YZFOO7F
Topic Author
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Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Fri Jun 29, 2007 11:12 am

Hey all,

This happened a while back but a co-worker was finally able to get me a copy of her pictures.

On June 5th, a Canadian North Dash-8 (operated by Regional 1) landed at YZF with its nose gear frozen in place. The gear doors opened but the nose gear did not come down. Here are some pictures of the incident:

http://www.airliners.net/uf/view.fil...1788&filename=1183081874emUIGg.jpg

http://www.airliners.net/uf/view.fil...1788&filename=11830818556GLDfR.jpg

http://www.airliners.net/uf/view.fil...1788&filename=1183081904GFfgWo.jpg


My question for the third photo is why would one of the pilots bother coming out the hatch and the other going out the front door? It seems to me that going through the hatch was a little unnecessary.
Promise me you'll always leave the ground
 
WestJetYQQ
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Fri Jun 29, 2007 11:33 am

Quoting YZFOO7F (Thread starter):
It seems to me that going through the hatch was a little unnecessary.

Yeah, Try the Door.

I never even heard about this. Thanks for Posting.
Will You Try to Change Things? Use the Power that you have, the Power of a Million new Ideas.
 
aogdesk
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Fri Jun 29, 2007 11:42 am

Made for a much more dramatic photo op.
 
sprout5199
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Fri Jun 29, 2007 11:42 am

I would have to guess that the Capt told the First Officer to see to the passengers while he shut down the engines. Being that they did not know if there was a fire the Capt went out the nearest exit. Good CRM on their part.


Dan in Jupiter
 
T prop
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Fri Jun 29, 2007 12:09 pm

That would be hard on your hands. The 'rope' is just a nylon strap about 1-1/4" wide. Yes in this case the door would be better. Note that there is one pilot at the top of the airstair, don't know why the other one wants to use the rope.  laughing 
 
silentbob
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Fri Jun 29, 2007 12:12 pm

Quoting YZFOO7F (Thread starter):
My question for the third photo is why would one of the pilots bother coming out the hatch and the other going out the front door? It seems to me that going through the hatch was a little unnecessary.

How often do you have an excuse to pop the hatch? Might as well make the best of a bad situation.
 
AJ
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Fri Jun 29, 2007 1:24 pm

Quoting YZFOO7F (Thread starter):
My question for the third photo is why would one of the pilots bother coming out the hatch and the other going out the front door? It seems to me that going through the hatch was a little unnecessary.

Operators have pretty stringent emergency procedures to be followed that would normally dictate exactly which exit should be used by which crewmember in an evacuation.
 
Boston92
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Fri Jun 29, 2007 1:25 pm

Quoting YZFOO7F (Thread starter):
My question for the third photo is why would one of the pilots bother coming out the hatch

Weeeeeeeeeeee
"Why does a slight tax increase cost you $200 and a substantial tax cut save you 30 cents?"
 
F9Animal
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Fri Jun 29, 2007 1:31 pm

I would have just climbed back into the hole and exited through the door. You can tell the pilot does not look too excited about his exit.
I Am A Different Animal!!
 
travatl
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Fri Jun 29, 2007 1:40 pm

Quoting YZFOO7F (Thread starter):
why would one of the pilots bother coming out the hatch and the other going out the front door?

I'm gonna have to go with Drama Queen. This ain't an L1011 - in the time it took to pop the hatch and climb out, he could have GLANCED aft and seen there was no smoke/fire in the five feet to the exit. It's actually pretty funny - one pilot nonchalantly coming down steps, holding rails, one pilot on roof of aircraft at the nose. (Where he'd be the most likely to slide into flames). Every basic evacuation training I've ever been through teaches the safesty evac route is one in which you can see a path or destination.... somehow a roof hatch doesn't seem to qualify in this instance.
 
travatl
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Fri Jun 29, 2007 2:01 pm

Quoting AJ (Reply 6):
Operators have pretty stringent emergency procedures to be followed that would normally dictate exactly which exit should be used by which crewmember in an evacuation.

Yeah, and every operator I have been with stated CLEARLY - "Choose your SAFEST and NEAREST exit." The hatch isn't applicable in either instance here.
 
T prop
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Fri Jun 29, 2007 2:06 pm

Quoting AJ (Reply 6):
Operators have pretty stringent emergency procedures to be followed that would normally dictate exactly which exit should be used by which crewmember in an evacuation.

If climbing out of that hatch and using the crappy rope is dictated I'd be complaining. Jeez, climbing down using that rope is probably more dangerous for that guy than the actual gear up landing. I also vote for drama queen, one pilot diving down the rope and the other standing near the galley with what, a cup of coffee in his hand?  Silly
 
CanadianNorth
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Fri Jun 29, 2007 3:05 pm

Can't argue with taking the scenic route eh? Not everyday you get to go out that route and get away with it, so why not give er a try...


CanadianNorth
What could possibly go wrong?
 
drgmobile
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sat Jun 30, 2007 3:38 am

My question for the third photo is why would one of the pilots bother coming out the hatch and the other going out the front door? It seems to me that going through the hatch was a little unnecessary.

I am going to have to second the motion on "Drama Queen"

I didn't even realize Regional 1 was operating on behalf of Canadian North in Canadian North colours. What else am I missing out on?
 
Kuna
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sat Jun 30, 2007 9:23 am

1st picture appears to be a nice landing minus missing the front nose gear.

2nd picture looks as if the FO is at an amusement park/water park and getting ready to go down a slide.

3rd picture looks as if the Captain is asking the ARFF if he has seen their nose gear.

Note: In pictures 2 and 3 the emergency exit window has been removed. In the first picture its a white spot where the window is in place, and in pictures 2 and 3 it is black, and appears to be laying on the ground by the plane.

In all seriousness glad to hear everyone was ok and that they made a successful landing.
Pinnacle Airlines
 
greg3322
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sat Jun 30, 2007 9:42 am

Something that does look kind of scary - the passengers running towards the rear of the plane right past the props. It appears the props have stopped turning, but have they? Does a Dash-8 have prop brakes to stop them quickly?

Greg
 
Kuna
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sat Jun 30, 2007 10:25 am

Quoting Greg3322 (Reply 15):

I would assume that they do since, the emergency exit is located right there near the prop.
Pinnacle Airlines
 
Boston92
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sat Jun 30, 2007 11:26 am

Quoting Greg3322 (Reply 15):
Something that does look kind of scary - the passengers running towards the rear of the plane right past the props. It appears the props have stopped turning, but have they? Does a Dash-8 have prop brakes to stop them quickly?

Engines are on and running in first pic, but the props have stopped in both the 3nd and 3rd pic.
"Why does a slight tax increase cost you $200 and a substantial tax cut save you 30 cents?"
 
DL777Dude
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sat Jun 30, 2007 11:36 am

Oh My!  rotfl 

This one made my day. It looks as if he is trying out for SWAT or maybe he is a fan of 24 and wants to be like Jack.  Wink

Thanks for posting.
 
rikkus67
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sat Jun 30, 2007 2:28 pm

So...what is the current status of this Dash 8? How long to repair (assuming no major structural damage) ? Is this formerly C-GZTC? ..(I actually have C-GZTC as a background pic in Regional 1 colours... leaving YQL)

...what aircraft is Canadian North substituting?
AC.WA.CP.DL.RW.CO.WG.WJ.WN.KI.FL.SK.ACL.UA.US.F9
 
levent
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sat Jun 30, 2007 5:28 pm

Ha ha... it made me smile to see that pilot climbing out of the hatch and gliding down via the rope... he's all action, while the other guy just walks out of the door as if nothing happened...

Well, at least that poor polar bear got to walk level...

In the airline I worked for, some pilots made their last flight on the Q315 before being re-trained to another type. They climbed out of the hatch on top of the aircraft, and I took some pictures of them sitting on the wing etc. All with permission of the maintenance guys of course.
 
mu2
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sat Jun 30, 2007 11:41 pm

My guess is that the airplane is cocked so the flightdeck door won't open. The F/O went out the hatch first, and into the cabin to make sure everyone was out. The 3rd pic was takin when the F/O was exiting after checking.
 
Olympus69
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sun Jul 01, 2007 1:56 am

Quoting Mu2 (Reply 21):
My guess is that the airplane is cocked so the flightdeck door won't open. The F/O went out the hatch first, and into the cabin to make sure everyone was out. The 3rd pic was taken when the F/O was exiting after checking.

That sequence makes no sense at all.

My guess is he's up on top directing traffic.
 
mu2
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sun Jul 01, 2007 2:15 am

Quoting Olympus69 (Reply 22):
That sequence makes no sense at all.

My guess is he's up on top directing traffic.

Odviously you know nothing about a Dash. I have trouble sometimes in normal ops trying to open and close the door. It's not the door itself, but the deadbolt that locks the door shut. Tell me why this doesn't make sense.

Directing traffic? I think that's the job of ATC.
 
GPIARFF
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sun Jul 01, 2007 2:43 am

I think we are assuming that one of the pilots came out through the cockpit door. It's possible that both pilots came out the hatch and as the ARFF guys set up fire protection and evacuation the first pilot out opened the L1 door to assist with evac and or check to see if it has been completed. I would have preferred that to have happened because if the were to be a fire it would be right outside the L1 door. Proper evac would be under the wing and a pilot coming out the cockpit door and down the steps would lead the passengers out that way instead of into the arms of the firefighters.

GPIARFF
Pa chiye ladan dlo ou bwe ( don't crap in your drinking water )
 
Boston92
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sun Jul 01, 2007 2:55 am

Quoting Mu2 (Reply 23):
Odviously you know nothing about a Dash. I have trouble sometimes in normal ops trying to open and close the door. It's not the door itself, but the deadbolt that locks the door shut. Tell me why this doesn't make sense.

Directing traffic? I think that's the job of ATC.

uhhh,  checkmark 
"Why does a slight tax increase cost you $200 and a substantial tax cut save you 30 cents?"
 
syncmaster
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sun Jul 01, 2007 3:34 am

Removing the emergency doors are not as much of a deal as is being made in this thread, they simply open like any other door on the aircraft, and in most cases and be put back just as easily.
 
T prop
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sun Jul 01, 2007 8:04 am

Quoting Mu2 (Reply 21):
My guess is that the airplane is cocked so the flightdeck door won't open.

Give the old bird some credit! You're talking about an airplane with Canadian bush plane roots here, they're tough. Dropping a Dash 8 on it's nose is not going to tweak the flight deck door frame.
 
CP744
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sun Jul 01, 2007 11:02 am

Quoting Rikkus67 (Reply 19):
So...what is the current status of this Dash 8? How long to repair (assuming no major structural damage) ? Is this formerly C-GZTC? ..(I actually have C-GZTC as a background pic in Regional 1 colours... leaving YQL)

...what aircraft is Canadian North substituting?

It was C-GRGO..... It's being repaired in YYC, I believe it will be back in service within two weeks. There was minimal damage, from the reports I got. Kudos to the flight crew..although they ended up about six feet off the centre line  Wink

C-GRGI and C-GZKH are running the rotation up north out of YEG. C-GZTC is doing the evening YYC-YEG-YYC run.

Cheers,
 
positiverate
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sun Jul 01, 2007 11:55 am

Might just be me, but it looks like in photo 3 there's a third person in the cockpit. Maybe someone was on the jumpseat?
 
Boston92
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sun Jul 01, 2007 12:05 pm

Check this out, incudes some quotes from some of the pax plus other info:

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/north/story/2007/06/06/plane-landing.html
"Why does a slight tax increase cost you $200 and a substantial tax cut save you 30 cents?"
 
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chrisnh
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sun Jul 01, 2007 12:20 pm

Quoting YZFOO7F (Thread starter):
My question for the third photo is why would one of the pilots bother coming out the hatch and the other going out the front door? It seems to me that going through the hatch was a little unnecessary.

I think he was planning on using the door until he thought, 'Ooooo! Someone is taking pictures!'
 
mu2
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sun Jul 01, 2007 1:16 pm

Quoting T prop (Reply 27):
Give the old bird some credit! You're talking about an airplane with Canadian bush plane roots here, they're tough. Dropping a Dash 8 on it's nose is not going to tweak the flight deck door frame.

Did you read the rest of my post? You guys talk like you know. I fly this thing every day, and I'm telling you, sometimes we have trouble locking and unlocking the deadbolt. I have had to get out of my seat and force the lock open on many occasions. Sometimes to lock it you have to wait for the push back to get it to lock.

I give the Dash a lot of credit. Tha deadbolt isn't a part installed at the factory. It's after market for these old Dashes.

Quoting Positiverate (Reply 29):
Might just be me, but it looks like in photo 3 there's a third person in the cockpit. Maybe someone was on the jumpseat?

I think what you are looking at are the O2 masks.

I laugh when I read some of the posts on here. Keep them coming with your outrageous assumptions about how a crew would use the ditching hatch to exit an airplane when they can just walk out the door. I also find it funny that we are able to direct traffic from the top of the plane now. Hahaha keep them coming!
 
Boston92
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sun Jul 01, 2007 2:01 pm

Quoting Mu2 (Reply 32):
I think what you are looking at are the O2 masks.

Wait... I doubt that that bird has O2 masks on board seeing as the older ones don't...I guess since you fly them I want you to answer a question... On the planes that do NOT have O2 masks in the cabin (such as the old AC D-8's), do they have them in the cockpit for pilot use?
"Why does a slight tax increase cost you $200 and a substantial tax cut save you 30 cents?"
 
T prop
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sun Jul 01, 2007 6:09 pm

Quoting Mu2 (Reply 32):

Did you read the rest of my post? You guys talk like you know. I fly this thing every day, and I'm telling you, sometimes we have trouble locking and unlocking the deadbolt. I have had to get out of my seat and force the lock open on many occasions. Sometimes to lock it you have to wait for the push back to get it to lock.

I give the Dash a lot of credit. Tha deadbolt isn't a part installed at the factory. It's after market for these old Dashes.

Yes, I know a little about the D8, I'm familiar with the ballistic door by TTF aerospace. If you have that much trouble operating the deadbolt, you should be able to operate it with 2 fingers from your seat, it's not shimmed properly and one day the deadbolt handle (3/16" cres steel) could snap off. If you're lucky you release the hinges and get the door off, if not maybe you get your picture taken while using the rope!  laughing 
 
mu2
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Sun Jul 01, 2007 10:50 pm

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 33):
Wait... I doubt that that bird has O2 masks on board seeing as the older ones don't...I guess since you fly them I want you to answer a question... On the planes that do NOT have O2 masks in the cabin (such as the old AC D-8's), do they have them in the cockpit for pilot use?

Yes the Dash does have O2 masks in the cockpit. One for each pilot (they hang on a quick release), and one for the jumpseat. We carry one bottle of portitable O2 in the cabin. It has to be enough for 10% of the people on board. No big deal, we can make it below 10 from fl250 in about 3 minutes.

Quoting T prop (Reply 34):
Yes, I know a little about the D8, I'm familiar with the ballistic door by TTF aerospace. If you have that much trouble operating the deadbolt, you should be able to operate it with 2 fingers from your seat, it's not shimmed properly and one day the deadbolt handle (3/16" cres steel) could snap off. If you're lucky you release the hinges and get the door off, if not maybe you get your picture taken while using the rope!

Haha. Yes I have had to take it off it's hinges before. I had the verticle piece unscrew, fall, and lost.
 
Olympus69
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Mon Jul 02, 2007 12:11 am

Quoting Mu2 (Reply 23):
Tell me why this doesn't make sense.

Gladly. You say the F/O goes up through the hatch and into the cabin. How does he get into the cabin from up there?. After checking that the passengers are out, he then apparently somehow gets back up on top of the fuselage for some reason and is seen coming down in photo 3. Meanwhile, the captain has figured out how to open the door from the flight deck and exirs the normal way.

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 25):
Directing traffic? I think that's the job of ATC.

I meant mostly passenger traffic - making sure they're not running all over the place. He seemed to doing some arm waving.
 
mu2
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Mon Jul 02, 2007 2:01 am

Quoting Olympus69 (Reply 36):
Gladly. You say the F/O goes up through the hatch and into the cabin. How does he get into the cabin from up there?. After checking that the passengers are out, he then apparently somehow gets back up on top of the fuselage for some reason and is seen coming down in photo 3. Meanwhile, the captain has figured out how to open the door from the flight deck and exirs the normal way.

WOW, you messed that all up! The Cap or F/O goes out the ditching hatch. He is now outside. You still follow me? Ok good. He re-enters the cabin from the outside to make sure everyone is out. He then turns around and walks back down the steps. Man, that was hard to understand. Glad that's over now. The other guy (Cap or F/O) stays in the cockpit securing and shuting everything down. When he is done he also exits through the ditching hatch.
 
Olympus69
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Mon Jul 02, 2007 5:17 am

Quoting Olympus69 (Reply 22):
The 3rd pic was taken when the F/O was exiting after checking

Ok. I was assuming the second photo shows the F/O on the top, whereas, using your scenario it was the Captain.

Quoting Mu2 (Reply 37):
When he is done he also exits through the ditching hatch.

Yeah, it makes sense if both pilots exited through the hatch. It shows how screwed up you can get if you are trying to fit together a scenario based on 2 different assumptions  Smile
 
YZFOO7F
Topic Author
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Mon Jul 02, 2007 7:07 am

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 30):
Check this out, incudes some quotes from some of the pax plus other info:

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/north/story....html

Yeah the guys that were called in from airport mtce said the paramedics had to take a woman to the hospital because she was having panic attacks after landing. In my opinion, the landing was nicely done with minimal damage.

After everyone was out, the emergency crews used a huge airbag to prop the nose up while they chipped away the ice built up around the gear. After that it came down and locked like normal and they towed it away.
Promise me you'll always leave the ground
 
CP744
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Tue Jul 03, 2007 2:38 am

Quoting YZFOO7F (Thread starter):
My question for the third photo is why would one of the pilots bother coming out the hatch and the other going out the front door? It seems to me that going through the hatch was a little unnecessary.

The answer is...... it's SOP..... FO goes out the top, Capt. goes out throught the L1, so he can check the cabin for paxs.

Cheers
 
rikkus67
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Tue Jul 03, 2007 3:19 am

Quoting CP744 (Reply 28):
C-GZTC is doing the evening YYC-YEG-YYC run.

Thanks so much for the info CP744! Glad to see Regional 1 still existing in some form or another... or are they still flying for C. North?
AC.WA.CP.DL.RW.CO.WG.WJ.WN.KI.FL.SK.ACL.UA.US.F9
 
CP744
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RE: Dash 8 Lands With Nose Gear Up (Photos)

Thu Jul 05, 2007 11:15 pm

Quoting Rikkus67 (Reply 41):
or are they still flying for C. North?

5T wet leases 4 DH8's from them. C-GZKH, C-GZTC, C-GRGI and C-GRGO. TSH has a couple other DH8's, I believe. I think one is doing some work for NATO in Africa????.... Not sure about the location. They also do occasional work for CNRL. Most of the crews are flying the wet leases, as the pairings involve overnighting in YZF for a one night.

I beleive 5T intends to obtain two of the DH8's (RGO, RGI) sometime in the fall, and start crewing with 5T crews in 2008.

Rumour has it 5T's intention is to operate 2 DH8-200's and 2 of the uprated -100's. (RGO, RGI)