plateman
Posts: 646
Joined: Wed May 23, 2007 9:36 am

UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Tue Aug 14, 2007 12:12 am

On approach to Dulles, it seems according to the Washington Post that the door that holds in the wheel feel into a local park, scaring some local residents.

Plane landed safely and was en route from Hartford.

Fair use from the WP:
"Authorities said yesterday that the piece came from United Express Flight 7350, bound for Dulles from Hartford, Conn. The Canadair Regional Jet 700, carrying 64 passengers and four crew members, had apparently shed the small door that recedes when the wheels emerge before landing..."

Article link: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...le/2007/08/12/AR2007081201137.html

How often does this happen? Was there really any problem with shedding the door for landing?

-Brian

[Edited 2007-08-13 17:16:37]
"Explore. Dream. Discover." -Mark Twain
 
A10WARTHOG
Posts: 200
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RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Tue Aug 14, 2007 12:45 am

As long when the door departs the airplane, it does not take hyd. lines and wiring with it or hits any thing else. I really can not see a problem for the passengers. Now for the people on the ground, it could be more of a problem. Still I think good odds it would not hit someone. We would lose static wicks all the time and oil door on the engine and apu seem to like flying off on the ERJ.
 
flynavy
Posts: 2177
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RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Tue Aug 14, 2007 3:47 am

Notice how there aren't any "United Express CRJs Are Falling Apart" thread in relation to this topic.
Change is: one airline, six continents!
 
airfoilsguy
Posts: 3485
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RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Tue Aug 14, 2007 4:47 am

I would have snatched it up and taken it home. Would be a cool souvenir,  Smile Maybe turn it into an end table.
It's not a near miss it's a near hit!!
 
jlbmedia
Posts: 297
Joined: Mon Jun 03, 2002 11:29 am

RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Tue Aug 14, 2007 5:55 am

Quoting PlateMan (Thread starter):
Was there really any problem with shedding the door for landing?

Maybe, to the people in the park it could have fallen on.  Wink
JLB54061
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
Posts: 6118
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RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Tue Aug 14, 2007 6:46 am

Quoting Flynavy (Reply 2):
Notice how there aren't any "United Express CRJs Are Falling Apart" thread in relation to this topic.

Exactly. Amazing how some were so quick to jump on the NW DC-9's are falling apart bandwagon when one lost a panel last week.

This incident goes to show that it happens to all types of aircraft regardless of age.
There are more of these incidents than people thing, although very far and few in between.
Most don't even make the news and even fewer even make it onto a.net.
 
penguinflies
Posts: 932
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RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Tue Aug 14, 2007 6:55 am

There is an AD to reinspect the attach fittings every 100 flight cycles to prevent this type of incident.
 
Rick
Posts: 125
Joined: Mon Dec 13, 1999 9:37 am

RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Tue Aug 14, 2007 9:10 am

That door landed a few miles up the road from where I live. Interestingly enough, I was delayed in Savannah, GA because a part was missing off of the rear engine of the Mesa Air CRJ200. They let us off the plane and we waited in the terminal for about 2 hours before reboarding for a 10:30 PM departure. The flight crew noticed it on walkaround after we had boarded. I was so anxious to get home to IAD I did not even notice if they ever repaired it, I almost did not care, I never felt nervous flying on it. One lady on the plane was bitching about the pilot being anal for refusing to fly the plane...backseat drivers! My blessings go out to the owners of the sandwich stand who stayed late to serve the plane load of hungry passengers, although 1/3 of the passengers bailed out and took other modes of transportation back to DC that night.
 
ilikeyyc
Posts: 1326
Joined: Tue Dec 09, 2003 8:09 am

RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:15 am

Quoting Penguinflies (Reply 7):
There is an AD to reinspect the attach fittings every 100 flight cycles to prevent this type of incident

Yes, it seems that when the door is out in the windstream, it vibrates a lot causing cracks and loose rivets. I have removed many MLG doors due to loose rivets, though I have only seen one with a crack. Bombardier tried to rectify the problem by adding two doublers to each door, however the doors are still subject to cracks and damage. The latest attempt to fix the problem is to remove the solid door rod and replace it with one that has a giant spring inside the rod. We'll see if this fixes the problem. Personally, I am skeptical.
Fighting Absurdity with Absurdity!
 
roseflyer
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RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Tue Aug 14, 2007 12:02 pm

I was listening to some engineers that work at JAL and they track how many parts fall off airplanes, and it is very interesting. I was surprised to find out that it is a regular occurrance to lose things from screws to hoses to doors. There's a pretty famous picture of an Airtran plane losing the engine cowling. It is far more common than you'd think. It's kind of scary if you think about it, but parts falling off of airplanes is not rare.
If you have never designed an airplane part before, let the real designers do the work!
 
bond007
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RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Tue Aug 14, 2007 12:12 pm

I used to work at Cranfield during the PFA rally, and had the task some years of answering phones while in the control tower. Well, most were for weather briefings, but one call from a lady in town who was totally convinced that a piece of glass/plastic had fallen into her yard from an aircraft. We had many calls from NIMBYs, complaining about the dangers of the rally etc. etc., so I asked if she really saw it fall from the sky and explained it could have been some trash left by vandals or something. She accepted it might not have fallen from a plane, and we ended our conversation after taking her details for our 'complaint log'.

...about an hour later, a pilot came up to the control tower, informing us that his "window had fallen out when he turned base leg." !!!

I told him I knew exactly where he could find it  Smile

Jimbo
I'd rather be on the ground wishing I was in the air, than in the air wishing I was on the ground!
 
F9Animal
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RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Tue Aug 14, 2007 8:32 pm

Quoting Flynavy (Reply 2):
Notice how there aren't any "United Express CRJs Are Falling Apart" thread in relation to this topic.

LMAO! If I had gotten off of work a few hours ago, I would have put in the same exact wording you put in. Is that not the truth??!!

Luckily nobody on the ground was hurt.
I Am A Different Animal!!
 
MAC26000
Posts: 36
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 7:16 pm

RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Tue Aug 14, 2007 8:56 pm

The piece actually landed in my development...I love the idiots on the local news who said that a "piece of the landing gear fell off". It must have floated to the ground, pics that I saw showed very little damage
 
xjramper
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RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Tue Aug 14, 2007 11:35 pm

Interestingly enough...when I flifo that flight number on United's site, that flight number does not exist. The next thing I find interesting is that there is only one flight that is operated by UAx from BDL to IAD. That flight operates at 1626 from BDL and arrives into IAD around 1800. And that flight number is 7282.

Another newsworthy item that is f*%&$(# up by the media.

XJR
Look ma' no hands!
 
Arrow
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RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Wed Aug 15, 2007 12:35 am

Quoting MAC26000 (Reply 12):
I love the idiots on the local news who said that a "piece of the landing gear fell off".

I guess it depends on how narrowly you define "part of the landing gear." Most people out there -- excepting a.nuts of course -- would not be troubled by describing the door that opens and closes to let the wheels in and out as part of the landing gear. It is part of the landing gear. How else would you generally describe it? To complain about this is pedantic in the extreme

Quoting Xjramper (Reply 20):
Another newsworthy item that is f*%&$(# up by the media.

I'm assuming you're complaint is about screwed up flight numbers (and not the landing gear door). Media had to get the number from somewhere -- they wouldn't arbitrarily make it up -- so its debatable who screwed up. If I had a dollar for every time I was given faulty info by someone in authority I'd be very rich.
Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
 
bond007
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RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Wed Aug 15, 2007 1:04 am

Quoting Xjramper (Reply 20):
Another newsworthy item that is f*%&$(# up by the media.

LOL ... looks like it was 7350, a weekly Saturday flight perhaps  Yeah sure

Another item that is f*%&$(# up by a.netters  Smile


Jimbo
I'd rather be on the ground wishing I was in the air, than in the air wishing I was on the ground!
 
tdscanuck
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RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Wed Aug 15, 2007 1:21 am

Quoting Arrow (Reply 21):
It is part of the landing gear. How else would you generally describe it?

I agree that, to a lay person, the gear doors might as well be called part of the landing gear. To anyone who knows airplanes, though, it would be far more accurate to refer to it as part of the wing-body fairing.

Tom.
 
Arrow
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RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Wed Aug 15, 2007 5:26 am

Quoting Tdscanuck (Reply 23):
I agree that, to a lay person, the gear doors might as well be called part of the landing gear. To anyone who knows airplanes, though, it would be far more accurate to refer to it as part of the wing-body fairing.

That's my point. The reporter was being ripped for describing it in laymen's terms -- but that's exactly who the audience is. He's not writing a technical report for the NTSB. And while I agree with you about the wing-body fairing argument, what do you do about those door pieces on some aircraft that are attached to the landing gear strut?

I just get fed up, generally, with all the crap dumped on media aviation reporting -- and I concede that some of their screw-ups are inexcusable -- when I've seen equally egregious mistakes made on this forum by people who definitely should know better and don't have the excuse of deadline pressures that most reporters face all day long.

I'm also having a bad day.
Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
 
itsnotfinals
Posts: 1573
Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2007 8:51 am

RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Wed Aug 15, 2007 5:42 am

Quoting Tdscanuck (Reply 19):

I wasn't talking about manufacturing cost...building that durable is heavy (relatively speaking) so you end up paying in fuel burn to carry the structural weight. In some applications the trade makes sense, in some it doesn't.

The CASM for a DC-9-30 is less than a 50 seat RJ, and still cost less per seat mile (assuming you are filling the DC-9)
Speedbird 178 Heavy, FINAL runway 27L
 
penguinflies
Posts: 932
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RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Wed Aug 15, 2007 8:55 am

I think the gear door we are speaking of is under landing gear chapter in the maintenance manual, while other parts like wheel bin brushes for landing gear on the CRJ are under the fuselage structure.

For your enjoyment:

From the FAA website, the original AD is back to 2003 and probably back further under the CRJ200(440):

DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION

Federal Aviation Administration


14 CFR Part 39

[Docket No. FAA-2006-24074; Directorate Identifier 2005-NM-213-AD;
Amendment 39-14676; AD 2006-14-05]

Airworthiness Directives; Bombardier Model CL-600-2C10 (Regional Jet Series 700, 701, and 702) Airplanes, Model CL-600-2D15 (Regional Jet Series 705) Airplanes, and Model CL-600-2D24 (Regional Jet Series 900) Airplane


ACTION: Final rule.

SUMMARY: The FAA is superseding an existing airworthiness directive (AD), which applies to certain Bombardier Model CL-600-2C10 (Regional Jet Series 700 and 701) and CL-600-2D24 (Regional Jet Series 900) series airplanes. That AD currently requires repetitive detailed inspections for cracking or deformation, or pulled or missing fasteners, on the lower panel of the left- and right-hand main landing gear (MLG) doors, as applicable, and corrective actions if necessary. This new AD reduces the repetitive inspection interval for certain airplanes. This new AD also adds airplanes to the applicability. This AD results from a report of a MLG door departing from an airplane. We are issuing this AD to prevent failure of the lower panel of the MLG door, departure of the lower panel from the airplane, and consequent damage to airplane structure, which could adversely affect the airplane's continued safe flight and landing.
 
User avatar
HAWK21M
Posts: 29867
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2001 10:05 pm

RE: UA Express Wheel Door Falls Off

Wed Aug 15, 2007 11:15 am

Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 9):
I was surprised to find out that it is a regular occurrance to lose things from screws to hoses to doors.

The term "Regular" is misleading.Ideal would be "Abnormal" & its not common.Its a Mx overlook at most times.

Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 9):
There's a pretty famous picture of an Airtran plane losing the engine cowling

Relative airflow is powerfull if the Cowl latches are not properly attached.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)