EK156
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Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sat Nov 10, 2007 4:59 pm

According to Boston Consulting Group, Emirates is on its way to become the No.1 International Airline in passenger load by 2015. It currently no. 7 and catching up with Lufthansa which is no. 1 very fast!

http://www.gulfnews.com/business/Aviation/10166527.html

I guess when we talk passenger load, this does not involve service on board. But profit wise, EK is doing an excellent job. So if EK are closing up on the Major Airlines in passenger load then they definitely are doing something right and are not depending on government funding like alot of people say

Oh and by the way, EK is the highest priced amongst airlines if you want to buy a ticket out of Dubai!!! For Example, a ticket with EK to London is more expensive than with BA or Virgin or Royal Brunei
 
flyorski
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sat Nov 10, 2007 5:03 pm

Not great for LH, but it is understandable. If EK does manage to fill all those 380s and adds some more, than they would have to be number one. It would not surprise me if at some time complete open skies happens, and EK could fly domestically anywhere from north America to Japan, no doubt if they could they would.
"None are more hopelessly enslaved, than those who falsly believe they are free" -Goethe
 
reality
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sat Nov 10, 2007 5:43 pm

The title of this thread "Emirates To Be No. 1 In Passenger Loads" may be a little misleading. The article seems to be talking about INTERNATIONAL passenger loads on "international airlines."

It says that "The Dubai carrier flew 16.7 million passengers in 2006. Lufthansa again took the number one spot among international airlines with 38.2 million passengers flown, followed by Air France, British Airways and KLM." (I guess the 38.2 million passengers on Lufthansa doesn't include domestic passengers?)

It then goes on to say that "American Airlines was the world’s largest airline by passenger traffic in 2006, with 99.8 million passengers." Of course American is an "international airline" too, but this figure obviously includes domestic passengers.

[Edited 2007-11-10 09:45:03]

[Edited 2007-11-10 09:46:40]
 
Bongodog1964
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sat Nov 10, 2007 8:28 pm

Methinks Mr O'Leary might have an opinion on this one. FR carried 42 million passengers in the year ending March 2007, and are expanding at about 20%/annum. The vast majority of these will be international.
I realise their passenger yield is relatively low; but if you are counting on the basis of passenger numbers, they have to be near the top.
 
cobra27
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sat Nov 10, 2007 10:44 pm

I don't think they will manage it, but who knows.

Does anybody know who owns emirates (the airline)?
 
ANother
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sat Nov 10, 2007 10:50 pm

Quoting EK156 (Thread starter):
But profit wise, EK is doing an excellent job.

Care to share the P&L statements? Also don't forget they fly to/from an airport built by slave labour (ok - $200 a month isn't slave labour, it's just close)

Quoting EK156 (Thread starter):
Oh and by the way, EK is the highest priced amongst airlines if you want to buy a ticket out of Dubai!!! For Example, a ticket with EK to London is more expensive than with BA or Virgin or Royal Brunei

There is an expression in this business - you don't sh*t in your own back yard. What do you want to bet that EK sells connecting flights via DXB at much lower prices than those from DXB?
 
reality
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sat Nov 10, 2007 11:07 pm

Well, however they did it.....Emirates is a big success and something that people from the region can be proud of. Congratulation. I'm looking forward to the day when they fly to the US West Coast.
 
BigTom
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sun Nov 11, 2007 7:55 am

Quoting ANother (Reply 5):
Care to share the P&L statements? Also don't forget they fly to/from an airport built by slave labour (ok - $200 a month isn't slave labour, it's just close)

Well I wouldn't exactly call it that. The labourers come willingly from the neighbouring countries. When cheap labour is available you take it. Just like Western companies outsource to take advantage of cheaper labour.

Cheers
 
MYT321
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sun Nov 11, 2007 8:34 am

I read recently that FR "...now fly more passengers accross international borders than any other airline.". IIRC the article was written by A.net's 'favourite' travel journalist Mr Simon Calder.
"The A380 is coming to MAN"
 
aa1818
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sun Nov 11, 2007 3:44 pm

Good luck to EK!

Does anyone know where I can find a list of the top carriers by passenger loads please?
Does AA rank anywhere in the top few places?

AA1818
“The moment you doubt whether you can fly, you cease for ever to be able to do it.” J.M. Barrie (Peter Pan)
 
reality
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sun Nov 11, 2007 4:43 pm

Quoting AA1818 (Reply 9):
Does anyone know where I can find a list of the top carriers by passenger loads please?

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World%27s_largest_airlines


The numbers are easier to read if you click the link. Below, the columns are jumbled. The first number on each line is for 2006, the second number for 2005. No number is given for Ryanair for 2005. I presume that Ryanair flights are much shorter, on average, than other international carriers.

Scheduled international passengers carried (thousands)
Rank Airline 2006
2005
(thousands)
1 Flag of Ireland Ryanair1 40,532 -
2 Flag of Germany Lufthansa2 38,236 35,740
3 Flag of France Air France 30,417 28,898
4 Flag of the United Kingdom British Airways 29,498 28,922
5 Flag of the Netherlands KLM 22,322 21,435
6 Flag of the United Kingdom Easyjet 21,917 -
7 Flag of the United States American Airlines 21,228 20,659
8 Flag of Singapore Singapore Airlines3 1 8,022 16,618
9 Flag of the United Arab Emirates Emirates 16,748 14,976
10 Flag of Hong Kong Cathay Pacific4 16,667 5,369
Flag of DenmarkFlag of NorwayFlag of Sweden Scandinavian Airlines System - 13,378
Flag of Italy Alitalia - 12,841

Notes

* Note 1: This figure is suspect as 40,532,000 is the total number of passengers flown by Ryanair in 2006 (see the rolling 12 months as at December 2006). Ryanair flies a small but still significant number of domestic routes in Ireland, the UK, Italy and Spain. Confirmation of the number of passengers flown on these routes is needed before Ryanair can claim top spot in the international passengers flown category. Even 25 domestic return flights a day with 135 passengers (both conservative estimates - there are at least a dozen daily domestic return flights in the UK alone and a similar number in Italy) would account for almost 2.5 million passengers.


--------------------

Scheduled passengers carried
Rank Airline 2006
(thousands)[1] 2005
(thousands)
1 Flag of the United States American Airlines 99,835 98,038
2 Flag of the United States Southwest Airlines 96,277
3 Flag of the United States Delta Air Lines 73,584 86,007
4 Flag of the United States United Airlines 69,265 66,717
5 Flag of the United States Northwest Airlines 55,925 57,547
6 Flag of Germany Lufthansa1 51,213 48,958
7 Flag of France Air France2 49,411 47,787
8 Flag of Japan All Nippon Airways 49,226 48,315
9 Flag of Japan Japan Airlines 48,911 50,884
10 Flag of the People's Republic of China China Southern Airlines 48,512 43,228
Flag of the United States Continental Airlines - 42,777
 
reality
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sun Nov 11, 2007 4:51 pm

This may be the table that the article in post 1 quotes that puts Emirates at #7. Ryannair does not show up on this table because it has more short flights and therefore flies fewer passenger-kilometers. Is that correct? Or did they omit Ryannair for some other reason?

Scheduled international passenger-kilometres flown
Rank Airline 2006
(millions)[2]
1 Flag of France Air France1 112,689
2 Flag of the United Kingdom British Airways 111,336
3 Flag of Germany Lufthansa2 109,384
4 Flag of Singapore Singapore Airlines3 87,646
5 Flag of the United States American Airlines 81,129
6 Flag of the United States United Airlines 74,578
7 Flag of the United Arab Emirates Emirates 74,578
5 Flag of the Netherlands KLM 71,761
6 Flag of Hong Kong Cathay Pacific4 71,124
10 Flag of Japan Japan Airlines 59,913

From: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World%27s_largest_airlines
 
Thorben
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sun Nov 11, 2007 5:02 pm

I would count the size by the total pax-km flown, both domestic and international:

Rank Airline 2006 (millions)

1 American Airlines 224,330
2 United Airlines 188,684
3 Delta Air Lines 158,952
4 Air France1 123,458
5 Continental Airlines 122,712
6 Northwest Airlines 116,845
7 British Airways 114,896
8 Lufthansa2 114,672
9 Southwest Airlines 108,935
10 Japan Airlines 89,314
11 Singapore Airlines3 - 80,988

SQ figures are for 2005.

Strange that LH only makes place 7, I thought they were the biggest in the world.

EK with its 100 widebodies will sooner or later appear there and march to the top, especially with

58 own (plus leased) A388
70 or so 77W
10 77L
10 A345
20 A35X
50 A359

plus more planes
France 1789; Eastern Germany 1989; Tunisia 2011; Egypt 2011
 
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lightsaber
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sun Nov 11, 2007 5:03 pm

Quoting Reality (Reply 11):
This may be the table that the article in post 1 quotes that puts Emirates at #7.

Thanks for the data Reality. I believe that the international passenger kilometers is the best number to compare on. e.g., Taipei to Hong Kong is a really popular route, but not on the same scale as HKG-LHR, or SIN-LAX/JFK.

But its interesting to compare. With EK ordering *even more* A380's, their growth will be amazing.

If anything, these huge orders bring into question whom EK will sell off used aircraft to. For with their history of fleet replacement, resale becomes important. Obviously, the lower the purchase price, the easier it is to depreciate the airframe down to zero.  spin 

Lightsaber
"They did not know it was impossible, so they did it!" - Mark Twain
 
ANother
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sun Nov 11, 2007 9:07 pm

Quoting BigTom (Reply 7):
Well I wouldn't exactly call it that. The labourers come willingly from the neighbouring countries. When cheap labour is available you take it. Just like Western companies outsource to take advantage of cheaper labour.

Suppose this makes you feel less guilty. Willingly is just a little stretch. Tell me why strikes are illegal in the UAE? Or belonging to a union? Doesn't change my statement EK operates from an airport built by (almost) slave labour.
 
hightower
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sun Nov 11, 2007 9:25 pm

Quoting ANother (Reply 14):
Tell me why strikes are illegal in the UAE? Or belonging to a union? Doesn't change my statement EK operates from an airport built by (almost) slave labour.

 Sad But can you really be surprised?
Take action and responsibility to do yours for the environment... thx
 
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Qatara340
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sun Nov 11, 2007 9:45 pm

Quoting ANother (Reply 14):
Doesn't change my statement EK operates from an airport built by (almost) slave labour.

Hahaha.... another EK hater! It has nothing to do with this topic so I suggest you put a lid to it.
لا اله الا الله محمد رسول الله
 
jacobin777
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Sun Nov 11, 2007 10:14 pm

Quoting ANother (Reply 5):
Care to share the P&L statements? Also don't forget they fly to/from an airport built by slave labour (ok - $200 a month isn't slave labour, it's just close)

Your example has a majour flaw in it....

I'll use Pakistan as an example....

$200/month is RS.120000 rupees/month.....that worker would make no more than 3,000 rupees/month if if he stayed in Pakistan....

9,000 rupees/month x 12 months x 6 years (approximate amount of length some stay)= approximately 650,000 rupees...that is HUGE for a labourer..enough to purchase property and have their sons/daughters married...that is an opportunity they would never had have in Pakistan...

[Edited 2007-11-11 14:17:07]

[Edited 2007-11-11 14:22:15]
"Up the Irons!"
 
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lightsaber
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RE: Emirates To Be No.1 In Passenger Load By 2015

Mon Nov 12, 2007 2:32 am

I keep coming back to how EK is planning to operate dual operations DXB/JXB. Part of me is fascinated that they'll try it, part wonders if they can? History has shown that split operations confuses customers and many dread switching airports.

But with an all widebody strategy, they should be able to maximize their one hub. (Even with two airports, its a one city hub.)

Does anyone have the breakdown of DXB flights by type?
e.g.,
1. Percent of flights or pax on EK widebodies
2. Percent of flights or pax on other airline widebodies
3. Percent of flights pax narrowbodies
4. Percent of flights freight (if broken down by aircraft size, even better).

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 17):

9,000 rupees/month x 12 months x 6 years (approximate amount of length some stay)= approximately 650,000 rupees...that is HUGE for a labourer..enough to purchase property and have their sons/daughters married...that is an opportunity they would never had have in Pakistan...

Very similar to why a certain demographic comes to work in the US. Its the only way they can get a leg up. They work hard until they can afford a home and to start a small business. In the middle east, they also work to pay for a child(s) wedding(s).

So are the conditions ideal? Heck no. But I know how the system works here in the USA. Better or worse here? At least Dubai is improving (the e-paycheck system).

Lightsaber
"They did not know it was impossible, so they did it!" - Mark Twain