Boston92
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The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 1:40 am

How old are the aircraft? When will the time come to replace some of them (some are getting pretty old and broken). The last one I was on was missing an overhead bin and three or four armrests.

Why dont other airlines operate the E120? It seems much better than the Dash 8 and Saab340.

Have there been any major problems with them (three times ago, the number two engine would not start and we were on the ground for an hour before deplaning and re-booking).

What do you guys think of the aircraft?
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B52overSMF
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 1:50 am

I don't know just how true this actually is but when I worked on the ramp I was chatting with some Skywest pilots about the EMB 120 and they were talking about how the plane isn't all that efficient. More specifically they mentioned it's thrust to lift ratio and the fact that they fly pretty high in the RPM settings to keep the thing moving. I have no idea how true or untrue this is.I'm really just spreading potentially bad gossip here.  Wink
 
graphic
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 1:51 am

Quoting Boston92 (Thread starter):
Why dont other airlines operate the E120? It seems much better than the Dash 8 and Saab340.

Not sure about the Saab, but the Dash is a much better hot-and-high performer, hence the E120s being taken out of regular rotations to the mountain towns from the DEN hub.
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SNCNtry32
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 1:53 am

Quoting Boston92 (Thread starter):

Why dont other airlines operate the E120? It seems much better than the Dash 8 and Saab340.

I also heard the Saab is a butter airframe from some XJ pilots. When 9E operated the Saab, it was the 'weapon of choice' for most pilots. Everyone around MSP seems to love the Saab's, except the passengers..
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Osprey88
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 1:58 am

Originally, I think these aircraft were put into OO's fleet to provide a high number of flights to regional destinations to give the passenger a large number of times to choose from. Now though, I think that their fleet of 120s has become more of a hassle than it is worth and would really like to see OO replace these with Q400s which would be more efficient and (in my view) more comfortable.
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ATAIndy
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 2:12 am

Quoting B52overSMF (Reply 1):
I have no idea how true or untrue this is.I'm really just spreading potentially bad gossip here.

Uh-oh, that's always a "good" conversation starter, lol.  wink 
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whatusaid
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 2:13 am

At one time, I remember one of the Mgt team at Skywest saying they were looking at ERJ-135's as a possible replacements. Those days are long gone, given the economics of today. Frequency was the marketing goal at the time, thus the need (then and I would expect today) to remain under 50 pax given the limited traffic in a number of these markets. Frequencies have come down, but I would expect the 120's to rattle around the West for many years to come.

Will we ever see a Q400 flying for Skywest? I doubt it, not in their UAX colors out of SFO or LAX.
 
Boston92
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 2:36 am

Quoting WhatUsaid (Reply 6):
but I would expect the 120's to rattle around the West for many years to come.

Good. For the west, I can not imagine any better aircraft. They interior is not bad also. The ceiling is an estimated 5'8"+ and the seats are pretty comfortable, especially the lone seat in A. The 120's are faster than any other US Airline turboprop, and do not normally (in any of my flights) have that many MX problems.

As for Hot and High, I did not really notice anything different when I landed or tookoff from RNO a couple days ago. RNO and DEN are at about the same elevation, right?

Also, the E120's are a big moneymaker I would assume. They really do not burn that much fuel on any of the short LAX-XXX or SFO-XXX flights.

The E120 also battles wind and rough air better than ANY other aircraft below the size of a 757. One time I remember taking of from SBP with 60 MPH SUSTAINED winds and gusts of up to 80 MPH and the plane moved around barely anything. I was watching the Saab340 land before we took off, and it did not look very fun. When landing in SFO, we again felt barely anything, but when I left SFO an hour later on a larger A320, we were moved around pretty good up there.

Long live the E120.
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PanAm747
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 3:24 am

The EMB120 is basically a bumblebee. Short, stubby, but as durable as anything ever built, and can fly when most people think it can't. Also, the buzz from both can be heard from great distances...  rotfl 

For United Express, it is the perfect plane for California - very few high airports (although the central valley summers can be gruesome!!) and small enough to offer flexible times and schedules, but large enough to actually be semi-comfortable (as opposed to a metroliner). In fact, I mentioned once that California is where all 120's will come to die - sort of the elephant graveyard...but in a nice way.

If it were not for the 120, airports such as BFL, VIS, or MOD might not have any service at all. In 1999, after AA pulled out of BFL, UA Express was the only airline left there, soldiering on to SFO and LAX. Now, even with all the competition (such as it is), the 120 is still the perfect plane for these routes.

I wouldn't want to fly cross country on one, but for short hops, they're just fine.
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RCoulter
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 3:39 am

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 7):
RNO and DEN are at about the same elevation, right?

DEN is 5431
RNO is 4415ft
 
graphic
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 3:50 am

Quoting Osprey88 (Reply 4):
Now though, I think that their fleet of 120s has become more of a hassle than it is worth and would really like to see OO replace these with Q400s which would be more efficient and (in my view) more comfortable.

That would make no sense whatsoever.
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Osprey88
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 4:17 am

Quoting Graphic (Reply 10):
That would make no sense whatsoever.

What makes you say that?

Looking at the California market where most of the 120s are used, why wouldn't the Q400 be a good choice? Take for example the SFO-SBA. Today their are 10 flights using the 120s. With 30 seats per 120 that is 300 seats total to SFO. If OO used a Q400 on this route today, why couldn't they run 4 flights which would equal 296 seats (74 X 4=296) to SFO. Using this plan of fewer flights, they would need fewer aircraft overall which could reduce maintenance and fuel costs.

Or am I missing something?
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Goldenshield
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 4:18 am

Most of these Brasilias are less than 10 years old. There's no real sense in getting rid of them. Hell, look at Northwest and their DC-9's.  Smile

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 7):
The 120's are faster than any other US Airline turboprop

Not as fast as the Q400, but is faster than most other turboprops. You have to remember that the E120 was designed in the early 80's, and the Q400 was designed in the late 90's.
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Boston92
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 5:05 am

Quoting Osprey88 (Reply 11):
Today their are 10 flights using the 120s. With 30 seats per 120 that is 300 seats total to SFO. If OO used a Q400 on this route today, why couldn't they run 4 flights which would equal 296 seats (74 X 4=296) to SFO.

Exactly...that is the point of the Brasilia. To have a lot of frequency but efficiant as any other aircraft.

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 12):
Most of these Brasilias are less than 10 years old. There's no real sense in getting rid of them.

Thank you. I never really meant this thread to be a "replacement" thread. Just interested in the avg age and when and what would be a good aircraft to replace it with.
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SpencerII
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 5:14 am

I remember when OO ran that from SLC to SNA & LAX to TEX Both were horrible flights.
 
Osprey88
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 5:18 am

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 13):
Exactly...that is the point of the Brasilia. To have a lot of frequency but efficient as any other aircraft.

But what is more beneficial to an airlines revenue? Having lots of aircraft and more frequency or having fewer aircraft and less frequency?

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 13):
Just interested in the avg age and when and what would be a good aircraft to replace it with.

I would be interested to know if their will be a replacement aircraft for them. I don't know if their will be an aircraft company will be willing to produce a 30 seat turboprop when the Brasilia needs to be replaced.
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JayDub
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 5:23 am

There are 60 total Brasilias in the SkyWest fleet.
14 operate on the Delta Connection side, 46 on the United Express side of the house.
The average age of the Bro fleet is 10.4 years.

[Edited 2007-08-10 22:23:41]
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PanAm747
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 5:28 am

Quote:
Looking at the California market where most of the 120s are used, why wouldn't the Q400 be a good choice? Take for example the SFO-SBA. Today their are 10 flights using the 120s. With 30 seats per 120 that is 300 seats total to SFO. If OO used a Q400 on this route today, why couldn't they run 4 flights which would equal 296 seats (74 X 4=296) to SFO. Using this plan of fewer flights, they would need fewer aircraft overall which could reduce maintenance and fuel costs.

Frequency, frequency, frequency. America wants frequency.

What would you be doing with the Q400 the rest of the day? An airplane not flying is one that is not making money.

Also, consider that fewer seats available means a higher cost and more profit. Check out any BFL-LAX or BFL-SFO cost. The cheapest I could find to LAX was over $500. The reason? UAx wants to keep these seats available for the business traveller. When he has multiple choices, he's more likely to want to save time and not have to drive over the Grapevine to LAX. However, if there's only one flight a day, and he can't take it, he will drive, and that seat will go empty.
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Goldenshield
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 5:31 am

Quoting Osprey88 (Reply 15):
But what is more beneficial to an airlines revenue? Having lots of aircraft and more frequency or having fewer aircraft and less frequency?

How about they buy a DC-10 and run it just 1 time a day?
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DeltaAVL
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 5:32 am

Quoting SNCntry32 (Reply 3):
I also heard the Saab is a butter airframe from some XJ pilots.

It's a butter airframe, eh? I'm not so sure I'd want to put my life into the hands of an airplane made of butter!  Wink
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WesternA318
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 5:44 am

Quoting Osprey88 (Reply 11):
What makes you say that?

Looking at the California market where most of the 120s are used, why wouldn't the Q400 be a good choice? Take for example the SFO-SBA. Today their are 10 flights using the 120s. With 30 seats per 120 that is 300 seats total to SFO. If OO used a Q400 on this route today, why couldn't they run 4 flights which would equal 296 seats (74 X 4=296) to SFO. Using this plan of fewer flights, they would need fewer aircraft overall which could reduce maintenance and fuel costs.

Or am I missing something?

I think for an aircraft to pass muster with OO's fleet department would be a) suitable for thehit n high condition at MANY of OO's stations in the Intermountain West area, as well as b) comparable CASM compared to the EMB120, not to mention somwhat easy to acquire, and acquisition costs somewhat on the lower end.
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Boston92
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 6:23 am

Skywest got the E120's from Embraer, right?

Quoting JayDub (Reply 16):
There are 60 total Brasilias in the SkyWest fleet.

What happened to the other ten?
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JayDub
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 7:30 am

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 22):
What happened to the other ten?

Two Brasilias have left the fleet this year...one in January, one in March. I know at least one and I believe both were flown FAT - FXE for delivery to a private buyer.

I assume the other 8 left the fleet over the previous couple of years.
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Osprey88
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 7:48 am

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 17):
Frequency, frequency, frequency. America wants frequency.

I think you are partially correct, but I think you can make even more money with smart frequency timing. Yes America wants frequency, you are correct, but you do not have to offer pax 10 flight times to choose from. 3, 4, or 5 well-placed flights should do the trick to most airports in the OO's California market. I go back to the SFO-SBA example. Today the flight times SBA-SFO were:

6:36
7:41
8:21
10:20
12:00
1:52
3:45
5:52
7:32
8:53

Now if I operated those flights with a Q400, here are my flight times:

6:45
10:45
3:30
8:00

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 17):
Also, consider that fewer seats available means a higher cost and more profit. Check out any BFL-LAX or BFL-SFO cost. The cheapest I could find to LAX was over $500. The reason? UAx wants to keep these seats available for the business traveler. When he has multiple choices, he's more likely to want to save time and not have to drive over the Grapevine to LAX. However, if there's only one flight a day, and he can't take it, he will drive, and that seat will go empty.

Applying this to my SBA scenario you could still keep the seat at ~$500, because you still have the frequency to give him choice. However, their is a flip side in which you are correct on. I could not run Q400s to BFL because, as you said, because unless you have a monopoly, you need frequency, and you could only justify running 1 Q400 BFL-SFO and 1 Q400 BFL-LAX.

Overall, I'd say their are some markets that could support Q400(s) I think, but their are others that would require a EMB120.

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 18):
How about they buy a DC-10 and run it just 1 time a day?

If I had a monopoly I would, and maybe not a DC-10, but a 787-3....  biggrin 
"Reading departure signs in some big airports reminds me of the places I've been"
 
justlump
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 7:48 am

In reference to your question regarding the performance of the 120 vs the Saab 340 and the Dash 8, as previously mentioned, the Dash 8 is a superior hot/high performer. Luckily, I have had extensive hands-on experience with both the 120 and the Saab. The EMB 120 is faster, flies higher, and has an external APU. However, when it comes to performance issues, the Saab wins hands down. My base airport (SJT) sits at approximately 2000ft elevation, is 350mi from IAH, with an 8300ft main runway (18/36). When the temp reaches 36C in the summer, the Brasilia takes a major hit (weight restriction) when it comes to passengers carried. On an average day (35C) , OO 120's were restricted to 18 to 24 pax and 600lbs bags depending on the particular aircraft (fuel load 2400lbs). The Saab 340, does not take a serious hit until 40C. On an average 35C summer day, it can routinely carry 30-32pax and 900-1000lbs in bags (with a fuel load of 2600lbs). As you can see, as a Station Manager, I greatly prefer the Saab. It is uncomfortable and slow, but it gets the job done.
Aircraft performance issues were the main reason SkyWest lost the IAH Continental Connection contract to Colgan. OO is a great airline with fantastic people, but the EMB120 was seriously lacking in the trans-Texas market.
 
Goldenshield
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 8:10 am

Quoting Justlump (Reply 25):
My base airport (SJT) sits at approximately 2000ft elevation, is 350mi from IAH, with an 8300ft main runway (18/36). When the temp reaches 36C in the summer, the Brasilia takes a major hit (weight restriction) when it comes to passengers carried. On an average day (35C) , OO 120's were restricted to 18 to 24 pax and 600lbs bags depending on the particular aircraft (fuel load 2400lbs).

Not true. The performance was great up to about 42C, when it really started to crap out. What hurt the Bro in the Houston market were the numerous storms, reroutes, etc., that required more fuel.
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AirlineBrat
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 8:39 am

To be honest, the EMB-120 is my least favorite aircraft. They are noisier than hell and if you sit anywhere between the wing and the front of the cabin, you have to wear earplugs or your ears ring for days. Here at ACV, UA-EX (aka OO) only flies the 120's into here. I prefer the Q-400's like QX flies into here. Folks above who mentioned that a Q400 is much too big for smaller California cities may have a point. In that case the 37 seat Q200 would work perfect and the sound canceling technology takes care of the noise issues.

No wonder Q400's are too big when UA charges $300-400rt to fly ACV-SFO and $250rt to fly from ACV down to SoCal with a connection in SFO. Looking at the 'E-Fare weekend getaway' offering UA has on their website for this and next weekend...... ACV-SFO/RNO for $70 each way. If they offer $70 each way airfares all the time, they could easily fill Q400's daily. If I was not flying down to Sacramento next week for work, I would be all over that and would have spent the weekend in Reno.

Standard fares on QX's Q400's between ACV/RDD and LAX are usually around $250rt if you get your ticket at least a month in advance. From what I understand, load factors are decent most the time. If you are going to charge $400rt for a 250 mile flight then I am driving and will stop for lunch at the In-N-Out in Santa Rosa while on my way to the city........
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skyrat
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 9:14 am

SKW management has expressed their love for the Q400. I have heard that they want a long term contract, which is why they haven't gone and bought any. They pulled out of the 70 seat turboprop RFP that CO had out because they didn't think it was a long enough contract. Rumors are that UA wants the Q400, but they also won't commit to a long contract either.

I can see the Q400 being a great plane for the mountain cities as many have posted. I think it would be a perfect fit for OO.
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aviationnut12
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 9:22 am

I love the Brasilia, and also the ATR 72. Yeah they are noisy, but go fly on a Cessna 152 and you'll soon learn what noise is. I remember flying PHX-PSP on a OO EMB-120 about ten years ago. We had to fly through a storm and got tossed around like a ping-pong ball. It was great fun though. Long live the turboprops!
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hawaiian717
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 11:32 am

Quoting Osprey88 (Reply 24):

I think you are partially correct, but I think you can make even more money with smart frequency timing. Yes America wants frequency, you are correct, but you do not have to offer pax 10 flight times to choose from. 3, 4, or 5 well-placed flights should do the trick to most airports in the OO's California market.

Nope, they want frequency. A few years ago, United tried cutting LAX-SAN frequencies and adding Shuttle by United 737s to the route. Didn't really work out.
 
Boston92
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 12:04 pm

Inside the Brasilia, the noise is really not that bad. Two days ago, I carried on a conversation with the guy behind me, across from me, and the flight attendant. The noise is pretty relaxing, the noise is not even comparable to the old Dash-8's aka Comair.
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hiflyer
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 9:00 pm

love the 120...especially when I score row 9 on the window....ahhhh legroom.

FYI SKW had two different interior 120's in the past due to a pickup of some from another carrier (Westjet?)....and now NASCAR teams have been picking up used ones to help move crew members around from race to race.

FYI UAX no longer serves VIS in the valley and BFL is getting it's first UAX RJ this fall with a nonstop to DEN.

What I don't know is how many of SKW birds are standard 120's and how many are the enhanced birds....120er adv.

Re the SBA frequency argument...yes they want that frequency and business on all 120's improved when they moved into Term 8 at LAX and stopped using that remote parking.

Someone mentioned the ATR72...I have flown that bird down in SoFla and it seems every flight could have used about twice the current air conditioning capacity...would not bode well in the valley of Calif with trip digit temps routine. Q400 is just too much aircraft...but the q200 is slower than the 120.
 
srbmod
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 10:09 pm

Quoting Boston92 (Thread starter):
Why dont other airlines operate the E120? It seems much better than the Dash 8 and Saab340.

I still think EV and OH made a mistake in retiring their fleets when they did. I know that part of EV's fleet was upgraded to the ER standard a few years before they were retired (pretty much any EV Brasilia in the Deltaflot livery had been upgraded to the ER standard). Now most of the EV and OH fleet was getting up in age (EV was the launch customer for the E-120 back in the mid-80s and the bulk of their fleet was delivered between 1986-1993) the last E-120 delivery for EV was in 1993 and the last OH E-120 was delivered in 1992. EV had already retired the bulk of their oldest E-120 by 1999-2000.). A good portion of OO's E-120 fleet was delivered in the last 8-14 years. In fact, the majority of E-120 deliveries from 1993-1999 were for Skywest.

One thing to remember is that by the late 90s, the regional jet came in a and knocked the turboprop market into a tail spin. Orders were already becoming sparse, and the main turboprops being ordered were in the 50+ seat range.

I really think there is still a need for a turboprop a/c in the 30 seat range, but as long as airlines are willing to waste an RJ on a route that could be better served economically with a turboprop, airlines will have to depend on older models as there's not any sub-50 seat turboprops (other than the ATR-42) being actively sold these days.

The E-120 and the Dash 8-100/200 sold in almost similar numbers, and the Saab 340 outsold both of them by close to 80 a/c. Later entries into the 30 seat market, the Do-328 and the BAe J41, each barely cracked the 100 a/c mark in orders. This is mainly due to poor timing on those manufacturers' parts since by that time, the RJ 'Revolution' was well under way.
 
Goldenshield
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sat Aug 11, 2007 10:25 pm

Quoting Hiflyer (Reply 32):
What I don't know is how many of SKW birds are standard 120's and how many are the enhanced birds....120er adv.

They are all 120ER models. The last RT model was retired a few years ago (and now working cargo.)
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Boston92
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sun Aug 12, 2007 2:22 am

Quoting Hiflyer (Reply 32):
Q400 is just too much aircraft...

Yeah it is. The Brasilia even for its small size is roomy inside. The seats do not recline making it good for tall people like me to fit fine.
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F9Animal
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sun Aug 12, 2007 4:54 am

I used to fly as a passenger on the EMB 120 at least 2 times a week. I really enjoyed flying on it, and had no issues. The flights from LAS to PSP were always interesting in the summer due to the turbulence, but that was the fun of flying for me. The aircraft rarely had MX issues. Come to think of it, I do not recall any MX issues at the OO base I was at. The only issue we had on a few occasions in 2 years was baggage falling up against the cargo door, therefore making one of us or a mechanic to climb through the passenger cabin access point to get to the luggage (which was not fun, and took a bit of a delay for us). Otherwise, the plane was a tank.

I did not have a problem with the cabin noise either. Comfortable bird to fly on from a passengers perspective. The APU was also great for hot cities, as the cabin would stay cool when it was 110 degrees out.
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Boston92
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sun Aug 12, 2007 5:43 am

Quoting F9Animal (Reply 36):
Comfortable bird to fly on from a passengers perspective. The APU was also great for hot cities, as the cabin would stay cool when it was 110 degrees out.

Exactly. A few weeks back when flying SBA-LAX, the only MX problem I ever encountered with the Brasilia made us re book and I had to go on a later CRJ. That kinda made me bummed, but in the end, I got to fly from SFO-RNO on one instead of the CR7 so it all worked out. That flight was fun.
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DLOnur
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sun Aug 12, 2007 6:00 am

Quoting AirlineBrat (Reply 27):
To be honest, the EMB-120 is my least favorite aircraft. They are noisier than hell and if you sit anywhere between the wing and the front of the cabin, you have to wear earplugs or your ears ring for days. Here at ACV, UA-EX (aka OO) only flies the 120's into here. I prefer the Q-400's like QX flies into here. Folks above who mentioned that a Q400 is much too big for smaller California cities may have a point. In that case the 37 seat Q200 would work perfect and the sound canceling technology takes care of the noise issues.

No wonder Q400's are too big when UA charges $300-400rt to fly ACV-SFO and $250rt to fly from ACV down to SoCal with a connection in SFO. Looking at the 'E-Fare weekend getaway' offering UA has on their website for this and next weekend...... ACV-SFO/RNO for $70 each way. If they offer $70 each way airfares all the time, they could easily fill Q400's daily. If I was not flying down to Sacramento next week for work, I would be all over that and would have spent the weekend in Reno.

Standard fares on QX's Q400's between ACV/RDD and LAX are usually around $250rt if you get your ticket at least a month in advance. From what I understand, load factors are decent most the time. If you are going to charge $400rt for a 250 mile flight then I am driving and will stop for lunch at the In-N-Out in Santa Rosa while on my way to the city........

Load factors are always heavy on the ACV-SFO run....all of those 120's are full almost all of the time--this is the case now and was the case when I worked at ACV for WestAir and Skywest in the mid-late 1990's.

OO did bring in a couple of RJ's in ACV a few years back, but they've since taken them back out of ACV.

I remember quite well Capt. Steve Kern who worked for WestAir and was based out of ACV (it was a base for flight crew when WestAir was in business) did a last fly by in ACV--at about 200 feet--in his 120 on his last flight as a WestAir employee on 09APR1998, everyone was on the ramp cheering...then Capt. Barry Bramson did the same thing at about 250feet.....it was classic--I have photos of them from pre-digital photos....

-onur
Old ACV UAX
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IADCRJ
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sun Aug 12, 2007 2:58 pm

Quoting Boston92 (Reply 36):
The APU was also great for hot cities, as the cabin would stay cool when it was 110 degrees out.

The APU in addition to the lavatory is probably the best feature in terms of Passenger comfort for this aircraft.
 
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RayChuang
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Mon Aug 13, 2007 12:31 am

I wonder are there any plans to upgrade the EMB 120's in SkyWest service? They could be a great candidate for a newer engine turning six-bladed props that will cut fuel consumption and reduce engine noise, since you don't need to turn the propeller so fast with a six-bladed prop.
 
Boston92
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Mon Aug 13, 2007 2:30 am

Quoting RayChuang (Reply 39):
I wonder are there any plans to upgrade the EMB 120's in SkyWest service? They could be a great candidate for a newer engine turning six-bladed props that will cut fuel consumption and reduce engine noise, since you don't need to turn the propeller so fast with a six-bladed prop.

Are there upgrades like this available that would reduce already low fuel costs to even lower? How much fuel would you be saving?
"Why does a slight tax increase cost you $200 and a substantial tax cut save you 30 cents?"
 
AirlineBrat
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Mon Aug 13, 2007 9:05 am

Quoting DLOnur (Reply 37):
OO did bring in a couple of RJ's in ACV a few years back, but they've since taken them back out of ACV.

I was fortunate to fly on the RJ between SFO and ACV a couple of times when OO flew them up here. At one point if my memory is correct, they flew three RJ's a day up here. All three left SFO in the late afternoon or evening, one turned around and returned to SFO as the last or second to last southbound flight of the day and the other two RON'ed and returned to SFO first thing in the morning. One left around 5:30am and the other left around 7am. That all quickly ended when UA went through BK reorganization and now we are back to 100% EMB120's out of ACV. One of which I'll be on first thing tomorrow morning. The 5:30am ACV-SMF. I am not looking forward to getting up at 4am.........
I'm leavin on a jet plane. Don't know when I'll be back again....
 
DLOnur
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Mon Aug 13, 2007 10:18 am

Quoting AirlineBrat (Reply 41):

I was fortunate to fly on the RJ between SFO and ACV a couple of times when OO flew them up here. At one point if my memory is correct, they flew three RJ's a day up here. All three left SFO in the late afternoon or evening, one turned around and returned to SFO as the last or second to last southbound flight of the day and the other two RON'ed and returned to SFO first thing in the morning. One left around 5:30am and the other left around 7am. That all quickly ended when UA went through BK reorganization and now we are back to 100% EMB120's out of ACV. One of which I'll be on first thing tomorrow morning. The 5:30am ACV-SMF. I am not looking forward to getting up at 4am.........

Yeah, it was nice having the RJ service into ACV...a lot easier to non-rev on in and out as opposed to the very full 120's.

Tell the AM shift that I say hello--Verno, Elena, Jackie, Todd....etc....those are some of my really good friends from back in my ACV days. They are all lifers there because it is so damn diffiuclt to leave ACV....It was difficult for me to leave and go back into the outside world, beyond the "Redwood Curtain."

 Wink

-o-
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Caspian27
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Mon Aug 13, 2007 1:21 pm

Quoting PanAm747 (Reply 8):
If it were not for the 120, airports such as BFL, VIS, or MOD might not have any service at all. In 1999, after AA pulled out of BFL, UA Express was the only airline left there, soldiering on to SFO and LAX. Now, even with all the competition (such as it is), the 120 is still the perfect plane for these routes.

ZV using a 1900 provides EAS service to VIS via LAS now.
Meanwhile, somewhere 35,000 ft above your head...
 
flyboy97502
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Mon Aug 13, 2007 7:00 pm

Quoting JayDub (Reply 22):
Two Brasilias have left the fleet this year...one in January, one in March. I know at least one and I believe both were flown FAT - FXE for delivery to a private buyer.

I assume the other 8 left the fleet over the previous couple of years.

A few I've seen made their way up north!


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[Edited 2007-08-13 12:04:56]
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whatusaid
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Mon Aug 13, 2007 11:03 pm

Pre-911, UAX was running six RJ's a day between FAT and SFO. Of course, given that was the same aircraft shuttling back 'n forth, one ATC delay and the entire day was a disaster. As with any FAT jet flight to SFO, you hit cruising altitude for what seems about five minutes. Still, it was a nice departure from the 120's which are decent, but noisy aircraft for what will always be a regional aircraft route.

Thinking into the future, one can wonder if the CRJ will find a new home on intra-state flights as the -700's become the choice for inter-state service. Based upon the increased 120 flying on SFO-SMF and SFO-SBA, I suppose that's more or less wishful thinking. But, SFO-ACV seems to always be overbooked when I'm sitting around SFO due to ATC delays, and I could easily see that route being one of the first for CRJs if they were to become available.
 
Goldenshield
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Tue Aug 14, 2007 6:29 am

Quoting WhatUsaid (Reply 45):
But, SFO-ACV seems to always be overbooked when I'm sitting around SFO due to ATC delays, and I could easily see that route being one of the first for CRJs if they were to become available.

They become overbooked as people booked on later flights arrive into SFO and find that their flight is so massively delayed due to flow that they've been re-booked onto an earlier departing flight that was also heavily delayed..
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CWAFlyer
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Tue Aug 14, 2007 10:15 am

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 25):
Not true. The performance was great up to about 42C, when it really started to crap out. What hurt the Bro in the Houston market were the numerous storms, reroutes, etc., that required more fuel.

What hurt was Continental's insistance that 4 of the airplanes that were operated were the ones in COEX paint. All 4 were RT's and had been sitting in Roswell for a couple years prior to the CO/OO contract and each had to have $1 million in work done to them to get them up to SkyWest's standards. All 4 were junk and all we did we get calls from every single station asking for the "Silver Birds". There weren't enough to go around unfortunately.
 
IADCRJ
Posts: 328
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RE: The Skywest (USA) Brasilia Thread

Sun Aug 19, 2007 3:26 pm

Quoting Caspian27 (Reply 43):
ZV using a 1900 provides EAS service to VIS via LAS now.

I believe that zv recently discontinued this route.

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