IAD787
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Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sat Jun 23, 2007 11:09 am

Before now, it was not specifically known what airlines would be the first to receive the 787 Dreamliner. It was clear that ANA would be the launch customer receiving the first production model (LN7) and the previous six would be used as test frames; eventually being refurbished and delivered to ANA, Northwest and another unknown airline.

Flightblogger has learned exactly which frames, including the two General Electric powered GENx 787s (LN 5 & 6) will go once fight testing has ended. In addition, this blogger has learned the destination of the second production model 787-8.

All Nippon Airways will be the recipients of LN1 and LN2, while Northwest Airlines will receive LN3 and LN4. Royal Air Maroc, the national airline of Morocco will take delivery of LN5 and LN6, the GENx test frames.

Dreamliner Eight, LN8, also known as ZA008 will be delivered to Air China in time for the 2008 Summer Olympic Games in Beijing.

Graphics and pictures of the first eight are here:

http://flightblogger.blogspot.com

LN1/ZA001:
All Nippon Airways
Rolls Royce Trent 1000
N787BA

LN2/ZA002:
All Nippon Airways
Rolls Royce Trent 1000
N787EX

LN3/ZA003:
Northwest Airlines
Rolls Royce Trent 1000

LN4/ZA004:
Northwest Airlines
Rolls Royce Trent 1000

LN5/ZA005:
Royal Air Maroc
General Electric GENx

LN6/ZA006:
Royal Air Maroc
General Electric GENx

LN7/ZA007:
All Nippon Airways
Rolls Royce Trent 1000
Production Unit 1

LN8/ZA008:
Air China
Rolls Royce Trent 1000
Production Unit 2

A lot of additional detail on the first eight are here:

http://flightblogger.blogspot.com

Onward,

IAD787
Former FlightBlogger turned Wall Street Journal Aerospace Beat Reporter
 
centrair
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sat Jun 23, 2007 11:21 am

Thank you. Been wondering this for awhile. Now I just hope I get to be on one of those NW 787s when they start Asia ops.

Now I am wondering when CO, AC, QF and JL get theirs?
My name is Centrair but HND is closer. Let's Japanese Aviation!
 
jogales
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sat Jun 23, 2007 11:30 am

Thanks for the info! Since these are going to be part of the flight testing program, would it be correct to assume that they won't be the first 8 Dreamliners delivered? Assuming that's correct, do you have any info on who the first few 787s will go to? I know ANA gets the first one, but after that...?

Josh
-
 
XT6Wagon
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sat Jun 23, 2007 11:59 am

Quoting Jogales (Reply 2):
Thanks for the info! Since these are going to be part of the flight testing program, would it be correct to assume that they won't be the first 8 Dreamliners delivered? Assuming that's correct, do you have any info on who the first few 787s will go to? I know ANA gets the first one, but after that...

if you read the post you would see only the first 6 at this time are used for flight test, the #7 frame goes to ANA and #8 to Airchina.

The only possible change to this is Boeing has said if it needs to it will add MORE frames to the test flight program to see it done on time. I would suspect the #7 frame would be used, but not #8 as The olympics and the frame number are both symbolic in nature and great efforts will be made to see that plane be done on time.
 
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RobK
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sat Jun 23, 2007 6:31 pm

Jon, so l/n 1 won't be wearing N787DL after all then eh?  Wink Strange that! I'm sure I recall someone saying it would be N787BA a good while back, but the name of that person slips my mind at the moment ......  biggrin 

R
 
legoguy
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 12:14 am

That is one great looking aircraft! The Dreamliner ANA livery looks great! Not long to go now.

When will the first 787-900 be built? (and the 787-1000?)
Can you say 'Beer Can' without sounding like a Jamaican saying 'Bacon'?
 
IAD787
Topic Author
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 1:17 am

Quoting RobK (Reply 4):
Jon, so l/n 1 won't be wearing N787DL after all then eh? Wink Strange that! I'm sure I recall someone saying it would be N787BA a good while back, but the name of that person slips my mind at the moment ...... biggrin

Sometimes you place bets and you win, sometimes you place bets and you lose. I still believe that N787DL will find a home on one of the 787s. The details of that FAA log was just too coincidental. I'm not much of a conspiracy theorist, but they could be saving Delta Lima for LN1 at the last minute and move Bravo Alpha and Echo X-Ray to LN2 and LN3 as a surprise. Who knows?
Former FlightBlogger turned Wall Street Journal Aerospace Beat Reporter
 
kaitak744
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 1:18 am

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 5):
When will the first 787-900 be built? (and the 787-1000?)

For the last time, it is the 787-9 and 787-10, NOT the 787-900 and 787-1000...

787-3's launch customer: ANA. EIS 2010
787-9's launch customer: Air New Zealand. EIS 2010
787-10 EIS 2013

^all EIS before the first A350.
 
legoguy
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 1:26 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 7):
For the last time, it is the 787-9 and 787-10, NOT the 787-900 and 787-1000...

Whoops, Airbus on the brain there on my behalf.

Any exact dates for the roll out of the first 787-3, 787-9 and 787-10?
Can you say 'Beer Can' without sounding like a Jamaican saying 'Bacon'?
 
atmx2000
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 1:26 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 7):
787-10 EIS 2013

There is no -10 EIS yet.
ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
 
bimmerkid19
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 2:35 am

Quoting IAD787 (Thread starter):
LN3/ZA003:
Northwest Airlines
Rolls Royce Trent 1000

LN4/ZA004:
Northwest Airlines
Rolls Royce Trent 1000

Wow!! The first RR engines for NW!!! I love RR Engines. They are nice and quiet!
Last flights: LH 3738 MUC - ZRH , LH 3749 ZRH - MUC . Upcoming: EK 50 MUC - DXB 3-aug. and EK 322 DXB - ICN 7- Aug.
 
OB1504
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 2:42 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 7):
For the last time, it is the 787-9 and 787-10, NOT the 787-900 and 787-1000...

Although once you add the Boeing customer code to the aircraft type (i.e. 787-919), doesn't it in effect become the 787-300/-800/-900/-1000?
 
Ken777
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 2:49 am

Great information - thank you for all your efforts!

The question I'm starting to think of is how many 787's Boeing will have for delivery when they get their certification. I've read that Boeing will continue to build planes during the certification process and there will be more than a handful ready. I'm assuming that the final number will be dependent on the suppliers and the ramping up process, but would love to know the anticipated number.
 
kaitak744
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 4:10 am

Quoting Atmx2000 (Reply 9):
Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 7):
787-10 EIS 2013

There is no -10 EIS yet.

http://boeing.com/news/releases/2007/q2/070619c_nr.html

"We see the 787-10 being introduced sometime around 2013"
 
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RobK
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 4:41 am

Quoting IAD787 (Reply 6):
Sometimes you place bets and you win, sometimes you place bets and you lose. I still believe that N787DL will find a home on one of the 787s. The details of that FAA log was just too coincidental. I'm not much of a conspiracy theorist, but they could be saving Delta Lima for LN1 at the last minute and move Bravo Alpha and Echo X-Ray to LN2 and LN3 as a surprise. Who knows?

 Wink

I personally don't think N787DL will be a 787 test reg. However, I'm now hearing rumours about N787A, N787E and N787ZA ..... Coincidentally, those 3 are all registered to Boeing at Seattle whereas N787BA and N787EX are registered to Boeing at Oklahoma... Ho-hum...

R
 
legoguy
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 6:23 am

For those who missed the picture in the link...



Quoting IAD787 (Thread starter):
All Nippon Airways will be the recipients of LN1 and LN2

Since ANA will recieve the first aircraft built, does this mean the 787 will have Rolls Royce Engines hanging under the wings at the roll out and on the first flight?
Can you say 'Beer Can' without sounding like a Jamaican saying 'Bacon'?
 
kaitak744
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 8:14 am

Quoting Legoguy (Reply 15):
Since ANA will recieve the first aircraft built, does this mean the 787 will have Rolls Royce Engines hanging under the wings at the roll out and on the first flight?

Yes, the first Boeing aircraft to roll out with non-us engines.

Also, the liveries the planes are in... that is the livery those planes will roll out in. 787s can not be repainted, so you will not see a 787 in full Boeing colors.
 
cbphoto
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 8:26 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 16):
Also, the liveries the planes are in... that is the livery those planes will roll out in. 787s can not be repainted, so you will not see a 787 in full Boeing colors.

Ok, I might have been asleep for the past few years here, but the 787 cannot be re-pained? I know it is a composite material, and that the (shiny) Aluminum liveries were out of the question, but a 787 cannot be re-painted at ALL? If this is true, then my question(s) is this. First, if the livery gets worn and faded can they add additional paint to an already existing livery? And the second question, what happens if the aircraft switches owners, or a leasing company takes back a 787, and leases it to another airline? Is it going to be a permanent hybrid livery?
ETOPS: Engines Turning or Passengers Swimming
 
aussie747
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 8:31 am

Quoting Centrair (Reply 1):
Thank you. Been wondering this for awhile. Now I just hope I get to be on one of those NW 787s when they start Asia ops.

Now I am wondering when CO, AC, QF and JL get theirs?

According to the latest JQ were to get their first one in AUG 2008 and QF in JUL 2009, but who's to say if that will change depending on production running to schedule
 
northstardc4m
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 8:38 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 16):
Yes, the first Boeing aircraft to roll out with non-us engines.

cough cough 757 cough...
Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
 
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sammyk
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 8:43 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 16):
Yes, the first Boeing aircraft to roll out with non-us engines.

I thought the 757 held that distinction?
 
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alaskaqantas
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 9:25 am

Quoting Centrair (Reply 1):
QF

yeah Im wondering when QF will recieve their 787s as well. They have the largest purchase with 115 787s.
~Cheers-
~~Kyle H.
to some people the sky is the limit, to aviation enthusiasts, its home!
 
kaitak744
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 9:49 am

Quoting Cbphoto (Reply 17):

Ok, I might have been asleep for the past few years here, but the 787 cannot be re-pained? I know it is a composite material, and that the (shiny) Aluminum liveries were out of the question, but a 787 cannot be re-painted at ALL? If this is true, then my question(s) is this. First, if the livery gets worn and faded can they add additional paint to an already existing livery? And the second question, what happens if the aircraft switches owners, or a leasing company takes back a 787, and leases it to another airline? Is it going to be a permanent hybrid livery?


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Serge Bailleul - AirTeamImages



Notice how in this UA 747, the composite wing-body fairings have not been sanded. The new livery of this aircraft was simply painted over. You can not sand down composite parts. You have to paint over. Painting over adds to aircraft weight, which is why Boeing won't do it.
 
md90fan
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:18 am

I could have sworn ET was supposed to get their's before those airlines. Their CEO even said so.
http://www.devanwells.blogspot.com/
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:20 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 22):
Notice how in this UA 747, the composite wing-body fairings have not been sanded. The new livery of this aircraft was simply painted over. You can not sand down composite parts. You have to paint over. Painting over adds to aircraft weight, which is why Boeing won't do it.

You do not sand the paint off any aircraft. Old paint is removed by chemicals. Paint has been removed from composit parts before, it is not a big problem. But, Boeing does not want to do that for the B-787 flight test airplanes.
 
AF022
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:33 am

Quoting MD90fan (Reply 23):
I could have sworn ET was supposed to get their's before those airlines. Their CEO even said so.

I also remember hearing that ET would get the 787 after only ANA. Has this changed?
 
AirNZ
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:33 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 16):
787s can not be repainted,

Out of curiosity, if they can't be repainted how they are painted in the first place then?
Flown:F27/TU134/Viscount/Trident/BAC111/727/737/747/757/767/777/300/310/320/321/330/340/DC9/DC10/Dash8/Shorts330/BAe146
 
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PM
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 12:02 pm

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 16):
Yes, the first Boeing aircraft to roll out with non-us engines.



Quoting NorthStarDC4M (Reply 19):

cough cough 757 cough...

 checkmark 

Quoting Sammyk (Reply 20):
I thought the 757 held that distinction?

 checkmark 

We might also, at a pinch, add the 777-300...  Wink

It is a curious fact that no Boeing widebody has ever made its maiden flight on GE.

PW can claim the 747, 767 and 777 while RR have snagged the 787.  cheerful 
 
Carpethead
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 12:25 pm

So in other worlds, like the 777 program, there will be no company prototype hanging around for years.
 
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sammyk
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 1:39 pm

Quoting AirNZ (Reply 26):
Out of curiosity, if they can't be repainted how they are painted in the first place then?

Well, he said "repainted". That is the key word. You can obviously paint them initially.

(BTW, I don't believe it can't be repainted, just explaining what the poster is saying)
 
cbphoto
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 4:49 pm

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 22):
Notice how in this UA 747, the composite wing-body fairings have not been sanded. The new livery of this aircraft was simply painted over. You can not sand down composite parts. You have to paint over. Painting over adds to aircraft weight, which is why Boeing won't do it.

I see what you mean, so those parts of the aircraft will get re-painted, not necessarily stripped of paint?

Quoting Sammyk (Reply 29):
BTW, I don't believe it can't be repainted, just explaining what the poster is saying)

So it can be repainted???

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 24):
Paint has been removed from composite parts before, it is not a big problem. But, Boeing does not want to do that for the B-787 flight test airplanes

Ok, now I am confused  Confused  Confused So a composite fuselage like the 787 can be re-painted?? I understand Boeing does not want to deal the re-paint process, but if a company or leasing firm want/need the aircraft to be repainted, then it CAN be done? Because from what I gathered from Kaitak744, that the 787 CANNOT be repainted at all? Sorry for my ignorance, but I am really curious about this matter, and in no way am I trying to pin someones words against another's!!
ETOPS: Engines Turning or Passengers Swimming
 
AirNZ
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:54 pm

Quoting Sammyk (Reply 29):
Well, he said "repainted". That is the key word. You can obviously paint them initially.

Ah cheers! I guess what I was meaning was that if they can't be repainted, how can they be painted originally (if you see what I mean)?
Flown:F27/TU134/Viscount/Trident/BAC111/727/737/747/757/767/777/300/310/320/321/330/340/DC9/DC10/Dash8/Shorts330/BAe146
 
ual747-600
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Mon Jun 25, 2007 10:43 pm

Does anyone know when the second flight model will be built and join the first in flight testing?

UAL747-600
 
474218
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Tue Jun 26, 2007 8:57 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 16):
787s can not be repainted, so you will not see a 787 in full Boeing colors.

An aircraft's rudder is a balanced flight control it has a maximum weight. They can only be painted over a specific number of times before they must be stripped and repainted. Since composite rudders have been used for years and have been stripped of paint and repainted many times, I can't see why the 787 can't be stripped and repainted.
 
ikramerica
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RE: Who Gets The First Eight 787s? Answers Here

Tue Jun 26, 2007 9:20 am

Quoting AF022 (Reply 25):
I also remember hearing that ET would get the 787 after only ANA. Has this changed?

Test frames don't just immediately get handed over to customers once the plane is certified. They go through a refurb process of 2-3 months, depending on what was inside them for testing. The "in service" test frame with a full complement of seats for route proving will be the easiest to convert to service, the others will take longer.

In the mean time, Boeing is going to be building and stocking non-test aircraft that will be delivered as soon as the 787 and the production process are both certified.

That means that just because we know who gets the first eight to be BUILT doesn't mean that they are the first eight deliveries.

ANA will get the first delivered plane, which should be LN7, from what I can glean from all the threads of the past and this one. I also doubt that LN7 or LN8 will be "added" to the test program if they need more hours in a hurry. They will likely grab one later in the queue.

I'm pretty sure LN7 must remain green so it can be delivered to ANA, the launch customer, the day it is certified.

And the RAM jets don't necessarily even have to finish flight testing before EIS, since they are the GEnx frames, and the first deliveries are RR. But it can't fall more than a few weeks behind RR certification if they want to get frames to JL, QF and various China carriers before Beijing 2008. But RAM may not get their test planes until August, so the carriers like ET and others promised to be ahead of RAM in line need not worry...
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.

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