warreng24
Posts: 573
Joined: Fri Nov 18, 2005 9:38 am

End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Fri Aug 17, 2007 12:39 pm

When will we see an end to complimentary meal service in Y class on Trans-Atlantic flights?

For example, United's ORD-HNL service is similar in duration and distance to many East-Coast to Europe flights. The ORD-HNL service features no complimentary meal service in Y, except for a bag of pretzels and a non-alcoholic beverage. United offers Buy-On-Board snackboxes (4 types to choose from) and a Buy-On-Board meal (a salad or a sandwich).

ORD-HNL, 4422 miles, 8 hour and 55 minute block time

PHL-LGW, 3563 miles, 7 hour and 15 minute block time

IAD-LHR, 3670 miles, 7 hours and 34 mintue block time

Given that United's ORD-HNL flight is almost 9 hours long and there have been no news reports of passengers revolting over the lack of complimentary meals, how long until complimentary meal service on Trans-Atlantic flights is replaced by Buy-On-Board service?

I suspect that once one carrier leads the way with this, others will soon follow suit.
 
FLYGUY767
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Fri Aug 17, 2007 12:45 pm

Quoting Warreng24 (Thread starter):
When will we see an end to complimentary meal service in Y class on Trans-Atlantic flights?

Certainly not in the foreseeable future..

Quoting Warreng24 (Thread starter):
For example, United's ORD-HNL service is similar in duration and distance to many East-Coast to Europe flights.

However United Airlines isnt competing with BA, AF, KL, or VS on the route.. United Airlines needs to maintain the meals as it is part of the guest experience. If BA offers the same fare as United and maintains free meals United Airlines will be at competitive disadvantage.

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
dl767captain
Posts: 1206
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Fri Aug 17, 2007 1:25 pm

i think we will see meals return, even if for sale but at least a real meal not a snack box since airlines are starting to make money again
 
laca773
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Fri Aug 17, 2007 2:47 pm

I hope UA will bring back complimentary meals on their longhaul, European length Hawaii sectors from ORD as well as DEN, LAX, SFO, and etc.. CO, DL, & HA offer them and it will help bring UA up a couple of notches in terms of inflight and customer service. Same goes for the Y+ cabin on the p.s. flights and other transcons from the westcoast to IAD, PHL, BOS.

LACA773
 
commavia
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Fri Aug 17, 2007 3:20 pm

Personally, I don't think you'll see the same meal service deterioration on U.S.-Europe runs as we've seen of late on Hawaii flights for two reasons: first, while Hawaii is primarily a leisure-driven market, U.S.-Europe flights (especially to big cities like London, Paris, Frankfurt, Zürich, etc.) have a very strong and demanding business travel component to their demand, and second, U.S. carriers face much more intense competition on their Atlantic flights from European airlines who, most likely, won't be getting rid of free Y food on their U.S. flights anytime soon, making it much more difficult for U.S. carriers to make that competitive switch.
 
WeAreUnited
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Fri Aug 17, 2007 3:34 pm

Quoting Warreng24 (Thread starter):
United's ORD-HNL service is similar in duration and distance to many East-Coast to Europe flights. The ORD-HNL

United served meals on this flight MONTHS after AA stopped doing so and starting selling their own version of snack boxes and BOB meals.

United obviously was just putting their flights on par with the competition- which sadly enough resulted in a downgrade of service.
 
qqflyboy
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Fri Aug 17, 2007 9:14 pm

Quoting WeAreUnited (Reply 5):
which sadly enough resulted in a downgrade of service.

It's still funny to me the loss of barely edible food is considered a downgrade. If the boxes are anything like AA's sandwiches and wraps, they are far better than the food that was served for "free." Since tickets are likely cheaper than five years ago, I'd rather pay some extra dough and have something enjoyable to eat.

On the subject of TATL flights, AA is surveying flight attendants right now on service upgrades to the coach meal service including the return of personal bottles of water, fresh dessert, fresh green salad, mid flight candy service and more food for the second-service. Currently the meals in Y have the entre (which are fairly new and far better than anything we've had in a long, long time) that is served with a prepared salad like coleslaw or similar, dinner roll and (sometimes) prepackaged dessert like a brownie or cookies. They're looking at bringing back fresh cake (yeah, maybe the coconut will come back!) and fresh green salads along with bottles of water as opposed to the prepackaged water cups. Nothing new, really, just getting back to the way the service in Y used to be.

Not all of the components are likely to come back though. Another thing they are looking into is adding a sandwich to the second-service snack box. The pizza and salad of before was way too much food and so much of it went to waste. The current box with a sandwich just might be the right mix.

So I guess the answer to the OP's question is: Not any time soon. The meal service is actually about to improve!
The views expressed are mine alone and do not necessarily reflect my employer’s views.
 
bhxdtw
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Fri Aug 17, 2007 10:11 pm

isnt the cost of 2 meals on a TATL service included in the fare ?

J

 Smile
 
FLYGUY767
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Fri Aug 17, 2007 10:50 pm

Quoting QQflyboy (Reply 6):
AA is surveying flight attendants right now on service upgrades to the coach meal service including the return of personal bottles of water, fresh dessert, fresh green salad, mid flight candy service and more food for the second-service. Currently the meals in Y have the entre (which are fairly new and far better than anything we've had in a long, long time) that is served with a prepared salad like coleslaw or similar, dinner roll and (sometimes) prepackaged dessert like a brownie or cookies. They're looking at bringing back fresh cake (yeah, maybe the coconut will come back!) and fresh green salads along with bottles of water as opposed to the prepackaged water cups

WOW!
 eyepopping   eyepopping 

I had no idea things were that thrifty back in Economy on American Airlines TATL services. Water in a cup? Sounds like Aeroflot and not American Airlines. I know one thing that I would change in First and Business is the mug style coffee cups. They are outdated, and arent exactly tasteful. They are fine if you are in your local diner, but not so appropriate for a International First or Business Class cabin.

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
CV990
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Fri Aug 17, 2007 10:55 pm

Hi!

Maybe if that happens anytime ( I personally doubt it...) it's not going to be with european airlines first! Right now the US airlines flying transatlantic don't give any alcoholic beverages but the european airlines give them on Y. I flew 2 months ago AF and I even got a glass of genuine champagne and the F/A asked if I wanted another one!!!
Regards
CV990, the Maserati of the skies!
 
LAXorLGWonDL
Posts: 99
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Fri Aug 17, 2007 11:10 pm

Quoting CV990 (Reply 9):
Right now the US airlines flying transatlantic don't give any alcoholic beverages but the european airlines give them on Y.


I believe DL now serves 1 complimentary alcoholic beverage in Y on TATL flights with the meal service - I've heard this, but did not see anything about it on there website; anyone out there able to chime in?

 Smile
Next Up: STR, JFK, ATL, TPA, ANC
 
FLYGUY767
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Fri Aug 17, 2007 11:16 pm

Quoting LAXorLGWonDL (Reply 10):
I believe DL now serves 1 complimentary alcoholic beverage in Y on TATL flights with the meal service - I've heard this, but did not see anything about it on there website; anyone out there able to chime in?

Do they take Euros and Dollars?

-JD
Summer Trip 2007: DEN HAAG>DUBAI>LONDON>VERONA>COSTA SMERALDA>CAPRI
 
RL757PVD
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Fri Aug 17, 2007 11:24 pm

Quoting LAXorLGWonDL (Reply 10):
I believe DL now serves 1 complimentary alcoholic beverage in Y on TATL flights with the meal service - I've heard this, but did not see anything about it on there website; anyone out there able to chime in?

That is correct
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
luisca
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 12:14 am

Quoting LAXorLGWonDL (Reply 10):

I believe DL now serves 1 complimentary alcoholic beverage in Y on TATL flights with the meal service - I've heard this, but did not see anything about it on there website; anyone out there able to chime in?

I flew ATL-PTY a few months ago (3:55 lengh) and I got a free alcoholic drink, we were 2 hours late so that might have been the case! anybody know if it is now standard practice for DL on international flights regardless of whether or not they are Europe bound?

The Truth of the matter is the US airlines can do whatever they want with their inflight meal service, most educated travellers will avoid a US airline if they can, I specifically told my travel agent to avoid every US airline on my fligths to Europe this winter it cost me 120 bucks more total but I am flying BA, KL, AF and Swiss!

The only reason I would have travelled on a US airline to Europe was if they had significantly (over 200) lower fares.

[Edited 2007-08-17 17:15:13]
If it ain't Boeing (or Embraer ;-)) I ain't Going!
 
LAXorLGWonDL
Posts: 99
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 12:20 am

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 11):
Do they take Euros and Dollars?

-JD

Yes, in my experience they take both on TATL flights. I've been spoiled the last couple of trips, as I was able to upgrade to BusinessElite...but even in coach I'll be happy to get back to Europe (vice Afghanistan) in October!

 Smile
Next Up: STR, JFK, ATL, TPA, ANC
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 12:45 am

Quoting LAXorLGWonDL (Reply 10):
I believe DL now serves 1 complimentary alcoholic beverage in Y on TATL flights with the meal service - I've heard this, but did not see anything about it on there website; anyone out there able to chime in?

NW serves free drinks in Y on TATL flights too ( I don't know how much, since I've only sat up in WBC since I've been >21 on TATL). This was to have the same service that KLM provides
 
FLYACYYZ
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 12:46 am

Quoting Warreng24 (Thread starter):
I suspect that once one carrier leads the way with this, others will soon follow suit.

Sadly, I agree. Nobody wants to be first with this initiative.
Above and Beyond
 
atlantaflyboy
Posts: 59
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 5:49 am

I had heard rumours earlier this year that AA was toying w/ the idea of going to BO on their SNN flights that are sold as all-coach, and if it was successful they were going to BOB on all flights 8:30 and less across the board regardless of destination. Guess that is not happening.
 
ua76heavy
Posts: 41
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 6:04 am

I remember travelling on the HNL-mainland flights (as well as other routes) in the early 90's and seeing most of the food going to waste. A lot of passengers would only eat half of the meal, or make disparaging remarks and refuse to eat it (yet had not probleam eating McDonalds, KFC, Taco Bell or food from other garbage-gut places). Now after complaining about how lousy the food was, people want the return of "complimentary" meals? Either tank-up before you board, bring your food with you or buy a snack box.
 
rdwootty
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Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2005 4:28 am

RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 6:17 am

There is no doubt that the US carriers are not on the same service level or choice for BOB as the European carriers. I am travelling on a LCC carrier next week. BHX-IBZ with Monarch. I will be offered, free earphones, free newspaper,extra legroom seats at a small fee,prebook numbered seat, again at a small fee.The flight block time is about 2.1/2 hours. The meal service will be 2 choices of hot meal with a salad starter ,warm roll and a dessert with water and a coffee for £6. Last time I flew with them the meal was very good and they also offer a hot sandwich with a coffee for £4 and so on... Bar service will also be offered prior to the meal and then after the meal I will be offered a liquor ( Baileys on ice for me) at a small fee.
So all that on a 2.1/2 hour flight. I paid all of £36 each way for the flight but the service will be as good as ever. If I can get my piccy machine to work I will send in my first trip report... ps as the flight will be full of clubbers I am sure there will be a q for the loo.
 Big grin
 
MAH4546
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 6:28 am

You won't see an end to it because of compietition. The day European airlines end meal service, would be when US airlines do, too, and that is obviously not happening any time soon (I was on a Swiss flight between Rome and Zurich last month, and even that had a meal service!).

An example of this is on American Airlines' routes to South America. Miami-Maracaibo is a short flight, roughly the length of Miami-Boston, but AA still has meal service on that flight, and every single flight to South America (as well as Bridgetown and Port of Spain) from the mainland US, because the compieition does it.
a.
 
tundra767
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 6:30 am

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 8):
I would change in First and Business is the mug style coffee cups. They are outdated, and arent exactly tasteful. They are fine if you are in your local diner, but not so appropriate for a International First or Business Class cabin.

Actually these go over very well with customers traveling in Premium Cabins. Many airlines offer these larger mug style mugs both US and International.
 
itsnotfinals
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 6:30 am

Quoting Luisca (Reply 13):
Europe this winter it cost me 120 bucks more total but I am flying BA, KL, AF and Swiss!

So you want to pay 120 dollars extra for about 8.. dollars of "food"? and 4.00 in free drinks? that's a 10x return for the airline  Smile
Speedbird 178 Heavy, FINAL runway 27L
 
BoeingBoy
Posts: 142
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 6:58 am

Look - lets all stop the BS.

2 pilots no FA's no food no drink 2 emt's - thats all we need - we're going from a to b - now sit down shut up give me ya $500 and we'll tell you when we get there.

You people have some nerve. Its transportation baby. do ya get meals in a cab ?

And oh yeah - you 2 people with the $49 tickets - Please wait till the other passengers deplane - we need to talk to you.
10% is the best we can do
 
3201
Posts: 813
Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2004 4:16 pm

RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In

Sat Aug 18, 2007 7:01 am

Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 11):
Do they take Euros and Dollars?

On UA they take USD (5), EUR (4), and GBP (3).

Quoting Tundra767 (Reply 21):
Quoting FLYGUY767 (Reply 8):
I would change in First and Business is the mug style coffee cups. They are outdated, and arent exactly tasteful. They are fine if you are in your local diner, but not so appropriate for a International First or Business Class cabin.
Actually these go over very well with customers traveling in Premium Cabins. Many airlines offer these larger mug style mugs both US and International.

I agree, I like the AA mugs a lot better than the china coffee cups on UA (and in fact a lot of UA frequent fliers request styrofoam instead in premium cabins).

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 20):
(I was on a Swiss flight between Rome and Zurich last month, and even that had a meal service!).

And yet the likes of Iberia and SAS charge extra for everything, even a Coke. Personally, I like the idea of charging for everything in Y, leads to less waste (give food/drinks only to those who really want it), don't have everyone else subsidizing those who choose to eat that stuff, let people decide what they want to bring instead. This point is key:

Quoting UA76Heavy (Reply 18):
I remember travelling on the HNL-mainland flights (as well as other routes) in the early 90's and seeing most of the food going to waste. A lot of passengers would only eat half of the meal, or make disparaging remarks and refuse to eat it (yet had not probleam eating McDonalds, KFC, Taco Bell or food from other garbage-gut places). Now after complaining about how lousy the food was, people want the return of "complimentary" meals?

Exactly.
7 hours aint long-haul
 
flymd
Posts: 166
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 8:55 am

I don't think that US carriers will start a BOB type program for TATL flights because they are still trying to "compete" with International carriers that will likely not start such a service. As it is, the US carriers by and large provide an inferior product.

I love UA but I still have a hard time choosing them for my international flights (and usually go with LH or LX). If they were to further dilute their product, I don't think I would bother to fly them internationally at all.
Fly the friendly skies of life!. Enjoy every minute.
 
Lufthansa
Posts: 2303
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 9:29 am

Well I think specifically in the case of United, it won't happen.

If anything, i think the reverse is likely to happen. Why?

Just watch the videos posted on the "suite dreams" site
in regard to the New United Business Class and first class products.
If you listen to the comments made, there is much talk of wanting to be
the "one us carrier" that competes with the international carriers at the same
level. At the same time we heard of upgrades being extended to economy
with new PTVs etc.

What this means is I believe United sees money in Long Haul flights, and that
it has to have better standards if it is going to win everybody's business. There was once
a time in the 1990s, that if you got on a UA 777 flight to europe you got a much better product
then you would have if you got on say, Lufthansa or KLM. (in economy we're talking here).
I see United's recent moves as signals this is the direction they want to head back to. Delta seem to have
signalled similar moves with their product upgrades. So in the case of both of these carriers, I would say I'd actually
expect what is on offer in economy in terms of meals to actually INCREASE instead of be eliminated.

AA however is another animal all together. While i think they would be stupid to do it, and their flights to South America even on very short flights are full service, if anybody attempts to make this move it will be AA. Sometimes this airline never ceases to surprise me... its is just TOOO cheap sometimes. But honestly, I don't even think AA would do this, based on what's been said about trails for upgrades. Think about it? if AA did this on say NYC-LHR flights, don't you think you'd see Virgin Altantic sticking ads all around the place promoting its 'full service' product?
 
baw716
Posts: 1460
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2003 7:02 pm

RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 11:23 am

Quoting BoeingBoy (Reply 23):
Look - lets all stop the BS.

Ah...what BS? This is a legitimate discussion about meal service on transatlantic flights and why that exists vs. the domestic markets.

Quoting BoeingBoy (Reply 23):
2 pilots no FA's no food no drink 2 emt's - thats all we need - we're going from a to b - now sit down shut up give me ya $500 and we'll tell you when we get there.

Have you ever had to evacuate an aircraft? Good luck evacuating a 757 (smallest bird flying Economy across the pond) with two people. Also, on an 8 hour flight, people have to eat and drink...if not, they will get sick. OK, there might be an argument for not offering free meals, but that is meat of this discussion. As to your comment about sit down, shut up etc...not sure how to respond to that and not be offensive.

Quoting BoeingBoy (Reply 23):
You people have some nerve. Its transportation baby. do ya get meals in a cab ?

There's transportation and then there's transportation. If you attempt to compare flying in an aircraft to sitting in a cab, its apples and oranges, baby.

Quoting BoeingBoy (Reply 23):
And oh yeah - you 2 people with the $49 tickets - Please wait till the other passengers deplane - we need to talk to you.

Your point being???

I guess my point in addressing each of your points is, ah, what was your point? If you are trying to be funny, congrats, you get the sarcasm award. If you are trying to be serious? Try harder.

baw716
David L. Lamb, fmr Area Mgr Alitalia SFO 1998-2002, fmr Regional Analyst SFO-UAL 1992-1998
 
pshifrin
Posts: 246
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2001 10:02 am

RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 12:00 pm

We flew AA non-stop DFW-OGG in February. Meal "service" was drinks + BOB. Problem was there was just ONE BOB choice, the salad, and they announced that there weren't enough if everyone wanted one. 8+ hour flight. It was a complete f-ing disgrace. Hey but the tickets were free and i was smart enough to buy lots of good stuff at DFW. Not everyone on that flight reads a.net and probably had no idea how bad it was going to be and arrived at OGG very hungry.
 
tundra767
Posts: 400
Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2005 9:33 am

RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:42 pm

Quoting 3201 (Reply 24):
I agree, I like the AA mugs a lot better than the china coffee cups on UA (and in fact a lot of UA frequent fliers request styrofoam instead in premium cabins).

The large AA style mugs are currently used in United First on P.S. flight only. Nice to see but would be even better to see on more transcons and International flights.
 
Viscount724
Posts: 18991
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 7:32 pm

RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sun Aug 19, 2007 9:03 am

Quoting Baw716 (Reply 27):
Good luck evacuating a 757 (smallest bird flying Economy across the pond)

Not quite. AC uses the A319 on their current seasonal service YYT-LHR.


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SkyexRamper
Posts: 1952
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RE: End Of Complimentary Meals On Tatl Flights In Y?

Sun Aug 19, 2007 12:47 pm

I wish Midwest would bring back their Midwest Express meals.....5 star dining and always more food than you could eat. When they done sized from true meals to snacks, before eliminating all major snacks, they were spending $16 per meal. I would be happy to pay $20 for that these days. It was actual food, high quality food.
Good Luck to all Skyway Pilots! It's been great working with you!