

JNB has a 14,000' runway. SLC's longest is only 12,000. On a hot day, DL's 767-3ER needs about 13,000'. The 788 woudl need about 11,000 on a hot day.

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 29):
752s can make any route to Hawaii from SLC, but not Europe for DL. They can only be used from NYC-JFK or BOS

Which is exaclty what I said. The question was about Europe which I said the 757/767 can't do, at least not without a payload penalty on hot days.

[Edited 2007-05-04 07:37:29]
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Fri May 04, 2007 11:23 pm

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 35):
Which is exaclty what I said. The question was about Europe which I said the 757/767 can't do, at least not without a payload penalty on hot days.

Which is why the SLC Department of Airports does have plans to extend runway 16L-34R to at least 14,500 feet in the near term. Look for a tunnel structure to be built for 22nd North just west from I-215 in the next couple of years to start on this.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
OOer
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Fri May 04, 2007 11:44 pm

Once they get some 787 in, they should look into SCL-FCO. Hell, they make everywhere else to FCO work!!!!! Also, they will have the help of the AZ codeshare in FCO!!!!!
 
airbazar
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Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Sat May 05, 2007 12:08 am

Quoting B4REAL (Reply 7):
Further US-FR open skies takes care of any landing rights, and there are available aircraft should they really want to operate the route.

What does one thing have to do with the other? Open skies and landing slots oare 2 completely different issues.

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 18):
How big a ski market is SLC and Utah compared with Colorado and DEN? Perhaps one-quarter of it being generous.

The question is, how much smaller is it for Europeans. The fact that you can't drink alcohol certainly has to have a big impact on it. Also, skiing in the US in general is significantly more expensive than in Europe. $80-$100 per lift is the standard price in the Rockies. For that money I can almost get both the lift and a room in certain places in the Alps, especially in Austria and Slovenia.
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Sat May 05, 2007 12:15 am

Quoting Airbazar (Reply 38):
The question is, how much smaller is it for Europeans. The fact that you can't drink alcohol certainly has to have a big impact on it. Also, skiing in the US in general is significantly more expensive than in Europe. $80-$100 per lift is the standard price in the Rockies. For that money I can almost get both the lift and a room in certain places in the Alps, especially in Austria and Slovenia.

 checkmark  While lift tickets in Utah are substantially less than what they go for in Colorado, the liquor control laws in Utah are amongst the strictest in the U.S. (I'm actually surprised Utah hasn't tried to pull what New Mexico has tried recently with F9 and US), and paying the nightly cover charge for a private club cuts into how much you actually pay for a ski vacation to Park City.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
flyorski
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Sat May 05, 2007 2:28 am

Quoting Airbazar (Reply 38):
$80-$100 per lift is the standard price in the Rockies. For that money I can almost get both the lift and a room in certain places in the Alps, especially in Austria and Slovenia.

Actually, it's usually cheaper in UT than Colorado. In Alta for example a Day pass is $52 and multiple days are $50 (that means if you buy a day pass for two days, you save $4). And because of the Euro vs. Dollar issue, this is a MAJOR saving when it comes to some of the prices in the Alps.
"None are more hopelessly enslaved, than those who falsly believe they are free" -Goethe
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Sat May 05, 2007 4:02 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 36):
Which is why the SLC Department of Airports does have plans to extend runway 16L-34R to at least 14,500 feet in the near term. Look for a tunnel structure to be built for 22nd North just west from I-215 in the next couple of years to start on this.

Don't need the extension with the 787-8 with the high thrust option. It's sub 12k on a hot day.
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Sat May 05, 2007 5:43 am

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 41):
Don't need the extension with the 787-8 with the high thrust option. It's sub 12k on a hot day.

Keep in mind that the 787 is still at least 3-5 years away for DL for the first wave, but none the less SLC does need longer runways irregardless. 12,000' for a North American hub airport high on the west slope of the Rocky Mountain region just won't cut it.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
blackknight
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Sat May 05, 2007 6:01 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 42):
Keep in mind that the 787 is still at least 3-5 years away for DL for the first wave, but none the less SLC does need longer runways irregardless. 12,000' for a North American hub airport high on the west slope of the Rocky Mountain region just won't cut it.

The updated master plan says they reviewed runways lengths up to 15,600 and settled on 15,100 feet to accomodate up to the 747-400 fully loaded on a hot day.
BK
 
blackknight
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Sat May 05, 2007 6:05 am

Below is a link to the update.

Some real good reading and information for an airport that should not dream big according to most here. I for one think the data speaks for its self.

http://www.slcairport.com/pdf/planning/slc_alp_report.pdf
BK
 
OOer
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Sat May 05, 2007 6:53 am

Thats a pretty interesting report. Didn't realize the 777-200 was so limited out of SLC....looks like the A340 family even does better than the 777!!!!!
 
blackknight
Posts: 222
Joined: Sat Dec 11, 2004 4:40 am

RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Sat May 05, 2007 7:00 am

Quoting OOer (Reply 45):
Thats a pretty interesting report. Didn't realize the 777-200 was so limited out of SLC....looks like the A340 family even does better than the 777!!!!!

Hot and High plus 4 engines versus 2. In addition there are power lines as noted in the report to the North. Also the tower at Hill AFB 21 miles down range to the north is listed as a factor. Which is questionable in my book.
BK
 
blackknight
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Sat May 05, 2007 7:36 am

Note the updated planning report says the following:

1.4 POTENTIAL FOR
INTERNATIONAL
OPERATIONS
According to SLCDA, airlines such as Virgin
Atlantic Airways, Air France, Delta Air
Lines, and Lufthansa have discussed adding
service to several European destinations
utilizing aircraft such as the Airbus A340,
Boeing B767, and Boeing B747.

Hint:Virgin
Atlantic Airways would use the A340-600 Hmmm., do we detect the hint of the winds of change? Branson does it his own way and usually is successful. I think this will become another Anet will it or will it not be successful topics. Time will tell.
BK
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Sat May 05, 2007 8:12 am

Quoting BlackKnight (Reply 47):
Note the updated planning report says the following:

1.4 POTENTIAL FOR
INTERNATIONAL
OPERATIONS
According to SLCDA, airlines such as Virgin
Atlantic Airways, Air France, Delta Air
Lines, and Lufthansa have discussed adding
service to several European destinations
utilizing aircraft such as the Airbus A340,
Boeing B767, and Boeing B747.

Hint:Virgin
Atlantic Airways would use the A340-600 Hmmm., do we detect the hint of the winds of change? Branson does it his own way and usually is successful. I think this will become another Anet will it or will it not be successful topics. Time will tell.

I would further elude that BA might even look at SLC for service in the likely dog eat dog world of US/Europe open skies. Branson is a "step out of the box" kind of leader of his business that he would likely jump at such an idea first.
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
pdxcof9
Posts: 130
Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2006 5:27 am

RE: DL CEO Visits SLC Celebrates DL, Europe In Future

Sat May 05, 2007 8:49 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 36):
Look for a tunnel structure to be built for 22nd North just west from I-215 in the next couple of years to start on this.

Great, more construction I need to avoid!!! lol

Quoting CV880 (Reply 23):
How many people in SFO/SJC/OAK/SEA/PDX are going to fly to SLC to go to HNL/OGG just because the fare is cheaper

Just saw about 10 bags going to HNL off the SFO flight here is SLC.

And my opinion with all this is I think a Europe flight would do well in the winter. A lot of skiers coming in. Why would you come to SLC in the summer??? It's hot and miserable. HAHA.  biggrin 
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