777fan
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UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 1:12 am

Long time, no thread so here goes nothing...

I recently had the pleasure of taking a quick weekend hop over to Chicago for an extended visit with some family, friends, and clients and flew UA (as always) - trip report to come. While waiting for my return flight to BWI to begin boarding, I took some time to walk the length of both the B and C concourses that UA calls home (can't really count the orphaned gates in T2).

At any rate, I couldn't help but notice that IMO, it appears that UA's B and C concourses (terminal 1) really aren't big enough to handle the amount of passengers that transit them on any given day. The gate areas are generally too small (60-80 seats at most gates), the concessions (particularly the restaurants) are woefully short of seating (the Jazz Cafe food court in concourse C is way too small), and the main thoroughfares are extremely narrow. This particular issue becomes evident when pax waiting to board spill into the main walkway. The bathrooms are also heavily congested more often than not.

After recently transiting UA's other hubs at SFO and DEN, I couldn't help but wonder if anyone else (like UA?!) has noticed this and if anyone knows of any plans to address the lack of space at what is supposed to be UA's premier gateway? Whatever they do, I hope they leave the style alone - it's still a great building...



777fan
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uadc8contrail
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 1:28 am

777,
i have noticed that alot as well, i spent 12 yrs working there and when we left out of C23 last month, i was in the hall way next to the moving walkway and kept on thinking how did we board dc10s/767s on the east side of the C side from C9-C23...we were on a 757 and it was cramped as hell, i also noticed there is no more space on the floor between the gates as it has been taken over by oversized kiosks. i walked around with my son and actually laughed to myself to see a 777 at gate C29, my god that area around 29-31 was cramped. i knew that helmut had a clause when he designed it that he had all control over changes, but i guess that doesnt apply anymore. a needed immediate change is to get rid of that late 80s era seats....that plastic sucks
bus driver.......move that bus:)
 
kstateinALB
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 1:31 am

Quoting 777fan (Thread starter):
it appears that UA's B and C concourses (terminal 1) really aren't big enough to handle the amount of passengers that transit them on any given day.

I disagree, I think that they do have enough space to handle the amount of passengers, it's just when two international flights board at the same time when you see the biggest issues.

Quoting 777fan (Thread starter):
The gate areas are generally too small (60-80 seats at most gates),

However I do agree with this, usually people have to stand at a gate area 30 minutes before.

Quoting 777fan (Thread starter):
This particular issue becomes evident when pax waiting to board spill into the main walkway.

I think this has to do with people lining up to rush on board when their seating area is called, not as much as not having enough room.

Quoting 777fan (Thread starter):
The bathrooms are also heavily congested more often than not.

I guess it depend's on which ones you go to, for example, the ones in the far part of the B terminal are usually free of people surprisingly.
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777fan
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 1:54 am

Quoting KstateinALB (Reply 2):
I disagree, I think that they do have enough space to handle the amount of passengers, it's just when two international flights board at the same time when you see the biggest issues.

Try walking down to the semi-circle ends of the C-concourse. Back in the pre-RJ, gate-B22 mega-UAX-expansion days, they used to be home to flights to/from smaller markets (CMH, DSM, IND, on 737s, etc) but are now called upon to routinely handle loaded 757s and A320s.

International flights tend to board from C-16, C18, C18A which thankfully were designed to handle heavies as they have just enough seats in the gate area and are pushed away a bit from the main walkways in the concourse.

I almost forgot to mention the RCCs at ORD...sad, sad, sad.



777fan
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gigneil
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 1:58 am

Go to anywhere else in ORD and ask yourself this again.

The United terminal is positively heavenly compared to AA's, and certainly anywhere else there.

The concourses are wide and airy, the seating areas spacious and clean. Yes, it might not be as large as needed but it is in drastically better shape than the entire rest of the airport.

UA's SFO facilities are inferior, unless you are referring to the concourse G gates which opened recently. Clearly DEN, open in 1995 and designed for UA, is a superior facility but you'll find the concessions there lacking.

NS
 
777fan
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 2:14 am

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 4):
The United terminal is positively heavenly compared to AA's, and certainly anywhere else there.

The concourses are wide and airy, the seating areas spacious and clean. Yes, it might not be as large as needed but it is in drastically better shape than the entire rest of the airport.

Yes, much better than anything else at ORD although the check in and baggage claim of AA's T3 are in the midst of a nice update.

I beg to differ about SFO - concourse F is plenty wide, has a killer foodcourt with plenty of seating, gate areas with good seating, plenty of big windows, spacious (comparatively speaking to ORD) bathrooms, and a nice (again, by UA standards) Red Carpet Club.


777fan
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SLCUT2777
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 2:59 am

UA's facilities at ORD are MUCH better per say than what DL has at SLC. Now there is a hub facility that is showing its age.
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apodino
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 3:07 am

Lets clairify something here. United's Mainline facilities were built for United, and while I agree concession choice isn't great, the concourses are somewhat wide, and I have never had a problem with seating while waiting for a flight.

On the other hand, if you are on an Express flight, there is a very good chance you will be departing from the F concourse in Terminal 2, unless you are lucky enough to be on a 170 or a select EX Plus flight. The F concourse, despite being recently renovated, is a disgrace. The waiting areas are real small, so you can easily be forced to stand. There are not enough gates, so frequently three flights are sharing one gate, and its real easy to end up on the wrong flight. The concessions are a joke. And there is a so called shuttle bus from the c Gates, but you have to walk down a narrow staircase to get there, and there are no escalators. As much as it pains me to say this, they need to take a lesson from USAirways in PHL about how to run a shuttle operation to express. And the shuttle is only for C gates, if you are on the B gates, you are walking for a while. What I think they may want to consider is either extending the B22 pier all the way down Taxiway H, which would be an engineering headache so I doubt it will happen. Or with room being opened by 14R-32L being decomissioned, a new midfield express terminal could be built, and this would also free up gate space in Terminal 2.

SFO is not that bad a hub for United, but again the RJ facilities are inadequate in my opinion. Truthfully speaking, all the UA hubs are subpar for the industry save for DEN, which is a new airport.

I don't think American has bad facilities at all. The Eagle facility in G is real nice, plus H and K are easy on the eyes and are in somewhat good shape, plus there is a reasonably sized food court as well.

If you want to start a discussion about which airlines hubs are the best, taking the legacy carriers here is the order I would rank them:

1. Northwest: As much as they suck in many areas, DTW and MSP are two very fine facilities and never have delay problems at all except for recently at MSP due to runway construction. MEM is outdated, but its still better than many places.
2. Continental: Even with all of EWR's headaches, the terminal itself is a fine facility, IAH is great, and CLE is real nice as well.
3. American: ORD is not a bad facility. Even though A and C in DFW are outdated, the skytrain makes connections a breeze, plus the airport can handle a lot of traffic. MIA has improved a lot with the north terminal.
4. Delta: JFK brings them down a bit. That terminal is a dump and needs to go. SLC is a bit outdated as well. But ATL has improved a lot and its not that bad, but needs a better RJ facility. CVG is their best facility. The comair terminal is great but it needs jetways.
5. USAirways: Would be higher if not for PHL. PHL has all its problems, but does have a great RJ terminal that is easy to navigate. The concessions in PHL are pretty good too. CLT, PHX, and LAS are all great hubs, and connections in any of them are a breeze, and all three are also great O and D airports as well.
6. United. See above.
 
uadc8contrail
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 3:29 am

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 6):
UA's facilities at ORD are MUCH better per say than what DL has at SLC. Now there is a hub facility that is showing its age.

SLC
your kidding right????....slc is WAY BETTER airport to connect in than ord,,,,even a bad wx day in slc is hands down easier to navigate......every mainline concourse in slc is much wider less cluttered with the kiosks than ord hands down...even the E gates are alot easier to wait in than the F concourse at ord
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panam330
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 3:30 am

Quoting Apodino (Reply 7):
3. American: ORD is not a bad facility. Even though A and C in DFW are outdated, the skytrain makes connections a breeze, plus the airport can handle a lot of traffic. MIA has improved a lot with the north terminal.

Lest you forget AA's multi-billion dollar terminal at JFK. It's absolutely incredible. I wish AA flew JFK-SYR so I could actually utilize this facility.

Quoting Apodino (Reply 7):
4. Delta: JFK brings them down a bit. That terminal is a dump and needs to go. SLC is a bit outdated as well. But ATL has improved a lot and its not that bad, but needs a better RJ facility. CVG is their best facility. The comair terminal is great but it needs jetways.

Am I seriously the only one that likes JFK? It's almost certainly because the Worldport is unique, not because it's a passenger-friendly facility. The other terminal (2) is a total dump, though. Needs to go. As for ATL, it may be boring in terms of architecture, but it's one of the nicest, easiest facilities I've ever come across. Sure, the RJ gates could use a little organizing, but given the sheer volume of what goes in and out of there, it's not half bad. CVG is just fine, if not for that annoying shuttle. I wish there were an underground walkway, similar to CLE's.
 
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Coal
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 3:41 am

I'm not very familiar with the terminals are ORD, but here are my  twocents 

Last June I arrived from SIN via NRT on UA and thought the terminal looked very nice and new. However, the terminal from where I took the ORD-MIA flight looked very old and tired, and had way too much "UA blue" paint everywhere.

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ckfred
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 5:52 am

Quoting 777fan (Reply 3):
Try walking down to the semi-circle ends of the C-concourse. Back in the pre-RJ, gate-B22 mega-UAX-expansion days, they used to be home to flights to/from smaller markets (CMH, DSM, IND, on 737s, etc) but are now called upon to routinely handle loaded 757s and A320s.

Actually, the semi-circle for B22 used to be for UAX turboprops. I know I used to see several British turboprops parked along there, and possible som Convair 580s. That was back in the late 80s and early 90s.
 
sparkingwave
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 6:12 am

My personal theory is that the facilities were designed to be a little smaller so that people could warm each other up with their own respiration as well as the central heating. When Chicago gets cold, its gets COLD! And feeling that cold blast in the jetway to the aircraft while boarding in the dead of winter is nothing to sneeze at!

The other bad thing is that Starbucks and McDonald's gets really crowded in the morning while people are waiting for their flights. I can't wait forever for my sausage biscuit and lowfat latte!

In the end, while the individual gates seem small there seems to be a good job of aircraft turnover to minimize overcrowding. It can even be fun to people watch there. And that underground neon walkway is the coolest thing I've seen at an airport!
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PavlovsDog
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 8:43 am

Anybody know what's going on the proposed West Terminal? Will United be the primary tenant there?

http://egov.cityofchicago.org/webpor...WebPortal/COC_ATTACH/final_alp.pdf
 
777fan
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 1:45 pm

Quoting Coal (Reply 10):
Last June I arrived from SIN via NRT on UA and thought the terminal looked very nice and new. However, the terminal from where I took the ORD-MIA flight looked very old and tired, and had way too much "UA blue" paint everywhere.

Sounds like you arrived in the "newer" T5 and transferred over to T1 to connect. It's somewhat ironic that the "blue" paint you referred to has remained pretty much as is since the terminal was built over 15 years ago. It's almost as if the color scheme for UA's new livery originated from the color of the B and C concourses at ORD.

Quoting Ckfred (Reply 11):
Actually, the semi-circle for B22 used to be for UAX turboprops.

Yes, I'm aware of that - I was referring to the C concourse semi-circles being used for smaller markets that received jet service before the RJ invasion. I can remember B22 hosting flights to/from MKE (BAe 146), MLI, MAD, etc.

Quoting SparkingWave (Reply 12):
When Chicago gets cold, its gets COLD! And feeling that cold blast in the jetway to the aircraft while boarding in the dead of winter is nothing to sneeze at!

Tell me about it. My most recent flight to ORD from HNL (nonstop UA1) in February landed about 15 minutes early but took about 30 minutes to deplane because the jetway at C17 had a one-inch thick coating of ice on it. When I left HNL thevening before, it was sunny and 81 degrees. Upon landing at ORD at 5:05am the next morning, the temperature (not including wind chill) was -2 F. Naturally, our redeye flight was the first to use the gate that morning and the ground crews (who were struggling with the temps and blowing snow) hadn't had a chance to unfreeze the jetway. Suffice to say, the 83 degree temperature change was quite a shock (understatement of a lifetime).

Quoting PavlovsDog (Reply 13):
Will United be the primary tenant there?

That's one of the things I was wondering when I started the thread. I can't imagine they would given the time it'd take to shuttle over there. As many UA ORDers know, a connection from, say C4 to B7 can be tight enough and that's with the underground walkway! As Apodino pointed out, connecting from T1 to T2 (F concourse) is ridiculous (I've been lucky enough to only have to do it once).



777fan
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laca773
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 2:17 pm

Quoting KstateinALB (Reply 2):
I think that they do have enough space to handle the amount of passengers, it's just when two international flights board at the same time when you see the biggest issues

I was on UA 129 last evening which was operated with a 319 and the boarding area @ C21 was tight with all the standbys.
I think they have a very nice terminal and they are still updating it a lot. I love the new departure and arrival boards they have. The only thing I see a major problem with is when there are over two hundred people clearing security and tney only have one area open. That's a pain in the damn tuckus.
If UA might try and concentrate on keeping the international departures grouped together during the evening peak to Europe and the UK and late morning to the Far East, it might help things. To expand on that, remove some of these gates and make them dual jetway gates like C10A & C10B. Then when they are not being used for international departures they can be used for heavies going to LAX/SFO/SEA/Hawaii.

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 4):
Go to anywhere else in ORD and ask yourself this again.

The United terminal is positively heavenly compared to AA's, and certainly anywhere else there.

Agree 100 %.

LACA773
 
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SLCUT2777
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 2:24 pm

Quoting Uadc8contrail (Reply 8):
your kidding right????....slc is WAY BETTER airport to connect in than ord,,,,even a bad wx day in slc is hands down easier to navigate......every mainline concourse in slc is much wider less cluttered with the kiosks than ord hands down...even the E gates are alot easier to wait in than the F concourse at ord

Please read reply #7 above:

Quoting Apodino (Reply 7):
Delta: JFK brings them down a bit. That terminal is a dump and needs to go. SLC is a bit outdated as well. But ATL has improved a lot and its not that bad, but needs a better RJ facility. CVG is their best facility. The comair terminal is great but it needs jetways.

SLC needs in my estimation (it is my home airport--and an embarrassment to me for my community!) a substantial overhaul. Thankfully it is in the works...
DELTA Air Lines; The Only Way To Fly from Salt Lake City; Let the Western Heritage always be with Delta!
 
UnitedFirst
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 2:44 pm

Quoting 777fan (Reply 3):
Try walking down to the semi-circle ends of the C-concourse. Back in the pre-RJ, gate-B22 mega-UAX-expansion days, they used to be home to flights to/from smaller markets (CMH, DSM, IND, on 737s, etc) but are now called upon to routinely handle loaded 757s and A320s

Isn't the B18-B22 'arc' almost entirely used for Ted flights now?

Certainly the color scheme and Ted paraphenalia everywhere would suggest that...
 
777fan
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 3:01 pm

Quoting UnitedFirst (Reply 17):
Isn't the B18-B22 'arc' almost entirely used for Ted flights now?

Nope, I've seen Ted flights parked all over the place although yes, it seems that many of them congregate in that area. UA's ORD map page doesn't denote a particular gate area for Ted. Likewise, a quick check of Ted flights from ORD to LAS shows that they're pretty much all over the B concourse: B11, B18, B22, and B5.

http://www.united.com/page/article/0,6722,1113,00.html


777fan
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Algoz
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 3:26 pm

If you want to see crap facilities (UA or otherwise) come to LHR......
 
kstateinALB
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 4:12 pm

Quoting 777fan (Reply 3):
Try walking down to the semi-circle ends of the C-concourse

Well the one semi circle starting at C1 is primarily Express nowadays, the opposite side gets the mainline flight as said above. Thats a tough area,b ut some other gates do have enough room IMO.

Quoting Apodino (Reply 7):
The F concourse, despite being recently renovated, is a disgrace.

It is, I was there a week ago or so, and unfortunetly it felt like the air conditioning is non existent. However, the museum they have there now is great to see after a flight. Really cool.

Quoting UnitedFirst (Reply 17):
Isn't the B18-B22 'arc' almost entirely used for Ted flights now?

Sometimes, I flew on a UA 737 and we arrived and departed from gate B19. I also arrived in the same area from a UA mainline flight.
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xtoler
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 5:46 pm

Working, I'm usually in and out of the tip of the F gates. God forbid a long layover there, not a whole lot to do, but at least my per diem kicks in. That's a laugh.

Commuting from RIC back to DEN and I try not to go through ORD if I can help it, but if I can't get out of IAD, what other options do I have from RIC? Oh, as an F/A for a certain regional airline my benefits covered UA, US, and AA. I'm quite familiar with ORD, especially the UA side. It's bad enough waiting to get on a plane, even worse spending the night there. Yeah, I could fork out half a paycheck, even with my benefits for a hotel room, or stay there for the next aircraft smoking to DEN and actually get on it. If the seats at the gates had armrests you could raise up and sleep on, I may find it an okay airport. ORD just plain out sucks. The retro architecture is cool, but I can only take so much. I hear the United crew room is nice, but I'm not about to sneak down there as I'm considered a scab.

The first taste I had of ORD was back in '90 right after I graduated high school and before I went to the USAF. I was flying from RIC to LAX to visit my grandparents. It sucked back then, and it still sucks now. If you have a tight connection, especially if you have to go to the international terminal, I feel for you. As far as a well planned airport, and convenience to gates, it's second to none other than EWR to fly in and out of. The place just plane sucks!!!!!!!
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theflcowboy
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 6:45 pm

I combat the problem of ORD, its congstion & delays by flying to MKE. The drive time from MKE to where I go in Chicago (Lake Forest) is less time than it takes for most flights to clear the active and sit on the taxiway waiting for a gate.  Smile
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airportplan
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 7:54 pm

Quoting PavlovsDog (Reply 13):
Anybody know what's going on the proposed West Terminal? Will United be the primary tenant there?

Currently no airline tenant has committed to the West Terminal. What you see on the Airport Layout Plan drawing is the extent that the terminal has been developed. There are several other possible long range terminal projects in the pipeline at ORD, but nothing will be firmed up until after the first new runway opens next year, the FAA flight cap is lifted and pressure builds for additional gate space.
 
UAL777UK
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 7:57 pm

I agree that if your at the C Gates and two international widebodies are going, it can be a little busy, but hell, fine me an airport that isn't when that happens.

My answer.........stay in the RCC until the last minute you can then come to the gate.
 
halls120
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 8:16 pm

Quoting Algoz (Reply 19):
If you want to see crap facilities (UA or otherwise) come to LHR......

No need to go that far. Just come to IAD and UA's "temporary" C/D terminals and you can experience a true low rent experience.

By happy with what you have at ORD.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
rwsea
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 8:20 pm

I don't mind UA's terminal too much, but my biggest complaint is the concessions. Given that I'm spending seemingly more and more time at ORD (thanks to the delays!), I would at least appreciate a few nice sit-down options rather than just a bunch of fast food places with no seating. One or two sitdown restaurants would really help alleviate my frustrations!

As far as the concourses themselves, I find the terminal quite nice.
 
COA735
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Sun Oct 21, 2007 8:20 pm

The B6 terminal at JFK in the AM is a zoo also. My girlfriend grabed on to my arm at one point.
 
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flybynight
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:05 am

It seems like I've spent more time at ORD than at home!

What I always notice is how hot it is in there on a warm summer day. Sucks. All that glass. The a/c can't keep up. Not even close.
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United Airline
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:44 am

ORD is still very new I think
 
gigneil
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 1:59 am

Quoting United Airline (Reply 29):
ORD is still very new I think

It opened in 1942.

NS
 
BlatantEcho
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 2:12 am

B & C seem so dark at night. The facility is nice enough, but it's nothing to write home about.
They're not handing trophies out today
 
747fan
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 2:37 am

Quoting United Airline (Reply 29):
ORD is still very new I think

Well, it depends on which terminal you're referring to. As Gigneil stated, the actual airport opened in 1942, but didn't have a large amount of pax traffic until 1962, when the three terminals were opened. Terminal One, the United terminal, was completely rebuilt in the late '80's (1989?) so it isn't exactly new, but its not that old yet. But it has seen nearly 20 years of wear and tear from a very high amount of passengers, so it would make sense that its showing some age. One example if this is the seats in the gate loungest (retro 80's design, worn out, not that comfy). The other 2 terminals are original, although most of Terminal 3 has been renovated (but not the departure hall, which still looks "1960's," kinda reminds me of the old T8 at JFK) . However, the parts that haven't been renovated are quite outdated, with dirty carpet, dirty ceiling tiles, not wide enough, somewhat dim lighting, etc. Basically a time-machine back into the 1960's. Terminal 5 is quite nice (if lacking in terms of shopping/concessions) and is the newest of the ORD terminals, being built separate from the main terminal complex about 15 years ago.
 
ytib
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 2:38 am

Quoting United Airline (Reply 29):
ORD is still very new I think



Quoting Gigneil (Reply 30):
It opened in 1942.

The United terminal opened in 1987. As someone who use to be through there quite often, I find it cold in the winter and very warm in the summer. Moving walkways in the tunnel make it difficult to pass others, which is needed when connections are late and I just have to run along side of them. Limited food options but better than it was in the past with the food court added on the C concourse. Space in the gates is limited for the larger flights especially on Thurs/Fri afternoons as those flights are filled. Four legged friends in some of the RCC's especially on the B concourse as they are small and people all over the place, thus food on the floor attracting them. Bathrooms are quite small for a hub operation. Leaks in the glass on the very rainy days. Don't forget in the early days they had to soap down the glass as it reflected into the controllers eyes in the afternoon, which was resolved back then. Yep, a Helmut Jahn building which some people may recall the State of Illinois building he designed in downtown Chicago also had some problems early on and of course the complaint of a lot of wasted space.
 
Cubsrule
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 2:49 am

Quoting PavlovsDog (Reply 13):
Anybody know what's going on the proposed West Terminal? Will United be the primary tenant there?

Unlikely. If Terminal 6 ever gets built, that will permit Skyteam and unattached carriers to vacate Terminal 2. Terminal 2 would then be replaced with an international facility designed to handle UA and Star partners, presumably moving many heavies from T-1 and permitting a consolidation of mainline and express operations in Terminal 1. That's all somewhat far off, though.
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RedTailDTW
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:00 am

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 34):
Unlikely. If Terminal 6 ever gets built, that will permit Skyteam and unattached carriers to vacate Terminal 2. Terminal 2 would then be replaced with an international facility designed to handle UA and Star partners, presumably moving many heavies from T-1 and permitting a consolidation of mainline and express operations in Terminal 1

Actually I could see it going this way. Terminal 2 would be replaced with a brand new Regional Jet facility consolidating all express to the new Terminal 2. That leaves all of Terminal 1 for mainline, Ted, and Star Alliance partners. However I do agree that this would be later down the road.


Mason
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Cubsrule
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:03 am

Quoting RedTailDTW (Reply 35):
That leaves all of Terminal 1 for mainline, Ted, and Star Alliance partners.

Putting an FIS facility in Terminal 1 without gutting it would be darn near impossible. That's why they have to put it in (new) T-2.
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RedTailDTW
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:06 am

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 36):
Putting an FIS facility in Terminal 1 without gutting it would be darn near impossible. That's why they have to put it in (new) T-2.

Oh Yeah, totally skipped that part! Now your idea makes a little more sense...


Mason
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UA772IAD
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:23 am

ORD is like heaven compared to LAX or IAD. I would have to say LAX is the worst, with the NRT, SYD 744 and LHR 777 boarding out of 74/76/77 there is no room for any other flights to board there when any of those are boarding. There is one Customer Service desk in the terminal, which is TINY and always has long lines.

IAD is the "temporary" trailer that has been there 20 years too long. The terminal is grey and has no windows, and is always depressing to fly into.

Of course, ORD is no SFO, NRT or DEN. KOA is probably the best UA station- easy lines, open air terminal, no waits, and of course, being up close to the planes!
 
jfrworld
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:24 am

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 4):
UA's SFO facilities are inferior, unless you are referring to the concourse G gates which opened recently.

Umm, I disagree. Although, I think UA's SFO terminal needs some warmer colors and nicer carpet (the gray, blue, and white) seems a bit cold, but the concourses are wide and the gate areas have plenty of seating. You rarely see people spilling out of the gate areas into the concourse, unless its a fully loaded 747 or 777 boarding for ORD, DEN, or IAD.

I think the variety of concessions is far superior to that of the other hubs. The food court in the center has a wide selection - everything from Japanese, Chinese, American Grill, Italian, etc. In addition to the food court there are several other full service restaurants including the Yankee Pier, Anchor Steam, and Buena Vista. Also, the Yankee Pier has the best airport clam chowder that I've ever had.

And don't forget, SFO is home to UA's nicest Red Carpet Club. Although, this isn't a hard hurdle to leap.
 
UA772IAD
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 3:30 am

SFO inferior? Maybe a decade ago, but not today. Sure it could use some new carpeting, sure the architecure is 80s, but its better than ANY of the other domestic terminals at SFO, hands down. The conecessions are good and there is plenty of lounge space at each gate. G is heaven, but its also 20 years younger.
 
gigneil
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:21 pm

SFO could certainly benefit from new carpet and colors, and, idk, readable gate displays?

NS
 
halls120
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:40 pm

Quoting Jfrworld (Reply 39):
And don't forget, SFO is home to UA's nicest Red Carpet Club. Although, this isn't a hard hurdle to leap.

UA's nicest domestic RCC, maybe. The Tokyo RCC kicks ass.
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Mcmax
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 11:15 pm

Quoting Apodino (Reply 7):
I don't think American has bad facilities at all. The Eagle facility in G is real nice, plus H and K are easy on the eyes and are in somewhat good shape, plus there is a reasonably sized food court as well.

I fly AA connecting through ORD a bit, and am always struck by how crowded H and K are all the time. The terminals are narrow, and when I'm often rushing to connect from one end of the concourse to another, I feel like I'm a fish swimming upstream against the stream of deplaning passengers. I had a 4-hour layover in ORD a few months ago (due to a flight cancellation due to bad Midwest weather), and wandered over to the UA terminal to take a look. I'm still impressed with it. While it still has that exposed steel beam construction typical of the 80s, it still looks very modern--kind of like a mini-Times Square with all those large information screens and ads.

Quoting UA772IAD (Reply 40):
SFO inferior? Maybe a decade ago, but not today. Sure it could use some new carpeting, sure the architecure is 80s, but its better than ANY of the other domestic terminals at SFO, hands down. The conecessions are good and there is plenty of lounge space at each gate. G is heaven, but its also 20 years younger.

UA's SFO terminal is wonderful. Granted it's spread out a bit, but the restaurant choices are pretty good, and the corridors are wide enough to accomodate all the traffic. Thank goodness they moved the security checkpoint for the North Terminal back to the escalator areas because it permits AA passengers to take advantage of the great restaurants and stores in the UA section of the North Terminal.
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kstateinALB
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 2:03 am

Quoting RwSEA (Reply 26):
One or two sitdown restaurants would really help alleviate my frustrations!

They do have a couple sit downs, Chili's is in concouse B, as well as Bergstrom's (sp.?) in the C Concouse. I get Chili's all the time because in reality, a huge burger in fries is less expensive then chinese food at Manchu Wok.
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FlyBoy84
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 3:20 pm

I fly to or through ORD at least a couple of times a year and Terminal 1 still feels great to me! The only thing that baffles me is that it seems that the ticketing area used to consist of walk-through counters with individual baggage belts. After getting your boarding pass and checking your bag, people walked straight through to security. Now the ticket counters are more conventional counters and you have to walk around to get to security. Don't know if that has anything to do with TSA requirements or something else.

T3 is nice visually - especially the portion with the barrel-vaulted skylight and the flags. The post-security area is nice since it allows views of the ramp! Security seems more organized in T3 versus T1's seemingly endless maze. The H/K hallway is a bit narrow, but I like how the pillars separate the gate areas from the hall. The changes they are making to the landside by adding a new glass frontage on both levels will certainly make T2 and T3 look more modern!

As far as the future, I don't see ORD needing T6 and the West Terminal. But who am I?

However, the West Terminal would be a great concept if they would develop it in phases to replace the existing complex. Start with what they are showing us now and move United into it. After tearing down the current T1, build another airside and put non-hubbers there. After redeveloping the land that the current terminals sit on, build the other airsides to house AA and international carriers. They could also build dedicated highways around the perimeter of the airfield to handle traffic going in and out of the airport.

Of course, this would make yet another Denver/Atlanta-style airport. Can't argue with that layout, though, if it provides the necessary efficiency! Knocking down the old stuff - especially T2 and T3 would certainly be getting rid of a lot of history, but...AHHH progress  cheeky 
 
sxf24
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 3:42 pm

Quoting SLCUT2777 (Reply 16):
SLC needs in my estimation (it is my home airport--and an embarrassment to me for my community!) a substantial overhaul. Thankfully it is in the works...

SLC is an easy to navigate and well maintained facility. It can get a little crowded, especially in the E Gates or the high C/D gates with multiple flights, but it is nothing to be ashamed about.

If you'd like to talk about an embarrassment to a community, lets talk about LAX.
 
777fan
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Wed Oct 24, 2007 12:10 am

Quoting Cubsrule (Reply 34):
Terminal 2 would then be replaced with an international facility designed to handle UA and Star partners, presumably moving many heavies from T-1 and permitting a consolidation of mainline and express operations in Terminal 1.

That would be great!

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 42):
The Tokyo RCC kicks ass.

No doubt, although every time I fly pay a visit, it's packed to the point where you have to fight to get a seat. The fill-it-yourself draught beer machine at the self serve bar is one of the coolest things I've ever seen. For whatever reason, however, I always forget to grab a pic of it (too much beer, I suppose).

Quoting McMax (Reply 43):
While it still has that exposed steel beam construction typical of the 80s, it still looks very modern--kind of like a mini-Times Square with all those large information screens and ads.

While it wasn't one of the backlit ad-boards you're referring to, UA has quite possibly the best ad banner hanging from the ceiling in the C concourse, just above the top of the escalators going to/from the B concourse. It's an obvious response to WN's TV ad line that rips RJs while touting their "big, comfy Boeing 737s". The banner reads: "Some airlines jump puddles, we cross oceans". Awesome!

Quoting UA772IAD (Reply 40):
Sure it could use some new carpeting, sure the architecure is 80s, but its better than ANY of the other domestic terminals at SFO, hands down.



Quoting McMax (Reply 43):
UA's SFO terminal is wonderful. Granted it's spread out a bit, but the restaurant choices are pretty good, and the corridors are wide enough to accomodate all the traffic

SFO - hands down the best food options and RCC (DEN is a close second, though).

Quoting KstateinALB (Reply 44):
They do have a couple sit downs, Chili's is in concouse B, as well as Bergstrom's (sp.?) in the C Concouse

Berghoff. Try the Amber the next time you're there. The roasted turkey sandwich is good too - it's one of the last remnants of a Chicago icon.


777fan
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flightopsguy
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RE: UA's ORD Hub Showing Its Age?

Wed Oct 24, 2007 12:22 am

All of ORD is overstuffed. Check out the OMP (ORD Modernization Program) websites, and you will see on the eastern part of the field a number of parallel shapes. These represent possible new terminals of 100 gates or more. The same plans will also show a much enlarged T-5 international terminal.
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