Beaucaire
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LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:24 am

As expected -Mr. Mayrhuber has announced that as of Summer 2008 three new German airports might be eligible for Intercontinetal flights with LH..STR,HAM and DUS.
He would not elaborate on details for competetive reasons,but this hint is clearly a strategy to fight back Gulf and US carriers,that have been opening recently smaller airports in Germany.
In German only..
http://www.aero.de/news.php?varnewsid=3746
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wilco737
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:28 am

Lets see if this will come true... I have my doubts, but I hope it! some nice long haul flights out of HAM Big grin I guess I have to change fleet again and get based in HAM  Wink

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Beaucaire
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:37 am

I would not expect Mr. Mayrhuber to make false announcements without serious backing from his board...
LH can only grow out of regional airports,considering the limitted space available in FRA and MUC..
The tarmac has limits and slots -even in Germany- are not an expandable commodity..
Since LTU have announced the opening of Berlin as a Long-Distance hub( at least a small one..) ,LH would have an interest to not compete against LTU in TXL.
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wilco737
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:47 am

Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 2):
I would not expect Mr. Mayrhuber to make false announcements without serious backing from his board...

I am still sceptic... I heard so many things LH planned to do and then did not... for example: retiring the 737s... I was told back in 2003: you will never ever fly 737s at LH... well, I did! Started in 2004 until april 2007. And the 737 will be in the fleet until 2012! Same with the old 747-200! It took nearly 10 years until it was really gone out of LH...
So, I will just wait and see what will happen in the future! sure it is possible and I konw about the problems in MUC and FRA... Had to deal with the traffic there everyday...

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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 2:51 am

Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 2):
LH can only grow out of regional airports,considering the limitted space available in FRA and MUC..
The tarmac has limits and slots -even in Germany- are not an expandable commodity..

Lufthansa will keep on growing intercontinental traffic at FRA and MUC for a long time to come. While these airports may be slot constraint and crowded, longhaul growth will hardly be hampered by such limitations. I presume that LH will link these regional airports to partner hubs, such as IAD and ORD, so as to establish decent connectivity at least at one end because I guess there are very little viable O&D pairs that include the likes of HAM, STR and DUS unless narrowbodies are deployed.
 
Notarzt
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM

Mon Jun 11, 2007 2:52 am

Quoting Beaucaire (Thread starter):
As expected -Mr. Mayrhuber has announced that as of Summer 2008 three new German airports might be eligible for Intercontinetal flights with LH..STR,HAM and DUS.

Lufthansa already operates intercontinental flights from Dusseldorf to New York-JFK and Chicago (pure Business Class flights operated by PrivatAir with A319CJ), however, medium-sized airports such as Cologne-Bonn, Hamburg, Stuttgart or Hannover are lacking of intercontinental Lufthansa services.

Problem is that Lufthansa's competitors are growing more rapidly, airlines from the U.S. on the one hand, and from the Gulf states on the other hand recently commenced services on transatlantic routes from German airports (Delta from Dusseldorf to Atlanta, Continental from Cologne-Bonn to New York-Newark, Northwest Airlines from Dusseldorf to Detroit, Emirates from Hamburg to New York-JFK)...
 
Mir
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 3:22 am

I'm somewhat puzzled by the omission of TXL or SXF.

Quoting WILCO737 (Reply 1):
I guess I have to change fleet again and get based in HAM

You know that would probably mean flying Airbus, right?  Wink

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ConcordeBoy
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 3:52 am

So guessing this is a prelude to transoceanic flights?

...if they're just thinking of opening the likes of these airports to holiday/special interest locations in north/west Africa and western Asia, then I don't really see what the big deal would be.
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Humberside
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:21 am

Quoting Notarzt (Reply 5):
Lufthansa already operates intercontinental flights from Dusseldorf to New York-JFK and Chicago (pure Business Class flights operated by PrivatAir with A319CJ),

The PrivatAir flight uses EWR not JFK

Could these services get upgraded to a LH aircraft?
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DAL767400ER
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:40 am

Well, let's see what will actually happen. There had already been talk last year that LH would start to base some A343s in Hamburg this year, and last I know I don't exactly see LH A343s operate out of HAM as regular pax flights. That said, it would be interesting to see what routes they would attempt. Just hope it won't be NYC, having 2 carriers to that market is overkill as is.
 
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eta unknown
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:02 am

Anybody remember the LH DC-10 JFK-DUS/HAM/STR flights???
 
hman
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:05 am

I hope AB/LT really kicks LH's a** in BER. It's a shame how they avoid the largest city and capital of their home country. They don't even give the city a chance that seems to work for DL, CO, QR, AB and hopefully others soon. Now they want to start intercontinental from about every airport in this country besides TXL??? Hopefully once the others make Berlin a sucessfull international airport it will be to late for LH to get a big share of it.

Don't get me wrong, I like LH, but the way they treat this city is just unbelievable.
 
vv701
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:08 am

There are two direct flights from STR to LHR on six days a week, one on the seventh. They are operated by Cityline CRJ700s. Would any intercontinental flights from STR be also operated with Cityline aircraft?  wink 
 
vfw614
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:27 am

Just to clarify, the source for that story is the Handelsblatt, the well-respected German business daily. They will publish this "exclusive story" tomorrow. So it is for sure not just another rumour making rounds.
 
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LTU932
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:30 am

I'm curious to see if these plans for new intercontinental flights out of HAM will eventually become reality. If it does, the 787-8 would be the perfect aircraft for this purpose. It's not too big, and it's not too small.
 
hman
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:34 am

Quoting Vfw614 (Reply 13):
Just to clarify, the source for that story is the Handelsblatt, the well-respected German business daily. They will publish this "exclusive story" tomorrow. So it is for sure not just another rumour making rounds.

Here is a link to Handelsblatt online http://www.handelsblatt.com/news/Unt...hansa-plant-neue-langstrecken.html.

I have to revide my post above, this article does include BER, so I guess, everything is open.
 
tommybp251b
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:36 am

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 14):
If it does, the 787-8 would be the perfect aircraft for this purpose

Like the A340-300, of which they have a few.
Tom from Cologne
 
Wsp
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM

Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:45 am

Quoting Beaucaire (Thread starter):
As expected -Mr. Mayrhuber has announced that as of Summer 2008 three new German airports might be eligible for Intercontinetal flights with LH..STR,HAM and DUS.

The article actually says:

Quote:
Details nannte er aus Wettbewerbsgründen nicht, doch nach Informationen aus Branchenkreisen sind schon ab dem Sommerflugplan 2008 Langstreckenflüge aus Hamburg, Stuttgart und Berlin möglich.

The thread title and original post is wrong.
 
LHboyatDTW
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM

Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:55 am

If the 757 had more range, then I'm sure CO would have started serving STR a while ago.

Though besides DL, who else is there to compete with for US flights? I'm not sure of how big STR's market is to accommodate another widebody for an intercontinental flight, but when I flew in and out of there it looked like there wasn't much room for growth.

[Edited 2007-06-10 22:58:53]
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 6:03 am

Quoting LHboyatDTW (Reply 18):
If the 757 had more range, then I'm sure CO would have started serving STR a while ago.

They should have the range. EWR-STR is barely 38 nm shorter than EWR-TXL in terms of still air distance, so STR would not be such a big problem for a 757.
 
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RayChuang
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM

Mon Jun 11, 2007 6:18 am

I think LH could see a major bump up in flights out of Berlin once Berlin Brandenburg International is fully open. I wouldn't be surprised that LH's upcoming fleet of 747-8I's will be heavily based there, catering to traffic for people dealing with the German government based in Berlin. LH's A380-800 fleet will probably mostly operate out of FRA and MUC, in my humble opinion.  Smile

I do think that we will see more international flights from LH out of Stuttgart and Dusseldorf, but with smaller planes. That could mean LH may end up buying A350XWB-800 models for this very purpose.
 
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 6:40 am

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 19):
They should have the range. EWR-STR is barely 38 nm shorter than EWR-TXL in terms of still air distance, so STR would not be such a big problem for a 757.

Pure distance-wise maybe, but the geographical situation of STR would prohibit operations of 757s out of STR to EWR. The combination of high terrain to the east of the take-off runway, compared with often unfavorable winds, on more than one occasion have forced DL to add a fuel stop in BGR on their STR-ATL 763 flight, and the 763ER obviously normally should have more than ample range to do STR-ATL nonstop.
 
selcalcheckok
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 6:57 am

It has always struck me odd that LH has never went ahead with a NYC-TXL service in recent years. If they have before I can remember, what happened on this route that they gave up, or why have they not tried ?


Quoting Notartz
"Problem is that Lufthansa's competitors are growing more rapidly, airlines from the U.S. on the one hand, and from the Gulf states on the other hand recently commenced services on transatlantic routes from German airports (Delta from Dusseldorf to Atlanta, Continental from Cologne-Bonn to New York-Newark, Northwest Airlines from Dusseldorf to Detroit, Emirates from Hamburg to New York-JFK)..."

Does anyone think that LH can compete by marketing alone ( service, more attractive aircraft ) against these flights if they were to try?
 
cgnnrw
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 6:59 am

Yo LH, let's get that DUS-PHL-DUS service up and running!!!!!!!!!!

I'm no expect in the field (that doesn't stop a lot of people here does it?) but I would think DUS would be the top contender. The airport is relatively modern, offers top notch services and is easily accessable to public transportation, NRW is Germany's most populated state, not everyone in the region enjoys/wants to go to FRA to get out of Europe and DUS could certainly start up another long-haul service without having to worry about the time/slot restrictions. A flight going to say...PHL (hint hint) scheduled to leave late morning would allow for pax to connect from the early arrivals from TXL, HAM or STR and also offer incoming pax connections to these cities plus many more.

Again, just my two Eurocents for what they're worth.....
A330 man.
 
patroni
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 7:27 am

Quoting Eta unknown (Reply 10):
Anybody remember the LH DC-10 JFK-DUS/HAM/STR flights???

LH 408 STR-DUS-JFK operated by DC-10, yeah  Smile

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The HAM-DUS connection was afaik only a 737 or so under the same flight number. LH used to have a flight STR-FRA-SFO (LH430 if I recall correctly), but it was also a 737/727 to FRA and then a 747 FRA-SFO.

Didn't HAM also used to have direct flights to Tokio NRT via Anchorage operated by LH 747 somehwere in the 1980s?
 
Philadelphia1
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 8:14 am

Quoting Cgnnrw (Reply 23):
Yo LH, let's get that DUS-PHL-DUS service up and running!!!!!!!!!!

Dont have to tell me twice.


Quoting Cgnnrw (Reply 23):
A flight going to say...PHL (hint hint) scheduled to leave late morning would allow for pax to connect from the early arrivals from TXL, HAM or STR and also offer incoming pax connections to these cities plus many more.

Not to mention if there is a codeshare with USAirways, there can be connecting flights to all over the US, Canada and the Caribbean
 
BOAC911
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 8:16 am

Those

Quoting Patroni (Reply 24):
The HAM-DUS connection was afaik only a 737 or so under the same flight number. LH used to have a flight STR-FRA-SFO (LH430 if I recall correctly), but it was also a 737/727 to FRA and then a 747 FRA-SFO.

Those were just flight number routings. The domestic portions of those flights were almost always operated by 727/737/A300. Also, LH 404/401 at one time was marketed as NUE-FRA-JFK v.v.

The Tokyo polar flights made stops at either DUS (large Japanese Population, former Sony HQ for Germany) or HAM, before going on to ANC.

Before LH consolidated its intercontinental operations at FRA, there were many routings that made stops at some other german or european city (at the time not uncommon for other cariers either), these included routings such as
FRA-MUC-GIG-VCP-EZE
HAM-FRA-JFK (707)
MUC-DUS-JFK
MUC-CGN-JFK
FRA-AMS-LAX
FRA-SVO-NRT
and the list goes on...
 
LHFADUS
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 8:22 am

Quoting Humberside (Reply 8):
Quoting Notarzt (Reply 5):
Lufthansa already operates intercontinental flights from Dusseldorf to New York-JFK and Chicago (pure Business Class flights operated by PrivatAir with A319CJ),

The PrivatAir flight uses EWR not JFK

Could these services get upgraded to a LH aircraft?

Until short after 9/11 LH actually DID operate that route with A342/A343, so it's not that unlikely, that they someday take-over that route again.

Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 2):
LH can only grow out of regional airports,considering the limitted space available in FRA and MUC..

MUC is still far from reaching limits IMO. The terminal is hardly ever full, the next runway is on its way and the airport has nothing but green around it. FRA also has some cards left which aren't in the game yet: Terminal 3 and the new runway are coming and the A380 hangar is momentarily under construction.

Nevertheless, LH can no longer ignore competitors taking big pieces of "their" cake. EK with 2 daily connections from DUS, LT now teamed up with AB, growing to become LH's biggest competitor on home-ground. DUS has too much potential to be ignored - being germany's airport no. 3, with passengers coming from as far as the netherlands. The City of Düsseldorf has the largest japanese community in Germany, the Ruhr District with large cities like Essen, Duisburg, Bochum, Dortmund, Oberhausen etc summs up to a larger surface and higher population than berlin. IMO it's just a matter of time until LH operates L/H flights from DUS again.
 
HUYfan
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 8:29 am

I would hope for Dusseldorf! The problem, however, with anything outside of the FRA/MUC markets, such as HAM or DUS, is filling the front end!

Regards

Mike
 
ACDC8
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 8:36 am

Quoting HUYfan (Reply 28):
I would hope for Dusseldorf! The problem, however, with anything outside of the FRA/MUC markets, such as HAM or DUS, is filling the front end!

Which is why LH flies 2 PrivatAir flights to EWR and ORD 6 days a week? I agree, DUS is a very large leisure market, but the demand is also quite high for business and premium cabins given the number of companies located in the Rhein/Ruhr area.
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HUYfan
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 8:46 am

That is somewhat true, however, if you consider how the MUC hub started, there is considerably more premium demand for the likes of Asia and the US from MUC than from somewhere like DUS. MUC-LAX gets premium traffic, however, although LTU offer a premium product, DUS-LAX just isn't in the same league. I think LH would find it difficult to make long-haul work from anywhere else in German.

Regards

Mike
 
ACDC8
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 8:52 am

Quoting HUYfan (Reply 30):
I think LH would find it difficult to make long-haul work from anywhere else in German.

Not necessarily. DUS is within easy driving distance of many world class companies that would like to see this kind of service being offered. Also, it gives LH more options for cnx flights, as an example, instead of NUR-FRA-LAX, they could also offer NUR-DUS-LAX as an example.
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HUYfan
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 9:06 am

It has been tried and tested before and it doesn't work. LTU is the right carrier for DUS, not LH.

Regards

Mike
 
ACDC8
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 9:21 am

Quoting HUYfan (Reply 32):
It has been tried and tested before and it doesn't work. LTU is the right carrier for DUS, not LH.

It may have, but markets change. LH is a smart airline, they do their homework very carefully. Also, you are underestimating the DUS market greatly.
A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
 
FXMD11
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 9:28 am

Quoting Eta unknown (Reply 10):
Anybody remember the LH DC-10 JFK-DUS/HAM/STR flights???

YES, me! Flown DC-10 DUS-JFK in Jan 1993.This was my first Atlantic Crossing.
 
BOAC911
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 9:57 am

It's very obvious that Hamburg, Düsseldorf, and Berlin customers are willing to take other carriers instead of changing planes at FRA or MUC. This is the quandry that LH finds itself in. At what point will the hub-and-spoke system begin to neglect LH's german customers? I suspect it already has. Residents of Germany (not just greater Frankfurt and Munich, which are also being gouged) are still Lufthansa's bread and butter customers....
 
N1120A
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 12:31 pm

Quoting LHboyatDTW (Reply 18):
If the 757 had more range, then I'm sure CO would have started serving STR a while ago.

Range really shouldn't be an issue. Even given the conditions at STR, the 757 handily outperforms even the 763ER (which is a hell of a performer itself), which should negate the terrain and wind issues.

Quoting RayChuang (Reply 20):
I wouldn't be surprised that LH's upcoming fleet of 747-8I's will be heavily based there, catering to traffic for people dealing with the German government based in Berlin.

That is a pipe dream. The 748I fleet is likely to be based in Frankfurt and maybe Muenchen and any long haul from Berlin, Hamburg, etc. would be on smaller aircraft like the 787

Quoting BOAC911 (Reply 26):
FRA-AMS-LAX

That was a range issue, not a passenger demand issue.
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panam92
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 12:40 pm

When ever I have to fly to Hamburg from New York, I try to avoid Frankfurt as much as possible. I used to like there JFK-DUS-HAM service and in the 60's 70's I flew nonstop JFK-HAM on that great Boeing 707 with either Lufthansa or Pan Am, those where the days. KLM has been my choice lately.
 
bimmerkid19
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 2:37 pm

Quoting PanAm92 (Reply 37):
KLM has been my choice lately.

maybe start using EK, You might flip out. The service on EK is Top-notch, plus on a A340-500 with their ICE Entertainment System. 60 Movie/TV channels and numerous game selections and movies from all over the world as well as a nice selection of music, and good food.. and all in Economy.. How nice!
Last flights: LH 3738 MUC - ZRH , LH 3749 ZRH - MUC . Upcoming: EK 50 MUC - DXB 3-aug. and EK 322 DXB - ICN 7- Aug.
 
Tomaeroeng
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 3:18 pm

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 21):
Pure distance-wise maybe, but the geographical situation of STR would prohibit operations of 757s out of STR to EWR. The combination of high terrain to the east of the take-off runway, compared with often unfavorable winds, on more than one occasion have forced DL to add a fuel stop in BGR on their STR-ATL 763 flight, and the 763ER obviously normally should have more than ample range to do STR-ATL nonstop.

That leads to another question. With what equipment does LH plan to fly transoceanic out of STR? Sometimes, STR switches the active runway to 07 just for the DL 763 when the wind conditions allow it. I even saw something like a tailwind take-off. I am not sure how often this happens but i witnessed it twice during taxiing and approach in my small PA28  Wink

The 763 obviously can't make it over the Echterdinger hills that elevate 2 miles behind the threshold of runway 25. What aircraft LH operates transcon can make it? The A333? I doubt the A343 could do it. And the 744 would be exaggerated. BTW Condors 752/3 do climb out nicely, but of course not with the fuel for transat, just for the 4.5 hour hop to the canaries.

As to the amount of passengers, I am quite sure that a flight to New York would do pretty well, considering that STR is economically a very strong region. For my part I can say that i always prefer to fly out of FRA and getting a nonstop flight to my destination in the US that connecting at ATL. With LH I can at least be somewhat sure that the flight is not cancelled or delayed, while using DL to connect I always fear the worst....

tom
 
TriStar500
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:23 pm

It will be interesting to see, how AB/LT reacts to this. Although they are currently chiefly operating to beach destinations long-haul (with very few exemptions, e.g. JFK, LAX and BKK), I am sure that there are already plans to expand into markets, which are currently held by LH and the other "regular" scheduled carriers.

LH's step might not only be a reaction to the intrusion of EK, DL, CO etc. into their home market, but also an preemptive strike to their only meaningful German competition.
Homer: Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!
 
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LTU932
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:38 pm

Quoting Tomaeroeng (Reply 39):
The 763 obviously can't make it over the Echterdinger hills that elevate 2 miles behind the threshold of runway 25. What aircraft LH operates transcon can make it? The A333? I doubt the A343 could do it.

The A343 should be able to do it, even if that requires restrictions. Think of SXM, which has a hill behind the RW27 threshold, even closer than the ones near RW25 in STR plus, unlike STR, it has a very short runway, and the A343 can still make it nonstop from SXM to CDG (albeit most likely with restrictions). The issue is probably engine out performance, which due to the obstacle clearance issue in STR, would cause aircraft like a 767 to go weight restricted.

SJO has an obstacle problem similar to that of STR, hence why twins often make a triangular routing like NM did by operating MAD-SJO-PTY-MAD with their A330s (including their sole A333, which wasn't even the longer range HGW model). DE also operates to SJO with twins, but those make a stop both ways (previously at MCO and HAV, now at SDQ, although they're supposed to have 5th Freedom Rights for SDQ-SJO-SDQ right now) and despite the short distance they fly for the enroute stop, when they take off from SJO, I always see them fly somewhat unusually low over SYQ, unlike DL when operating 763s on ATL-SJO-ATL.
 
N1120A
Posts: 26467
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RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:56 pm

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 41):

The A343 should be able to do it, even if that requires restrictions.

The 767 is a far better performer than the A343, despite being a 2 engine aircraft. It's wing design is made for lift and performance and it weighs 1/3rd less.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
Tomaeroeng
Posts: 30
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2006 9:05 pm

RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:00 pm

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 41):
The A343 should be able to do it, even if that requires restrictions. Think of SXM, which has a hill behind the RW27 threshold, even closer than the ones near RW25 in STR plus, unlike STR, it has a very short runway, and the A343 can still make it nonstop from SXM to CDG (albeit most likely with restrictions). The issue is probably engine out performance, which due to the obstacle clearance issue in STR, would cause aircraft like a 767 to go weight restricted.

Yes the problem is the engine out performance, as my Flight Instructor told me who flies the MD11. So the 343 should make it, but what about other twins? A333, 777 and of course the 787? I dont have my charts here in the office to give the exact data of the topography. A C152 makes it just fine  duck 
 
Burkhard
Posts: 1916
Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:34 pm

RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 6:29 pm

Quoting Eta unknown (Reply 10):
Anybody remember the LH DC-10 JFK-DUS/HAM/STR flights???

No, it was on a 707 I did it last time .

Burkhard
 
ZakHH
Posts: 1570
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2005 11:32 pm

RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 6:48 pm

Finally! More widebodies for HAM...  hyper 

Quoting Mir (Reply 6):
I'm somewhat puzzled by the omission of TXL or SXF.



Quoting HMan (Reply 11):
I hope AB/LT really kicks LH's a** in BER. It's a shame how they avoid the largest city and capital of their home country.

As already stated above, Berlin is considered by Lufthansa. But in general, I think Berlin is overrated. Size (in terms of inhabitants) is not all that matters, and the economic situation in and around Berlin is - to put it mildly - not the best. But airlines usually fly where the music plays. Thus, HAM, DUS and STR come into mind before Berlin would.

Don't get me wrong, there is a significant traffic potential in Berlin, no doubt about it. And I am 100% sure LH will not forget Berlin. But then, Berlin - Hamburg is less than 2 hours by train, so an intercontinental hub would be close within reach anyway.

Finally, our government does the best they can to focus everything to Berlin. If economical reasons won't be enough to promote Berlin, there will be enough political reasons to be generated in no time. So I guess our "Hauptstädter" won't have to worry.

Quoting WILCO737 (Reply 1):
I guess I have to change fleet again and get based in HAM

Guess that would not be the worst of all options, so I keep the fingers crossed for you.  crossfingers 
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Loadsheet
Posts: 57
Joined: Tue Jul 27, 2004 3:15 am

RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 7:18 pm

Quoting Patroni (Reply 24):
Didn't HAM also used to have direct flights to Tokio NRT via Anchorage operated by LH 747 somehwere in the 1980s?

yes - they operated the B742 from FRA via HAM, ANC, NRT to Osaka Itami at that time. 3 stops - unbelievable today. If you want i can pick out a timetable from the 80's to give you some more details conc days of ops and more !
 
COEWRNJ
Posts: 1000
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2003 9:46 am

RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 8:26 pm

Didn't LH serve IAD non-stop from either TXL or HAM for a brief time around 2001?
 
patroni
Posts: 1372
Joined: Sat Aug 14, 1999 7:49 am

RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 8:41 pm

Quoting Tomaeroeng (Reply 39):
With what equipment does LH plan to fly transoceanic out of STR? Sometimes, STR switches the active runway to 07 just for the DL 763 when the wind conditions allow it. I even saw something like a tailwind take-off

In the 1980s Condor used to have weekly DC-10 nonstop services STR-JFK, operated for Reisebuero Schwaben International. And that was even before the runway was extended and moved away from the Weidacher hills. So maybe LH should consider getting a DC-10 out of Mojave?  Wink
 
cgnnrw
Posts: 1045
Joined: Tue May 17, 2005 3:11 am

RE: LH Wants To Open Intercontinental From STR,HAM,DUS

Mon Jun 11, 2007 8:51 pm

Quoting COEWRNJ (Reply 47):
Didn't LH serve IAD non-stop from either TXL or HAM for a brief time around 2001?

LH served IAD from CGN until early 90's with A310 equipment.
A330 man.

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