hjulicher
Posts: 665
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 2:26 pm

SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Sun Jun 24, 2007 3:35 pm

At the Le Bourget Air Show, Aeroflot Russian Airlines confirmed their deal with Airbus for the 22 frames that will upgrade it's longhaul fleet between 2014-2017. This will push the number of Airbus aircraft in it's fleet up to 65.

Aeroflot also signed an agreement with Rolls-Royce for the servicing of engines that have been selected for their 10 leased AerCap A330's. These planes will be brand new of production lines, and will be delivered beginning next year.

Looks like SU is really going to expand big time, possibly opening up new hubs in secondary Russian markets, or perhaps gearing up for the Alitalia acquisition if it goes thru.

THINGS AEROFLOT HAS TO LOOK FOWARD TO:
1) Opening of SVO-3, a dedicated Skyteam facility at Sheremetyevo Airport in Moscow that will be connected by high-speed rail, improving connectivity between the facility and Moscow.
2) New mid-range aircraft... A320 and A321 new deliveries.
3) E-ticketing, in accordance with the guidelines set by IATA.
4) Alitalia, if it goes thru
5) 10 New A330's.
6) 22 Boeing 787's.
7) 22 Airbus A350's.
8) SuperJet for domestic ops.
LH 442
 
User avatar
LTU932
Posts: 13091
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 12:34 am

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Sun Jun 24, 2007 3:40 pm

Surprising that SU chose RR for the A330s since they usually buy GE (including the CFM56) for their Western built fleet, but given that the A350 is so far only offered with the Trent XWB, it would make sense for commonality.
 
User avatar
PM
Posts: 4848
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:05 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Sun Jun 24, 2007 4:12 pm

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 1):
Surprising that SU chose RR for the A330s since they usually buy GE

Perhaps not all that surprising. The Trent is the market leader (by far) on the A330 while the GE CF6 is the least popular choice out of three. There's a strong case to be made that the Trent 700 is a "better" engine for the A330 than the CF6. So SU chose the better engine rather than maintain some spurious concept of loyalty to GE.

Now, what will they choose for their 787s... ?
 
User avatar
LTU932
Posts: 13091
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 12:34 am

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Sun Jun 24, 2007 4:48 pm

Quoting PM (Reply 2):
The Trent is the market leader (by far) on the A330 while the GE CF6 is the least popular choice out of three.

True, but the CF6-80E1 seems to be at least closing in on PW for second A330 engine of choice (there seem to be more A330s with GE engines coming from TLS than PW4000 powered ones).

Quoting PM (Reply 2):
Now, what will they choose for their 787s... ?

If they're wise, they'll choose the Trent 1000 for commonality with the Trent XWB and Trent 700.
 
User avatar
PM
Posts: 4848
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:05 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Sun Jun 24, 2007 5:13 pm

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 3):

True, but the CF6-80E1 seems to be at least closing in on PW for second A330 engine of choice

They were but PW have recently come back with A330 orders from Grupo Marsans, Kingfisher, TAM and Guggenheim. Moreover, they're likely to get the order for recently ordered A330s from TG and US. Plus, they're on the A330F and GE aren't.

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 3):
(there seem to be more A330s with GE engines coming from TLS than PW4000 powered ones).

That's certainly been true for the last year or two but GE's backlog is drying up.

My take on the A330 is that:
* RR cannot now lose the substantial lead they've built up;
* PW are coming back and will hold on to 2nd place;
* GE are losing interest in the programme.

When the last one rolls off the line (an A330F, I assume, a decade or more from now) I'm guessing that RR will have about 50%, PW about 30% and GE 20%. After Paris, RR are already between 45% and 50%. I don't see them losing that. They've got off to a good start on the A330F (three customers against one for PW) and they remain the most popular choice on the pax versions.

In fact, with SQ (19), Air Asia X (15) taking double digit orders to RR, SU are merely maintaining the trend.
 
User avatar
LTU932
Posts: 13091
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 12:34 am

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Sun Jun 24, 2007 6:02 pm

Quoting PM (Reply 4):
They were but PW have recently come back with A330 orders from Grupo Marsans, Kingfisher, TAM and Guggenheim.

IT ordered Pratt engines? That's surprising, I thought they'd order more Trent engines for commonality purposes with the A345s.
 
9v-svc
Posts: 1703
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2001 5:19 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Sun Jun 24, 2007 6:03 pm

Just a question, did SU comfirm their order for 787s ?

Along with SQ , which other airlines is likely to operate both 787 and 350 ?
Airliners is the wings of my life.
 
Danny
Posts: 3714
Joined: Thu Apr 25, 2002 3:44 am

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Sun Jun 24, 2007 6:18 pm

So GE lost another 108 engines (20xA330 44xA350 and most likely also 44xB787). Protecting their investment in 773ER is turning into self inflicted sabotage.

[Edited 2007-06-24 11:20:33]
 
Thorben
Posts: 2713
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2005 10:29 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Sun Jun 24, 2007 6:33 pm

Quoting 9V-SVC (Reply 6):
Just a question, did SU comfirm their order for 787s ?

Yes, shortly before the LeBourget show.

Quoting 9V-SVC (Reply 6):
Along with SQ , which other airlines is likely to operate both 787 and 350 ?

I believe several others will. The 787 orders this far were mainly for the 787-8. Those who have those might combine them with the bigger A359 and A3510.

Quoting Danny (Reply 7):
So GE lost another 108 engines (20xA330 44xA350 and most likely also 44xB787). Protecting their investment in 773ER is turning into self inflicted sabotage.

Numbers are even higher, because of spare engines. Otherwise I agree. I can't understand GE, because the 777NG will be done after only ten years, the A350 will probably last 20 or so years. Why give it all to RR?
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
User avatar
PM
Posts: 4848
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:05 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Sun Jun 24, 2007 7:15 pm

Quoting LTU932 (Reply 5):
IT ordered Pratt engines?

Indeed. It was only for five frames but it was quite a win for PW - and at Paris IT ordered ten more so we can assume they'll have PW too. Grupo Marsans (i.e. Air Comet and Aerolineas Argentinas) chose PW too. And at Paris TAM returned to PW for their next six A330s. (TAM's first batch of five had PW but then they leased five from GECAS with GE.)

In the current flood of orders for 777s, 787s, A330s and A350s these wins don't amount to much but they're the best news PW have had since they failed to get aboard the 787.
 
workhorse
Posts: 218
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:35 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:14 pm

Quoting Thorben (Reply 8):
I can't understand GE, because the 777NG will be done after only ten years, the A350 will probably last 20 or so years. Why give it all to RR?

Maybe because they are not sure that A350 will last 20 years. And I tend to think the same thing, too...
 
User avatar
breiz
Posts: 1426
Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2005 9:12 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:28 pm

Quoting Hjulicher (Thread starter):
4) Alitalia, if it goes thru

The latest news were that SU had pulled out of the purchase race.
The latest latest are that they are still on:
http://www.ansa.it/site/notizie/awnp...lish/news/2007-06-18_11890626.html
 
Thorben
Posts: 2713
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2005 10:29 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Sun Jun 24, 2007 10:48 pm

Quoting Workhorse (Reply 10):
Maybe because they are not sure that A350 will last 20 years. And I tend to think the same thing, too...

Why, what is going to happen to it from 2013 to 2033?
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
a3
Posts: 212
Joined: Wed Oct 04, 2006 5:24 am

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Sun Jun 24, 2007 11:58 pm

Quoting Danny (Reply 7):
So GE lost another 108 engines (20xA330 44xA350 and most likely also 44xB787). Protecting their investment in 773ER is turning into self inflicted sabotage.

I think that the lack of interest that GE showed regarding their involvement to the A350EWB project is going to cost them more and more sales the years to come.
Any way , GE took the decision to be on the same boat with Boeing letting the field open to competitors , time will show if this was a smart move.

Rgds
A3
Don't spend your money on airlines that don't respect your business.
 
manni
Posts: 4049
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2001 1:48 am

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Mon Jun 25, 2007 12:01 am

Quoting 9V-SVC (Reply 6):
Just a question, did SU comfirm their order for 787s ?



Quoting Thorben (Reply 8):
Yes, shortly before the LeBourget show.

No, they didn't. Boeing updated their ordersheet during the Airshow but did not add Aeroflot.
SUPPORT THE LEBANESE CIVILIANS
 
workhorse
Posts: 218
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:35 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Mon Jun 25, 2007 12:02 am

Quoting Thorben (Reply 12):
Why, what is going to happen to it from 2013 to 2033?

Y3
 
cloudyapple
Posts: 1261
Joined: Sun Jul 24, 2005 7:01 am

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Mon Jun 25, 2007 12:23 am

Quoting Danny (Reply 7):
So GE lost another 108 engines (20xA330 44xA350 and most likely also 44xB787). Protecting their investment in 773ER is turning into self inflicted sabotage.

More like 216 + about 20 spares!
A310/A319/20/21/A332/3/A343/6/A388/B732/5/7/8/B742/S/4/B752/B763/B772/3/W/E145/J41/MD11/83/90
 
iL62M
Posts: 54
Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 7:51 am

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Mon Jun 25, 2007 4:15 am

Quoting 9V-SVC (Reply 6):
Just a question, did SU comfirm their order for 787s ?



Quoting Manni (Reply 14):
No, they didn't. Boeing updated their ordersheet during the Airshow but did not add Aeroflot.

There is a simple explanation of this... The board of Directors meeting with the question of approving the deal with Boeing on 22x 787s is still to come in July. Doubt that this will turn otherwise than approval of the deal )))
And the situation is quite stupid for a "normal" man (not for a lawyer though): Aeroflot cannot state that it is really going to buy 787s and sign the contract when everyone knows it will be done, and Boeing cannot add Aeroflot on their order list 'cos of SEC and so on...
 
User avatar
par13del
Posts: 6720
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2005 9:14 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Mon Jun 25, 2007 4:32 am

I must admit to being confused here, was totally unaware that the GE engines used on the B773ER were also requested by Airbus to power the A330. Now I am aware that GE has so far refused to make an engine for the A350XWB, how that affected the A330 was unknown to me, always thought they were making engines for the B787 and B748i.
Learn something new on this site every day.
 
EI321
Posts: 4788
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2009 4:43 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Mon Jun 25, 2007 5:06 am

Quoting IL62M (Reply 17):
Quoting 9V-SVC (Reply 6):
Just a question, did SU comfirm their order for 787s ?



Quoting Manni (Reply 14):
No, they didn't. Boeing updated their ordersheet during the Airshow but did not add Aeroflot.

There is a simple explanation of this... The board of Directors meeting with the question of approving the deal with Boeing on 22x 787s is still to come in July

Why is it taking so long?
 
User avatar
jetmech
Posts: 2316
Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2006 2:14 am

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Mon Jun 25, 2007 11:03 am

Quoting Par13del (Reply 18):
I must admit to being confused here, was totally unaware that the GE engines used on the B773ER were also requested by Airbus to power the A330.

The GE engines used on the B773ER and the A330 are different. The B773ER uses the GE90-115B, whilst the A330 uses the GE CF6-80E series of engine. I believe that the engine GE will be making for the B787 and B748, and could be making for the A350 will be versions of the GEnx series of engine.

Regards, JetMech
JetMech split the back of his pants. He can feel the wind in his hair :shock: .
 
iL62M
Posts: 54
Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 7:51 am

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Mon Jun 25, 2007 3:45 pm

Quoting EI321 (Reply 19):
Why is it taking so long?

Because of Russian legislation rules ))))
 
dallasnewark
Posts: 391
Joined: Tue Nov 08, 2005 4:33 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Mon Jun 25, 2007 5:20 pm

A Question to the Russian members of the forum:

What do you think of SU of fyling either to IAH or DFW? Will it work?
Both Houston and Dallas have fairly sizeable russian population. Will Texas to Moscow succeed?

I'm only asking this because ATL-SVO is pretty successful, and a lot of their traffic connects to other US cities through ATL.

Texas is thriving economically, and I think that would make sense instead of returning to Seatte for example
B732/3/4/5/6/7/8/9, B742/4, B752/3,B762/3/4, B772/3, A306, A318/9/20/21, A332/3, A343/6, MD80/83/88, L1011, TU104/134, F
 
iL62M
Posts: 54
Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 7:51 am

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Mon Jun 25, 2007 8:28 pm

Dallasnewark,
As far as i know SU has flights to LAX, JFK, ATL and IAD (take a look at their web site). Not sure if SU takes it all by himself. Probably some of those are codeshared with Delta, probably not ( well i'm not working in Aeroflot - just a beginner-spotter  Smile ). Probably it's best for SU (for now) to have Sky Team to help to deliver people to those airports from where SU can deliver them to Moscow.
I think one of the reasons for SU to buy 44 long-hauls - is to expand it's position in the USA and American region (South and North i mean).
Maybe there is someone who has more information on that.
Hope i helped you somehow.
 
ba319-131
Posts: 8159
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2001 1:27 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Tue Jun 26, 2007 3:33 am

I can't wait to see the 332 in SU colours, she is a sharp looking plane, those SU colours will be just stunning on her!
111,732,3,4,5,7,8,BBJ,741,742,743,744,752,762,763,764,772,77L,773,77W,L15,D10,30,40,AB3,AB6,A312.313,319,320,321,332,333
 
User avatar
Aeroflot777
Posts: 3011
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 2:19 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Tue Jun 26, 2007 4:08 am

Quoting IL62M (Reply 23):
As far as i know SU has flights to LAX, JFK, ATL and IAD (take a look at their web site).

SU currently flies to LAX, JFK and IAD in the US. They used to have a very reasonable operation in the Americas but pulled out of many cities during their re-branding stage. For fleet simplicity purposes they had to cut down their world-wide network while they gave back their 777s and received new Airbus aircraft. The 11 763ERs in SU's fleet are doing most of the international work, with the IL-96 serving a few destinations in Asia. With the arrival of the New long-haul fleet, expect a MAJOR expansion and return to many previously-served cities. I'm looking forward to the cities served in South America.
I'm really not sure about Texas though, even though there is a substantial population, that is not always what supports a flight. Hopefully though, time will tell! The more destinations the better.

Aeroflot777
 
hjulicher
Posts: 665
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 2:26 pm

RE: SU Confirms A350; Chooses RR For A330

Tue Jun 26, 2007 3:15 pm

I see SU beginning its expansion to Skyteam hubs where it can pick up passengers from other cities connecting at one facility. If SU were to start services to Texas, it would most likely be IAH since that's a skyteam hub, and typically IAH is a better performing international airport than DFW. However, I don't see it happening, and if it were to happen, would take much longer. The problem is, is that the potential "oil" traffic has their own planes on which to fly, and thus doesn't need the commercial services available.

SU is taking one some heat currently as well, as competitor Transaero offers services to YYZ, and YUL, an airport SU doesn't serve. It will be interesting to see who SU ends up codesharing in the US and Canada? They have three options, and DL seems to be the most likely, as they already have discussed codesharing on the ATL and JFK flights, and DL is the only one that flies currently to Moscow. If CO or NW were to add services to SVO, things might change, and SU would have a choice of with whom to code-share.

SU lacks a central US destination, and ORD or DTW seem like the best possibilities.

With 10 new aircraft, I see SU opening about 5/6 new destinations. We shall see what happens. Secondly, I think all US and Canada flights will be upgraded to the A330, while the 767's will be sent to less prized routes like VVO, KHV, and the like.
LH 442

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos