ghillier
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Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 7:20 pm

AA is dropping their 2 nonstops between ORD-PDX after December 12 and I don't understand why. They fly the route with an MD-80 and they have plenty of them and I am on one of the flights once every 10 days or so and they are packed - always asking for volunteers to give up their seats and go on a later flight. Anyone have any ideas ?

[Edited 2007-11-05 11:42:03]
 
qqflyboy
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 7:35 pm

Us AAers don't quite get it either. However, AA says the yields in the winter are terrible. They are currently evaluating the route to see if they'll bring it back in April.
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ramprat74
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 7:37 pm

I don't know why. We UA should be picking up the slack, but we are losing our red-eye flight in January also. I work the PDX-ORD flights everyday, and they are always full.
 
EXAAUADL
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 7:42 pm

I thought this was re-instated
 
doug_or
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 7:50 pm

Quoting RampRat74 (Reply 2):
but we are losing our red-eye flight in January also

Really? Son of a.....

I will be going between PDX and ORD a lot starting in January (a decision made months ago)... looks like I couldn't have picked a worse time. With the red eye and AA on the route it seems like those flights are always full. Without them? I shudder.

As far as yields are concerned, a quick set of random dates in feb and jan show ORD-SEA non stops being consistantly $100 cheaper than ORD-PDX. Perhaps too many of our passengers were lower yielding connecting passengers. It is interesting that on these dates WN flying MDW-PDX has tickets available at almost half the price. I wonder if WN (who I tihnk added a second non stop in the last year) has been hurting AA's ability to attrace O&D passengers. While UAL has a strong base of FFs in PDX I'm pretty sure AA has almsot none (not sure who things work for our loads of AS FFs).
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iowaman
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 7:50 pm

Yields. With WN flying PDX-MDW, yields in the winter are poor since loads aren't quite as great either. Full flight doesn't equal profits.

There are rumors of it coming back in April as seasonal. Guess we'll see.
 
LambertMan
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 7:50 pm

Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 3):
I thought this was re-instated

It may have been, but it shows you American's intentions with regard to domestic capacity. Outside of a few loss leaders, if it isn't cutting it, goodbye.
 
Cubsrule
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 8:09 pm

Quoting Iowaman (Reply 5):
There are rumors of it coming back in April as seasonal. Guess we'll see.

That wouldn't make a whole lot of sense given that AA is trying to get away from seasonal flying (ORD-GLA, ORD-ANC, etc.).
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rwsea
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 8:24 pm

As others have mentioned, I'm sure it's a mix of low yields, WN, and the fact that AA has a minimal presence in PDX (I believe their only other service is 3-4x daily to DFW). Most people I know in both PDX/SEA associate ORD more with UA than AA. When you combine that with AA's aircraft being stretched and the increasing constraints of operating at ORD, AA probably decided they could use the planes and the ORD capacity better elsewhere.

PDX-ORD ia a business market and a "seasonal" service just isn't going to cut it if AA wants to be successful. Sure loads are higher in the summer but that's the case everywhere. With that said, AA has cut from SEA recently as well, and the gap has been filled by AS. Maybe AS will give it a go if they can find the aircraft/slots at ORD.
 
LH459
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 8:44 pm

I guess AA has decided to abandon Europe traffic from PDX. Connecting at DFW is much less attractive option than ORD from PDX.
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KELPkid
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 9:04 pm

Quoting Doug_Or (Reply 4):
I will be going between PDX and ORD a lot starting in January (a decision made months ago)... looks like I couldn't have picked a worse time. With the red eye and AA on the route it seems like those flights are always full. Without them? I shudder.

There's another airline that will get you PDX-Chicago non-stop, they just happen to fly into MDW and their planes happen to be painted Canyon Blue...  Wink
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bobnwa
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 9:07 pm

Quoting LH459 (Reply 9):
I guess AA has decided to abandon Europe traffic from PDX. Connecting at DFW is much less attractive option than ORD from PDX

If Europe traffic is part of their decision, then maybe NWA announcing PDX-AMS was a factor.
 
SkyexRamper
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 9:14 pm

Quoting QQflyboy (Reply 1):
However, AA says the yields in the winter are terrible. They are currently evaluating the route to see if they'll bring it back in April.

One would think that the PDX area would be espeically jumping in the winter considering all of the skiing and winter sports.
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gunsontheroof
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 9:16 pm

Quoting RampRat74 (Reply 2):
I don't know why. We UA should be picking up the slack, but we are losing our red-eye flight in January also. I work the PDX-ORD flights everyday, and they are always full.

I've gotta think UA has a stronger customer base in Portland than AA does. Probably one of the places where UA really dominates the ORD sectors. RWsea seams to have hit the point there, so I'll leave it at that.
 
bobnwa
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 9:20 pm

Quoting SkyexRamper (Reply 12):
One would think that the PDX area would be espeically jumping in the winter considering all of the skiing and winter sports.

The skiing and winter sports crowd would definitely be low yield.
 
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ramprat74
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 10:29 pm

Quoting SkyexRamper (Reply 12):
One would think that the PDX area would be espeically jumping in the winter considering all of the skiing and winter sports

We get our winter sports travelers in June and July, if you can believe that. Mt. Hood is packed with all kind of ski/snowboard camps on the glacier in those months.
 
Cubsrule
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 10:41 pm

Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 11):

If Europe traffic is part of their decision, then maybe NWA announcing PDX-AMS was a factor.

PDX-AMS was announced after AA pulled ORD-PDX.
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DTWAGENT
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 10:41 pm

Maybe Alaska Air will pick these flights up. They are a partner with AA code sharing. I know that NWA only has a few flights in the winter months and in the summer they bring back alot of flights. Maybe AA is going to do the same.

Hard to say....

Chuck
 
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seabosdca
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Mon Nov 05, 2007 10:53 pm

I hope AS finds a way to pick up the slack. Certainly, they've been doing well on their new PDX-BOS service with a 737-700. I've found tickets on BOS-PDX-BOS consistently more expensive for the same dates than BOS-SEA-BOS, even when SEA-BOS goes back to 1x daily after the holidays.

I wonder if maybe those many AS frequent flyers haven't internalized that they can get miles from AA flights. Personally, I fly AA through ORD whenever AS transcons are too expensive, which is somewhat often.
 
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TWA757
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Tue Nov 06, 2007 1:51 pm

I'm flying ORD-PDX on UA for the first time in late December, and looking forward to it because of the 757 (never bigger than an MD-80 when I flew the route on AA or nonstop from STL in TWA's last few years).

The situation with AA pulling out seems like a catch-22. Did the fact that UA flies "bigger" planes on the route (757, 319/320) lead to AA not doing as well, or was it that UA was just doing better and so they upgraded capacity?
 
mrstl
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Tue Nov 06, 2007 2:04 pm

Quoting TWA757 (Reply 19):
The situation with AA pulling out seems like a catch-22. Did the fact that UA flies "bigger" planes on the route (757, 319/320) lead to AA not doing as well, or was it that UA was just doing better and so they upgraded capacity?

UA has larger planes in most cases
Inflight entertainment
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I think a better route network
nicer terminal at ORD
more destinations with more frequencies to most places


I do not know why anyone would choose AA over UA at ORD- unless they have a lot of travel to Latin America, and this is coming from someone who flies mostly AA out of STL. AA will continue to lose business flying MD-80's on midcons out of ORD-- IMHO
 
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United787
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RE: Why Is AA Dropping ORD-PDX?

Tue Nov 06, 2007 2:24 pm

Quoting MrSTL (Reply 20):
I do not know why anyone would choose AA over UA at ORD- unless they have a lot of travel to Latin America, and this is coming from someone who flies mostly AA out of STL. AA will continue to lose business flying MD-80's on midcons out of ORD-- IMHO

I choose UA when the price is competitive, but I recently flew AA from ORD-PDX because it was a lot cheaper and I was able to connect to Horizon to OTH on one ticket. I would think that the connections with Alaska and Horizon would warrant AA keeping the service but I say good riddens to the Mad Dogs...