kaitak
Posts: 9033
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Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 4:02 pm

Good morning folks and happy Star Wars day (May the 4th be with you  Wink)

The story so far: Obi Wan Ahern is running for cover, since the evil rebellion, led by Darth Kenny and the intergalactic Rabbit, has spun a rumour across all corners of the galaxy that Obi Wan has hidden 30,000 galactic credits in the underfloor compartment of the Millenium Falcon, given to him by one of the bounty hunters.

Meanwhile, back on planet Earth ...

We should be hearing about the new EI order in the near future, so I thought we might try a little sweepstake among ourselves: what will it be? Just like guessing a new baby, except without the weight (not many parents like being told their new baby will be 220t, not least the expectant mother!) and sex, so: what type? How many bought directly and how many leased?

My guess: 787-9s: six directly, eight from lessors.

Over to you folks ...

Run strong on this thread, the force will!
 
Toulouse
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 5:29 pm

Excellent intro Kaitak, as always. Reading your introductions always puts a smile on my face, thank you (and I need a bit of cheering up at the moment!).

I've never been a betting man (simply as I haven't one a cent on the lotto, the Spanish lottery, or the French lotteries, and more or less gave up a few years ago, yet I admit the enormous sums of Euromillions encourages me to get a ticked every now and then)... but my bet for the Aer Lingus order is:

Airbus A-350's with a good deal for an interim order of 330's. I further suspect EI will son exercise it's right on its 320 options and if they have any sense, I think a few 319's should be ordered.

Reagrding breakdown, that's just too much gambling for me, but what the heck.

As I think Airbus will be more "desperate" for the order I'll bet on
7 350's directly from Aribus and 7 on lease (I've just taken that off the top of my head, no real logical consideration involved).

So so far we have:

Airbus: Un point, one point.
Boeing: Un point, one point.
Long live Aer Lingus!
 
Danny
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 5:38 pm

Quoting Toulouse (Reply 1):
Airbus A-350's with a good deal for an interim order of 330's. I further suspect EI will son exercise it's right on its 320 options and if they have any sense, I think a few 319's should be ordered.

I think EI should go with XWB for three reasons:

1. More room for growth than 787. EI already have up to 330 seats on the A330.
2. Proven and common with their current fleet A330 as interim aircraft.
3. Likely Airbus will give them better price as they are under pressure.


Agree with Toulouse on A319. Look how BMI improved their bottom line by ditching A321 and getting more A319.
Yes A321 has a lower CASM but ONLY if the extra seats are filled which is not the case for EI.
 
BrianDromey
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 5:51 pm

Quoting Toulouse (Reply 1):
Airbus A-350's with a good deal for an interim order of 330's. I further suspect EI will son exercise it's right on its 320 options and if they have any sense, I think a few 319's should be ordered.

I am also thinking A350. Airbus really needs to get the orders rolling in for this one. If EI were to be a launch customer for the A350, the aircraft could be as discounted as half price. EK have been offered bargain basement A330's as intirim lift, so its possible EI could get a similar deal (on a smaller scale  Wink ). Im going to say 15 A350 (mix of -800(5) -900(10))And options on at least 10. While Airbus needs orders, it cant stomp around in front of Boeing with 14 orders!

A few intirim A330s will also be take up, perhaps A340 'classics' around the 2012 mark.

The A320 options could also be delivered as part of this order. I would realy like to see a mix of A321s and A319s. Trunk routes like LHR, CDG, AMS and FRA could all make use of the A321, and offer EI lower costs as well. Where as routes like MAN, BHX, GLA, EDI (JER, TLS in winter) could all use the A319 better than the A320. Id like to see 4 A321s and 6 A319s. This offeres a similar nuber of seats as 10 A320s would do. Just packaged differently.

There was also a comment about "Cork North" (or Shannon as some people might say), in the last thread,

I think the catchment area for SNN would be mainly Galway, Limerick and Clare. Also a lot of North Kerry. I think both can sustain year round service. If an ORK-NYC/BOS route were launched, the biggest looser would be the EI service to LHR and AMS. I dont se places like IAD, ORD in either airports future, however.

Brian.
Next flights: MAN-ORK-LHR(EI)-MAN(BD); MAN-LHR(BD)-ORK (EI); DUB-ZRH-LAX (LX) LAX-YYZ (AC) YYZ-YHZ-LHR(AC)-DUB(BD)
 
Aer Lingus
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 5:53 pm

Although I would hope it will be the 787, I am still betting on it being the A350 with a sweetener for interim A330's. Nothing wrong with some new 330's until 2014. its still a great aircraft.

If its 787s though perhaps 10 789's with 4 788's to explore those emerging markets or indeed provide extra frequencies on less dense markets.
 
Toulouse
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 5:55 pm

Quoting Danny (Reply 2):



Quoting BrianDromey (Reply 3):

So given Danny and Brian's voting, can we say the voting currently stands as follows?:

Airbus: Three points, trois points.
Boeing: One point, one point.
Long live Aer Lingus!
 
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OA260
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 5:56 pm

Hi Kaitak cool intro. You should have been on Prime Time program last night!!! There was a special program about how young Irish voters feel detatched from Irish politics and sadly alot of students wont be able to vote due to the Thursday ballot which means thousands will still be at Uni. . FF were accused of ''silencing'' the young voters and I have to agree. Bertie got a major grilling by press yesterday for the 30,000 (Galactic credits issue ) lol... Funny enough SF came out the best last night . Also the government only gave people 2 days to get their postal vote sorted and that included getting the Gards to sign it !!! Even more suspect!!!

No debates on the aviation industry or tourism!! I dont think there will be any to be honest, unless the Greens kick up on carbon stuff again .

Oh well its another sunny warm day here in Ireland. Enjoy it while it lasts , its due to break just in time for our May Bank Holiday  Angry

I hope EI goes for the A350 as it will keep the fleet all Airbus which has suited them well so far rather than having bits of this and bits of that. Also we have our resident photographer TLS to take the first pics in a few years time  Big grin
 
pilot21
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 6:24 pm

Mrng all

Great intro as usual Kaitak, although it is slightly depressing that our current, and possible future leader is fighting more suspicious money deals while asking the voters to ignore his 'Private Life' and re-elect him. Politics is for another thread, but it does leave a slightly bitter taste in the mouth.

On the order front, hoping that we don't have too long to wait on this one now, but having thought long and hard about this one, I'm going for a Boeing deal, much and all as I know it's Airbus's order to loose. I just feel that the A350XWB isn't a firm design with tested knowledge, and while 2013 entry-into-service gives them time to sort things out, I feel there is a strong likelihood that Airbus will encounter issues with the design/manufacture of the aircraft, while Boeing will have 5yrs production under their belt at that stage.

I'm going for 10 B787 ordered directly from Boeing, with another 4 or 5 coming from a lessor, who will provide up to 5 extra A330's as cover until the B787's arrive.

Pilot21
Aircraft I've flown: A300/A310/A320/A321/A330/A340/B727/B732/B733/B734/B735/B738/B741/B742/B744/DC10/MD80/IL62/Bae146/AR
 
EIDUZ
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 6:30 pm

I have to go with the A350. 6 Direct and 8 leased.

I also think that they will make an announcment for the A320 options in line with the introduction of the new base in continental Europe.
Aer Lingus - National Pride.
 
pilot21
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 6:41 pm

On a different note, the EU Commission is saying July 4th is the date for their announcement on the proposed FR/EI take-over review. Details below, but let's hope with EI's ties to the US, we can read something into the date significance!!!

European Union regulators extended
their antitrust review of Ryanair Holdings Plc's proposed
purchase of Aer Lingus Plc after Ryanair offered ways to
overcome potential competition obstacles.
The European Commission, the 27-nation EU's regulator in
Brussels, didn't provide details of Ryanair's commitments. The
commission will rule on the transaction by July 4.
Ryanair announced the takeover bid in October to combine
the two Dublin-based airlines. While the offer has since lapsed,
Ryanair Chief Executive Officer Michael O'Leary has said he
plans to make another bid if EU approval is secured.
Aircraft I've flown: A300/A310/A320/A321/A330/A340/B727/B732/B733/B734/B735/B738/B741/B742/B744/DC10/MD80/IL62/Bae146/AR
 
mccormk
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 6:44 pm

My guess will be a 15 plus 5 options. With a sale and lease back on delivery for 7 of them. Also with a 320 and 330 on delivery on the 15th. My guess is that will be the day of the announcement.
 
Toulouse
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 7:28 pm

Quoting OA260 (Reply 6):
Also we have our resident photographer TLS to take the first pics in a few years time

Ha, so I'm now the resident a.net Irish thread photographer in TLS am I?

So for our sweepstake, I take it we're now at:

Airbus: 6 votes
Boeing: 3 votes

I hope Aer Lingus is listening to us!

On another note and back to GC we discussed yesterday, they have actually for once been efficient: I e-mailed them my missing flights yesterday evening, and just got an email apologising for the flights not being credited and that they had now credited them to my account. No me not having much faith in GC, I immediately logged onto my GC account, and hey presto, the missing points had been credited... Bravo GC! (on that particular front anyway)
Long live Aer Lingus!
 
EINA330
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 7:51 pm

Hey All,
Great intro Kaitak,but you forgot to mention Cowen the Hut!
I think they will go with Airbus.Familiar product,existing relationship and above all the simple fact that they could possibly get a great deal,both on the 350 and on interim 330s.I also believe the 319 would make perfect sense for Aer Lingus to serve the thinner routes and emerging markets.
As for numbers,my guess is 14 also,but not sure of breakdown between buying and leasing.
Airbus:7 points,Sept points
Boeing:2 points,deux points.
 
abc9
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 9:55 pm

Quoting EINA330 (Reply 12):
think they will go with Airbus.Familiar product,existing relationship and above all the simple fact that they could possibly get a great deal,both on the 350 and on interim 330s.I also believe the 319 would make perfect sense for Aer Lingus to serve the thinner routes and emerging markets.
As for numbers,my guess is 14 also,but not sure of breakdown between buying and leasing.

Excellent summary of my thoughts EINA330 - make that 8-2 so
 
EI321
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 10:08 pm

Do Norwegian air shuttle fly to dublin? Dublin is listed on their website.
 
cornish
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 10:32 pm

My understanding is that the EI non_Irish base is now only between MAN and BHX.

Do any of you Irish a.netters have any further info on this or an idea of which is favoured right now? Or is it simply going to come down to which offers them the best deal ?
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
 
ei737ng
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 10:35 pm

I would expect Airbus to win the order with 7 direct purchase and 7 leased with option for 4. However, I'd love to see it going to Boeing. I agree with Mccormk that a good possibility is 15th May for announcement. I feel Airbus will offer EI a deal too good to turn down, and with 787 selling so well Boeing are no that desparate for orders and fon't have to offer big discount rates.
 
Eirules
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 10:36 pm

Quoting EI321 (Reply 14):
Do Norwegian air shuttle fly to dublin? Dublin is listed on their website

I think they have stopped flying to DUB but I do stand to be corrected.

On the L/H fleet I cannot look beyond Airbus.
*EI need something in the short term until the 350 or 787 arrive and realistically the 330 is the only aircraft that fits that bill and I cant see Boeing giving EI 330s for the next few years.
*The fleet commonality will surely come into play and with EI continuing to order 320s it looks like this is their short haul aircraft of choice for the short to medium term future. In terms of training surely its easier to train crew and maintenance on a 350 than a 787 if they already know the 320.
*Finally the money. Airbus need the order more than Boeing, bottom line. They will therefore IMHO give EI a better deal than Boeing will be willing to on an aircraft that is already selling faster than they probably expected!
The way you cut your meat reflects the way you live....
 
smokeyrosco
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 11:28 pm

I expect it to be 350's aswell, it's usually a 1:1 owned leased ratio, I'd imagine it will be the same or maybe one or two in favour of EI. My Reasoning is simple really, the 330 has been an almost ideal aircraft for EI (even with tech problems recently which seem to have been resolved now for the most part?), also EI has done alot for the 330 (and airbus) when they got their early models they proved that the twin could be successful across the pond. One rumor that used to float around the airport is that EI got a 330 for next to nothing from AirBus for exactly that reason.

I know it wouldn't really matter now but wasn't EI burned badly with a 767 order(or lease)? wasn't that the reason we have seen 767's in EI colors for a short while.


View Large View Medium
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Photo © Wingnut

John Hancock
 
Toulouse
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Fri May 04, 2007 11:59 pm

I see Airbus is certainly winning our poll...
Now we just have to wait to see the results of the true decision makers!
Long live Aer Lingus!
 
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shamrock350
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 12:09 am

I'm thinking and hoping for A350s, the 787 has always looked good for EI but with Airbus probably offering a great deal for A350s and even better deal for interim A330s plus fleet commonality, which is essential for a low fares airline so I expect an A350 order for -800s and -900s the -1000 is a bit big for EI, maybe one day though.

I wonder if Aer Lingus has shown any interest in the 787-10? It would allow lots of room for further growth. If EI order the 787 maybe a 787-10 order could be made further down the road but if it does happen it wont be anytime soon.

Quoting Cornish (Reply 15):
My understanding is that the EI non_Irish base is now only between MAN and BHX.

I'm hoping for BHX, lots of potential there and a nice battle could start with FR from EMA but EI need to get those fares down and the brand out there. Could we see an Aer Lingus TV ad campaign in the UK, I'm probably dreaming.
 
COEI2007
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 12:15 am

Quoting Toulouse (Reply 11):
On another note and back to GC we discussed yesterday, they have actually for once been efficient: I e-mailed them my missing flights yesterday evening, and just got an email apologising for the flights not being credited and that they had now credited them to my account. No me not having much faith in GC, I immediately logged onto my GC account, and hey presto, the missing points had been credited... Bravo GC! (on that particular front anyway)

Thats happened a few times to me, and I normally get a response within 24 hours!
 
pilot21
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 12:26 am

Quoting Smokeyrosco (Reply 18):
One rumor that used to float around the airport is that EI got a 330 for next to nothing from AirBus for exactly that reason.

EI got the original A330's for next to nothing because they were built for Air Inter who cancelled their order when the Air France take-over went through. One of reasons why EI opted for the aircraft was that they were available almost immediately as a few aircraft were actually sitting idle in TLS having been built for an order that no longer existed.
Thus they were cheap and readily available which EI wanted so they could get rid of the B741's asap.(remember it was only 1.5yrs from when EI said they needed the new aircraft to allow the Transatlantic routes to remain open to when the last B747 was retired, not bad - although they only had 3 aircraft.

Quoting Smokeyrosco (Reply 18):
I know it wouldn't really matter now but wasn't EI burned badly with a 767 order(or lease)?

EI wasn't burned by Boeing or the lease company on these. They had ordered them for the DUB-LAX route which the Govt. said would be given permission to fly without the SNN stop-over. However the permission wasn't received, and the Gulf war 1 started resulting in a massive drop in pax loads on all flights, especially on the US routes, so EI got burned financially on operating a l/h aircraft on LHR routes, they managed to pass them on, but it was an expensive lesson.

[Edited 2007-05-04 17:41:25]

[Edited 2007-05-04 17:42:39]
Aircraft I've flown: A300/A310/A320/A321/A330/A340/B727/B732/B733/B734/B735/B738/B741/B742/B744/DC10/MD80/IL62/Bae146/AR
 
smokeyrosco
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 1:07 am

Quoting Pilot21 (Reply 22):

Cheers for that, clears up a few things
John Hancock
 
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OA260
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 2:00 am

Quoting Toulouse (Reply 11):
On another note and back to GC we discussed yesterday, they have actually for once been efficient: I e-mailed them my missing flights yesterday evening, and just got an email apologising for the flights not being credited and that they had now credited them to my account. No me not having much faith in GC, I immediately logged onto my GC account, and hey presto, the missing points had been credited... Bravo GC! (on that particular front anyway)

LOL...you were slaggin them not so long ago!!! 10 points and your anybodies LOL...

Well after a whole day with no internet at work , I finally got on to check my mail and Anet!!! Just shows you how you cant live without computers anymore. I couldnt do any of my work today .
 
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shamrock350
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 2:08 am

Quoting OA260 (Reply 24):
Well after a whole day with no internet at work , I finally got on to check my mail and Anet!!! Just shows you how you cant live without computers anymore. I couldnt do any of my work today .

The only aviation related things I get at school is listening to my PE teacher go on about how great Ryanair is and how his brother loves being a pilot for them. As a proud member of the Aer Lingus fan club it gets on my nerves and he thinks it's funny! Today he said, "wait until they fly to America, Aer Lingus is doomed" I was very angry  Angry
 
EISHN
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 3:08 am

Great intro Kaitak. Where do get your thread names, and intro ideas from? I always like them!

As for the order, I'm going for the A350. But as for the number, I'm going for somewhere between 14-20 now, with more to be ordered in the not to distant future. Because, if you look at it, it'll be 7/8 years before they arrive. Look how much EI have grown in the last 10 years. The long haul fleet has nearly tripled since the first A330s arrived. With OS between Ireland and Canada, and the EU and US, theres going to be a lot of growth. But there will also be the new overseas base. Presuming that there may 3 or 4 by 2015, I'm going to guess that one base will 6, and another recieve 4. Presuming EI build themselves up at these overseas bases, these could work. They could grow L/H over the years, and continue to expand.
As for the Irelnad order of 14-20, you have to remember that ORK will probally be able to handle a large a/c like the A350, plus SNN services, and maybe BFS?

As for how many they will buy, and how ,manhy they will lease, I bet 40% bought, 60% leased.
St. Flannan/ Fhlanain- She took off to find the footlights, And I took off for the sky
 
COEI2007
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 3:32 am

I finally did a trip report, with poor pictures, but its a start!!!!!!!!!!!

DUB-EWR-DUB CO, J (by COEI2007 May 4 2007 in Trip Reports)
 
kaitak
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 3:32 am

Quoting EISHN (Reply 26):
Great intro Kaitak. Where do get your thread names, and intro ideas from? I always like them!

Thanks EISHN ... I had to have a Star Wars theme today, so it just flowed from there! It's nice to have a bit of humour in it anyway, because above all else, these threads should be fun and enjoyable.

Interesting that there is an overwhelming majority going for the A350 over the 787; Airbus will certainly make EI a very attractive offer and it's certainly not something one can rule out; they're both very much in it. I just get the impression from all the indications I've ever seen and heard, mostly unofficially, that the 787 is the preferred aircraft. However, it is still very possible for Airbus to win. It's kind of fun to sit on the sidelines and watch the titans battle it out. Pass the choccie hob-nobs ...
 
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OA260
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 3:36 am

Quoting COEI2007 (Reply 27):
I finally did a trip report, with poor pictures, but its a start!!!!!!!!!!!

Hey COEI2007 , did you get any pics of the seats and meals etc??? Nice pic of the 777 .
 
COEI2007
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 3:39 am

Quoting OA260 (Reply 29):
Hey COEI2007 , did you get any pics of the seats and meals etc??? Nice pic of the 777 .

I have one-pic of the seat, which I forgot to add! I must upload it! I was last to board on the outbound, so I didnt want to take pics! Any my meals didnt last long enough to take pictures!!!!
 
EISHN
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 3:42 am

Quoting Kaitak (Reply 28):
Thanks EISHN ... I had to have a Star Wars theme today, so it just flowed from there! It's nice to have a bit of humour in it anyway, because above all else, these threads should be fun and enjoyable.

It shows the young boy still inside of you (not a knock at whatever age you may be of course!), and besides, I always like your entertaining intros, something which I don't think many other, if any, continuous threads like this one start with such a welcoming and entertaining intro, perhaps its an Irish thing!

Quoting COEI2007 (Reply 27):
I finally did a trip report, with poor pictures, but its a start!!!!!!!!!!!

Hey. great report. Its good to see that they have such good loads, and that they're sending the 762 back for the summer.
St. Flannan/ Fhlanain- She took off to find the footlights, And I took off for the sky
 
COEI2007
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 3:50 am

Quoting EISHN (Reply 31):
Quoting COEI2007 (Reply 27):
I finally did a trip report, with poor pictures, but its a start!!!!!!!!!!!

Hey. great report. Its good to see that they have such good loads, and that they're sending the 762 back for the summer.

Thats the lowest the loads have been in a long time!!!!!! Theres rarely more than 10 seats open!!
 
jwmd123
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 7:06 am

Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 20):
I'm hoping for BHX, lots of potential there and a nice battle could start with FR from EMA but EI need to get those fares down and the brand out there. Could we see an Aer Lingus TV ad campaign in the UK, I'm probably dreaming

If it is now down to BHX and MAN as said before then I would go for BHX.

Lived in BHX for 19 years and EI have a good brand in the area. The fares between EI and FR are very close generally.

BHX would be a good fit for EI. The airport at BHX has lots of potential and with the huge catchment area, BACON now gone (was a large user of BHX) and IMO one of the most underserved airports in the UK (Second biggest city).

However, if they did announce BHX, I would certainly see FR have a huge expansion from EMA.

Anyone ever been to EMA. What is it like?
 
BrianDromey
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 8:25 am

Quoting JWMD123 (Reply 33):
BHX would be a good fit for EI. The airport at BHX has lots of potential and with the huge catchment area, BACON now gone (was a large user of BHX) and IMO one of the most underserved airports in the UK (Second biggest city).

Indeed. I was at MAN today and BAconnect/flyBE is a mess. Customers are being treated quite badly, there does not appear to be any/many flyBE staff around the place, and there are constant delays. If BHX is even on par with MAN then there is ample opertunity for EI to step in and make a lot of routes work.


Nice TR CO! I have a few nice pics for my upcoming MAN-ORK-MAN TR, which I will post next week.

Brian.
Next flights: MAN-ORK-LHR(EI)-MAN(BD); MAN-LHR(BD)-ORK (EI); DUB-ZRH-LAX (LX) LAX-YYZ (AC) YYZ-YHZ-LHR(AC)-DUB(BD)
 
rineanna
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 8:45 am

Quoting JWMD123 (Reply 33):
Anyone ever been to EMA. What is it like?

I did a SNN-EMA-SNN at the end of 2005. It's a grand airport. Nothing spectacular about it, but I had no major problems with it (the check-in staff weren't exactly a bundle of fun, but there's a few of them at most airports anyway!). I think it underwent some sort of an expansion since I was there, which would have been needed if FR/WW/EZY were going to expand (which FR did). I'll remember it in a positive light, however, as I saw my first 747 landing there as I walked across the apron!

Quoting COEI2007 (Reply 32):
Thats the lowest the loads have been in a long time!!!!!!

Bring on the 777s!! Big grin
 
EISHN
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 6:08 pm

Quoting Rineanna (Reply 35):
Bring on the 777s!!

I saw a 767-400 last November in SNN. I was suprised, but thought that maybe the 764 comes in for the winter, in place of two daily 757s. I also saw one of Deltas ex gF 763s, and EI-DAA for the first time. Last summer I alos saw a US 757 in the new colours and a transiting RJ A310. Lots of interesting aircraft to see down at SNN, no matter what time of year!
St. Flannan/ Fhlanain- She took off to find the footlights, And I took off for the sky
 
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shamrock350
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 7:28 pm

Quoting JWMD123 (Reply 33):
However, if they did announce BHX, I would certainly see FR have a huge expansion from EMA.

Ryanair will not be happy, Aer Lingus is a threat, FR learned that a few years ago when EI made a recovery into a low fares airline and started doing well out of DUB again on European routes. EI was talking about 15 new routes which is quite a big expansion and I can see FR doing the same at EMA. I was quite surprised to hear that EI was looking at a UK base, that's the home of U2 and FR the biggest LCCs in Europe. There is no doubting that it will be a challenge for EI but if they can get costs down and the brand out there I think they could do quite well at BHX.
 
rineanna
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 7:47 pm

Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 37):
EI was talking about 15 new routes which is quite a big expansion

This surely means that EI will have to confirm some of their options on the 320 soon, yes?
 
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shamrock350
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 7:57 pm

Quoting Rineanna (Reply 38):
Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 37):
EI was talking about 15 new routes which is quite a big expansion

This surely means that EI will have to confirm some of their options on the 320 soon, yes?

Yes, I'm sure they said 15 new routes and that would need a good few A320s. Maybe the two new A320s coming later this year will be based there just to get things started. Aer Lingus expect to start flights from the new base early 2008 so an order could be made soon maybe at the same time as the A350/787 order, that would be even bigger news!
 
styles9002
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 8:36 pm

Good Morning, All.
I have read these threads for a long time and finally decided to join up so I can add replies. I enjoy these threads although I must admit I disagree with some of the opinions. Anyhow, I have a question on the potential EI base as either BHX or MAN ; EI mentioned the reason they are opening a base outside of Ireland was to take advantage of a lower operating cost environment. Would someone who knows more than me advise how BHX or MAN compares to DUB for operating costs? I can't imagine that wages are less or airport fees, so what is the advantage?
It is what it is.
 
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shamrock350
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 8:42 pm

Welcome to airliners.net Styles9002!

Quoting Styles9002 (Reply 40):
Would someone who knows more than me advise how BHX or MAN compares to DUB for operating costs? I can't imagine that wages are less or airport fees, so what is the advantage?

I dont know what the difference in operating costs are but I do think it is strange that EI would say this and look at a UK base when I'm sure operating costs must be much lower in Eastern Europe.

Does anyone know when we are to hear about the new base?
 
styles9002
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 9:17 pm

Thanks, Shamrock350.

I read somewhere that EI were also considering RIX or TLL which would certainly would be lower operating costs than BHX or MAN. I would also think that BA or BD or other carriers would already be operating on this model at MAN or BHX if they considered it feasible.

Any ideas on where EI would fly ex MAN or BHX? Are they thinking Poland or other eastern European cities?
It is what it is.
 
COEI2007
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 10:42 pm

Quoting Rineanna (Reply 35):
Quoting COEI2007 (Reply 32):
Thats the lowest the loads have been in a long time!!!!!!

Bring on the 777s!!

Never gonna happen! Two 752's will operate DUB from Sept, so thats the best thats gonna happen!

Quoting EISHN (Reply 36):
I saw a 767-400 last November in SNN. I was suprised, but thought that maybe the 764 comes in for the winter, in place of two daily 757s. I also saw one of Deltas ex gF 763s, and EI-DAA for the first time. Last summer I alos saw a US 757 in the new colours and a transiting RJ A310. Lots of interesting aircraft to see down at SNN, no matter what time of year!

The 764 operated CO126, EWR-DUB-SNN, for Thanksgiving! I was lucky to get to fly the 764 that day!
 
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OA260
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 11:07 pm

Quoting COEI2007 (Reply 43):
Never gonna happen! Two 752's will operate DUB from Sept, so thats the best thats gonna happen!

lol....the only way you will get on a 777 is the CO19 from LGW!!!
 
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shamrock350
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sat May 05, 2007 11:07 pm

Quoting Styles9002 (Reply 42):
I read somewhere that EI were also considering RIX

RIX was another rumoured base because of how well the DUB flight is supposedly going and of course the lower operating costs but with FR having 8 routes from their already it would be hard for EI take them on.

Regarding BHX, BD and BA dont fly from there as much as MAN and LHR. However BmiBaby do have quite a big presence in BHX and it could be difficult for EI. Other LCCs like FR and U2 seem to stick to EMA rather than BHX.

I would love to see EI back in Northern Ireland, the Irish brand would help quite a bit and I'm sure they would be a welcome change from BD and U2, theres also lots of room for transatlantic growth but I doubt the new base will be Belfast because EI said the new base will serve DUB.

Wasn't there talk of EI thinking about using some LHR slots for Belfast last year?

Quoting Styles9002 (Reply 42):
Any ideas on where EI would fly ex MAN or BHX? Are they thinking Poland or other eastern European cities?

I think Eastern Europe, Spanish routes and possibly North Africa is likely and obviously to Ireland.
 
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OA260
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sun May 06, 2007 12:38 am

Quoting Shamrock350 (Reply 45):
Wasn't there talk of EI thinking about using some LHR slots for Belfast last year?

Yeah but I dont think they will go head to head with BMI as BHD is much better and BMI have is sewn up.
 
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shamrock350
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sun May 06, 2007 12:51 am

Northern Ireland was talked about just after the IPO then FR made their bid and all the rumours and talk disappeared most of them returned apart from this one so maybe they are looking at expanding at Cork rather than going further North to Belfast.

I expect a few more routes out of Cork from Aer Lingus, more eastern Europe for next winter.
 
styles9002
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sun May 06, 2007 1:02 am

Is EI quiting the ORK MAN route they recently launched? I don't see it in the Amadeus timetable anymore? If they are collapsing the route, that is hardly good news for EI & ORK particularly.
It is what it is.
 
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shamrock350
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RE: Feel The Force: Irish Aviation Thread 22/07

Sun May 06, 2007 1:03 am

Quoting Styles9002 (Reply 48):
Is EI quiting the ORK MAN route they recently launched?

Yes I'm afraid so. It is no longer bookable after June, the route has only been operating two months so it must have been doing quite badly.

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