trekster
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US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 5:11 am

LATEST: US officials in trans-Atlantic flight tuberculosis infection warning. More soon.


Scrolling headline on the BBC news website

Any news on this????
Where does the time go???
 
seansasLCY
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US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 5:16 am

On BBC News 24 they said the man had a resistant strain of TB and travelled from Atlanta - Paris then Prague - Montreal. They have asked passengers on his flights to report to a hospital. The man is in quarantine in Atlanta. Its on News24 now
 
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OA260
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US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 5:20 am

Yes this strain is extremly dangerous and has been resistant to drugs!! The US have even issued a rare qurantine order.
The two airlines affected were AF and OK .

[Edited 2007-05-29 22:22:56]
 
jimyvr
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US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 5:33 am

AF385 and OK104, to be exact, quoted from Reuters
1000 - 01MAR07 | http://airlineroute.blogspot.com/
 
CV580Freak
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US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 6:16 am

BBC page has come up now

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/6702765.stm

Imagine sitting next to him !!!. The guy wants to be jailed, in isolation, and keys thrown away.
One day you are the pigeon, the next the statue ...
 
Ken777
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US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 6:20 am

The man didn't appear to have been feeling sick when he was flying. I imagine he is more upset about having the disease than we are about him flying.

The patient, who has few symptoms, has radiographic evidence of pulmonary TB and tests positive for XDR-TB, the agency said.

"On the basis of the patient's clinical and laboratory status, and lack of receiving adequate treatment for XDR-TB, this patient was considered potentially infectious at the time of his airline travel, and meets the criteria in the WHO guidelines for initiating an airline contact investigation," it said.

Link: http://www.cnn.com/2007/HEALTH/conditions/05/29/tb.flight/index.html
 
iclcy
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US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 7:02 am

FYI, London has one if not the worst rates of TB in Europe. Statistics I saw a few yrs ago certain areas of London were worse than places like Kolkata. One of the many reasons I don't take public transport anymore.
 
Arrow
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US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 7:28 am

Quoting IcLCY (Reply 11):
Thats a whole new area which would also have legal issue for airlines and the threat of being sued if they got it wrong and denied a passenger the right to fly. Also how does a check in agent or gate agent tell if youve got TB or a cold!!!

That's why I'd love to hear some lawyers weigh in on this one. Airlines can deny boarding to people who meet certain criteria (e.g. falling-down drunk, abusive to crew/fellow passengers). And a pilot can land the plane somewhere and have someone kicked off. And they can haul you off if your name is on the no-fly list. So the question is a due-diligence issue. How much responsibility does an airline have if it allows some one who is obviously sick (albeit with an unknown condition) to get into a controlled-atmosphere cigar tube for several hours with a couple of hundred fellow travellers. The question is where do you draw the line? Wonder if there's any case law on this.
Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
 
gte439u
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US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 7:35 am

Quoting Arrow (Reply 13):
How much responsibility does an airline have if it allows some one who is obviously sick (albeit with an unknown condition) to get into a controlled-atmosphere cigar tube for several hours with a couple of hundred fellow travellers. The question is where do you draw the line? Wonder if there's any case law on this.

We may not have to look at case law on this one - even if we did, which country would we look to - since the WHO has a guidelines for airlines. It appears that an airline would not be unreasonable to deny boarding to someone simply carrying TB. Of course, these are only guidelines, so individual jurisdictions may have laws to the contrary.

http://www.who.int/inf-pr-1998/en/pr98-96.html
 
JER757
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US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 8:49 am

90% of TB carriers do not show symptoms. Its only a small minority where the bacteria (mycobacterium tuberculosis) actually reach the alvioli to cause the infection. Seeing as he travelled on the 12th May this is about the time required for symptoms to become evident and a (differential) diagnosis made, if he was diagnosed around now.

So in all probability the guy in question probably walked on board that A/C having no idea he was a carrier of the disease, as 1/3 of us are!

I don't think burning him at the stake is quite the answer...  Wink
Gale force fog... don't you love it?
 
nonrevman
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US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 9:07 am

This really makes you wonder how many people are potentially infected. The news reported that everyone within 2 rows are to be contacted. This only deals with the flights. What about the people sitting next to him at the gates? How about the concourse commuter train in ATL? That thing is usually very crowded. The people in the planes are not the only ones at risk right now. They just happen to be the easiest ones to find. Hopefully this does not spread.
 
FLYGUY767
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US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 9:18 am

Quoting Nonrevman (Reply 21):
This really makes you wonder how many people are potentially infected.

The media also reported that this strand that he has is without a doubt fatal. This strand whatever it is named, can be caught by the infected person talking, coughing, yawning, et al. This is going to make the British Airways - KGB radiation incident seem rather miniscule. The next question is or has got to be. What was the rotation of that Air France aircraft? AF is currently using the 744 to ATL? If so wouldnt MIA, SFO, JFK, BOS, YUL, YYZ, GIG, GRU, and others around the World be at risk since they are AF 747-400 destinations?


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Oddly enough, Air France has absolutely no mention of this on their website. I have to commend British Airways since they were man enough to step up and leave a rather detailed bulletin on their website regarding this matter.

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
777gk
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US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 2:32 pm

All things considered, at least he made the right decision by flying into ATL, with the CDC there!
 
cyclonic
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US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 6:26 pm

My sympathies go out to the poor bloke - especially as he wouldn't have known a damn thing about how sick he really was until relatively late in proceedings.

A lot of us are carrying disease right now and have no idea, so there's no use getting angry at the guy.
Keith Richards: The man that Death forgot...
 
chevvy2
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RE: LATEST: US Officials In Trans-Atlantic Flight Tube

Wed May 30, 2007 8:58 pm

Hey guys,
Are you not overreacting here. Yes, the passenger was wrong to fly without checking with the airlines regarding his disease. Can you imagine now, every traveller being asked by the airline for a full medical history before a boarding pass is issued? It is bad enough that the US require addresses for foreign travellers but can you imagine the legal mayhem of being asked to disclose to the airlines staff if you are at risk of any disease including AIDS when you book a ticket.

Lets put this case in perspective. MDR TB is increasing in most of Africa as well as some of the countries in Asia. It has arisen basically because humans are careless regarding taking their medications regularly as prescribed, because AIDS is rife and reduces immunity to diseases such as TB and because the bacteria are quick to develop resistance mechanisms to the few available drugs that the Mycobacterium is sensitive to. Also note that the infectivity of the mycobacterium is relatively low in the healthy population and has nowhere near the infectivity of the influenza virus or even the common cold.

I have yet to hear of quarantining of flights from Africa to the US or Europe as happened with SARS some years ago to Canadian flights. No, Dont blame AF or OK for carrying the patient. Rather, the patient in this case should be the culpable one, provided that he really knew that he had the disease. At least the airlines are looking into the safety and wellbeing of the passengers seated close to the patient.

Flying is a hazardous business even as a passenger  Wink
 
Ih8b6
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 9:10 pm

Quoting 777gk (Reply 12):
All things considered, at least he made the right decision by flying into ATL, with the CDC there!

He didn't fly into ATL. He left ATL on Air France to get married in Greece and honeymoon in Italy. Officials in Italy were contacted by the CDC who tried to quarantine him but he didn't think it was warranted. He didn't think he needed to be quarantined so he ignored them. He essentially snuck back into the US by flying from Prague to Montreal and then driving to NYC. There he was met by doctors and taken to the CDC.

Now, I know the guy wanted to get married and didn't think he had a bad strain of this TB, but the dude put awhole heck of a lot of people at risk.
Over-moderation sucks
 
DL787932ER
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 9:15 pm

http://www.ajc.com/health/content/he...stories/2007/05/29/0530meshtb.html

The infected passenger's side of the story.

Summary:
-He was going to Rome for his honeymoon
-He knew he had TB but did not know when he left the US that it was the super drug-resistant kind. He probably got it in Asia.
-He had no symptoms and didn't feel sick - doctors found the TB during routine testing for something else
-He specifically asked his doctors if he could leave the US and they said he could
-The CDC contacted him in Rome and told him first not to leave, then that he had to surrender to health authorities and that he could not fly back to the US
-The CDC would not bring him back on one of their jets (this has been a recent scandal in the US; the CDC has three jets with full-time crew that are rarely used, except for personal business of various government officials. Actually aiding sick or quarantined people is one of the intended uses, but permission was denied for unknown reasons)
-He figured that his passport was flagged only by US and maybe Italian officials, so he left Italy for Prague and flew to Canada before driving to the US
-Once back in the US, he contacted CDC and voluntarily went into quarantine
-He is now (for the first time in the US in 34 years) being quarantined by force
-He did not break any laws
F L Y D E L T A J E T S
 
AsstChiefMark
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Wed May 30, 2007 10:36 pm

Quoting DL787932ER (Reply 16):
He did not break any laws

He's still a selfish, conceited, thoughtless idiot.
Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Damned MSP...Red tail...Red tail
 
Qantas744er
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 1:37 am

Regarding the aircraft where the Tuberculosis infected man flew on!

Here is the ACARS message for AF385 departing the 12th of may 2007 to CDG from ATL

ACARS mode: 2 Aircraft reg: F-GEXB [Boeing B744]
Message label: Q0 Block id: 5 Msg no: S22A
Flight id: AF0385 [ATL-LFPG] [Air France]
----------------------------------------------------------[ 12/05/2007 06:05 ]-

So plane involdved was F-GEXB

heres a pic of the aircraft


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Photo © SkyLiner




For the second flight

Czech Airlines Flight 104 on the 24th of May 2007

ACARS mode: 1 Aircraft reg: OK-YAC [Airbus A310]
Message label: ** Block id: @ Msg no: 1750
Flight id: OK0104 [PRG-YUL] [CSA Czech Airlines]
----------------------------------------------------------[ 24/05/2007 13:59 ]-

Aircraft involved OK-YAC

Here a pic
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Photo © Suchy

Happiness is V1 in Lagos
 
FLYGUY767
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 2:30 am

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18936405/

According to the above mentioned article this guy sounds like a real piece of work, not to mention cocky. I feel bad for the guy since he has this, however he shows absolutely no regard for anyone that he may have infected. He also feels that since he is educated he should not have to be quarantined.

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
khobar
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 2:32 am

Quoting 777gk (Reply 12):
All things considered, at least he made the right decision by flying into ATL, with the CDC there!

He flew to Montreal to specifically evade - he knew he was on a no-fly list.

Quoting Cyclonic (Reply 13):
A lot of us are carrying disease right now and have no idea, so there's no use getting angry at the guy.

He knew he had TB.

Quoting Chevvy2 (Reply 14):
Are you not overreacting here. Yes, the passenger was wrong to fly without checking with the airlines regarding his disease. Can you imagine now, every traveller being asked by the airline for a full medical history before a boarding pass is issued? It is bad enough that the US require addresses for foreign travellers but can you imagine the legal mayhem of being asked to disclose to the airlines staff if you are at risk of any disease including AIDS when you book a ticket.

Not over-reacting at all. All blood is screened for disease even though blood is in very short supply. Blood is even refused from persons of high-risk groups because they are in high-risk groups, and rightly so given that some diseases don't show up until down the road by which time a whole lot of others could be infected.

AIDS poses a risk in certain circumstances. As far as I know, it's not carried in the air and can be contained with "ordinary" care. TB, on the other hand, apparently can't. Big difference.

There's something very wrong with this whole story.

The guy knew he had TB and made travel plans specifically to evade authorities.
He "snuck back into the US because he feared treatment in Italy."
He wanted the CDC to provide a jet to fly him back to Atlanta.
The CDC almost provided a jet to retrieve him from Europe, at tax-payers' expense.
The CDC did provide a jet to fly him from New York to Atlanta - at tax-payers' expense.
He is currently in isolation in an Atlanta hospital, with an armed guard stationed outside his door.

I've a feeling there's something missing from the reports. Why the kid gloves?
 
omoo
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 3:46 am

Quoting Khobar (Reply 20):
The guy knew he had TB and made travel plans specifically to evade authorities.
He "snuck back into the US because he feared treatment in Italy."
He wanted the CDC to provide a jet to fly him back to Atlanta.
The CDC almost provided a jet to retrieve him from Europe, at tax-payers' expense.
The CDC did provide a jet to fly him from New York to Atlanta - at tax-payers' expense.
He is currently in isolation in an Atlanta hospital, with an armed guard stationed outside his door.

Cause its not PC to provide more info on the patient (social stigma)
Fly Air Popobawa
 
AsstChiefMark
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 4:18 am

Quoting Omoo (Reply 21):
Cause its not PC to provide more info on the patient (social stigma)

No. It's because it's illegal to make information available to the public that will identify the patient. identified.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HIPPA
Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Damned MSP...Red tail...Red tail
 
khobar
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 4:33 am

And why are they only concerned with the two flights? How did he get from Paris to Prague via Italy? Why no concern for anyone else? Why Prague if his honeymoon was in Italy? Prague is apparently an excellent destination for a lot of reasons, but did he go there specifically to evade capture?
 
georgiaame
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 4:41 am

What I find rather unusual, is that this guy is hardly the only one with MDR-TB running around. What was it about him that sent the gestapo into action to nail him? Generally speaking, even MDR-TB is treatable, but typically with 5-6 medications simultaneously, and at higher doses, where normally you would treat acute TB with 3 drugs for about 1 month, then cut back to 2 after you have determined the drug sensitivities of the bug. Something is missing here...

When I was in training, as a general rule of thumb, when a patient came into the ER at 2AM with a high fever and looked really sick, if he or she was Asian, the presumptive diagnosis was TB, African or Indian it was malaria, or a young guy who spoke English it was AIDS. It was a pretty good rule to work with. What they all had in common was just how very sick they all were. None of them would have been in any condition to get on a plane to go travelling around Europe for a week or two. Which leads me back to what was going on with this particular individual? My academic curiosity is peaked.

As for the general public, prudence would dictate skin testing anyone who came into contact with this guy IF he is infectious, and we don't know that for sure at this time. One of the pearls I've read is that everyone seated within 2 rows is at risk; they just won't reveal which row he was sitting in. ( Must be a politically correct privacy issue.) Bottom line is that those on the flight should be skin tested. If they test negative, retest in one month. If they remain negative, they have nothing to worry about. If they test positive initially, they were not infected by this guy, but they should still follow protocol for active treatment at this time. When the initial skin test is negative, and retesting goes positive 4-6 weeks down the line, the presumption at that point would be that they were infected by this guy, and need to be treated for MDR-TB. The drug resistance profile for this bug should be available by then to guide treatment of the recent converters, if CDC and the politically correct crew permits that information to be released. This could be a big mess... The lawyers are going to have a feeding frenzy over this one. Lots of money to be made... The good news is that Julie Gerberding,head of the CDC is an ID specialist, with an extensive HIV/Academic background, and she knows her TB backwards and forwards.
"Trust, but verify!" An old Russian proverb, quoted often by a modern American hero
 
eal46859
Posts: 39
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 5:21 am

His treatment was to have been (and may still be) an operation to cut out the TB, then several types of medication and all this to be done in Denver. He was quoted in the Atlanta Journal & Constitution newspaper (to get his side out) that he fled Rome so that he would not be confined there. He felt it would have been a death sentance since the only place that the operation can be done is in Denver. He also said he was not told he could not fly, but the doctors are saying they advised him not to fly, but that they could not prevent him from doing so. He apparently caught this while working in Asia for setting up hospitals.
 
khobar
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 5:45 am

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 24):
What I find rather unusual, is that this guy is hardly the only one with MDR-TB running around. What was it about him that sent the gestapo into action to nail him?

What he did was irresponsible, selfish, and should at least be viewed as possibly criminal. He not only knew he had TB but that it was a drug resistant type. There's a definite parallel I think should be considered here.

"The Fulton County folks gave him a verbal warning of the danger and the prohibition against travel on May 11," Brown said, noting that the patient's reaction set off some alarm bells.

"They were so concerned by his interaction in this discussion that they went back and hand-delivered a letter reiterating that he remain isolated and not travel," Brown said, adding that at that time, "a plan of treatment was put together."


Gestapo? Doesn't sound like it from any of the reports on the case.

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 24):
The good news is that Julie Gerberding,head of the CDC is an ID specialist, with an extensive HIV/Academic background, and she knows her TB backwards and forwards.

But Gerberding noted that U.S. health officials have had little experience with this type of TB. It's possible it may have different transmission patterns, she said.

"Cure is possible for up to 30 percent of cases, it said."
 
hiflyer
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 7:21 am

First off this is a prime example of the inability of the medical profession to understand that the current fleet of international aircraft RECIRCULATE the vast majority of the air numerous times....without any germicidal filters. The gentleman has been quoted that his doctor 'preferred" or 'recommended" he did not fly. Obviously whatever his doctor did say to him it never was drilled into him how serious it really was. Other passengers onboard with other illnesses may be...or at least could have been...exposed to a severe life threatening illness if their immune system is weak. From the point that the US Embassy told him to turn himself in overseas and he refused he was definitely acting outside the law.

More and more of my friends and associates come back from 2 to 10 hr flights now with colds and flu. More and more people are getting sick when in crowded cruise ships. And of course the elephant in the room is SARS and Bird flu.

You just know some yahoo congressman is going to stand up on the floor of the House in the next few weeks demanding that airlines install filtration in their air supply systems....or at least radically increase fresh air supply...which lessens aircraft performance. As the vast majority of cruise pax come via air that alone could help the cruise industry problem.

The problem is....I just may be in favor of that....and sooner rather than later.
 
767Lover
Posts: 3254
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 11:19 am

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 24):
they just won't reveal which row he was sitting in. (

The rows have now been identified in media reports -- although with conflicting information, which will have everyone in the misquoted row number to panic.

This case does sound very strange, and there are varying reports on how emphatic the officials were about their request that he not travel.

In the end, I expect this will be turned into a movie at some point. International incident, evading authorities, sneaking over borders...
 
707lvr
Posts: 457
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 1:57 pm

This event has been a good practice run if nothing else. Interesting that the Discovery Channel is doing a program on the real scary stuff tonight.

What's infuriating about the medical profession in a case like this is that doctors think in terms of statistics, whereas people tend to think of their own skins. Try and tell a doc that a 30% fatality rate is a 100% fatality rate for the people who died; they prefer [naturally] to roll the failures out the door and to the basement and concentrate making the living feel better. TB is particularly egregious since we're led to believe that you practically have to conduct unprotected CPR to catch it and yet somehow millions of people do. "Prolonged contact" does not mean that is the only way to get it; it just means that's what happens in virtually all cases. Not all. For the .001% which matters to me, I'm going to have the test even if I was in row 99.

As the news story has evolved this evening, this patient is looking steadily less sympathetic as people rush for asscover.

Oh, and the capper - the guy's a lawyer. Wonderful.
 
brons2
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Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2001 1:02 pm

RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 3:24 pm

This is unbelievable. They should have called the airlines as soon as they could not hand deliver that letter not to travel.

And he's a lawyer. Well, that makes perfect sense.
Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
 
hiflyer
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 8:17 pm

Just realized this idiot must have been doing the trip on miles...both Air France and Czech are Skyteam...that explains the routing to Prague to get to Montreal.

Interesting legal discussion on the tube last night re releasing the name of the guy or not. End result was that patient right to privacy trumped by public's right to know the name/picture to see if they have been in contact with him.

IMHO the minute he refused to follow his doctors orders not to travel he gave up his right to privacy.
 
omoo
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 11:41 pm

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 24):
when a patient came into the ER at 2AM with a high fever and looked really sick, if he or she was Asian, the presumptive diagnosis was TB, African or Indian it was malaria, or a young guy who spoke English it was AIDS.

That's so funny, so if i am Non US Black speaks English, 21 yrs old and was in china for one month what will i be tested for ?
Fly Air Popobawa
 
FLYGUY767
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Thu May 31, 2007 11:51 pm

Quoting GeorgiaAME (Reply 24):
When I was in training, as a general rule of thumb, when a patient came into the ER at 2AM with a high fever and looked really sick, if he or she was Asian, the presumptive diagnosis was TB, African or Indian it was malaria, or a young guy who spoke English it was AIDS. It was a pretty good rule to work with.

Maybe that is why we have so many malpractice suits in the United States.. Afterall a "presumptive diagnosis", is not an "educated diagnosis"!  stirthepot 

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
Arrow
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Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2002 7:44 am

RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:05 am

Quoting Omoo (Reply 32):
That's so funny, so if i am Non US Black speaks English, 21 yrs old and was in china for one month what will i be tested for ?

Schizophrenia? What the doc was getting at is the need to speed up the diagnosis based on statistical probabilities, prioritizing the lab work. It isn't foolproof obviously, but you have to start somewhere. There are lots of racial profiling parallels here (e.g. security checks at airports), but when the goal is to nail a diagnosis and begin the right treatment as quickly as possible, is anyone going to complain?

I wonder how long it will be before the first class action lawsuit is filed on this one, who will file it, and what jurisdiction they'll choose (US, most likely). I can see multiple defendants here.
Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
 
omoo
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 5:37 am

Quoting Arrow (Reply 34):
I wonder how long it will be before the first class action lawsuit is filed on this one, who will file it, and what jurisdiction they'll choose (US, most likely). I can see multiple defendants here.

Going to sue for what ? denied boarding due to confirmed TB status ? do airlines have a health screening status or alerts when someone checks in ? (kind of like TSA alerts/ boarding denials) is there such a system that the CDC utilizes to warn airlines ?
Fly Air Popobawa
 
sebring
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 5:46 am

 
trekster
Posts: 4319
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 5:57 am

Thanks for the update.

Not alot in the UK news about it today

Daniel
Where does the time go???
 
767Lover
Posts: 3254
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 6:06 am

In a very ironic twist, the guy's new father-in-law works in the TB lab at the CDC. There is an interview with him in the Atlanta Journal Constitution.

He did not see his daughter as being in any danger of contracting the disease.
 
Arrow
Posts: 2325
Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2002 7:44 am

RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 7:21 am

Quoting Omoo (Reply 35):
Going to sue for what ? denied boarding due to confirmed TB status ? do airlines have a health screening status or alerts when someone checks in ? (kind of like TSA alerts/ boarding denials) is there such a system that the CDC utilizes to warn airlines ?

Well, he did make it to a US no-fly list -- that's why he came back through Montreal. As far as potential lawsuits go -- anyone who sat next to him, or near him, now has to get tested for TB. From what I understand, it takes several weeks before some one can be declared "clean." I can see one of those folks taking a shotgun approach, looking for relief (i.e. money) from Airlines, CDC, the passenger, etc. Canadian authorities are already PO'd that they weren't told anything about this guy until a day after he'd re-entered the US. So much for sharing those no-fly lists. How ironic that this guy is a personal injury lawyer.
Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
 
sebring
Posts: 1320
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 12:08 am

RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 8:11 am

Quoting 767Lover (Reply 38):
In a very ironic twist, the guy's new father-in-law works in the TB lab at the CDC. There is an interview with him in the Atlanta Journal Constitution.

He did not see his daughter as being in any danger of contracting the disease.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/HEALTH/conditions/05/31/tb.flight/index.html
 
trintocan
Posts: 2725
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 9:01 am

My my my, we are getting very sensational about things here! First, a few points. TB is spread principally by coughing but unlike viruses such as the flu and common cold, relatively large droplets are involved in its transmission. Thus, while a person with the flu can easily disseminate virus particles by coughing into the air, the larger droplets involved in spreading TB tend to settle more rapidly and so transmission would require somebody to be in relatively close contact for some time - it is unlikely after, say, just a few minutes of proximity. Flights of the duration described, however, are a different matter and so people close to the said passenger may have become exposed. It may also arise if somebody is repeatedly exposed. HIV is a totally different matter - it is not spread by droplets at all but by body fluids, with blood, lymph, vaginal fluids and semen being most important here. Contact via broken skin or mucous membranes, sexual intercourse or blood transfusion are thus the main routes of transmission along with in utero transmission from mother to baby. The main relevance of HIV to TB is that the destruction of the immune system it causes leaves the body susceptible to TB as well as other otherwise rare conditions such as Kaposi's Sarcoma.

Once adequate exposure has occurred, the TB bacillus resides in the lung and causes a usually mild infection, often similar to a bout of the flu. One or more nodules form in the lung due to the body's inflammatory reaction. In the immunocompromised patient the primary reaction may be severe, though. The oft-classically described picture of TB with coughing, weight loss and thick and sometimes bloody sputum usually arises from reactivation of the primary or Ghon focus. The trouble is that this reactivation may occur many years after original exposure. Several weeks after exposure and the initial infection the body does respond to the Mantoux or skin test but this says nothing about when the exposure took place - it could have been the result of a previous, unrecognized episode. So, doing skin tests on the passengers next to the afflicted passenger would only be useful if the results are negative - i.e. that they did not seroconvert or were not exposed thus - but if they test positive there is still doubt as to when they were actually exposed.

As such, this matter is not a simple "open and shut" case. Additionally, medical management carries the important caveat of patient confidentiality, so the patient cannot be publicly identified (unless he voluntarily identifies himself). Unless the person was actively ill, it is also difficult to find the airline in the wrong here.

TrinToCan.
Hop to it, fly for life!
 
767Lover
Posts: 3254
Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2003 6:32 am

RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 9:43 am

Quoting Sebring (Reply 40):
Quoting 767Lover (Reply 38):
In a very ironic twist, the guy's new father-in-law works in the TB lab at the CDC. There is an interview with him in the Atlanta Journal Constitution.

He did not see his daughter as being in any danger of contracting the disease.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/HEALTH/condi....html

That's what I understand from reading the reports over the past couple of days. That's why this case is so strange. It just keeps getting stranger.
 
iflyatldl
Posts: 1796
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 11:04 am

This guy, who was clearly educated, did all this charity work, in Vietnam and wherever else, made a selfish choice period. His route of travel clearly points out he was trying to evade authority. And then, he wanted a private jet to bring him home from Italy at US taxpayer's dime. Gee, he should have asked for a private jet if he was that hell bent to go on this jaunt all over Europe. I don't care if he was getting married or buying his first whatever... There's never a good time to be diagnosed with TB, but now, he's frightened and inconvienced, and put in jeapordy, how many people? I don't wish the guy or his family anything bad, but he, and his fiance, AND their respective families should have thought the whole thing out better. Everyone's playing dumb and now they're victims? But yet health authorities are talking out of both sides of their mouths OR agencies stories aren't straight. Just biological drunk driving or behavior. Just my rant and two cents...
PS My prayers are with the people he came in contact with who'd be most at risk. And yeah, I hope there is a good ending to this-for everyone.
Ah, Summer, Fenway Park, Boston Red Sox and Beer.....
 
worldtraveler
Posts: 3417
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2003 6:18 am

RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 11:20 am

Quoting Khobar (Reply 26):
What he did was irresponsible, selfish, and should at least be viewed as possibly criminal. He not only knew he had TB but that it was a drug resistant type. There's a definite parallel I think should be considered here.

actually, the Fulton county health dept. completed the lab tests to confirm he had drug resistant TB and provided documentation to the patient only to find he had already left the US. The CDC contacted Italian authorities and they told him he was to report to an Italian hospital for treatment. Instead, he fled.

Quoting Hiflyer (Reply 31):
Just realized this idiot must have been doing the trip on miles...both Air France and Czech are Skyteam...that explains the routing to Prague to get to Montreal.

Maybe... but there is a definite Skyteam connection. He is from ATL, has travelled the world frequently, and is very likely a DL SM member. I'm sure his father also has a stash of DL SMs.

Quoting Arrow (Reply 39):
Canadian authorities are already PO'd that they weren't told anything about this guy until a day after he'd re-entered the US. So much for sharing those no-fly lists. How ironic that this guy is a personal injury lawyer.

actually, they were told but the US can't update another country's no fly list. There is an advisory that the US circulates and Canadian authorities received it. Apparently, the EU does not use the US no-fly list though (remember how much the EU has been complaining about the data the US gathers about passengers).

Quoting Trintocan (Reply 41):
Additionally, medical management carries the important caveat of patient confidentiality, so the patient cannot be publicly identified (unless he voluntarily identifies himself). Unless the person was actively ill, it is also difficult to find the airline in the wrong here.

and there are already discussions about changing laws to make it illegal to travel with a known communicable disease. and local and federal health officials acknowledge they want stronger procedures to apprehend people. They said they have never had a case where a person has refused to seek medical authority and has instead taken int'l travel. These types of cases don't happen often but when they do, officials need the tools to ground people and keep them out of public places.

Quoting Iflyatldl (Reply 43):
But yet health authorities are talking out of both sides of their mouths OR agencies stories aren't straight.

no they're not. read above.
 
Arrow
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RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 1:40 pm

Quoting WorldTraveler (Reply 44):
There is an advisory that the US circulates and Canadian authorities received it.

Do you have a source on that? I saw public statements to the contrary.

From the NY Times:

The department instructed any border control agents who encountered the man to “isolate, detain and contact the Public Health Service,” Mr. Knocke said.

If Canadian officials had known about the detention order, a quarantine officer would have isolated Mr. Speaker, escorted him to a hospital and arranged his secure transport back to the United States, said Jean Riverin, a spokesman for the Public Health Agency of Canada.


[Edited 2007-06-01 07:01:52]
Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
 
PExDCA
Posts: 222
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 5:09 am

RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 1:49 pm

Quoting AsstChiefMark (Reply 17):
He's still a selfish, conceited, thoughtless idiot.

 checkmark   checkmark   checkmark 
"A single twig breaks, but the bundle of twigs is strong." - Tecumseh
 
flybyguy
Posts: 1415
Joined: Sun Jun 27, 2004 12:52 pm

RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:40 pm

Quoting AsstChiefMark (Reply 17):
He's still a selfish, conceited, thoughtless idiot.

Air France, CSA, and every infected passenger should sue that blasted f*#ktard to heck and back, then afterwards he should be sent to federal prison with consecutive terms for attempted murder... that's if he doesn't cough himself to death in the next few weeks.

He put so many people at risk for a ceremony that could have been postponed. I would have had far more sympathy if he flew to attend a funeral for a close loved one. His actions IMHO were beyond conceited, they were sadistic.
"Are you a pretender... or a thoroughbred?!" - Professor Matt Miller
 
trintocan
Posts: 2725
Joined: Sun Apr 23, 2000 6:02 pm

RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 5:39 pm

WorldTraveler, to be truthful, yes, confidentiality can be overriden if the public's health and well-being is at risk. Thus, some diseases are designated notifiable by the World Health Organization (e.g typhus and cholera) but not TB or for that matter HIV / AIDS. Local protocols may make other diseases notifiable and to do so certain structures are put into place for doctors to report said patients. I mentioned confidentiality insofar as the media not being able to broadcast his name - while his name will be known to the authorities for disease surveillance it needs to be withheld from the wider public.

TrinToCan.
Hop to it, fly for life!
 
FLYGUY767
Posts: 1441
Joined: Thu May 24, 2007 11:26 pm

RE: US Warn On Trans-Atlantic Flight Tuberculosis

Fri Jun 01, 2007 9:50 pm

Quoting Trintocan (Reply 48):
TB or for that matter HIV / AIDS

TB and HIV/AIDS are two very different things. HIV/AIDS is caused by something totally seperate from TB. I would prefer to have someone with HIV/AIDS next to me anyday over a person with TB.

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI

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