Airstud
Topic Author
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Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 10:29 pm

Problematically, my database of Airports I've Landed At can't use the IATA designator as the primary key, because I've landed at (meaning I've been on flights that have landed at; no pilot, I) both Stapleton and Denver International; both of which of course were DENignated.

Any other triglyphs that have referred to more than one airport in their lifetimes?

I have departed from, but not landed at, RNO and YHZ. Airports aren't allowed on my list if I haven't landed there.
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yowza
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RE: Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Mon Oct 22, 2007 11:45 pm

BKK springs to mind. When they switched ops to Suvarnabhumi from Don Muang they moved the BKK designation.

YOWza
 
tcfc424
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RE: Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:02 am

AUS, it was Robert Mueller Municipal, and now is Austin-Bergstrom International.
 
AlexPorter
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RE: Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:05 am

HKG is probably the most obvious example outside of the United States.
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N1120A
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RE: Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:08 am

MUC is a good example after the switch from Riem to Strauss.
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Rivet42
Posts: 604
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RE: Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:24 am

Quoting Airstud (Thread starter):
Airports aren't allowed on my list if I haven't landed there.

... I think you need to redesign your database, then!!  Smile

Why not make this field a 4-character field, so that you can designate the previous use of a code with a suitable suffix (e.g. BKKX, HKGX, etc)...

Riv' (database designer)
I travel, therefore I am.
 
BOSSAN
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RE: Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 2:08 am

Since the designators date back to 2-letter US National Weather Service city codes, it seems likely that the oldest designators applied to the largest airport in each city, since that's where the weather would be read and then distributed around the country by Telex. However, I don't know if airlines used them systematically in the days of the first standardized airline tickets (1936 on), pre-mag stripe.

I can't find a reference for it, but it seems likely that the LAX designator moved from Grand Central Airport in Glendale to Mines Field in Westchester some time after 1946.
 
N1120A
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RE: Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:29 am

Quoting Rivet42 (Reply 5):

Why not make this field a 4-character field, so that you can designate the previous use of a code with a suitable suffix (e.g. BKKX, HKGX, etc)...

For non-aviation enthusiasts, 4 letter codes are difficult to comprehend.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
Rivet42
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RE: Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 1:41 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 7):
For non-aviation enthusiasts, 4 letter codes are difficult to comprehend.

...ah, no, I didn't mean the ICAO codes, they would indeed be baffling, even to some of us enthusiasts! No, I just meant where you might have BKK twice, for example, you make the current one BKK, and the previous airport BKKX. I note that this is what www.flightmemory.com do, so that when you enter historical data you can determine which was the correct airport at the time.

Riv'
I travel, therefore I am.
 
RDUDDJI
Posts: 1717
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 4:42 am

RE: Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 1:50 pm

Quoting Rivet42 (Reply 8):
...ah, no, I didn't mean the ICAO codes, they would indeed be baffling, even to some of us enthusiasts! No, I just meant where you might have BKK twice, for example, you make the current one BKK, and the previous airport BKKX. I note that this is what www.flightmemory.com do, so that when you enter historical data you can determine which was the correct airport at the time.

...add to that the fact that the ICAO codes also changed when the IATA ones changed, i.e. KDEN (DEN) moved from Stapeton to DIA. VHHH (HKG) moved from Kai Tak to the new airport. etc. etc.
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Kempa
Posts: 364
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RE: Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 4:12 pm

ATH designation moved from old Hellenikon to Eleftherios Venizelos.
 
ScottB
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RE: Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:46 pm

Not to steal user Centrair's fire, but NGO moved from Komaki to the current Chubu Centrair International Airport.
 
Airstud
Topic Author
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RE: Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:59 pm

Rivy-baby:

The idea of the databasoid is that a user can enter a FAMILIAR trigraph; which of course is the IATA code. If they enter RNO, then the record pops up with "Reno-Taco International Airport" in the "Official Name" field. However, if they enter DEN, then the "Official Name" field gets highlighted and the status line (yes LINE, for this is an old-fashioned 24x80 greenscreen) says something like "DISCERNMENT NEEDED." Same if they enter "US" in the airline designator field, my db wants to know whether they mean real USAir of old, or fake USAirways of today.

No database designer I; which is probably clear to you. This puppy will be hosted on a VAXstation and implemented in DEC C.

(I like vintage things, in case you can't tell)
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Rivet42
Posts: 604
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2005 11:26 am

RE: Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 11:06 pm

Quoting Airstud (Reply 12):
The idea of the databasoid is that a user can enter a FAMILIAR trigraph; which of course is the IATA code

.... what kind of user are you aiming this at? It sounds a little bit clunky for the GUI age...!  Smile Seriously, though, I think you could get a few ideas from the website I mentioned above, they've got this sorted out very well, and are proving themselves to be very popular (there was a massive thread on them a while ago).

Riv'
I travel, therefore I am.
 
Airstud
Topic Author
Posts: 3127
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2000 11:57 am

RE: Dual-duty Designators - Besides DEN?

Tue Oct 23, 2007 11:31 pm

I am anti-GUI!!!

The target user is a DEChead!! Anti-GUI, pro-VAX, pro-Rainbow100 DECheads, I say!!

Really I'm just keeping the ol' VAXstation alive; plus I need something spitting out DECnet layer 3 packets so my multiprotocol Cisco router gets put through its paces.

This isn't some legitimate, professional database; if that's what you're worrying. It's just a kewl vintage way to store - and build - my personal flight memory.

Cuz and Tapicus and even other airline buffs might join the user community someday, and then of course I'll have to design an HTML interface ew yuk. But already we're too far off-topic, for this forum is about airlines.

And one of the great things about airlines is that they still find use for green-screen COBOL applimacations, and in some places even still have 1970's terminals with black alphabetical keys and bright red, blue, green, and white function keys; VT52-style.

WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT COMPUTERS ARE SUPPOSED TO LOOK LIKE.
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timz
Posts: 6163
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RE: "lax"

Tue Oct 23, 2007 11:38 pm

Quoting BOSSAN (Reply 6):
it seems likely that the LAX designator moved from Grand Central Airport in Glendale to Mines Field in Westchester some time after 1946.

You think "LAX" existed in 1946? I don't see any mention of three-letter codes in 1946 OAGs.

I'll see if I can find which airport "LA" was.

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