doug
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PHX Intl Plans

Thu Oct 11, 2007 10:57 pm

Its probably laid out on the PHX web site but dealing with my local MIA website which tries but I think it would be better to get the info from forum members.How many intl flights are currently offered and to where in particular and what are the future destinations looking like.
 
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treebeard787
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:16 am

Hey,
The most likely new International flights from PHX will probably be with LH to FRA and possibly MX to MEX. Otherwise new flights will most likely not happen untill US Airways gets it's A332s and or A350s.

You also might want to check out this site, has some good info on PHX.
http://www.visitingphx.com/airlinelists.html

Here are the only Int'l flights I know of from PHX.
6x weekly flights to LHR by BA,,
Daily flights to MEX by US and I think AM,
Seasonal flights to SJO by US,
Daily flights to PVR by US,
Daily flights to HMO by US and AM,
Daily flights to CUN by US,
Flights to SJD by US,
Daily flights to YYZ by US and AC,
Daily flights to YEG by US,
Daily flights to YVR by US
Daily/Seasonal flights to YYC by US, AC and Westjet,
Seasonal flights to YWG by Westjet and I think AC,
I think thats most of them, I may have missed some.
Allons-y!
 
Flighty
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:36 am

PHX has an LHR flight on BA, its only Europe flight.

PHX has no Asia flight.

PHX has YVR, YEG and YYC, and possibly YYZ.

PHX has MEX, ZIH, CUN, I think ACA, GDL and san jose del cabo.

Also, an SJO flight that is not daily but regular.

Unless I am forgetting something, that is about it.


Rumors of the future: FRA on US/LH. NRT (unlikely IMO; PHX is mostly white people / Hispanic).

Also, I have heard PHX-PPT could be done by US during winter months using 767, if they wish.
 
LHboyatDTW
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:48 am

Mainly to Mexico with AM, HP/US, and soon MX. Also AC flies to PHX. BA has a daily 744 from LHR as well.

LH used to fly to PHX, but left in 2004. However, there are several convincing rumors stating that LH is interested in restarting PHX. I've never set foot in PHX, but I personally would love to see LH restart FRA-PHX-FRA.

As for daydreaming, I'm viewing AF/KL to do either CDG or AMS with an A332.  cloudnine 

That's just my two cents (although it's only a penny for your thoughts. What's up with that?  Confused )
The air in the clouds is very pure and fine, bracing and delicious because it's the same the angels breathe.
 
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treebeard787
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:56 am

Hey,
The most likely new Int'l flight will be by LH to FRA and possibly MX to MEX, Otherwise there most likely won't be any new flights until US Airways gets their A332s or A350s.

You should check out this website, It has alot of info on PHX.
http://www.visitingphx.com/airlinelists.html

Here are the International flights I know of,
European service,
6x weekly to London-LHR by BA, with B747

Mexico-service,
Daily to MEX by US and I think AM, with A319/320 and 737.

Daily to PVR by US with Airbus jets,

Daily to HMO by US with Dash-8s? and AM with MD80s

Daily to SJD by US with B737-300s or Airbus,

Daily to CUN by US with Airbus A320s,

Daily to MTY by US?

Daily to GDL by US,

Central America service-
Seasonal to SJO by US with A319s,

Canadian service-
Daily to YYZ by US and AC, with A320s. and either A319s or E-190s,

Daily to YVR by US with Airbus jets,

Daily to YEG by US with Airbus,

Daily to YYC by US and Seasonal by AC and Westjet with Airbus, E190s and B73Gs,

Seasonal to YWG by AC and I think Westjet with E190s and B73Gs,

I think thats most of them, I may have missed some.
Allons-y!
 
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treebeard787
Posts: 673
Joined: Sun Jul 24, 2005 11:03 am

RE: PHX Intl Plans

Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:57 am

Hey,
The most likely new Int'l flight will be LH to FRA and possibly MX to MEX, Otherwise there most likely won't be new flights
until US Airways gets their A332s or A350s.

You should check out this website, It has alot of info on PHX.
http://www.visitingphx.com/airlinelists.html

Here are the International flights I know of,
European service,
6x weekly to London-LHR by BA, with B747

Mexico-service,
Daily to MEX by US and I think AM, with A319/320 and 737.

Daily to PVR by US with Airbus jets,

Daily to HMO by US with Dash-8s? and AM with MD80s

Daily to SJD by US with B737-300s or Airbus,

Daily to CUN by US with Airbus A320s,

Daily to MTY by US?

Daily to GDL by US,

Central America service-
Seasonal to SJO by US with A319s,

Canadian service-
Daily to YYZ by US and AC, with A320s. and either A319s or E-190s,

Daily to YVR by US with Airbus jets,

Daily to YEG by US with Airbus,

Daily to YYC by US and Seasonal by AC and Westjet with Airbus, E190s and B73Gs,

Seasonal to YWG by AC and I think Westjet with E190s and B73Gs,

I think thats most of them, I may have missed some.
Allons-y!
 
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treebeard787
Posts: 673
Joined: Sun Jul 24, 2005 11:03 am

RE: PHX Intl Plans

Fri Oct 12, 2007 2:58 am

Hey,
The most likely new Int'l flight will be LH to FRA and possibly MX to MEX, Otherwise there most likely won't be new flights
until US Airways gets their A332s or A350s.

You should check out this website, It has alot of info on PHX.
http://www.visitingphx.com/airlinelists.html

Here are the International flights I know of,
European service,
6x weekly to London-LHR by BA, with B747

Mexico-service,
Daily to MEX by US and I think AM, with A319/320 and 737.

Daily to PVR by US with Airbus jets,

Daily to HMO by US with Dash-8s? and AM with MD80s

Daily to SJD by US with B737-300s or Airbus,

Daily to CUN by US with Airbus A320s,

Daily to MTY by US?

Daily to GDL by US,

Central America service-
Seasonal to SJO by US with A319s,

Canadian service-
Daily to YYZ by US and AC, with A320s. and either A319s or E-190s,

Daily to YVR by US with Airbus jets,

Daily to YEG by US with Airbus,

Daily to YYC by US and Seasonal by AC and Westjet with Airbus, E190s and B73Gs,

Seasonal to YWG by AC and I think Westjet with E190s and B73Gs,

I think thats most of them, I may have missed some.
Allons-y!
 
LHboyatDTW
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Fri Oct 12, 2007 4:10 am

Mexico : AM, HP/US, and (soon?) MX

Canada: AC

UK: BA

Rumors are floating around concerning LH's return to PHX. That I would love to see personally.  cloudnine 

Pipedream(s) = AF/KL to PHX from either AMS or CDG. Could AF's A332s even fly into PHX with the range and heat factors in consideration?
The air in the clouds is very pure and fine, bracing and delicious because it's the same the angels breathe.
 
laca773
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Fri Oct 12, 2007 5:43 pm

It would be great to see LH return to PHX especially with US now being combined fully with HP. I'm sure PHX flyers would greatly apreciate the option of being able to fly nonstop to Europe without having to connect in hellish PHL.

How is AM's PHX-MEX doing? Any chance they will increase their flights to PHX i.e., PHX-GDL? It's hard to believe US's GDL only dictates using a CR9. Is this market that small mainline a/c won't be economically feasibleWith it being US's westcoast hub I'd think there would be enough of a demand for them to utilize at least a 319. Thoughts?

LACA773
 
2travel2know
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Fri Oct 12, 2007 6:06 pm

Eventually It would make sense for US to fly PHX-GUA/SAL (or TA). Specially since TA is getting close to Star buddy UA.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
AlexPorter
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Fri Oct 12, 2007 11:09 pm

YWG is not served by AC from PHX - it is only served by WestJet and it's seasonal.

BY TERMINAL, including seasonal flights:
TERMINAL 2
Air Canada: Calgary, Toronto

TERMINAL 3
Nothing international, although Hawaiian serves Honolulu from Terminal 3.

TERMINAL 4
US Airways: Acapulco, Cabo, Calgary, Cancun, Edmonton, Guadalajara, Guaymas, Hermosillo, Ixtapa, Manzanillo, Mazatlan, Mexico City, Puerto Vallarta, San Jose (Costa Rica), Toronto, Vancouver
- Also, while not international, US Airways flies to Honolulu, Kona, Lihue, Kahului, and Anchorage.
Aeromexico: Guadalajara, Hermosillo, Mexico City
British Airways: London Heathrow
Westjet: Calgary, Edmonton, Winnipeg

- Again, not international, but ATA serves Honolulu and Kahului from Terminal 4.
Last Flight: SCX701 MSP-PHX B738 8Jan2008
 
thegooddoctor
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Sat Oct 13, 2007 12:42 am

Quoting Flighty (Reply 2):
Rumors of the future: FRA on US/LH. NRT (unlikely IMO; PHX is mostly white people / Hispanic).

...you know it's funny - white people and hispanics from PHX fly to places where there are not so many white and/or hispanic people (usually for business - since whites and hispanics wouldn't be caught dead visiting non-white/hispanic places for pleasure)

Turns out all of those japanese kids going home to visit their japanese grandmothers for thanksgiving aren't what create the big profits for US-Japan flights. PHX's position as a US hub is likely what will draw additional intl service - or at least be a big selling point. Meaning that there could be non-white/non-hispanic (more white/hispanic) people from cities other than PHX who would be on these flights.
The GoodDoctor
 
MAH4546
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Sat Oct 13, 2007 12:58 am

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 9):
Eventually It would make sense for US to fly PHX-GUA/SAL (or TA). Specially since TA is getting close to Star buddy UA.

US Airways can't even get PHX-SJO to perform properly, let alone PHX-GUA/SAL.
a.
 
2travel2know
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Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: PHX Intl Plans

Sat Oct 13, 2007 2:05 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 12):
US Airways can't even get PHX-SJO to perform properly, let alone PHX-GUA/SAL.

It's because the schedule, bad hub timing or because the type of market SJO is? If it's so bad why doesn't change to PHX-LIR?
Be sure that if US would fly to GUA and SAL, they wouldn't have to deal with leisure travelers as SJO but with lots of O/D VFR traffic.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
MMEPHX
Posts: 143
Joined: Mon Mar 29, 2004 10:54 am

RE: PHX Intl Plans

Sat Oct 13, 2007 3:50 am

For Phoenix to obtain additional long haul International service (Europe/Asia etc.) it needs to be able to generate business class traffic. The O&D business demand isn't here locally, otherwise BA would be running 7 days a week instead of 6. Phoenix has minimal major business HQ's and there isn't much point traveling say SFO-PHX-FRA on US/LH when a nonstop is available SFO-FRA (just one example). A full Y section just does not pay the bills if J/F are practically empty.

I would love to see more international service at PHX, especially to Europe (personal needs bias!) but I don't see it happening very soon. As a comparison PDX is a smaller market in terms of population, closer to an already major long haul "hub" (SEA) and yet still has flights to FRA, AMS (soon) NRT and various Mexico/Canada destinations. PDX has the business demand.

I hope that one day PHX can attract more international service but we may have to wait a while
 
thegooddoctor
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Sun Oct 14, 2007 10:50 am

Quoting MMEPHX (Reply 14):
The O&D business demand isn't here locally, otherwise BA would be running 7 days a week instead of 6.

One word: HUB. PHX isn't a strong INTL destination on its own - that's always been a given. US Airways makes the situation a different story. PHX isn't going to be the intl destination PHL is, but anyone west or south of PHL flying to the orient or south america, would probably much rather make a connection in PHX than in PHL. Actually, given PHL's delay rate, just about anybody who's flown through PHL regularly would probably rather connect through PHX...
The GoodDoctor
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Sun Oct 14, 2007 7:22 pm

Quoting LHboyatDTW (Reply 7):
Could AF's A332s even fly into PHX with the range and heat factors in consideration?

Yes.

Quoting Thegooddoctor (Reply 15):
but anyone west or south of PHL flying to the orient or south america, would probably much rather make a connection in PHX than in PHL.

...why on earth would anyone from just about anywhere in the country (other than the far SouthWest itself) want to connect to S.America via PHX instead of PHL/CLT?
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
flyb
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Sun Oct 14, 2007 7:26 pm

I wish AC would codeshare with US on the YEG-YYC-YVR to PHX and LAS routes. Would open PHX to a lot more Canadian traffic. I guess WJ has good connection for Canadains.
 
Flighty
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Sun Oct 14, 2007 10:16 pm

Quoting Thegooddoctor (Reply 11):

...you know it's funny - white people and hispanics from PHX fly to places where there are not so many white and/or hispanic people (usually for business - since whites and hispanics wouldn't be caught dead visiting non-white/hispanic places for pleasure)

Thanks for the lesson. I think you are right to some extent. However, look at what we have at PHX. Europe, a lot of Mexico flights, and zero Asian flights.

Geography explains the lack of Asia flights. But so, too, does demographics. Demographics can be oversold, and maybe I was doing that. But it can't be ignored entirely. PHX is plenty big enough for a Tokyo flight. Why don't they have one? SEA, SFO and the fact that there really is no Asian affinity, business or pleasure-wise, in the PHX area.
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Mon Oct 15, 2007 1:18 am

Quoting Flighty (Reply 18):
Geography explains the lack of Asia flights. But so, too, does demographics. Demographics can be oversold, and maybe I was doing that. But it can't be ignored entirely. PHX is plenty big enough for a Tokyo flight. Why don't they have one? SEA, SFO and the fact that there really is no Asian affinity, business or pleasure-wise, in the PHX area.

...taken a look at your neighbor to the N.W. lately?

LAS has barely a third of PHX's population, and similar demographics-- yet has several Asian flights/carriers making calls. It's all about business and yield. For the majority of intercons, particularly by non state-owned carriers, ethnic demographics are rather far down the list.
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
thegooddoctor
Posts: 418
Joined: Thu Nov 10, 2005 8:12 am

RE: PHX Intl Plans

Mon Oct 15, 2007 10:37 pm

Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 16):
...why on earth would anyone from just about anywhere in the country (other than the far SouthWest itself) want to connect to S.America via PHX instead of PHL/CLT?

Because connecting through PHL SUCKS. I don't want to pick on PHL, I actually like the city (at least as it's developed into), but PHL isn't exactly the happiest place on earth to make a connection. My point is, unless you are north of PHL or on the coast (not so out of the way), why would you fly out of the way to connect at PHL over PHX?

Quoting Flighty (Reply 18):
Demographics can be oversold, and maybe I was doing that. But it can't be ignored entirely. PHX is plenty big enough for a Tokyo flight. Why don't they have one? SEA, SFO and the fact that there really is no Asian affinity, business or pleasure-wise, in the PHX area.

How many people connect at LAX/SFO/SEA to get to asia? See ConcordeBoy's comment below...

Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 19):

...taken a look at your neighbor to the N.W. lately?

LAS has barely a third of PHX's population, and similar demographics-- yet has several Asian flights/carriers making calls. It's all about business and yield. For the majority of intercons, particularly by non state-owned carriers, ethnic demographics are rather far down the list.

Spot on brotha
The GoodDoctor
 
WA727
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Mon Oct 15, 2007 11:01 pm

Regardless of which airline is first (LH or US), PHX is yet to see the A330.
Don't just stand there, go get some glue!
 
MAH4546
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Mon Oct 15, 2007 11:03 pm

Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 19):
LAS has barely a third of PHX's population, and similar demographics-- yet has several Asian flights/carriers making calls.

Several? They have PAL flights via Vancouver (that market more to Vegas' large Filipino community than anything else) and three non-stops a week to Seoul.

JAL, Northwest Airlines, and Singapore Airlines can tell you what a great market Vegas-Asia is.
a.
 
Flighty
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Mon Oct 15, 2007 11:44 pm

Quoting Thegooddoctor (Reply 20):
How many people connect at LAX/SFO/SEA to get to asia?

SFO? Lots. LAX? Lots. Together, they serve the entire PHX to Asia market, I would imagine. SEA, not much yet, but it is gathering Asia flights over time.

PHX is well served to Asia. If you boys think PHX should have 5 Asian flights, good for you... maybe start your own airline and serve it? Tell us how it goes?  Smile
 
USAirALB
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Mon Oct 15, 2007 11:48 pm

How could a US 767 do PPT?
E135/E140/E145/E70/E75/E90/CR2/CR7/CR9/717/732/733/734/735/73G/738/739/752/753/762/772/77W/319/320/321/333/343
 
vega
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Tue Oct 16, 2007 12:06 am

Quoting Thegooddoctor (Reply 20):
Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 16):
...why on earth would anyone from just about anywhere in the country (other than the far SouthWest itself) want to connect to S.America via PHX instead of PHL/CLT?

Because connecting through PHL SUCKS. I don't want to pick on PHL, I actually like the city (at least as it's developed into), but PHL isn't exactly the happiest place on earth to make a connection. My point is, unless you are north of PHL or on the coast (not so out of the way), why would you fly out of the way to connect at PHL over PHX?

So you feel that one should be willing to spend an extra 2800 round trip nms inlight to RIO from STL via PHX just to avoid PHL airport? And that disparity applies to all of South America, except the far North. What a great observation!
We are but a moment in this vast Universe and when gone we will never have existed.
 
thegooddoctor
Posts: 418
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RE: PHX Intl Plans

Tue Oct 16, 2007 3:06 am

Quoting Flighty (Reply 23):
If you boys think PHX should have 5 Asian flights, good for you... maybe start your own airline and serve it? Tell us how it goes? Smile

Huh. I think we were all thinking 1-2 destinations over time. Add the O/D traffic from PHX (not arguing for big numbers here guys...) to the connecting traffic and all I think we're asserting is that it's viable.

Quoting Vega (Reply 25):

So you feel that one should be willing to spend an extra 2800 round trip nms inlight to RIO from STL via PHX just to avoid PHL airport? And that disparity applies to all of South America, except the far North. What a great observation!

You are telling me STL-Asia does not makes sense via PHX? As for South America, there is half of the country that isn't necessarily as close to PHL as STL: would you fly from SEA/PDX/YVR to South America via PHL? How about from DFW? To answer your question, I would pick an awful lot of places to stop before PHL.
The GoodDoctor