LAXDESI
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San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Mon Oct 22, 2007 11:18 pm

http://sify.com/finance/fullstory.php?id=14546624

Quotes:
With more Indian carriers tipped to fly to the US, the Mineta San Jose International Airport (SJC) is positioning itself as a major hub for the West Coast with a host of incentives. The carriers being approached by the SJC management include Kingfisher, Jet Airways and Sapphire Airlines, a start-up founded by Rahul S. Puranik, an Indian American pilot based in San Francisco.

The area around SJC is home to over 70,000 people of Indian origin, constituting the largest Asian Indian population in the Bay Area of San Francisco.

Ed Nelson, SJC director of air service development, said the incentives include waiving of landing, navigation and parking charges as well as payment of $250,000 for each airline for joint advertising in India to promote the US destination. "We are looking at revising the incentives beyond the one year we are presently offering them," Nelson told IANS.

Sapphire plans to launch operations late next year from San Francisco to Bangalore via Munich. Kingfisher is looking at direct flights to San Francisco from the middle of 2008. And Jet too has future plans for the West Coast. The carriers also have no worries about load factor since the economic boost of Silicon Valley has resulted in many Indian companies establishing their base there. These include Wipro, Mobera Systems and Tech Mahindra.

With US companies like Intel, Yahoo, Adobe, Google and Cisco having offices in Indian cities like Bangalore, Hyderabad and Chennai, business and family travel between India and the US is getting augmented, said Nelson.

SJC's small size with no immigration queues will prove a definite advantage, said Nelson. "We are also connected very well to major cities on the West Coast for Indians looking at onward connections," he said.
 
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yowza
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Mon Oct 22, 2007 11:47 pm

Interesting stuff. To tell you the truth I'm surprised that this did not happen sooner.

YOWza
 
as739x
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:00 am

A very surprising and SMART move by SJC. The possibility of SFO and SJC getting Indian serves seems feasible. San Jose has so much potential and if SFO admits it or not, depending on timing they could be running into some issues with international gates. Just today KLM was waiting for some time (grantes NW diverted a A333 MSP-HNL), which took away a gate. But as SFO gets overwhelmed with new carriers, this move by SJC could pay off.

Anyone have info on this Sapphire?

ASSFO
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jacobin777
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:25 am

Quoting AS739X (Reply 2):
A very surprising and SMART move by SJC. The possibility of SFO and SJC getting Indian serves seems feasible. San Jose has so much potential and if SFO admits it or not, depending on timing they could be running into some issues with international gates. Just today KLM was waiting for some time (grantes NW diverted a A333 MSP-HNL), which took away a gate. But as SFO gets overwhelmed with new carriers, this move by SJC could pay off.

....sounds great in theory, but in the end, as usual, SFO will win out.... Sad
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legacyins
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 1:06 am

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 3):
....sounds great in theory, but in the end, as usual, SFO will win out....

I agree. Unfortunately, as the article states, SFO is SJC biggest obstacle. Offering incentives are nothing new. SFO offers incentives to new carriers starting new routes to new destinations. The delicate dancing act of gate availability at SFO will always be a factor. In the end, a gate will be found. It's not like the old days in the former IT at SFO when it was common to have 3 747s lined up on the taxi ways during the summer waiting for a gate.

Having seen and worked at SJC "new" arrivals building, it got quite crowded when AA brought in a full load on their former NRT route.

That KLM flight did find a gate, abet the G-Terminal.  Smile

Quoting AS739X (Reply 2):
Anyone have info on this Sapphire?

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/...y_to_India/articleshow/2115313.cms
 
LAXDESI
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 1:07 am

Quoting AS739X (Reply 2):
Anyone have info on this Sapphire?

Googling, I found an article on it dating back to 2006 in which Sapphire projected FAA approval in 6 months, and operations in about 15 months.. I do not believe they are for real.
http://www.indiadaily.com/editorial/9789.asp
The incentives offered are not a lot in annual terms for transoceanic flights. Googling, I found more info. on the incentive program, with selected quotes below:

The Airport receives approximately $175,000 annually for a typical domestic flight that is operated on a daily basis, and an estimated $717,000 annually for a daily transoceanic flight. Fees and charges eligible to receive credit through the program include landing fees, gate use fees, aircraft parking charges, facility rental changes and airport-imposed international passenger processing fees (excluding Passenger Facility Charges—PFCs). Air service that operates during the Airport Curfew (11:30 p.m. to 6:30 a.m.) will not be eligible for the incentive program.
http://www.sjc.org/AirportReport/MayJune06/AR_content.html
 
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whosee
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 4:53 am

Well it would be great to see a 777 at SJC again! An A340 would be just as good too  thumbsup 

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 3):
....sounds great in theory, but in the end, as usual, SFO will win out....

Surely we should be able to snag one of the three mentioned airlines. Or how exciting would it be if American announces SJC-Bangalore. It could called the Nerd Bird v2.0!  biggrin 
 
stealth777
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 5:43 am

Well SFO is supposed to bring A1, A3, A5 online soon. that would give them 3 extra gates on the international side.
 
bkkair
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:05 am

Veering slightly off topic.........

Is gate availability actually a factor in adding new service or is profitability?

In Hong Kong, Chep Lap Kok still uses bus gates. Kai Tak probably used bus gates 80-90% of the time and airlines were lined up to start service.

In Bangkok, the new airport, Suvarnabhumi makes major use of bus gates, even TG (the home carrier) uses them. LAX uses bus gates.

At enormous airports, such as Suvarnabhumi, you are lucky when you get a bus gate because you get to immigration much faster than using a gate at the terminal where you might need walk to 15 minutes.

Airlines are more concerned about flying where they can make money than by where they can get a gate at the terminal.
 
ryu2
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:10 am

Can SJC's runway handle a plane loaded USA-India (I assume it has to be 777LR or A345)?
 
Nimish
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:26 am

I thought the issue with SJC was more to do with the runway length being inadequate or something? Has that issue been resolved?
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dlphoenix
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:33 am

SJC Runways are 11,000 feet long.
Thet are also 700 feet apart limiting simultaneous takeoff and landing, but this is also the case with SFO.
 
n53614
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 10:02 am

Quoting Ryu2 (Reply 9):
Can SJC's runway handle a plane loaded USA-India (I assume it has to be 777LR or A345)?

SJC did just fine with B777-200ERs headed to NRT and TPE...
B722 B732 B733 B734 B735 B73G B738 B739 B742 B752 B763 B772 A319 A320 A332 CRJ2 DHC8 DH8D E135 E140 E145 MD83
 
comorin
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:20 pm

Quoting DLPhoenix (Reply 11):
Thet are also 700 feet apart limiting simultaneous takeoff and landing, but this is also the case with SFO.

Isn't it a common sight at SFO to see both runways being simultaneously used for landing? Thanks for clarifying...
 
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Revelation
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:37 pm

Quoting Whosee (Reply 6):
Or how exciting would it be if American announces SJC-Bangalore. It could called the Nerd Bird v2.0! biggrin

Or the "Outsourced Nerd Bird"?  biggrin 
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as739x
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 12:37 pm

Quoting Nimish (Reply 10):

11,000 Feet. The second longest runway on the Bay Area behind 28R/10L at SFO. And SJC has 11,000ft runways.

Quoting DLPhoenix (Reply 11):

SJC and SFO are completely different. SFO primarily uses 1L/1R for departures. The 750 separation between SFO's 28L/R never hampers VFR simultaneous arrivals (exception is with strong westerly winds). Also, SJC is nowhere close to as busy as SFO. I have almost never seen simultaneous arrivals in the 31's.

Quoting Comorin (Reply 13):

Very common. All day long. Look at the photo's from SFO

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 3):



Quoting Legacyins (Reply 4):

Agreed: SFO will gobble these carriers up. I've always hoped for SJC to get a little piece of the action. But just not likely. Things will sure improve with A1,3,5 online. Legacy, you see them get A-5 jetways up yesterday? I'm being told a week from Friday is will be operational, what do you hear? Should add some variety to the view from my office.

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ConcordeBoy
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 1:23 pm

...what about OAK? Surprised no one's even mentioned it.

I'm aware of their reputation as the LoCo airport... but it's no secret that they wouldn't mind grabbing a piece of the intercontinental pie. Granted, both codeshare and interline connections would be weaker there than SFO; but if for nothing else than proximity to the city itself (vs SJC's proximity to tech companies in the valley), I wonder what chance it stands?
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2travel2know
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 2:16 pm

Quoting LAXDESI (Reply 5):
Air service that operates during the Airport Curfew (11:30 p.m. to 6:30 a.m.) will not be eligible for the incentive program.

That could keep a number of Latiamerican airlines away from SJC, many California-Mexico/Centralamerica flights arrive/depart between 2230 and 0130h.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
as739x
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 2:22 pm

Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 16):

I would think with Oakland its running short of gate space. Also, with the addition of TACA the international gate is being streched. The issue you run into adding a widebody international to OAK is that it would occupy the only gate that can except the arrivals. MX,TA wouldn't be to keen on bus Ops I would. Obviously its all about timing. But I thought about if Oasis started OAK-HKG and was sitting on Gate 1 from 5pm to 1am. Where would the Latin carriers arrive?

ASSFO
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jacobin777
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With So

Tue Oct 23, 2007 4:22 pm

Quoting Whosee (Reply 6):
Surely we should be able to snag one of the three mentioned airlines. Or how exciting would it be if American announces SJC-Bangalore. It could called the Nerd Bird v2.0!  biggrin 

....that would rock! IT's Mallya did say BLR-SFO is in the cards so if he decides a few miles south we'll get a "pseudo Nerd-Bird"... biggrin 

Quoting Stealth777 (Reply 7):
Well SFO is supposed to bring A1, A3, A5 online soon. that would give them 3 extra gates on the international side.

..thanks for dashing what little hope we had... mad ..LoL!

Quoting Ryu2 (Reply 9):
Can SJC's runway handle a plane loaded USA-India (I assume it has to be 777LR or A345)?

...yes....however, summer in San Jose does get to the mid 90's where as it rarely gets over 80 in Millbrae (where SFO Airport is located)

Quoting Comorin (Reply 13):
Quoting DLPhoenix (Reply 11):
Thet are also 700 feet apart limiting simultaneous takeoff and landing, but this is also the case with SFO.

Isn't it a common sight at SFO to see both runways being simultaneously used for landing? Thanks for clarifying...

..yes it is..happens all the time.... yes 



Quoting Revelation (Reply 14):
Quoting Whosee (Reply 6):
Or how exciting would it be if American announces SJC-Bangalore. It could called the Nerd Bird v2.0! biggrin

Or the "Outsourced Nerd Bird"?  biggrin 

 rotfl ....

Quoting AS739X (Reply 15):
SFO primarily uses 1L/1R for departures.

...it actually depends on the time of day (and of course other factors also-such as winds/weather/ect)..but primarily the time of day.... heavies will mostly use the 28's after 12:00 p.m....

Quoting AS739X (Reply 15):
Also, SJC is nowhere close to as busy as SFO. I have almost never seen simultaneous arrivals in the 31's.

....SFO is 2.5 times as busy SJC...... Sad

Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 16):
I'm aware of their reputation as the LoCo airport... but it's no secret that they wouldn't mind grabbing a piece of the intercontinental pie. Granted, both codeshare and interline connections would be weaker there than SFO; but if for nothing else than proximity to the city itself (vs SJC's proximity to tech companies in the valley), I wonder what chance it stands?

Not only is its reputation as a local airport, also, for many Indians (as well as tech companies) its actually easier and convenient to go to either SJC or SFO.....Besides Fremont and parts of Milpitas and the northeastern end of San Jose, its rather inconvenient to go to OAK...especially when the I-880 gets traffic.....
"Up the Irons!"
 
jfk777
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 4:39 pm

Why would a legitimate international airline flyig to San Francisco want to fly to San Jose. AA had their SJC to NRT flight for years and it never quite worked right. AA even tried SJC to Taipei and that didn't work either. SFO is the main international airport for northern California and that is the airport JET Airways, Kingfisher or any new airline should fly too. Air Canada or Mexicana are different for obvious reasons. It like saying newbie air is flying from Newarl to London, Mastan; its in the general English southeast but way the hel on the east coast.
 
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modernArt
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 4:50 pm

Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 20):
Why would a legitimate international airline flyig to San Francisco want to fly to San Jose.

Hmmm, maybe that... "The area around SJC is home to over 70,000 people of Indian origin, constituting the largest Asian Indian population in the Bay Area of San Francisco."

Quoting Jfk777 (Reply 20):
SFO is the main international airport for northern California and that is the airport JET Airways, Kingfisher or any new airline should fly too.

Maybe, but your comment is laced with nothing but arrogance. The SFO/SJ region is perfectly capabale of supporting multiple intercontinental airports...if not now, than certainly in the not too distant future.
 
ikramerica
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 4:55 pm

Quoting ConcordeBoy (Reply 16):
Granted, both codeshare and interline connections would be weaker there than SFO; but if for nothing else than proximity to the city itself (vs SJC's proximity to tech companies in the valley), I wonder what chance it stands?

It's not the proximity to the city that is the only factor. It's proximity to the tech companies on the peninsula. Again, SFO has the best of both worlds, as it's over 1 hour from SJC to the city. And there is a large Indian populations spread out among the expensive homes nearer to SFO as well.
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legacyins
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 5:19 pm

Quoting AS739X (Reply 15):
Legacy, you see them get A-5 jetways up yesterday? I'm being told a week from Friday is will be operational, what do you hear? Should add some variety to the view from my office.

Yes I did. I was walking through the A-Terminal on Sunday and they were installing seating and monitors on the second level. I have heard that one of the new gates will be A 380 ready? Our offices are right in the corner on the second level. I have a nice big window over looking Gates A-1 to A-9.

Quoting ModernArt (Reply 21):
The SFO/SJ region is perfectly capable of supporting multiple intercontinental airports...if not now, than certainly in the not too distant future.

Yes, this is true. There are many examples of multiple International Airports in the same geographic area. One aspect, sometimes forgotten, is the ability to process the passengers off the flight. By this I mean, are there Customs and Border Protection (CBP) Officer available to clear these prospective flights. CBP is not staffing SJC full time. Officers from SFO drive down to SJC to clear what ever flight comes in and then drive back up to SFO. There is such a shortage of CBP Officers at SFO as it is and to require seven of them to leave SFO during the peak arrival times would be an operational issue. This is not to say CBP would deny landing rights because of this (They did when MX wanted Fresno, but eventually worked it out with the City paying CBP's Bill) but it would create a problem.

As stated, I think the only possible carrier is Sapphire Airways, if they get off the ground. This will give SJC not only a direct flight to India but also a flight to Europe (Munich). being a new carrier, I would say they would want to control their start up costs as much as possible.
 
as739x
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 5:47 pm

Quoting Legacyins (Reply 23):

You must be able to look right into my office. I'm looking at your windows right now. I am right under gate 20. But I'd take your view anyday!

Thats a good point with the CBP. I completly forgot that SJC was done by SFO.

ASSFO
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copaair737
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 6:18 pm

Is AI still planning on starting SFO-BLR nonstop, or has that been put on hold since the JFK-BOM n/s isn't performing well for them?
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lhpdx
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 7:32 pm

SJC needs to focus and try to lure a flight to Europe and Asia for now...........
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Tue Oct 23, 2007 11:42 pm

Quoting LHPDX (Reply 26):
SJC needs to focus and try to lure a flight to Europe and Asia for now

...um, exactly what do you think they're trying to do with this?
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
stealth777
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Wed Oct 24, 2007 12:39 am

Quoting Legacyins (Reply 23):
I have heard that one of the new gates will be A 380 ready?

Legacy from what I have heard from Mike is that only the end gates would be A380 capable. That's where they would be putting in the additional 3rd jetway for the planes. Such as G101 and G102. (102 is not up yet) not sure which are the numbers at the end of A. I rarely go over there for lunch, I'm mainly at G, over at Deli-Up cafe for lunch.

-Stealth
 
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legacyins
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Wed Oct 24, 2007 1:11 am

Quoting Stealth777 (Reply 28):
That's where they would be putting in the additional 3rd jetway for the planes

I was meaning to ask about this "3rd' jetway. I saw it over at G101 for the A380. Is this unique to SFO or are there other airports who use this system?

Quoting Stealth777 (Reply 28):
I rarely go over there for lunch, I'm mainly at G, over at Deli-Up cafe for lunch.

I go there once in a while also. The other is Andeles.
 
stealth777
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Wed Oct 24, 2007 6:45 am

I've only seen it at SFO (I have a picture in the "Q", lets see if it makes it thru with the A380 at the triple jetway) but I havent seen other airports demonstrating a triple jetway. I remember seeing a dual jetway, where one was moved to the upper deck but I can't remember where I saw that pic.


Andeles.. good food I usually hit the one by Lori's diner over by AS gates (pre-security).
 
as739x
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Wed Oct 24, 2007 12:19 pm

Quoting Stealth777 (Reply 30):

Andeles, good lunch!

Quoting Legacyins (Reply 29):

I'll look into it more, but I was told by ramp tower that A-1 will be A380 capable. But it will not have the third jetway as G101.

ASSFO
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jfk777
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RE: San Jose Airport Lures Indian Carriers With Sops.

Wed Oct 24, 2007 5:48 pm

Quoting ModernArt (Reply 21):
Maybe, but your comment is laced with nothing but arrogance. The SFO/SJ region is perfectly capabale of supporting multiple intercontinental airports...if not now, than certainly in the not too distant future

My reasoning isn't arrogance its the factual truth, its not my fault AA couldn't make it work from SJC to either NRT or TPE. 70,000 people of Indian decent doesn't make a large enough pool for nonstop daily service to India from San Jose yet. In 10 years who knows, but could JET Airways or Kingfisher make a profit from SFO? I would say yes NOW it could work at SFO. Whatever draw backs SFO has, its very few these days, it is one of the great USA International airport, especially fro Asia but is served by almost every major European airline too.