Orion737
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Services From Southend?

Fri Nov 09, 2007 2:05 pm

I remember years ago quite a number of charter flights were operated to the Med resorts from Southend and even remember one charter airline, Princess Air basing a 146 at Southend for charter flights.

Do any your ops offer Southend departures and are there any schedulked services. I remember charters to jersey in Summer too.
 
mhodgson
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RE: Services From Southend?

Fri Nov 09, 2007 2:09 pm

I think the only SEN service at the moment is a summer Sunday DH8-400Q service to Jersey with BE
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BDKLEZ
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RE: Services From Southend?

Fri Nov 09, 2007 2:21 pm

SEN does however see quite a lot of private/business movements and thanks to ATC Lasham, there are many different commercial aircraft types (both passenger & cargo) to be seen rather regularly whilst on maintenance check.

I'm sure you know already, but if not then check out http://www.atclasham.co.uk/aboutus.html for more info on them.
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bennett123
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RE: Services From Southend?

Fri Nov 09, 2007 2:24 pm

 
Orion737
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RE: Services From Southend?

Fri Nov 09, 2007 2:24 pm

Im surprised there isnt at least one LCC flight, like to Dublin. Also tour ops used to featureholidays from Southend in the 80s and early 90s.
 
bennett123
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RE: Services From Southend?

Fri Nov 09, 2007 2:28 pm

http://www.southendairport.com/pages/operational_runway.htm

Is the runway a bit short for A319/A320/B737NG
 
Orion737
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RE: Services From Southend?

Fri Nov 09, 2007 2:35 pm

Not sure, 1-11s and 146s were frequent visitors for tour operator flights though a few years ago.
 
vv701
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RE: Services From Southend?

Fri Nov 09, 2007 2:35 pm

Air Livery are also based at SEN where they have two paint bays for respraying narrow bodied aircraft up to and including the 757. (They repainted all the ex-BA 752s that were converted to freighters at TLV by IAI into DHL livery. They repaint wide-bodied aircraft at FZO.)

Flightline with its fleet of aircraft for wet lease are also based at SEN as are Inflite's engineering and maintenance facility.
 
7LBAC111
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RE: Services From Southend?

Fri Nov 09, 2007 2:48 pm

Quoting Orion737 (Reply 4):
Im surprised there isnt at least one LCC flight, like to Dublin.

Why?

7L
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BDKLEZ
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RE: Services From Southend?

Fri Nov 09, 2007 5:06 pm

Quoting 7LBAC111 (Reply 8):
Why?

I was wondering the same.
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Orion737
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RE: Services From Southend?

Fri Nov 09, 2007 5:21 pm

It just seems FR fly to almost every regional airport in the UK, connecting to Dublin so just wondered why they hadnt tried Southend as well.
 
Humberside
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RE: Services From Southend?

Fri Nov 09, 2007 5:26 pm

SEN has potential for regional operations in particular (AMS, EDI, DUB etc) and has plans in place to support this - railway station on the London-Stratford-Southend line, airport hotel. It now needs to convert the plans and potential into reality

SEN is to gain a new operation soon, but it won't relate into a huge number of extra passengers - a new airline called Flywatch plan to fly to Le Tourquet 5 times a week from next spring, and Calais and Ostend (for Bruges) fortnightly in July and August- all flights will allow for a daytrip to the foreign destination

SEN also has Ford Air flights as well, which moved from STN a few years ago. Think Cologne is the only destination at the moment
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HT
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RE: Services From Southend?

Fri Nov 09, 2007 6:31 pm

Quoting Orion737 (Reply 10):
It just seems FR fly to almost every regional airport in the UK, connecting to Dublin so just wondered why they hadnt tried Southend as well.

SEN's terminal should have problems to handle the pax on a full B738 and available runway length is rather restricted.
Without an extension of runway in direction 24, I do not see too good options to build up traffic in anything bigger than regional jets / props up to 100 seat AVROs at SEN. Any runway extension of course would require to relocate or close Eastwoodbury Lane.
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Humberside
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RE: Services From Southend?

Fri Nov 09, 2007 10:23 pm

This is part a shameless plug for my forums, but for more detailed information on SEN, including the runway situation, you might like to check this forum out - http://www.phpbber.com/phpbb/viewforum.php?f=70&mforum=airhumberside

Other information is available on pprune
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egmcman
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RE: Services From Southend?

Sat Nov 10, 2007 11:26 am

Quoting Orion737 (Thread starter):
I remember years ago quite a number of charter flights were operated to the Med resorts from Southend and even remember one charter airline, Princess Air basing a 146 at Southend for charter flights.

I remember them in fact one of the directors was formerly in charge of the airport. That director is a director of Flightline now. My family knew his family well. From what I remember the 146 was QC model which meant at night it would be used to carry cargo. Their radio Callsign was "whisperjet". My local district council are don't seem to be keen on new development plans for the airport even though it will bring some prosperity to the area.
 
egmcman
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RE: Services From Southend?

Sat Nov 10, 2007 11:45 am

Quoting Mhodgson (Reply 1):
I think the only SEN service at the moment is a summer Sunday DH8-400Q service to Jersey with BE

It's a Saturday service or it going to change to Sunday next year?

I wish the operator well
 
7LBAC111
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RE: Services From Southend?

Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:00 pm

Quoting Orion737 (Reply 10):
It just seems FR fly to almost every regional airport in the UK, connecting to Dublin so just wondered why they hadnt tried Southend as well.

But with services to pretty much the 'rest' of the London airports that would be viable, (thus excludung LHR and LCY), why would they?

7L
Debate is what you put on de hook when you want to catch de fish.
 
Orion737
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RE: Services From Southend?

Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:10 pm

I suppose then Southend is at the mercy of BE and lets hope they can keep their summer service to Jersey. Its a far cry from when Southend was used for IT flights.
 
BDKLEZ
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RE: Services From Southend?

Sun Nov 11, 2007 2:35 pm

Quoting Orion737 (Reply 17):
I suppose then Southend is at the mercy of BE

I don't think SEN is at the mercy of any organisation. It has it's niche in MRO etc and doesn't need regular passenger services to remain viable.
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egmcman
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RE: Services From Southend?

Sun Nov 11, 2007 3:39 pm

Quoting Orion737 (Reply 17):
I suppose then Southend is at the mercy of BE and lets hope they can keep their summer service to Jersey. Its a far cry from when Southend was used for IT flights.

The best hope is that BE make SEN a hub and operate services. Personally I think it would be convenient if the operated SEN - AGP as my parents live in that area of Spain.

I remember Air Malta , Air Atlantis, Air UK and Hispania operated from SEN in 1980's Hopefully there will be new carriers starting new routes. The IT market has changed from the 1980's & early 90's the best hope is low cost regional flights and LCY diversions . Other than that European Netjets may operate more flights from SEN if slots at other airports become scarce.
 
Yak97
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RE: Services From Southend?

Mon Nov 12, 2007 8:38 am

Over the years Southend has had many scheduled services. Indeed back in the early 50's SEN was one of the busiest airports in the UK.

Who can remember the Carvairs? Passenger/car services to RTM, LTQ, OST and that real long range flight (for a Carvair) BSL?

Then there was the Maersk Air service with the F50(?) that ran for years from BLL until they could get slots in LGW.
The Holland Airlines/Tulip service from RTM with the Nomad? The National Commuter service with the B200 in semi Sabena colours, then the SD330 & 360 services to BRU, JER & GCI. The Harvest Air/Regionair service with PA31/EMB110/J31 to RTM. BRU & CDG? The Air Malta service with the B737-200 (outbound techstop in OST) Ah those were the days!!

The Princess Air operation was a real shame that it failed. The passengers loved the fact that they could be off the aircraft and in their cars in under 15 minutes, rather than face the 2+ hour drive from LGW or LTN (this was before STN had many services). A small IT program from SEN I beleive would still be a winner (similar to the Palmair service from BOH) as there is money around SEN and it has a large catchment area, and passengers will pay a supplemnet for a local service.

If I recall performance calculations have now changed and what was possible with larger aircraft in the past is no longer possible. However I would have thought a limited ATR42/Do328 service (into Europe, think UK services would be very limited?) would be possible to the major business destinations would be practical, again playing on the strengths of a quick passenger transit time out & in at the airport. The transit time by surface from SEN to LGW/LHR/LTN, even STN, in the morning rush hour can be considerable. And who whats to drive 2 hours west, when you want to fly east (into Europe?)

Southend does however have a perception problem and really needs the railway station (talked about for 10+ years?) to really justify the London Southend name.
 
diesel1
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RE: Services From Southend?

Mon Nov 12, 2007 1:35 pm

Quoting Egmcman (Reply 19):
I remember Air Malta , Air Atlantis, Air UK and Hispania operated from SEN in 1980's

Back in the mid 80s Paramount were contracted by the tour operator (Burstin Travel who later became the backers of Princess Air??) to operate from SEN to Mediterranean destinations. IIRC, they soon pulled out of the contract citing performance issues with their MD83s and the short runway at SEN.
Airways International Cymru then took the flights on with B737s (using both their 200 & 300 series I think)
Some of the ex Paramount flights may have been operated by a Spanish carrier (Air Sur or Oasis??) with MD83s - for some reason they didn't have issues with the short runway at SEN...

And as far as why no LCC at SEN. easyJet and Ryanair have huge operations at LTN/STN - why dilute your customer base?
Cambridge is another airport in the vicinity where the same question could be asked.
The entry of another carrier to areas where certain airlines have such a large amount of the market is risky (e.g. EUJet @ MSE)

These airports have been left behind in the LCC revolution, just like MSE or HUY.

Their hope for the future is create their own niche markets - MSE has cargo, SEN has maintenance. I understand the CBG niche may be to be covered with housing.
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Yak97
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RE: Services From Southend?

Mon Nov 12, 2007 2:32 pm

Yes, Burstin Travel was behind Princess Air, in response to being let down at short notice by Paramount. Some of the services were flown with Loganair 146's which positoned down from MAN each weekend - Burstin then sold the positioning flights for short breaks in Southend from Manchester - which was suprisingly successful.

Burstin, which was a Southend based Tour operator who had been in business for years and sold the Malta flights, then did a deal with Bath Travel in Bournemouth, a similar style of tour operator to Burstin, so the aircraft did SEN - XXX - BOH - XXX - SEN most days XXX = FAO, AGP, ALC, PMI etc. The aircraft then converted to the freight role at night for flights to BRU CGN etc. This enabled the Princess Air 146-200QC to have the highest utilisation of any 146 in the world during the summer of 1990.
 
diesel1
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RE: Services From Southend?

Mon Nov 12, 2007 5:43 pm

Quoting Yak97 (Reply 22):
This enabled the Princess Air 146-200QC to have the highest utilisation of any 146 in the world during the summer of 1990

Though unfortunately it didn't do Princess Air much good as they ceased operations with 12 months of starting flights. IIRC they had to lease in extensively soon after ops commenced due to a tailscrape or heavy landing?
What about their cargo services - how successful were these?

Quoting Yak97 (Reply 22):
Some of the services were flown with Loganair 146's which positioned down from MAN each weekend

Though pretty sure this was not the same year Paramount let them down.
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egmcman
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RE: Services From Southend?

Mon Nov 12, 2007 9:06 pm

Quoting Diesel1 (Reply 23):
What about their cargo services - how successful were these?

Very lucrative as I said in reply 14 I know the one of the former directors family.
 
egmcman
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RE: Services From Southend?

Mon Nov 12, 2007 9:13 pm

Quoting Yak97 (Reply 20):
Then there was the Maersk Air service with the F50(?) that ran for years from BLL until they could get slots in LGW.

They originally used Dash sevens

Quoting Yak97 (Reply 20):
Then there was the Maersk Air service with the F50(?) that ran for years from BLL until they could get slots in LGW.
The Holland Airlines/Tulip service from RTM with the Nomad? The National Commuter service with the B200 in semi Sabena colours, then the SD330 & 360 services to BRU, JER & GCI. The Harvest Air/Regionair service with PA31/EMB110/J31 to RTM. BRU & CDG? The Air Malta service with the B737-200 (outbound techstop in OST) Ah those were the days!!

Harvest Air I am sure served LTQ using Islanders or Trislanders from memory I remember watching them on the spectators gallery great days.
 
Yak97
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RE: Services From Southend?

Tue Nov 13, 2007 10:59 am

I have an old AirUK time table from winter 1980-81 and that shows services with HPH from SEN to DUS, RTM & OST. Were these the old BAF schedules? When did BAF give them up? I remember BAF went back in schedules with the Jersey invasions back in the late 80's but that was the VC8 era.
 
RebelDJ
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RE: Services From Southend?

Tue Nov 13, 2007 12:20 pm

I believe there is also a daily SEN-CGN rotation with a 146/RJ operated for Ford
 
airchabum
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RE: Services From Southend?

Tue Nov 13, 2007 1:54 pm



Quoting Yak97 (Reply 26):
I have an old AirUK time table from winter 1980-81 and that shows services with HPH from SEN to DUS, RTM & OST. Were these the old BAF schedules? When did BAF give them up? I remember BAF went back in schedules with the Jersey invasions back in the late 80's but that was the VC8 era.

I think those were former BIA routes...they operated Bandeirantes and Heralds ex-SEN around that time.

Quoting Yak97 (Reply 20):
Then there was the Maersk Air service with the F50(?) that ran for years from BLL until they could get slots in LGW.
The Holland Airlines/Tulip service from RTM with the Nomad? The National Commuter service with the B200 in semi Sabena colours, then the SD330 & 360 services to BRU, JER & GCI. The Harvest Air/Regionair service with PA31/EMB110/J31 to RTM. BRU & CDG? The Air Malta service with the B737-200 (outbound techstop in OST) Ah those were the days!!

I also recall around that time a twice daily Malmo service operated by Malmo Aviation with Caravelle/1-11. BMA were also regular visitors with Viscount/F-27 mainly to Jersey/Guernsey IIRC.

Sadly I can't really see any major potential for passenger services at SEN because the runway is too short to allow full payloads to a lot of destinations and you've got Europe's biggest LCC base an hour up the road. There has been talk over the years of building a new terminal/railway station, extending the runway and moving the church, and until those things happen no major airline is going to show any serious interest. I think the best hope for the airport is to provide an alternative in the not too distant future when LCY/STN reach capacity.

Cheers
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egmcman
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RE: Services From Southend?

Tue Nov 13, 2007 9:14 pm



Quoting RebelDJ (Reply 27):
I believe there is also a daily SEN-CGN rotation with a 146/RJ operated for Ford

It's two on the days it operates the flight I don't think operates every fay. The flights are operated on behalf of Ford Motor Co by Flightline it uses the Flightline callsign . I see the Morning departure as I live in Rochford it leaves around 6:55.

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