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knope2001
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YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Tue Jul 31, 2007 10:05 pm

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/070731/aqtu134.html?.v=7



Midwest Air Group Board Forms Committee to Explore Strategic and Financial Alternatives
Tuesday July 31, 8:30 am ET


MILWAUKEE, July 31 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- The Board of Directors of Midwest Air Group, Inc. (Amex: MEH - News), parent company of Midwest Airlines, announced today that it has formed a committee to explore strategic and financial alternatives that would serve to enhance value for the company's shareholders.

The committee's mandate is to review and evaluate strategic and financial alternatives and, as appropriate, make a recommendation to the full board of directors with regard to those alternatives. While the board of directors has not changed its recommendation regarding the unsolicited exchange offer by AirTran Holdings, Inc., the committee intends to commence discussions with AirTran regarding its proposal to acquire all outstanding shares of Midwest. Additionally, the committee intends to hold discussions with other strategic and financial parties that have recently expressed interest in pursuing a transaction with Midwest. The committee intends to execute confidentiality agreements with each of the interested parties that will enable them to conduct due diligence investigations. There is no assurance that this process will result in a transaction with AirTran or any other party.

The committee has five members. Serving as chairman is Samuel K. Skinner, Chicago, former Secretary of the U.S. Department of Transportation. Other members include: Jeffrey H. Erickson, Scottsdale, Ariz., a newly elected board member and former president and chief executive officer of Trans World Airlines and Atlas Air Worldwide Holdings; Ulice Payne, greater Milwaukee area, member of the board's Audit and Compensation Committees; Elizabeth T. Solberg, Kansas City, chair of the board's Compensation Committee; and Richard H. Sonnentag, greater Milwaukee area, long-time board member and chair of the board's Audit Committee.

According to Skinner, the board's decision to form the committee was made after extensive deliberations. "On April 12, the board recommended that shareholders reject the most recent AirTran offer. At that time, the board concluded that Midwest's strategic plan provides more attractive long-term value-creation opportunities for shareholders," he explained. "By providing AirTran and other interested parties with access to our confidential information and holding discussions with them, the board is pursuing a process to evaluate whether greater value can be delivered to shareholders through a near-term transaction."

Due to the nature of the committee's process, Midwest Airlines cannot commit to when it will comment further.
 
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knope2001
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Tue Jul 31, 2007 10:10 pm

I find this part particularly interesting....

Quoting Knope2001 (Thread starter):
Additionally, the committee intends to hold discussions with other strategic and financial parties that have recently expressed interest in pursuing a transaction with Midwest. The

does this suggest...

(a) that they are essentially planning on going with AirTran, but they don't want to portray it as a foregone conclusion without proper additional due dilligence

(b) that they have another buyout (including possibly one that would take them private) in the works, but they can't simply take it without fully evaluating...or giving the appearance of evaluating...all offers on the table

(c) something else?
 
Mikey711MN
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Tue Jul 31, 2007 10:37 pm

Quoting Knope2001 (Reply 1):
does this suggest...

(a) that they are essentially planning on going with AirTran, but they don't want to portray it as a foregone conclusion without proper additional due dilligence

(b) that they have another buyout (including possibly one that would take them private) in the works, but they can't simply take it without fully evaluating...or giving the appearance of evaluating...all offers on the table

(c) something else?

If I had a guess, I'd say "a".

"b" makes sense, but I'm unconvinced, given the lack of detail that MEH has offered to show value of their go-it-alone plan, that a private investment house would be interested. I refer to the pounding that management took during the last conference call and the sheer failure to deliberately address the question "what in the current plan contributes to the value of MEH shares?"

-Mike
I plan on living forever. So far, so good...
 
flyingchoirboy
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:02 pm

Thank goodness! The best way for the merger to go forward is if both parties are satisfied. I hope this leads to a reduction in tension between the two carriers.

Scott
 
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knope2001
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:29 pm

Quoting Mikey711MN (Reply 2):
does this suggest...

(a) that they are essentially planning on going with AirTran, but they don't want to portray it as a foregone conclusion without proper additional due dilligence

(b) that they have another buyout (including possibly one that would take them private) in the works, but they can't simply take it without fully evaluating...or giving the appearance of evaluating...all offers on the table

(c) something else?

If I had a guess, I'd say "a".

"b" makes sense, but I'm unconvinced, given the lack of detail that MEH has offered to show value of their go-it-alone plan, that a private investment house would be interested.

However a bid or bidder that Midwest has cooperated with may have more information than they have given AirTran. That's especially true if there's a consortium of investors brought together for the deal.

Quoting Mikey711MN (Reply 2):
I refer to the pounding that management took during the last conference call and the sheer failure to deliberately address the question "what in the current plan contributes to the value of MEH shares?

I think people make way too much of the drama at the conference call. The hedge fund reps, whose copmany clearly bought in to MEH after the AirTran puruit became public, have every interest for Midwest to sell ASAP. Their rants were fully predictable. Tim and the MEH reps have continued to stonewall again and again, and their refusal to enter into that debate on a conference call with continued stonewalling was just as predictable. Neither really tells us anything new.

[Edited 2007-07-31 16:31:46]
 
CitrusCritter
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:35 pm

Quoting Mikey711MN (Reply 2):
b" makes sense, but I'm unconvinced, given the lack of detail that MEH has offered to show value of their go-it-alone plan, that a private investment house would be interested.

I read elsewhere on the board that Herb Kohl had said that he would buy YX before he let FL buy them. Do you know if this is actually true? I imagine he can put together a group of investors to make this happen, though you are correct that few people will invest large sums of money into a business without a legitimate plan to move forward.
 
Mainland
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:36 pm

There goes any doubt on if the tender would be extended....
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quickmover
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:37 pm

Quoting Knope2001 (Reply 4):
However a bid or bidder that Midwest has cooperated with may have more information than they have given AirTran. That's especially true if there's a consortium of investors brought together for the deal.

Is that legal?

I can't see how they can withhold information from a bidder they don't "like" once they have agreed to look at strategic opportunities. Especially with 3 Airtran boardmembers.
 
DAYflyer
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:38 pm

Quoting Mainland (Reply 6):
There goes any doubt on if the tender would be extended....

.....or accepted. This merger will go through this year.
One Nation Under God
 
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knope2001
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:39 pm

Quoting Knope2001 (Reply 4):
However a bid or bidder that Midwest has cooperated with may have more information than they have given AirTran. That's especially true if there's a consortium of investors brought together for the deal.

I should have added that any potential suitor which Midwest is courting (if one exists...and that's only suggested in today's release) would also have access to information Midwest could produce to reture or cast serious doubt on AirTran's plans, and thus the comparative long-term value of the company if sold to AAI.

I can't help but think about the clause in the Midwest - Skywest agreement in which Skywest agreed to inject $25k in captial to Midwest should Midwest choose to exercise it. Certainly $25m alone isn't going to take the company private, but there's a reason it was added to the contract. Now does that mean Skywest is definitely part of a consortium which will buy out Midwest instead of AirTran? Of course not. But it suggests that such options have been seriously considered as a backup plan should AirTran continue their hunt, which they have. And so the notion of another bidder is not so far-fetched.
 
Mikey711MN
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:39 pm

Quoting CitrusCritter (Reply 5):
I read elsewhere on the board that Herb Kohl had said that he would buy YX before he let FL buy them. Do you know if this is actually true?

I think only Herb Kohl knows that. Frankly, I'm not sure if he's ever gone on record saying that as opposed to his letter formally opposing the acquisition attempt by FL.

Quoting CitrusCritter (Reply 5):
[F]ew people will invest large sums of money into a business without a legitimate plan to move forward.

...and I would think that Herb Kohl, a shrewd businessman in his own right, would fail to come to the conclusion that YX is well- and uniquely-positioned to make large sums of money moving forward for him to buy in either in whole or in part.

-Mike
I plan on living forever. So far, so good...
 
EXAAUADL
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:50 pm

Quoting CitrusCritter (Reply 5):
I read elsewhere on the board that Herb Kohl had said that he would buy YX before he let FL buy them

I know he owns the Bucks, but how much can a member of congress own?? When it comes to an airline there would be potential huge conflicts of interest if he owned YX. Of course he might also really let the FAA have it for such a lousy ATC system.
 
quickmover
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 12:05 am

Quoting Mikey711MN (Reply 10):
...and I would think that Herb Kohl, a shrewd businessman in his own right, would fail to come to the conclusion that YX is well- and uniquely-positioned to make large sums of money moving forward for him to buy in either in whole or in part.

He would have to bid more than FL to even have a chance. If an elected politician, got a sweetheart deal just to keep the headquarters local, the shareholder lawsuits would come fast and furious. Regardless of what many think, the shareholders own this company. Their time horizon or investment objectives are irrelevent. They wrote the check for the shares (directly or indirectly) and deserve to have their say and be compensated for their investment.
 
Ilovenz
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 12:24 am

Well, thankfully, at least two of the comittee members are from Milwaukee, and an additional one is from Kansas City, so they can advocate for the employees who are gonna be threatened by this potential merger. By Aug. 10 the pilots and FAs and everyone else at YX will know if they need to start looking for new jobs, or at least make sure they have supplemental income given the shaft FL is gonna give the employees they keep around.
 
Mikey711MN
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 12:47 am

Quoting Ilovenz (Reply 13):
By Aug. 10 the pilots and FAs and everyone else at YX will know if they need to start looking for new jobs

So who's going to fly the planes and attend the flights?

-Mike
I plan on living forever. So far, so good...
 
SkyexRamper
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:01 am

Quoting Ilovenz (Reply 13):
By Aug. 10 the pilots and FAs and everyone else at YX will know if they need to start looking for new jobs, or at least make sure they have supplemental income given the shaft FL is gonna give the employees they keep around.

Well just after all the pilots at Skyway get a raise, as their contracts are being redone at that time. Also it would take probably 2years for the sale to be completed before all the cutting and killing would take place.
Good Luck to all Skyway Pilots! It's been great working with you!
 
travatl
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:02 am

Actually the pilots and flight attendants will fair very well in the merger. Over half of their flight attendants will be senior to me in a post-merger, and I'm in the top 5% at AirTran now.
 
n917me
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:02 am

Quoting Ilovenz (Reply 13):
By Aug. 10 the pilots and FAs and everyone else at YX will know if they need to start looking for new jobs, or at least make sure they have supplemental income given the shaft FL is gonna give the employees they keep around.

Most likley Pilots and FA's will be secure, although I have no idea how low they will fall in seniority, some CA may end up as FO's.

CSR's/Rampers, in cities where FL is understaffed, they will be offered positions, although I think it is safe to say at a significantly lower wage. In cities where FL is staffed OK, sorry, but the YX staff will not be offered positions. I don;t care what Joe has said and promised, I have been through mergers before, and have seen many co workers loose their positions. After all, a merger is meant to grow a company while cutting costs. FYI, a counter/gate CSR starting in the East for YX is approx 10.50/hr plus shift diff.
 
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mke717spotter
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:22 am

Hmmm it seems like something else is up other than FL...Does anyone have any idea who these "other strategic and financial parties that have recently expressed interest in pursuing a transaction with Midwest" may be and how many? This makes me believe that they are going to be bought out by someone other than FL/go private. Hey, who knows, maybe Herb Kohl is actually one of the guys who YX will be talking to, ha. It just seems to me if YX wanted to go along with FL they would just jump into to head to head discussions. That's just what I think anyways...
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n917me
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:38 am

There is a "talk with Tim" at 1p today. I am sure not much will be revealed. Just the usual, we can not comment on who, when , etc..

Time will tell.
 
travatl
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:39 am

Quoting N917me (Reply 17):
FYI, a counter/gate CSR starting in the East for YX is approx 10.50/hr plus shift diff

FL CSRs start at $10 plus shift diff in the east.
 
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TVNWZ
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:46 am

Game, set, match...AAI.
 
azjubilee
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:46 am

I heard NWA could be one of those in the "other" category. NWA acquires Midwest and operates it as a subsidiary like they do with Mesaba, Compass and Champion in the past. The keeps Midwest, Midwest and prevents AirTran from competing effectively in the upper midwest. Everyone wins, except of course the Tranny. This solidifies the heartland as red tail country! This also prevents the Tran from getting too strong and improving their fight against big D down in the A-T-L.



AZJ
 
travatl
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:48 am

Quoting Azjubilee (Reply 22):
NWA acquires Midwest and operates it as a subsidiary like they do with Mesaba, Compass and Champion in the past.

How would the pilot's scope clause work with that? Isn't that how the original AirTran came into being in the first place?
 
n917me
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:50 am

Quoting Travatl (Reply 20):
FL CSRs start at $10 plus shift diff in the east.

Still a pay cut.
 
quickmover
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:54 am

Quoting Azjubilee (Reply 22):
I heard NWA could be one of those in the "other" category. NWA acquires Midwest and operates it as a subsidiary like they do with Mesaba, Compass and Champion in the past

I'm sure they won't make any cuts.
 
azjubilee
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 2:24 am

They could potentially operate it as a subsidiary, or roll it into NWA getting rid of the fleet. Scope wouldn't matter if it operates a/c with less than 76 seats. Or, it could be rolled into Compass, keeping everyone employed and using a combonation of 175s and mainline to keep MKE flying. Just speculation... but if NWA were indeed to get its hands on Midwest, IMO the only thing cut would be the fleet, unprofitable routes and the partners like Skywest. Perhaps Skyway could become the 1900 operator for NWA serving EAS markets and markets that the saab can't support. Doesn't it seem curious NWA started a code share in the midst of this hostile takeover? Perhaps it was the first step at striking back against AirTran. NWA needs a strong upper midwest competitor like AirTran like it needs another trip through Ch11.


AZJ

[Edited 2007-07-31 19:26:37]
 
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JBo
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 3:41 am

Quoting Azjubilee (Reply 26):
They could potentially operate it as a subsidiary, or roll it into NWA getting rid of the fleet. Scope wouldn't matter if it operates a/c with less than 76 seats. Or, it could be rolled into Compass, keeping everyone employed and using a combonation of 175s and mainline to keep MKE flying. Just speculation... but if NWA were indeed to get its hands on Midwest, IMO the only thing cut would be the fleet, unprofitable routes and the partners like Skywest. Perhaps Skyway could become the 1900 operator for NWA serving EAS markets and markets that the saab can't support. Doesn't it seem curious NWA started a code share in the midst of this hostile takeover? Perhaps it was the first step at striking back against AirTran. NWA needs a strong upper midwest competitor like AirTran like it needs another trip through Ch11.

That, or Midwest could be operated as a subsidiary entirely independent of NW's operation, where the two companies are tied only at the highest corporate level.

A bit of a utopian perspective, indeed, but nonetheless not impossible if that were to occur.
I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.
 
Mikey711MN
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 3:56 am

Here's an update from the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel NewsWatch article this afternoon.

-Mike
I plan on living forever. So far, so good...
 
quickmover
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 4:26 am

Quoting JBo (Reply 27):
That, or Midwest could be operated as a subsidiary entirely independent of NW's operation, where the two companies are tied only at the highest corporate level.

A bit of a utopian perspective, indeed, but nonetheless not impossible if that were to occur.

No offense, but your dreaming.

They might keep the flight crews in this scenario, but ground handling and customer service would be taken over by existing NW people. What I'm amazed by the most is the absolute hatred of Airtran. NW has been cancelling a ton of flights recently because of pilot issues. Are flight cancellations the best care in the air? Why would NW want anything more than a MKE focus city in the long run with hubs in MSP and DTW other than keeping a discounter out? At least Airtran can make the case that they truly need another full hub. NW doesn't need 3 primary hubs in the same area.

Given the choice of a NW focus city (temporarily) or a Airtran hub, you would take NW?

Nothing against the NW people. They have a fine airline, but I just don't understand the attitude of anyone but Airtran.

[Edited 2007-07-31 21:28:49]
 
azjubilee
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 4:35 am

NWA wouldn't operate MKE as a hub. It would obviously be a focus city, like it has been in the past. The only difference this time, would be they wouldn't have to contend with Midwest! With the proper fleet, better costs and less competition they could make MKE work. Remember there are far more NWA loyalists in MKE than there are for AirTran. Given the choice, I'd suspect they'd flock to the red tail... especially with what NWA can offer the customer. I really don't think it is so far fetched of an idea. NWA would certainly have a large portion of the market share, but by no means a monopoly. I would guess it would take on the form of IND.


AZJ
 
n917me
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 4:48 am

Or this whole meeting with FL could be YX's way of getting Octavian off their back. YX may have no intentions on merging, but by meeting it would appear that they are doing their fudiciary duty.

BTW.. interesting rumor this afternoon from on of our YX pilots who were hitching a ride from MSP to MKE.. The NW captain told him that YX bought the A320's that NW had for sale.... remember NW did have a buyer, but would not disclose any details.
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 4:57 am

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 8):
.....or accepted. This merger will go through this year.

Or not. Several other interested parties from my understanding.
 
sllevin
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 5:17 am

Quoting N917ME (Reply 31):
Or this whole meeting with FL could be YX's way of getting Octavian off their back. YX may have no intentions on merging, but by meeting it would appear that they are doing their fudiciary duty.

It's way more than Octavian. If the deal doesn't happen at this point, and if the stock price falls dramatically, the YX board needs to have VERY good due diligence done -- and lots of points to make -- to avoid potential civil and criminal repercussions.

Simply saying "we thought we could do better than FL" will not be enough if stockholders take a huge hit.

Steve
 
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JBo
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 5:18 am

Quoting Quickmover (Reply 29):

No offense, but your dreaming.

None taken, I even admitted so when I stated it was a utopian perspective.

Quoting N917ME (Reply 31):
BTW.. interesting rumor this afternoon from on of our YX pilots who were hitching a ride from MSP to MKE.. The NW captain told him that YX bought the A320's that NW had for sale.... remember NW did have a buyer, but would not disclose any details.

An interesting rumor, indeed. Granted, pilots will tell you just about anything ... but this one almost makes sense. Guess we'll see what comes of it.

[Edited 2007-07-31 22:21:59]
I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.
 
srbmod
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 5:29 am

I don't exactly think this means the game is over and AirTran has won. I think Midwest will look to being acquired by AirTran as the last option if they cannot get the $$$ to take the airline private (something that is a possibility) or cannot get another airline to make an offer that the stockholders will accept over the AirTran offer.


Some sort of deal has to be brokered in order to stave off potential shareholder lawsuits.

I would put the chances of FL winning and getting what they wanted at 65%. While everything looks to be going in their favor, there's still chances from someone to swoop in and get Midwest.

Does YX have their own gate/ramp staff at every YX outstation? I'm asking mainly to get an idea of some possible things that could happen at some of the stations, especially ones where both airlines fly to. I think it would be safe to assume that the YX staff @ ATL will be offered positions with FL there if the merger goes through as ATL is an FL station that is perpetually looking for staff.
 
n917me
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 5:57 am

Quoting Srbmod (Reply 35):
Does YX have their own gate/ramp staff at every YX outstation?

Generally YX has their own above wing staff at most outstations that are mainline. Usually after a station has 5 or more flights.. or has a good opportunity to handle OAL under wing will the station have a ramp. Most, if not all mainiline stations that have their own ramp have all agents cross utilized. (BOS, LGA, DCA, ATL, LAX, MKE, OMA, MCI)

LAX handles FL above and below wing..
Midwest Connect stations vary. Some have no YX staff at all, except a manager who oversees that city. (RDU/CLT/AUS)

Then of course you throw in the SkyWest cities that have an identity crisis, BWI, COS and now EWR, all which are seen as YX "mainline" cities, however only have CRJ service, EWR is the only one of the three that has its own Midwest above wing staff.
 
srbmod
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 6:08 am

Quoting N917ME (Reply 36):

Yikes, that kind of reminds me of DL in some ways, especially DL Connection only cities. I remember years back when I worked for EV, there were some cities where we handled both EV and OH and vice versa. Then there were cities where DL, EV, and OH flew into where everything was handled by Delta Global. Then you had some cities were it was mainline employees handling them in addition to DL stuff.
 
Cubsrule
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 7:38 am

Quoting Azjubilee (Reply 30):
With the proper fleet, better costs and less competition they could make MKE work.

I wonder whether NW would need to buy YX to reenter MKE in the absence of YX. It seems like a safe bet that NW will not attempt another focus city there if YX still exists due to their failure last time as well as the new partnership with YX. However, NW in its 2009 form could likely do just fine against FL, as they have significantly lower costs than they did last time they attempted a focus city and still enjoy a large RASM advantage (about 5.5 cents in the most recent DoT reporting period). Thus, they should be able to match FL's fares just about anywhere. They'll also likely have many 75 seaters on property by the time a merger goes through, so there will be a good bit of operational flexibility in terms of what size aircraft they use. Seems like NW could grow a great focus city at MKE without the baggage (financial and otherwise) that comes with an acquisition.

Quoting N917ME (Reply 36):
Some have no YX staff at all, except a manager who oversees that city. (RDU/CLT/AUS)

There are quite a few AL cities in this category. BNA and SDF come to mind (I can't speak for SDF, but MQ does a fantastic job for them at BNA, even with operational problems).
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
sideflare75
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 8:21 am

Quoting N917ME (Reply 31):
BTW.. interesting rumor this afternoon from on of our YX pilots who were hitching a ride from MSP to MKE.. The NW captain told him that YX bought the A320's that NW had for sale.... remember NW did have a buyer, but would not disclose any details.

Weren't they 319's and not 320's? Too small for YX.
 
N822ME
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RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 8:24 am

Quoting Travatl (Reply 16):
Actually the pilots and flight attendants will fair very well in the merger. Over half of their flight attendants will be senior to me in a post-merger, and I'm in the top 5% at AirTran now.

You make the assumption that seniority would be integrated based on date of hire. I believe both flight attendant groups are AFA, so date of hire would be required. However, pilot groups are separate unions so I really doubt YX pilots would get anything but a staple to the bottom. And everyone else.... at most stations, the YX people are senior to the FL. No union on the ground, so who is to say that seniority would be integrated based on date of hire? That would piss off the native FL. Who is to say YX non-union workforce wouldn't get an adjusted date of hire?
 
N822ME
Posts: 83
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2007 3:31 am

RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 8:26 am

Quoting Sideflare75 (Reply 39):
Weren't they 319's and not 320's? Too small for YX.

There was some discussion on a previous thread, and I believe these planes were going back to leasing companies and then to Russia.
 
B757capt
Posts: 1307
Joined: Mon Feb 09, 2004 7:11 am

RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 1:01 pm

Quoting N917ME (Reply 24):
Quoting Travatl (Reply 20):
FL CSRs start at $10 plus shift diff in the east.

Still a pay cut.

Pay cut or a job with a company that is making money.

You decide, well at least you will be able to in a few months.
The views written by this user are in no manner the views of my employer and should not be thought as such.
 
N822ME
Posts: 83
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2007 3:31 am

RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 8:08 pm

Quoting B757capt (Reply 42):
Pay cut or a job with a company that is making money.

Midwest is making money.
 
bobnwa
Posts: 4485
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2000 12:10 am

RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Wed Aug 01, 2007 8:46 pm

Quoting Travatl (Reply 23):
How would the pilot's scope clause work with that? Isn't that how the original AirTran came into being in the first place?

You are right, NWA did own the original Air Tran but had to give it up under pressure from the Northwest pilots at the time. Air Tran operated separately for a while with John Horn ex Northwest President as its President. It was then bought out by Value Jet but maintained the Air Tran name. Its Chairman and CEO is Joe Leonard ex NWA and its President is Robert Fornaro also ex Northwest. The history of Air Tran is well connected to Northwest.
 
SkyexRamper
Posts: 1952
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:17 am

RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Thu Aug 02, 2007 1:06 am

Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 44):
You are right, NWA did own the original Air Tran but had to give it up under pressure from the Northwest pilots at the time. Air Tran operated separately for a while

Actually, the original AirTran was never owned by NWA itself. It was created and owned by Mesaba at which point NWA only owned 29% of Mesaba. That is when NWA got fussy about Mesaba owning airplanes that messed with the NWA pilot scope clause. So Mesaba had to sell off AirTran and rename their own holding company from AirTran Corp to Mesaba Holdings.


AirTran's start: Mesaba bough Conquest Sun Airlines (a promising 737-200 start-up) and formed a holding company AirTran Corp (renaming Conquest to AirTran) to manage both Mesaba and the new AirTran. Mesaba sold off AirTran to ValuJet.
Good Luck to all Skyway Pilots! It's been great working with you!
 
We're Nuts
Posts: 4723
Joined: Sun Jun 04, 2000 6:12 am

RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Thu Aug 02, 2007 1:33 am

A merger simply to satisfy cut-and-run investment companies. How pathetic. If this happens, it will ruin AirTran. There is absolutely no strategic basis for north-south hub system. Not to mention passengers losing a truly unique, "pre-9/11" airline. But who cares as long as Octavian makes a buck?
Dear moderators: No.
 
srbmod
Posts: 15446
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2001 1:32 pm

RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Thu Aug 02, 2007 5:10 am

Quoting N917ME (Reply 24):
Still a pay cut.

Only a slight one. But some stations do start out at a higher pay rate than others because of the higher cost of living in those cities. The starting pay now if better than it was 7 years ago, when they started ramp and gate agents at $8.50/hr and those who worked on the PM shift got a 35 cent/hour shift differential.

Quoting N822ME (Reply 40):
And everyone else.... at most stations, the YX people are senior to the FL. No union on the ground, so who is to say that seniority would be integrated based on date of hire? That would piss off the native FL. Who is to say YX non-union workforce wouldn't get an adjusted date of hire?

At some stations, that would be a minor issue due to a major difference in the size of each airlines' crew there. For example, ATL. There are folks in Customer Service (ramp, gate, etc.) who do date back to the Valujet days, but considering the turnover they have, it's easy to move up on the seniority list. In the 11 months I worked there, I went up well over 100 spots on the ramp agent seniority list and in the bid that they were about to start when I left, I had managed to snag a Friday/Saturday line (But that's nothing compared to ASA. They had a bid about three months after I started and I had gone up on the seniority list high enough to snag a Friday/Saturday line.). Places like MKE will be interesting to say the least. I would hope FL does the right thing is uses the YX D.O.H. when it comes to merging the seniority lists for ramp/gate/ticket/res agents. Considering that FL is barely old enough to even have non-supervisory employees making the top out rate for those positions, it would definitely add some when the YX lists were merged in. I'm guessing that a restructuring of the pay scale could potentially be in order as well.
 
sllevin
Posts: 3312
Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2002 1:57 pm

RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Thu Aug 02, 2007 6:23 am

Quoting We're Nuts (Reply 46):
A merger simply to satisfy cut-and-run investment companies

Actually, if that were true, the holders of YX would have kicked in much earlier and with greater numbers.

There's nothing "cut and run" here at all. There is, however, clearly a belief that YX's current management will not be able to grow the company.

Steve
 
Mikey711MN
Posts: 1233
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 4:19 am

RE: YX Forms Committee To Talk To FL, Others

Thu Aug 02, 2007 7:24 am

Quoting Sllevin (Reply 48):
There is, however, clearly a belief that YX's current management will not be able to grow the company.

...at least to the level where the value of the shares would be at what FL is offering anyway. Truth be told, they are arguably growing the company.

Probably splitting hairs,
-Mike
I plan on living forever. So far, so good...

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