Mainland
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AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 7:41 pm

AirTran Holdings, Inc., Extends Midwest Air Tender Offer to June 8, 2007
http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/070517/nyth046a.html?.v=3

Tender offer is extended to June 8th, more than 13.9 million shares (approx 56.6%) have been tendered to AirTran.

[Edited 2007-05-17 13:13:35]
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knope2001
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 8:27 pm

If there was no poison pill and no anti-hostile-takeover statutes in Wisconsin, this would probably be it.

However there are.

I suspect this just sets up the boardinng meeting showdown where AirTran's three nominees may get elected to the board. If so they will be the minority at least until next year, as one of several anti-takeover measures put into place was to stagger the board terms. Only 3 of 9 members up every year.

If AirTran succeeds in getting 3 seats on the board, that in essence gives the rest of the Midwest BOD a year to (a) negotiate and come to an agreement with AirTran (b) find another buyer,either airline or equity investment group, or (c) find a way to take the company private, either with equity investors, serious debt leveraging, or both.

If have a majority of shares tendered was indeed "it", then there would be no point in them extending the offer, which they have again.
 
n917me
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 8:57 pm

Very well put Knope2001.

I think that this is FAR from over. Although this is a "victory" for AirTran, there is still many battles to be fought before this is over.

Looking forward to hearing a response from YX. No intetrnal communications yet.

A sad day for YX.
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 9:01 pm

AirTran is paying far too much. This will end them if they get the takeover. They aren't making money today, and buying Midwest isn't going to help them one bit.
 
DAYflyer
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 9:15 pm

Quoting N917ME (Reply 2):
I think that this is FAR from over. Although this is a "victory" for AirTran, there is still many battles to be fought before this is over.

It's just a matter of time, and how much it is going to cost FL.

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 3):
AirTran is paying far too much. This will end them if they get the takeover. They aren't making money today, and buying Midwest isn't going to help them one bit.

The business case for buying Midwest seems sound enough to me. How do you figure it wont help them out?
One Nation Under God
 
SeeTheWorld
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 9:22 pm

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 4):
The business case for buying Midwest seems sound enough to me. How do you figure it wont help them out?

I agree. This is one of the most logical mergers of any I've seen in 20 years. The synergies with routes and fleets are great.
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 9:34 pm

Quoting SeeTheWorld (Reply 5):
This is one of the most logical mergers of any I've seen in 20 years. The synergies with routes and fleets are great.

It doesn't matter what your synergies are if you take on excessive debt and a staff of ticked off employees. They will get slaughtered by access hungry airlines at MKE.

Consider this: You've done what is essentially a hostile take over, you have irritated the employees, you have no public brand loyalty and you're operatign at an airport that can be raided overnight by the other carriers who see this weakness (not to mention you probably see a few more "unscheduled" delays than normal that the other carriers won't have). That's how you get slaughtered. MKE isn't some fortress hub. It's small and ripe for raiding.
 
DAYflyer
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 9:37 pm

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 6):
MKE isn't some fortress hub. It's small and ripe for raiding.

Then let FL raid. FL has lots of new shiney 737's coming off the line. And if you think it is so easy to do, why did NW fail in it's raid?
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rumorboy
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 9:38 pm

Even if the use the poison pill they still have majority of the shares.

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 4):
They aren't making money today, and buying Midwest isn't going to help them one bit.

Funny you say that. Airtran had a first quarter profit. Fornano announced last week they would have "record earning's" in the second quarter and been profitable on annual basis for eight years's straight.

I think when Midwest announced earnings last quarter and didn't do"as expected"(Tim's words) and then lowered guidance for the year, most share holders began to question Midwests real motives.
 
bigjku
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 9:48 pm

It will be very sad if Airtran buys Midwest. I have had nothing but good experiences with Midwest and Airtran has never done anything for me other than be a steaming pile of junk. Missed connections, sat me on a runway for 3 hours waiting for a mechanic because they did not have one around and had to page him in that morning.

I have flown Airtran for at least 5 trips in the past couple of years and have had something go wrong in or out everytime. I am usually amazed if I hit my connection. My company no longer even tries to book with Airtran it got so bad.
 
n917me
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 9:53 pm

Quoting Rumorboy (Reply 8):
Even if the use the poison pill they still have majority of the shares.

But it will cost AirTran a hell of alot more money out of their own pocket instread of using the money Midwest has.
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 9:54 pm

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 7):
Then let FL raid. FL has lots of new shiney 737's coming off the line. And if you think it is so easy to do, why did NW fail in it's raid?

Brand loyalty and between the two there were minimal fare differences. You take away the product and the model changes. They either don't care because they have no plans to stay, or they're stupid.
 
Mainland
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 10:20 pm

Midwest's reply:

Midwest Air Group Comments on Results of AirTran's Unsolicited Exchange Offer
http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/070517/aqth086.html?.v=4

Quote:
MILWAUKEE, May 17 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- Midwest Air Group, Inc. (Amex: MEH - News), parent company of Midwest Airlines, today responded to the announcement by AirTran Holdings, Inc. (NYSE: AAI - News) of the preliminary results of its unsolicited exchange offer, which expired yesterday and was extended until June 8.

"Nothing has changed as far as control of Midwest Air Group is concerned; no shares have been purchased by AirTran," said Carol N. Skornicka, senior vice president, general counsel and secretary. "The exchange offer is subject to numerous conditions. Regardless of the number of shares tendered, AirTran would not purchase shares unless those conditions are waived or are satisfied."

Skornicka explained that several significant actions would have to be taken by the Midwest Board of Directors for those conditions to be satisfied, including waiving the provisions of Wisconsin law that protect Wisconsin corporations from hostile takeovers. "The board has declined to take action to satisfy any of the conditions," she pointed out. "While other scenarios are theoretically possible, as a practical matter, board approval would be required for AirTran to accomplish its goal of acquiring our company."
You don't need a passport to know what state you're in...
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 10:22 pm

Quoting Rumorboy (Reply 8):
Funny you say that. Airtran had a first quarter profit. Fornano announced last week they would have "record earning's" in the second quarter and been profitable on annual basis for eight years's straight.

At those levels, they'd be done in a week long strike.

Biggest key right here.

Quoting Mainland (Reply 12):
Skornicka explained that several significant actions would have to be taken... including waiving the provisions of Wisconsin law that protect Wisconsin corporations from hostile takeovers. ..."


[Edited 2007-05-17 15:26:21]
 
rumorboy
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 10:27 pm

looks like ovactian wants a deal now.


http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/070517/aqth086.html?.v=4

ADVERTISEMENT


"The acceptance of AirTran's offer by the majority of shareholders is a clear indication of the desire of Midwest's owners for the board of directors to immediately engage in productive and good faith negotiations to effectuate a transaction," Richard Hurowitz, CEO of Octavian, said. "The number of shares already tendered into the exchange offer is remarkable given that Midwest has not yet even turned over its shareholder list to AirTran.
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 10:34 pm

Quoting Rumorboy (Reply 14):
"The number of shares already tendered into the exchange offer is remarkable given that Midwest has not yet even turned over its shareholder list to AirTran.

That's because the shareholders aren't tendering them, speculators who manage the shares are. You have an entire street of invesment strategists that are under the false impression that airline mergers are required and that the system has too much capacity. The shareholders are acting on this false advice. Not the first time, won't be the last either.
 
quickmover
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 10:38 pm

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 6):
It doesn't matter what your synergies are if you take on excessive debt and a staff of ticked off employees.

I think the only "ticked off" employees are senior management. If a majority of the shareholders want a deal, this is looking more and more like extortion at the upper levels of MEH. As far as the rest of MEH employees and pilots, I would think they would have a better chance for advancement flying company planes rather than outsourced ones.
 
sideflare75
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 10:51 pm

Quoting Quickmover (Reply 16):
I think the only "ticked off" employees are senior management.

Think again.
 
n917me
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 11:18 pm

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 15):
That's because the shareholders aren't tendering them, speculators who manage the shares are.

BINGO!

Quoting Sideflare75 (Reply 17):
Quoting Quickmover (Reply 16):
I think the only "ticked off" employees are senior management.

Think again.

Exactly! However this is far from over though.
 
alphascan
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 11:23 pm

Quoting Knope2001 (Reply 1):
If AirTran succeeds in getting 3 seats on the board, that in essence gives the rest of the Midwest BOD a year to (a) negotiate and come to an agreement with AirTran (b) find another buyer,either airline or equity investment group, or (c) find a way to take the company private, either with equity investors, serious debt leveraging, or both.

Good review of the situation. I think option (c) needs to be broken down between heavy debt leveraging or not. Probably the only path left that will not result in significant changes to the business model is taking the company private with investors who believe in the model.

Knope, as the board's resident expert on Midwest, do believe Hoeksema is up to this challenge? I mean is he the right guy to bring the company through this successfully?
"To he who only has a hammer in his toolbelt, every problem looks like a nail."
 
quickmover
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 11:26 pm

Quoting N917ME (Reply 18):
Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 15):
That's because the shareholders aren't tendering them, speculators who manage the shares are.

BINGO!

So speculators are not shareholders and in turn are not investors? How long are these "speculators" required to hold their shares? If they are managing a hedge or mutual fund, are they required to forget about what is best for the investors of the fund (like making a profit on their shares)?
 
SkyexRamper
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 11:34 pm

Quoting Quickmover (Reply 16):
I think the only "ticked off" employees are senior management.

I can name a few more ticked off employees than you can... Big grin  Cool
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knope2001
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Thu May 17, 2007 11:34 pm

Quoting Alphascan (Reply 19):
Knope, as the board's resident expert on Midwest, do believe Hoeksema is up to this challenge? I mean is he the right guy to bring the company through this successfully?

Thanks for the compliment!

I know there are some (including employees) who are not particularly fond of Hoekesma, however I believe he is the right person for the task of trying to keep MEH out of AAI's hands at this point for several reasons:

(a) It would be hard to find somebody at this level to come in who has a greater personal interest in doing whatever it takes to keep Midwest from being sucked into another airline. He was with the company back in it's earliest formative stage when it was going to be a premium-service airline flying Appleton-Chicago-O'Hare-Atlanta/Fulton County in the early 80's. He's been at the helm through every up and down along the way, and he's not likely to let the fruits of 25+ years of work be dismantled and absorbed. If MIdwest indeed sells out to AirTran, Hoeksema

(b) He has long-standing connections within the local business community, and if anybody is going to glean support from that sector it will be him.

(c) Changing horses mid-stream in a battle like this is probably not the best course of action. Like him or not, it would be hard to find someone else to run the show who has more of a stake in it than he does.

Pure speculation on my part has the three AirTran directors elected in June, and that Midwest comes up with a non-AirTran alternative to buy the company and keep it independent. I just hope that it does not damage the company financially (like massive debt) that it does long-term damage. TIme will tell, I guess.
 
Cubsrule
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tender

Thu May 17, 2007 11:52 pm

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 4):
The business case for buying Midwest seems sound enough to me. How do you figure it wont help them out?

Some of you have seen this, as it's an old post of mine. But here are some potential problems

Quote:
I've been thinking a lot about t he as yet unexplained reasons that a lot of shareholders are hesitant to tender, and after looking over this thread and others, I think part of the problem is that AAI is being intellectually dishonest about the merger. There are circumstances under which a FL/YX merger would make a lot of sense, but AAI is yet to articulate them. In particular, more intelligent analysis in the following areas would help get shareholders (and the MEH BoD) on board with the merger:


* AAI needs to explain the relatively poor performance of its own stock. If I were an investor, the fact that AAI is $5 (about 30%) off its 52 week high would be a huge issue for me. AAI is never going to make an offer that is 100% cash, and so the health of its stock is of huge consequence to the long-term investor. How are they going to right the ship? They have almost completely ignored this question

* On a related note, AAI needs to articulate a viable long-term plan for the combined company. We've heard a fairly comprehensive plan for MKE (more on that below), but simultaneously, we know that FL has pulled planes off of business routes at DFW and MDW to add Florida flying, and we know that YX is growing its two focus cities, OMA and MCI. How does all of this fit together? Where does a city like BWI fit into all of this? We haven't heard yet

* What are the hidden costs of the merger? For example, J7 owes the city of Nashville a whole bunch of money, and FL will not be welcome there until this issue is resolved. This one is fairly common knowledge, but what other skeletons are in the closet?

* AAI needs to more honestly address the issue of jobs. In the short term, this merger will result in job losses in Wisconsin. Ordinarily, this wouldn't be a big deal. Mergers have synergies. Some employees are no longer necessary. Unfortunately, under Wisconsin law, this loss of Wisconsin jobs is a valid reason for the BoD of MEH to ask AAI to pay more. AAI only talks about the job gains, but MEH is concerned about job losses

* What will happen to service standards? This isn't about how everyone loves cookies (though I'll admit that every time I fly YX, I try to get 2, and the last time I flew AL, there was a deadheading pilot who slept the whole flight except when the cookies came around). We know that hot cookies and the current YX meals will not exist any longer. Yet, AAI says that they will start using the "best practices" of the current YX. This is a very creative way to say absolutely nothing. What does this mean?

* What place to RJs have in AAI's long term plans? Even the most ardent supporter of FL will concede that the ZW experiment failed. But they want to keep AL and OO around? The feed provided by regional carriers is an important part of the success of the MKE hub, and the addition of seats that comes with reconfigured 712s combined with the loss of this feed would prima facie seem like a recipe for disaster.

* And finally, what is the plan for MKE? We've heard these grand stories of a 350 flight hub. I've detailed in another thread why I don't think this is viable. In many markets, AAI proposes to fill 2 or 3 times the number of seats that AA and UA fill at ORD with about 1/4 the local market and about 1/2 the feed. Chicago is not a particularly high-fare market, so even the argument that low fares will stimulate the market doesn't get us there. I think MKE could probably support what I call "MEM-lite," a 150 daily flight hub of 3 banks. Why does AAI think it can support so much more?

* What if someone mounts a competitive response at MKE? If the merger goes through, there is no way that FL keeps E60 and E61. That leaves NW and CO with 9 gates and about 25 daily flights between them. NW could build a focus city similar to what they currently do at IND with very little trouble, and at IND, they compete successfully with FL AND WN. That spells potential trouble. B6 is looking for a midwest foothold. F9 is beginning to expand more and more outside of DEN. What if one of them enters (or, in the case of F9, grows) MKE? Both offer a better product. Has FL even considered these possibilities?

* And finally, there is the question of customer backlash in Milwaukee. Despite being a native of the upper midwest, I don't understand the loyalties that are present there. I do know that all AAI says is that lower prices will win hearts and minds. What if they are wrong?



I assume AAI has considered all of these issues. If they really want this merger to happen, they need to address them honestly.




Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 7):
And if you think it is so easy to do, why did NW fail in it's raid?



YX was there. NW can raid FL much more easily than it can raid YX.

[Edited 2007-05-17 16:53:21]
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SkyyMaster
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Fri May 18, 2007 12:00 am

Quoting N917ME (Reply 2):
Very well put Knope2001.

 checkmark 

Quoting N917ME (Reply 2):
A sad day for YX.

Airtran seems hellbent on making this happen. I'm not sure it will be of benefit to the employees of YX, their pax, or the people of Milwaukee in the long run. Stay tuned, this looks as if it will drag out a long while.
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Fri May 18, 2007 12:19 am

Quoting Quickmover (Reply 20):
So speculators are not shareholders and in turn are not investors?

It's not E-trade day traders offering advice to shareholders and moving portfolios. Its portfolio managers making recommendations to the shareholders on flawed assumptions about the present aviation environment.
 
mpdpilot
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Fri May 18, 2007 12:45 am

Quoting SeeTheWorld (Reply 5):
I agree. This is one of the most logical mergers of any I've seen in 20 years. The synergies with routes and fleets are great.

How do you figure? Yes they have the same planes and relatively complementry route structures, but that is about it. They offer extremely different products in what I would say are extremely different markets. I have to say that these two companies dont really go together in fact they could probably operate side by side and have very little affect on each other.
One mile of highway gets you one mile, one mile of runway gets you anywhere.
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Fri May 18, 2007 12:54 am

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 23):
And finally, what is the plan for MKE? We've heard these grand stories of a 350 flight hub. I've detailed in another thread why I don't think this is viable. In many markets, AAI proposes to fill 2 or 3 times the number of seats that AA and UA fill at ORD with about 1/4 the local market and about 1/2 the feed. Chicago is not a particularly high-fare market, so even the argument that low fares will stimulate the market doesn't get us there. I think MKE could probably support what I call "MEM-lite," a 150 daily flight hub of 3 banks. Why does AAI think it can support so much more?

Excellent points. Also of note, this temporary advantage will be nullified when O'Hare modernization is complete providing a 60% increase in O'Hare's capacity. Even if they were successful at an MKE build up, they'd get slaughtered at the end of the day because of the capacity pressure release at O'Hare reducing the current northward trip trend (that incidentally people are willing to make because of product differentiation in the form of a business class seat).
 
OttoPylit
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Fri May 18, 2007 12:55 am

Quoting SkyyMaster (Reply 24):
Airtran seems hellbent on making this happen. I'm not sure it will be of benefit to the employees of YX, their pax, or the people of Milwaukee in the long run. Stay tuned, this looks as if it will drag out a long while.

The funny thing is that Airtran doesn't know how to take a hint. Midwest's employees have made it clear that they don't want to work for a bottom-of-the-barrell company, and are completely happy working for the company that has earned the title "America's Favorite Little Airline." This airline has built itself from the ground up in an honest way and built supreme passenger loyalty through service, as compared to Airtran who has no brand loyalty and truly goes for the lowest common denominator as its customer. Therefore, YX's passengers would also be in for one heck of a downturn in service and have made it clear that they do not want this to happen and if it did, they would take their business elsewhere. And the people of Milwaukee and Wisconsin have made it clear that they are not interested in this type of acquisition, otherwise these state statutes would not already be in place. Not to mention the fact that the YX BOD has already told Airtran SEVERAL times to bugger off. Yet, Airtran doesn't see this as a resounding NO. In fact, if you read their press releases, they make it sound like YX shareholders are desperate for FL to takeover, which is 180 degrees from their true feelings.

Airtran's only motive in this is to take down the competition. They have no intent to turn MKE into the mega-fortress hub that they say they will. They want to take down the competition, they will stay in MKE, but flight options that YX provides would be slashed in half, and they will get a load of airplanes that they couldn't schmooze Boeing into continuing production of. And yet, they keep extending their offer over and over in the vain hope and attempt that YX shareholders will change their mind. They've already made their feelings clear. They may be willing to sell, but they would hold out for than Airtran can afford, not that Airtran would be able to realize that until they go belly up.

Perhaps YX should begin a campaign like Delta did with a "Keep Midwest My Midwest." That would get the word out of what is happening and allow more of YX and Milwaukee's citizens to see the true actions behind this acquisition attempt.

Just goes to show what kind of company that Airtran is, when its basically had to resort to pleading and begging in order to acquire another airline.



OttoPylit
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knope2001
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Fri May 18, 2007 12:56 am

A significant portion of the MEH company stock is now owned by firms looking to make a quick buck. The buyout offer put the stock "in play" and that attracted institutional short-term players who don't know much about the company stock they purchsed and couldn't care less if it was an airline, a meatpacking company, nursing home chain or a software develompent firm.

These investment firms park money in the stock of such acquisition targets by accumulating whatever is out there on the market for sale. This buying encourages real long-term investors to sell as it keeps the price up, although they are careful not to make the stock too hot so that it gets too expensive for them to acquire.

The only goal of the investment firm is to make a profit on the money the parked into that particular stock. They don't really care that it is AirTran wanting MIdwest, and if a better offer comes along they'll turn against AirTran in a heartbeat.

The bulk of the rhetoric and actions going on now have nothing to do with Midwest and their business plan, nor with AirTran and their plans for Midwest after the merger. Now it's about the institutional speculative investors getting their profits out of the deal no matter the outcome.

Keep that in mind when trying to link things like company performance, outlook, strategic plans, etc, to what's going on now. It isn't that the owners of the company believe in AirTran's plans or are against what Midwest is doing. It really isn't about that anymore, neither from the Midwest nor the AirTran side, when it comes down to how this will ultimately be decided.
 
quickmover
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Fri May 18, 2007 1:04 am

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 25):
It's not E-trade day traders offering advice to shareholders and moving portfolios. Its portfolio managers making recommendations to the shareholders on flawed assumptions about the present aviation environment.

The present environment is that MEH is now at $15 and before all this happened it was between $8-9. There is nothing flawed about taking a bird in hand. If this deal goes away, so will that premium. Any good portfolio manager that does his job, will lock in those gains and not give a second thought as to who the buyer is. If the deal goes away and the stock drops, there is nothing stopping them from re entering the stock.
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Fri May 18, 2007 1:19 am

Quoting Quickmover (Reply 30):
If this deal goes away, so will that premium.

The premium has to be sustainable, and it won't be if they take over Midwest. The primary reason carriers don't hammer away at MKE right now is because its a hub with a competitively priced "premium" product that they are unable to effectively raid. If you remove the product (not just seats and yield here), you remove the entry barrier. Barrier removed, end game. This isn't about one airline replacing another with a like product, AirTran does not have a better product than the other carriers that will allow them to fend off the competition. This isn't about airline market price, it's about PRODUCT. Any investor who thinks its about price doesn't understand why it is that Midwest exists and they will be sorely disappointed when their investment gets flushed down the proverbial toilet.
 
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JBo
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Fri May 18, 2007 1:55 am

Quoting Quickmover (Reply 16):
I would think they would have a better chance for advancement flying company planes rather than outsourced ones.

Not sure what you're talking about here, the only outsourced planes in YX are the OO CRJs, and in any event, they along with Skyway, would likely be gone if the merger goes through. As Cubsrule quoted before, FL and regional services don't mix well.

And then, there's Great Lakes picking up the EAS. Makes you wonder who they'll codeshare with, if anyone, in MKE should YX disappear.
I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.
 
Cubsrule
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Fri May 18, 2007 2:16 am

Quoting OttoPylit (Reply 28):
Perhaps YX should begin a campaign like Delta did with a "Keep Midwest My Midwest." That would get the word out of what is happening and allow more of YX and Milwaukee's citizens to see the true actions behind this acquisition attempt.

http://www.savethecookie.com/

Granted, it's not nearly as well-advertised as DL's efforts were.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
2175301
Posts: 728
Joined: Wed May 16, 2007 11:19 am

RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Fri May 18, 2007 10:41 am

I'd like to thank the people who have recognized what is different about Midwest. The product.

The reason that NW and others have not been able to affect Midwest is that they cannot offer the premium service that Midwest offers.

Should AirTran be successful - then AirTran's product can be easily competed against. Not only that - but AirTran can only get a very small percentage of the existing Midwest customer base.

The more accurate comparison - using automobiles - is like this:

Midwest is selling Lexus's; and they have pretty much locked up the Lexus market in the cities they operate in.

NW and other mainline airlines are the Fords, Chevy's, and GM's. Some premium product - but much of their product is just average (and some below average).

AirTran is selling Yugo's (for those of you who remember them) while Southwest is selling Honda Civics.

NW and other mainline airlines can sell some premium product - and can get some of the Midwest customer base ; but does not have the capacity in their averaged fleets to take most Lexus customers. Thus, they have failed to put Midwest out of business.

People who buy Lexus's will not buy a Yugo - ever. They might buy a Civic for their kids and occasionally ride in one.

AirTran would end up with a bunch of planes and gates while loosing all of the Midwest customers (except for a few extreme cases).

There is not enough other people interested in the Yugo market in Milwaukee - or reasonable driving distance - to fill planes. I just can't see how AirTran can be more than marginally successful in the Milwaukee market - and likely unsuccessful were they to get the Midwest planes, equipment, employees, etc.

I've spent about a week looking at the situation and have concluded that AirTran has nothing that Midwest wants.

However, looking at the financial situation with AirTran and their scheduled plane deliveries. Could it be that AirTran needs Midwest in order to avoid starting to sink in the next couple of years? What will happen to AirTran if they can't pay for or take possession of those planes and put them into really good use doing something?
 
DAYflyer
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Fri May 18, 2007 11:10 pm

Something else of interest in a Baltimore paper today:

Late yesterday, Midwest announced a "code share" deal with Northwest, with each airline selling seats on the other's flights.

Skornicka said the deal would add 250 city-pairs and allow customers to book travel and earn mileage awards on both carriers.

"We haven't put a value on it - and we probably won't," she said. "But it was part of the board's thinking in rejecting AirTran. And there are other aspects of our strategic plan that we'll release when it's appropriate."


So I was right on the other thread when I said that this was part of Midwest plan to try and raise revenue. I really dont know how far it will go to try to fend off Airtran, but I hope the merger takes place.
One Nation Under God
 
TedEx
Posts: 167
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Sat May 19, 2007 12:09 am

Quoting 2175301 (Reply 34):
I'd like to thank the people who have recognized what is different about Midwest. The product.

The reason that NW and others have not been able to affect Midwest is that they cannot offer the premium service that Midwest offers.

Should AirTran be successful - then AirTran's product can be easily competed against. Not only that - but AirTran can only get a very small percentage of the existing Midwest customer base.

The more accurate comparison - using automobiles - is like this:

Love the analogy... And also, welcome to my respected user list.
 
bigjku
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Sat May 19, 2007 12:36 am

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 35):
So I was right on the other thread when I said that this was part of Midwest plan to try and raise revenue. I really dont know how far it will go to try to fend off Airtran, but I hope the merger takes place.

Why? Airtran will get killed at both MCI and in Wisky. They will simply be another low cost garbage hauler and will open themselves up to lots of competition. Midwest has a lot of positive goodwill in both communities that Air Tran will not have. In fact Air Tran is really not liked much at all.
 
airtran717
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Sat May 19, 2007 1:15 am

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 3):
AirTran is paying far too much. This will end them if they get the takeover. They aren't making money today, and buying Midwest isn't going to help them one bit.

Justify your remarks please. how do you figure they aren't making money?
 
airtran717
Posts: 590
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Sat May 19, 2007 1:18 am

For the good or the bad, Joe Leonard almost always gets what he wants. There must be some merit in all this to pursue so vehemently. I know the man. I worked for him. Tenacious.
 
Boeing7E7
Posts: 5512
Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2004 9:35 pm

RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Sat May 19, 2007 1:19 am

Quoting AirTran717 (Reply 39):
Justify your remarks please. how do you figure they aren't making money?

Do you know how insignificant your profit margins are relative to what it will cost for you to survive against a downturn or Delta's bankrupsty emergence? Yes, you turn a very thin profit, but you aren't making any money. You're a paycheck away from a foreclosure.

Quoting AirTran717 (Reply 40):
I know the man. I worked for him. Tenacious.

He's also an ass.

[Edited 2007-05-18 18:24:08]
 
airtran717
Posts: 590
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Sat May 19, 2007 1:24 am

Quoting OttoPylit (Reply 28):

So as to not get my wrist slapped and a little suspension for a few days, I will not comment on Otto's post other than to say... here we go again, with his very own, private little war...

Almost all the other posters give some validation to their remarks. Others, however, only spout off.

I really don't know what happened to you while employed at AirTran, but I think it's high time you moved on and got over it.
 
airtran717
Posts: 590
Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2006 12:48 am

RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Sat May 19, 2007 1:26 am

Quoting 2175301 (Reply 34):
I'd like to thank the people who have recognized what is different about Midwest. The product.

The reason that NW and others have not been able to affect Midwest is that they cannot offer the premium service that Midwest offers.

A leather seat and a cookie. Oh boy!!
 
bigjku
Posts: 870
Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2007 10:51 pm

RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Sat May 19, 2007 1:26 am

Quoting AirTran717 (Reply 40):
For the good or the bad, Joe Leonard almost always gets what he wants. There must be some merit in all this to pursue so vehemently. I know the man. I worked for him. Tenacious.

Great, if he wants to take on a bunch of overhead, planes, people, debt and what not to get access to routes that are not going to fly his airline then more power too him. People who always get what they want are not necessarily good business people. They are just grown up versions of spolied children.
 
Boeing7E7
Posts: 5512
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RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Sat May 19, 2007 1:28 am

Quoting AirTran717 (Reply 43):
A leather seat and a cookie. Oh boy!!

Better than a sardine can with 4" less pitch, a 3" reduction in seat width and a couple of peanut chuckers.

[Edited 2007-05-18 18:29:38]
 
airtran717
Posts: 590
Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2006 12:48 am

RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Sat May 19, 2007 1:29 am

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 41):
Quoting AirTran717 (Reply 39):
Justify your remarks please. how do you figure they aren't making money?

Do you know how insignificant your profit margins are relative to what it will cost for you to survive against a downturn or Delta's bankrupsty emergence? Yes, you turn a very thin profit, but you aren't making any money. You're a paycheck away from a foreclosure.

Quoting AirTran717 (Reply 40):
I know the man. I worked for him. Tenacious.

He's also an ass.

Doesn't affect me any more at all. I work in the medical field now. Making twice what I did at FL. A paycheck away from foreclosure? Come on. Don't be so melodramatic folks. And... I never said he wasn't an ass. He is that too. What I said was... he's very tenacious. Big difference.
 
Boeing7E7
Posts: 5512
Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2004 9:35 pm

RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Sat May 19, 2007 1:30 am

Quoting AirTran717 (Reply 46):
Doesn't affect me any more at all.

Then why bother arguing here?
 
bigjku
Posts: 870
Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2007 10:51 pm

RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Sat May 19, 2007 1:34 am

Quoting AirTran717 (Reply 43):
A leather seat and a cookie. Oh boy!!

It is not just that for people flying it. I can be reasonably sure that if I fly Midwest I will get where I am scheduled to go on time. Air Tran seems to have all sorts of problems in this regard.
 
airtran717
Posts: 590
Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2006 12:48 am

RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Sat May 19, 2007 2:23 am

Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 47):
Then why bother arguing here?

I enjoy watching people argue about things that they have an emotional attachment to rather than a logical business decision about the argument. But, of course, that's all subjective anyway. Bottom line... it's up to the BOD and shareholders to decide. I guess it's just too bad that the public doesn't get a vote... oh wait... you do get a vote, by boycotting, right? Don't fly FL. Fine. It's not like there isn't someone standing next to you that needs to hop a plane to somewhere... Hmm. As usual, nothing but armchair CEO's abound.

[Edited 2007-05-18 19:25:22]
 
bigjku
Posts: 870
Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2007 10:51 pm

RE: AirTran Extends Tender Offer - 56.6% YX Tendered

Sat May 19, 2007 2:59 am

Quoting AirTran717 (Reply 49):
I enjoy watching people argue about things that they have an emotional attachment to rather than a logical business decision about the argument. But, of course, that's all subjective anyway. Bottom line... it's up to the BOD and shareholders to decide. I guess it's just too bad that the public doesn't get a vote... oh wait... you do get a vote, by boycotting, right? Don't fly FL. Fine. It's not like there isn't someone standing next to you that needs to hop a plane to somewhere... Hmm. As usual, nothing but armchair CEO's abound.

Actually one can make a pretty good business argument against this merger. AirTran is nothing special in the MCI, MKE market. Midwest makes what it makes because people will pay a little more to fly with them. AirTran will be looked at as just another carrier with just another fair. People will fly it if they have to but I would bet that as soon as Airtran buys Midwest another carrier will look to move in on those markets and the only thing AirTran can compete with is price.