redflyer
Posts: 3881
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2005 3:30 am

PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 12:05 am

Walked outside and was amazed to see so many criss-crossing contrails so far South. What is going on with traffic/weather at altitude to push all the traffic over the Valley of the Sun today? The views are looking towards the Southwest from the Southeast side of the valley.

Big version: Width: 640 Height: 479 File size: 88kb
PHX Sky #2 May 31, 2007
Big version: Width: 640 Height: 479 File size: 118kb
PHX May 31, 2007
My other home is a Piper Cherokee 180C
 
CM767
Posts: 450
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 11:58 pm

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:03 am

I have family on Phoenix and I have seen the same, add that to the spectacular sunsets and you always keep lookin to the sky.


Not a good place if you are afraid of the chemtrails.  Smile
But The Best Thing God Has Created Is A New Day
 
swiftski
Posts: 1837
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 6:19 am

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:05 am

Awesome stuff.

Cloudy hear today, but sometimes get similar views.
 
rikkus67
Posts: 1141
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RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:12 am

Hello from Sunny Southern Alberta, Red Flyer!

Man, do I ever miss Phoenix and Sky Harbour. My Mom is American, and my Grandparents (now deceased) retired to Phoenix in 1969. I spent far too much time on vacation in the 100+ F weather plane spotting along 24th Street.... Can you still spot there unencumbered by security?

Up here in YQL (Lethbridge, Alberta, CANADA)... we get the same phenomena on a regular basis. Lethbridge is 60 miles from the CDN/US border, and is aligned E-W with most of Canada's major cities. YYC (Calgary, Alberta) only 45 minutes by air north of YQL,and there is substancial traffic north-south. YVR (Vancouver, British Columbia) is about 1.5 hours flying time from YQL, and there is significant traffic E-W at all times of day & night. With the great circle routes from the US west coast to Europe, there is also major traffic flying overhead constantly also.

On a good day WITHOUT any wind (our area of Southern Alberta is among the top 5 windiest areas WORLDWIDE)...we certainly can get the criss-cross pattern identical to what you experienced....

My only complaint? YQL will never see 1/10th the traffic of PHX...regradless of fly-overs or not!! (Although we are the main diversion airport for YYC in inclimate weather).

..As an FYI... here is a map, showing YQL's location relative to PHX. I am almost directly north of you....by 1400+ miles...

http://www.mapquest.com/directions/m...&2pn=&2a=&2c=Phoenix&2s=AZ&2z=&r=f
AC.WA.CP.DL.RW.CO.WG.WJ.WN.KI.FL.SK.ACL.UA.US.F9
 
cdekoe
Posts: 53
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 1:14 am

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:21 am

Sunrise in Tucson was indeed very spectacular.

Dewpoint was -4 C, and neg temps started at 17,000 ft with calm winds aloft.
I believe the amount of traffic was normal, just better conditions to form contrails.

A perfect morning to go flying... too bad work interferes with play time...  Wink
We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them.
 
redflyer
Posts: 3881
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2005 3:30 am

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:59 am

Quoting Rikkus67 (Reply 3):
Can you still spot there unencumbered by security?

I don't think you can stop there to watch anymore. No shoulder space for pulling off the road and a fence right next to it (at least that's how I remember it the last time I was there about 3 years ago). There are a couple of parking lots off of the end of 7L and 7R, but they are not open to public use.

To do any appreciable spotting, you have to go to the top of the parking garage for Terminal 4. That's what I do these days. And I do it when I'm traveling and park my truck at the terminal. That way, I get out and put my suitcase next to me and spot for a good hour or more without anyone (security) bothering me. And the views from there are spectacular. A few years ago when LH was flying a 343 out of PHX I was able to catch its departure a couple of times. Spectacular to watch as that baby ate up most of the runway before wheels up. Never have been able to see BA's 744 or 772 taking off but did catch the 772 landing a few times.

Quoting Rikkus67 (Reply 3):
With the great circle routes from the US west coast to Europe, there is also major traffic flying overhead constantly also.

I assume you mean West Coast from PDX or SEA? Or does traffic from as far south as SFO overfly your airspace?

Quoting Cdekoe (Reply 4):
I believe the amount of traffic was normal, just better conditions to form contrails.

Wow, I'll have to watch more closely as I didn't realize that kind of traffic overhead was normal. I know the conditions were there this morning for the contrails, but I thought traffic was unusually heavy overhead as well.
My other home is a Piper Cherokee 180C
 
rikkus67
Posts: 1141
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RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 3:17 am

RedFlyer...

Of my most memorable spotting moments in Phoenix, was when the Concorde visited on a charter run. BA allowed the public a viewing tour into the aircraft, but by the time my Dad found parking, the line-up was "too long for the heat...sorry Richard".

The last time I was able to spot on 24th street was back in 2000, when I was down for my Grandma's funeral. I brought lots of suntan lotion, and a baseball cap. I also made sure I frequented the C-stores regularily. All I had with me was a small camera bag, and bottled water. There was nothing better than having the occasional "heavy" fly over you at such a low altitude. I still have many belly shots of the airlines overflying me... unforgettable.
AC.WA.CP.DL.RW.CO.WG.WJ.WN.KI.FL.SK.ACL.UA.US.F9
 
mhodgson
Posts: 4673
Joined: Mon Dec 30, 2002 8:47 pm

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 4:15 am

Great photo - I was flying from GYR this morning at about 6am, and the sky looked amazing!
No trees were harmed by this message. However, several million electrons were terribly inconvenienced
 
AirTranTUS
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Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2005 9:12 am

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 6:14 am

Would the large low pressure system (and associated thunderstorms/turbulence) in the Midwest have anything to do with that?

I love ASO!
 
rikkus67
Posts: 1141
Joined: Fri Jun 09, 2000 11:34 am

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 7:46 am

RedFlyer...

I do believe a majority of airlines travelling to California from Europe do overfly us. We have been a "marker" (don't know the proper tech term) since the early days of flying. Our proximity to the Rocky Mountains made a stop a YQL essential when preparing to fly west through the mountains to the coast. Trans Canada Air Lines (aka Air Canada) used YQL specifically for that reason, and we were the hub for all of Alberta until aircraft range wasn't an issue.
AC.WA.CP.DL.RW.CO.WG.WJ.WN.KI.FL.SK.ACL.UA.US.F9
 
jcavinato
Posts: 392
Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2005 9:14 am

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 10:30 am

I live in the PHX area and wondered the same thing. With airnav.flight tracker I found out that the criss-crossing is a lot of DFW and ATL to LAX, SAN and other California airports. Too, Las Vegas, SLC and other more northern airports' flights to Mexico. And, a LAS-TUC pure jet will sometimes leave a contrail.

Great shots, though.
 
4holer
Posts: 2724
Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2002 1:47 am

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 10:44 am

I've seen some great contrail days here in PHX myself, but had thought today was the best I'd ever seen. Thanks for the pics.
I noticed two things that I thought contributed to it. One was that there seemed to be low high altitude winds as contrails really hung together densely for quite some time. Second was that usually 95% of the flights typically are obviously to/from LAX or SAN. Todays traffic seemed to have alot of oddballs, north/south flights, and many of those were to the east of PHX and easy to see.
Amazing to see though. Seems clear now. Bummer!
Ghosts appear and fade away.....................
 
HPRamper
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RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 1:12 pm

Speaking of contrails...I saw a strange one yesterday. It was in the morning, and there were a lot going in a N-S direction...but one, probably the biggest, most defined of all, took a strange pattern...like a question mark. A sudden, abrupt bank to the side, then a wide curve and eventual straightening back to the original path. All in clear, cloudless sky. I couldn't make anything of it.
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 1:16 pm

Quoting RedFlyer (Thread starter):
What is going on with traffic/weather at altitude to push all the traffic over the Valley of the Sun today?

Your turn for chemtrail dusting.  rotfl 
 
redflyer
Posts: 3881
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2005 3:30 am

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 1:19 pm

Quoting Rikkus67 (Reply 6):
Of my most memorable spotting moments in Phoenix, was when the Concorde visited on a charter run.

Concorde was in PHX? Now THAT would have been something to see! Oh, for the life of me I still don't understand why that gal was retired!

Quoting Rikkus67 (Reply 6):
The last time I was able to spot on 24th street was back in 2000,

You've got my curiosity up. I have a meeting in Tempe next week. I think afterwards I'm going to head over to 24th St. and check it out. I'll let you know exactly what the conditions are like there currently. I'll be sure to take my cam with me in case there's a spot I can park and observe.

Quoting 4holer (Reply 11):
Amazing to see though. Seems clear now. Bummer!

Well, you bring up an interesting point. The sky was definitely clear this afternoon, but I could see two very distinct contrails forming from jets passing directly overhead. Obviously, the weather conditions were right; however, the traffic patterns were not. That's why I was surprised when Cedekoe, in reply #4, said traffic patterns were normal because there just wasn't a lot of traffic up there. Unless, of course, he was referring to morning traffic patterns.
My other home is a Piper Cherokee 180C
 
redflyer
Posts: 3881
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2005 3:30 am

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 1:24 pm

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 12):
I saw a strange one yesterday. It was in the morning, and there were a lot going in a N-S direction...but one, probably the biggest, most defined of all, took a strange pattern...like a question mark.

I saw one of those, too. Only it was a couple of years ago. I couldn't figure out what it was doing. Perhaps a military flight?
My other home is a Piper Cherokee 180C
 
4holer
Posts: 2724
Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2002 1:47 am

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 1:37 pm

Quoting RedFlyer (Reply 14):
Concorde was in PHX? Now THAT would have been something to see!

Well this pic was taken by my ex-wife.
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Christa L. Brandt

I was standing next to her about 2/3 of the way to the north runway. One of my all time best aviation moments.

Quoting RedFlyer (Reply 14):
Well, you bring up an interesting point. The sky was definitely clear this afternoon, but I could see two very distinct contrails forming from jets passing directly overhead. Obviously, the weather conditions were right; however, the traffic patterns were not.

Saw that as well. I attributed it to conditions being right as less "popular" altitudes. There are ALWAYS flights to CA overhead here!
Ghosts appear and fade away.....................
 
crjflyer35
Posts: 509
Joined: Tue Nov 08, 2005 2:26 am

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:38 pm

Quoting Rikkus67 (Reply 3):
Can you still spot there unencumbered by security?

Not so much on 24th st. anymore as posted above...those lots have been replaced by the new (ish) rental car garage and employee parking lots. T-4 is a great place, but if you want to catch a GREAT view of traffic landing on 26, take SR 153 to E. Air Lane, there are gravel lots just outside the fence, plus, you're next to T-4 and can get some great shots of BA's 744 when she parks at B-25....and myself throwing bags for US, lol.

I noticed all the contrails today while I was at work too, definitely clearer than normal here in the valley today. Pretty neat sight when the full moon was rising and was illuminating the contrails...very cool.
Ok, wait for the RJ to pass, cleared to push tail south Mike, and you're cleared to spin #2 in the push.
 
Maverick623
Posts: 4632
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 9:13 am

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 3:37 pm

Quoting Crjflyer35 (Reply 17):
I noticed all the contrails today while I was at work too, definitely clearer than normal here in the valley today. Pretty neat sight when the full moon was rising and was illuminating the contrails...very cool.

Did you also catch BA taking off right at sunset? There was a group of about 6 of us standing out by A28 taking pics of it... it was an awesome sight.
"PHX is Phoenix, PDX is the other city" -777Way
 
Tom in NO
Posts: 6725
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 1999 10:10 am

RE: PHX: Crossroads In The Sky Today

Fri Jun 01, 2007 9:59 pm

Hopefully the sky will look just as cool, and the PHX spotting will be just as interesting when we get out there early next week to visit family.

Tom at MSY (on the CrackBerry)
"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina

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