dellatorre
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Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 4:04 pm

According to the Brazilian aviation website www.jetsite.com.br , Airbus is going to announce on Nov 21st a mega order in Brazil. Right now rumors go into 2 directions.

1 - The acquisition of A380 aircraft by TAM.
2 - A new long haul fleet order by Varig.

The announcement is kind of certain. What really needs to be known is whether it's mega or not and whose ordering it.

Let the gossip begin!!!!    

To be honest, I didn't expect any of those to happen.

I could see TAM going for the A380, but not before 2010 or even later. Since RG is being run by GOL, I would expect at least a preference for Boeing product. I guess we'll have to wait and see what unfolds out of this.

Hey Richard (JJMNGR), do you have any tips on this one!!!  

I almost forgot. There is even a retouched picture of A380 in JJ colors.... Is this supposed mean something.......


[Edited 2007-11-13 08:06:45]

[Edited 2007-11-13 08:11:34]
 
BlueSky1976
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 4:11 pm

Just a wild guess: a new startup airline purchasing 100 A320s?
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kl911
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 4:11 pm

I can't see Varig going for Airbus, but TAM is definetily possible. Let's wait and see.

KL911
 
Thorben
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 4:13 pm

I was always sure that JJ would get A380s sooner or later, with a growing economy at home and a home-market of 150 million people.

Quoting Dellatorre (Thread starter):
1 - The acquisition of A380 aircraft by TAM.
2 - A new long haul fleet order by Varig.

Seems more like two mega orders.

Quoting Dellatorre (Thread starter):
According to the Brazilian aviation website www.jetsite.com.br , Airbus is going to announce on Nov 21st a mega order in Brazil. Right now rumors go into 2 directions.

How reliable is that site?

Quoting Dellatorre (Thread starter):
Hey Richard (JJMNGR), do you have any tips on this one!!!

Yes, can you give us any insight?
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kc135topboom
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 4:14 pm



Quoting Dellatorre (Thread starter):
I could see TAM going for the A380, but not before 2010 or even later.

It would have to be a later delivery. I think all the A-380 production slots are already taken until some time in 2012. I'm not so sure about an A-380 order for TAM, perhaps some (12-24) A-330s?

Or maybe RG is going to order some A-330Fs to work along side of their B-777Fs.
 
dellatorre
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 4:18 pm



Quoting BlueSky1976 (Reply 1):
Just a wild guess: a new startup airline purchasing 100 A320s?

That would be to good to be true. Wonder how the Ministry of Defense would think about that???

I guess this "mega" order is a little exagerated.. Would JJ buying a couple A380 or RG going for a dozen A350 be considered mega?

I have no idea, this really took me by surprise!!!!
 
jog
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 4:20 pm



Quoting Dellatorre (Thread starter):
There is even a retouched picture of A380 in JJ colors.

huh... the plan seems to be around for a while already, why else is the tail still red-blue and not traffic-light-like red-yellow-green?  Wink
 
dellatorre
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 4:27 pm



Quoting Thorben (Reply 3):
How reliable is that site?

This is one of Brazil's best aviation websites, run by a re-known aviation specialist (Gianfranco Betting). I can assure he wouldn't make up stuff like that if he didn't have anything behind it.

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 4):
It would have to be a later delivery. I think all the A-380 production slots are already taken until some time in 2012. I'm not so sure about an A-380 order for TAM, perhaps some (12-24) A-330s?

I meant that JJ would only consider ordering the A380 in 2010 or later.
 
BlueSky1976
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 4:28 pm

Quoting Dellatorre (Reply 5):
Would JJ buying a couple A380 or RG going for a dozen A350 be considered mega?

RG going for A350 would definitely be considered a "mega blow" to Boeing by some of the members here - just as JJ buying 8 77Ws was considered a "major victory" by the same people.

[Edited 2007-11-13 08:29:39]
POLAND IS UNDER DICTATORSHIP OF JAROSŁAW KACZYŃSKI AND HIS PUPPET GOVERNMENT. DEMOCRACY SHALL PREVAIL.
 
PPVRA
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 7:29 pm

Odd. Don't really know what to think about it. Completely out of the blue.

Could be A350s for RG, but that would be odd too.

A380s for TAM? . . will see.

PS: On the 21st??? That's too long to wait!! Big grin

[Edited 2007-11-13 11:30:30]
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C010T3
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 7:45 pm



Quoting Thorben (Reply 3):
ow reliable is that site?

Not that much. It has grown from an announcement from Airbus to a an announcement of a huge order.These rumours have come straight from the Brazilian Airport Gossipers Association. Trust me, everybody denies it, but it exists.Everyone somehow connected to aviation in Brazil has a membership. You wouldn't believe what people are capable of inventing down here. There are rumours of new 744 for Varig being spread, since they got rid of theirs in the first place.
 
incitatus
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 7:52 pm

Mega.....? Say 50 widebodies or 100 narrowbodies?

Mega order is very unlikely. Air traffic growth slowed in Brazil and due to ATC constraints the government is not interested in high air-traffic growth anymore.

Quoting Thorben (Reply 3):
I was always sure that JJ would get A380s sooner or later, with a growing economy at home and a home-market of 150 million people.

I am sure the A380 is not coming to TAM. A lot of those 150m + people cannot afford air travel. Outside of Sao Paulo - Miami there are no longhaul markets to take the A380. Not even SP - Paris.
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dellatorre
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 8:04 pm



Quoting C010T3 (Reply 10):
Not that much. It has grown from an announcement from Airbus to a an announcement of a huge order.These rumours have come straight from the Brazilian Airport Gossipers Association. Trust me, everybody denies it, but it exists.Everyone somehow connected to aviation in Brazil has a membership. You wouldn't believe what people are capable of inventing down here. There are rumours of new 744 for Varig being spread, since they got rid of theirs in the first place.

I respect your opinion about the source, but i don't agree!!! The same website was one of the first ones in Brazil to reveal BRA's intention to acquire E-jets, way before the airline annouce its order, regardless of how badly run BRA is. Oops! Should i say was!!!

I think is very unlikely for someone like Gianfranco, Jetsite's creator, to give an information like this being based on false rumors. He even set the date for the announcement..If it wasn't true, why would he put his reputation on the line? We would find out by the 21st that anyways.

I guess we have to wait to find out, won't we?
 
KL808
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 8:14 pm

Gol replacing its whole B737 fleet with an A32X fleet + RG ordering A350's  duck 

This must constitute a mega order.  Wink
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Mortyman
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 8:19 pm

So on what route will TAM use the 380 ? Between Europe and Brazil ?
 
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yellowtail
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 9:50 pm

the 380....between Sao Paolo and Rio of Course!
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Reggaebird
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 10:13 pm



Quoting KL808 (Reply 13):
Gol replacing its whole B737 fleet with an A32X fleet + RG ordering A350's

This must constitute a mega order.

This would be HUGE!!! It could also explain why the Boeing head of Sales is stepping down. GOL has been a staunch Boeing customer so a switch would be a financial and psychological blow for Boeing.

Another option would be that Emirates is buying a Brazilian carrier and kitting out the fleet with Airbii.
 
LH506
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Tue Nov 13, 2007 10:18 pm



Quoting Dellatorre (Thread starter):
According to the Brazilian aviation website www.jetsite.com.br , Airbus is going to announce on Nov 21st a mega order in Brazil. Right now rumors go into 2 directions.

1 - The acquisition of A380 aircraft by TAM.
2 - A new long haul fleet order by Varig.

The announcement is kind of certain. What really needs to be known is whether it's mega or not and whose ordering it.

Let the gossip begin!!!!

I guess it may be JJ firming up their Paris commitment + a couple of extra frames
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boeingfever777
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 12:16 am



Quoting KL808 (Reply 13):
Gol replacing its whole B737 fleet with an A32X fleet

Since 2004 GOL has placed (87) firm orders for 737-800 while only taking delivery on (21) of them... Having another (30) 737-7 active and (12) 737-8 leased and your saying they are going to what cancel (60+) 737-8's on order and buy from Airbus?

Yeah ok...  rotfl 

As far as JJ why and where do they need the capacity for A380's? They already have (8) 77W on order.
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bsbisland
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:00 am

JJ ordering A380 would be very shocking.

Quoting BoeingFever777 (Reply 18):
As far as JJ why and where do they need the capacity for A380's?

Good question, but maybe in the next decade they could fill those A380 on routes from GRU to MIA,JFK,CDG,FRA,LHR... But I think the 777-300 is already "big enough".
 
C010T3
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:07 am



Quoting Dellatorre (Reply 12):
I respect your opinion about the source, but i don't agree!!! The same website was one of the first ones in Brazil to reveal BRA's intention to acquire E-jets, way before the airline annouce its order, regardless of how badly run BRA is. Oops! Should i say was!!!

Not the first, nonetheless.

Quoting Dellatorre (Reply 12):
I think is very unlikely for someone like Gianfranco, Jetsite's creator, to give an information like this being based on false rumors. He even set the date for the announcement..If it wasn't true, why would he put his reputation on the line? We would find out by the 21st that anyways.

There will be an announcement, but other sources don't mention an order or even the size. It wouldn't be the first time that false rumours have been propagated by Jetsite.
 
loalq
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:14 am



Quoting LH506 (Reply 17):
I guess it may be JJ firming up their Paris commitment + a couple of extra frames

Agree. But I thought this were already firm...?

I heard rumors that GIG would be the first brazilian airport (even before GRU) to be remodelled to accomodate the A380, anyone with info on this?

Rgds, Loalq
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C010T3
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:11 am



Quoting Loalq (Reply 21):

Agree. But I thought this were already firm...?

I heard rumors that GIG would be the first brazilian airport (even before GRU) to be remodelled to accomodate the A380, anyone with info on this?

Rgds, Loalq

That may happen, because the Government of Rio de Janeiro is pressuring the Federal Government for the remodelling of GIG's T1. Since the T1's jetways are quite old, it's almost certain that they will be replaced. GIG never had a space issue, has the best infrastructure in Brazil and improvements of its taxiways are already on their way. The rumour makes total sense, specially after Infraero's president stated that GIG will be the only Brazilian airport to be adapted to the A380, which I actually don't buy. It is very probable that GRU will only get A380 positions, when T3 is built. Have you seen the gates at GRU? The exiting corridors are just too narrow.
 
donzilasse
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:53 am

This sounds a little to good to be true and if true I would only see two options.

1, Varig possibly could go for the A350.

2. JJ and A380 ? The only reason for this would be if JJ don't think that they can obtain enough of frequences to FRA and believes that their new connection with Star will bring so much traffic that they can fill them. The conservatism of Mr. Bologna probably would speak aginst this but, maybe a couple of frames could ensure JJ a continuing leading roll as the #1 Brazilian International Airline.

This sounds a little to good to be true but, I might find out on the 21st when I will be flying JJ8075 from MIA to GRU and CNF.

Lasse
 
donzilasse
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:00 am

Here the news! sorry only in Portuguese but the news confirms that it is only two alternatives.
1. JJ nuys A380
2. New longhaul fleet for Varig.

Lasse

Airbus anunciará mega venda no Brasil
No próximo dia 21, a Airbus vai anunciar um grande negócio no Brasil. As apostas mais altas são duas: a venda de aeronaves A380 para a TAM ou de uma nova frota de longo curso para a Varig. Enquanto isso, o jetsite já apresenta uma imagem do A380 nas cores da TAM. Façam suas apostas.
 
donzilasse
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:06 am

Sorry, I screwed up my flight number should off course be JJ8095.

Lasse
 
BAKJet
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:08 am



Quoting BlueSky1976 (Reply 1):
Just a wild guess: a new startup airline purchasing 100 A320s?

Virgin Brazil  Big grin
 
longhaul67
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:57 am



Quoting C010T3 (Reply 22):
Since the T1's jetways are quite old, it's almost certain that they will be replaced. GIG never had a space issue, has the best infrastructure in Brazil and improvements of its taxiways are already on their way.

If there are already plans to upgrade T1, wouldn't it make sense to upgrade to also accommodate the A380?
 
hloutweg
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:19 am

I have no doubt that there's some truth in the news.

But, and order for either TAM or Varig is a very polarized rumor. I mean that for such an exact date for the order, there's a lot of vagueness in the subject of that order, which lets me to believe that either all is false, or everything is true about one of the two orders. With this I mean, that the source knows more than they have just released. I believe is the second, and not the first.
In Varietate Concordia
 
wukka
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 4:19 am

"Mega Order"?

Something that will surpass EK and their commitment? What is a "Mega Order"?

This must be something beyond huge!

Or is the title of this thread totally misleading?

I know there's a lot of questions in my post, but I'm curious. A photoshopped 380 from this jetsite isn't enough to get me pumped up, and unfortunately I can't read fluent Portuguese.
We can agree to disagree.
 
C010T3
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 5:46 am



Quoting LongHaul67 (Reply 27):

If there are already plans to upgrade T1, wouldn't it make sense to upgrade to also accommodate the A380?

That's what I was going for.
 
LipeGIG
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:08 am

I believe TAM will acquire 6 to 8 A380 plus some additional A330 (6 to 12) and A350.

By the way, UA will begin code-share on JJ flights this Wednesday 14.

UA 9838 JFK 0725 GRU 2025 - A332
UA 9839 GRU 0845 JFK 1545 - A332
UA 9840 JFK 1740 GRU 0640 - A332
UA 9841 GRU 2230 JFK 0530 - A332
UA 9842 MIA 0905 MIA 2015 - A332 * Mon to Sat
UA 9843 GRU 1030 MIA 1540 - A332 * Mon to Sat
UA 9844 MIA 1920 GRU 0630 - A332
UA 9845 GRU 2345 MIA 0455 - A332

Rumors about GRU-LAX in march/08, GIG-MIA in june/08, GIG-JFK in oct/08 as well as a year round GIG-IAD oct/08 also.


Felipe
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jog
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 8:53 am

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 31):
Rumors about GRU-LAX in march/08,

I think this is the one with the highest chance of being realisitic as it was basically confirmed by Bologna already (see http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...ntonio-bologna-staying-power.html)

As mentioned before, it seems that GRU is currently somehow slot restricted as well as the timing opportunities for flights to/from the US and from Europe are somehow limited. Only to Europe you have a bigger window. Thus, further expansion in GRU requires bigger aircraft. But the A380 seems to me to be a too massive expansion, especially as it would require significant investments into GRU as well. It might be the right aircraft for GRU - FRA, LHR and maybe CDG in the future, but IMHO it is far too big for the daylight flights between GRU and the US. But let's wait and see...

[Edited 2007-11-14 00:56:26]
 
columba
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 9:20 am

I am hoping for additional A380s and A350s for JJ  Smile
It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
 
OHLHD
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 9:36 am

My bet is a VARIG longhaul order. It was rumored before. On the otherhand a A380 order by TAM would be great too.  Smile
 
kaitak
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 9:43 am

If it is a long haul order for RG, can it get back some of the routes it previously operated -for example, the LHR route now operated by TAM?
 
jog
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 10:24 am



Quoting Kaitak (Reply 35):
If it is a long haul order for RG, can it get back some of the routes it previously operated -for example, the LHR route now operated by TAM?

TAM has its own frequencies to LHR which is independent of RG. RG should be operating their own flights since the 29th of October again. I did not read anything about it yet, but according to LHR's website it seems that it is running.
 
dellatorre
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 10:56 am



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 31):
I believe TAM will acquire 6 to 8 A380 plus some additional A330 (6 to 12) and A350.

Which little bird made you believe such thing?????

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 31):
Rumors about GRU-LAX in march/08, GIG-MIA in june/08, GIG-JFK in oct/08 as well as a year round GIG-IAD oct/08 also.

If that really happens it's gonna be a major boost to JJ international plans. Finally can we see non-stop GIG-MIA & GIG-JFK.
 
airtebiong
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 11:53 am



Quoting Jog (Reply 36):
TAM has its own frequencies to LHR which is independent of RG. RG should be operating their own flights since the 29th of October again. I did not read anything about it yet, but according to LHR's website it seems that it is running

It is indeed running, im not quite sure of the frequency though. It's nice to see RG in LHR again!

Quoting Columba (Reply 33):
I am hoping for additional A380s and A350s for JJ Smile

My bet is on this one too.. Although im a little bit skeptical on the A380
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columba
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 11:57 am



Quoting Airtebiong (Reply 38):
Although im a little bit skeptical on the A380

Well, nobody would have expected that Air Comet and Aerolinas Argentinas would order the A380, too  Smile
It will forever be a McDonnell Douglas MD 80 , Boeing MD 80 sounds so wrong
 
SBBRTech
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 12:16 pm



Quoting Dellatorre (Thread starter):
1 - The acquisition of A380 aircraft by TAM.

I never thought JJ had that much of backlog demand for international passangers, even after RG´s collapse.
Domestically where could they use the A380? It fits nowhere, maybe GIG or GRU, that´s it. Taking our country´s
ability to mess up all kinds of projects and schedules, i don´t see our airports being remodelled soon enough.

Quoting OHLHD (Reply 34):
My bet is a VARIG longhaul order.



Quoting Kaitak (Reply 35):
If it is a long haul order for RG

After reading that the "new" RG would target mostly business travellers and people who really expect a "better service" (read people who got cash to burn), i´m starting to doubt that. They wouldn´t go for the biggest bus in the market if the plan was to avoid the Y class folks...or would they?
"I'm beginning to get the hang of this flying business" - C3PO
 
OHLHD
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:27 pm



Quoting SBBRTech (Reply 40):
After reading that the "new" RG would target mostly business travellers and people who really expect a "better service" (read people who got cash to burn),

They could get some A340-600 and have them mostly F and J Class with a small Y-Class section. However I doubt that there is so much confidence back into RG that they can enter this segment. But I might be wrong here.
On the other hand I can´t see a "mega order" then if it is only for Business Clients. We will see.  Smile
 
LipeGIG
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:46 pm



Quoting Dellatorre (Reply 37):
Which little bird made you believe such thing?????

 Smile

It's a bet considering the current market issues that i know. TAM is focused on increase their international network, where yields are better and with less competition. We remember JJMNGR mentioned about ZRH, MEX and others, and IMO, TAM will need more planes to fill the upcoming growing of Brazil. The numbers are based on:

CDG-GRU 2x A380
LHR-GRU 2x A380
MXP-GRU 2x A380
With this, 4 planes (considering A345 should be returned) will be available for new routes (which may include more flights from Brazilian Northeast to Europe / US)

The 6 additional A332 would allow TAM (they will already receive 4 in 2008 as per last investor relations update i got) to fly LAX, GIG-MIA, possible GIG-JFK, GRU-ZRH and even GRU-MEX.

The A350 should be because they will have more A330 to be replaced.

Quoting Jog (Reply 32):
As mentioned before, it seems that GRU is currently somehow slot restricted as well as the timing opportunities for flights to/from the US and from Europe are somehow limited

And makes more sense if we consider TAM can take advantage of bigger planes to increase their ability to handle the future demand without the need to cancel some domestic flights.

But i would say that a Varig possible order (including A380) would surprises me a lot !


Felipe
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
 
dellatorre
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:27 pm



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 42):
It's a bet considering the current market issues that i know. TAM is focused on increase their international network, where yields are better and with less competition. We remember JJMNGR mentioned about ZRH, MEX and others, and IMO, TAM will need more planes to fill the upcoming growing of Brazil. The numbers are based on:

CDG-GRU 2x A380
LHR-GRU 2x A380
MXP-GRU 2x A380
With this, 4 planes (considering A345 should be returned) will be available for new routes (which may include more flights from Brazilian Northeast to Europe / US)

The 6 additional A332 would allow TAM (they will already receive 4 in 2008 as per last investor relations update i got) to fly LAX, GIG-MIA, possible GIG-JFK, GRU-ZRH and even GRU-MEX.

The A350 should be because they will have more A330 to be replaced.

Although not certain, I gotta admit this seems to be a quite logical move.

In the coming years, JJ could be facing A380 competition from AF, LH & BA and even IB in their routes to Europe. If the market keeps growing, the A380 is a natural step for JJ to compete in those markets.
 
incitatus
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 7:02 pm



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 42):
And makes more sense if we consider TAM can take advantage of bigger planes to increase their ability to handle the future demand without the need to cancel some domestic flights.

You are forgetting that a very large aircraft like the A380 will be a desincentive for TAM to open longhaul routes outside of GRU. For example, in a market like Brazil to Italy, it is much more attractive to have multiple routes with smaller aircraft instead of a single route with a large one. Instead of doing GRU-MXP with an A380, TAM could serve GRU-MXP, GRU-FCO and GIG-MXP with smaller aircraft. If Varig comes out with a 787 fleet, it will be better positioned to cover more of the market compared to a TAM equipped with A380s - even considering only the destinations TAM would place A380s.

Outside of GRU-MIA, it makes no sense to have a very large aircraft in Brazil, and it makes no sense for an airline to have a fleet of a couple of aircraft dedicated to flying a single competitive route. Market share could shift to a competitor and there will be nowhere else to deploy the large aircraft.

Then there is the issue that TAM's longhaul fleet already looks like cobb salad, and that is expensive.
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donzilasse
Posts: 206
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 9:49 pm

Felipe,

Richard mentioned in another forum the possibility of this however it did not sound like this could be the news for the 21st. What's your opinion? Could a possible A380 order be this close for TAM? I could see some routes where slots might be scarce and it could make sence.

Lasse

P.S. Heading back to Ipatinga next Wednesday on JJ8095. Ipatinga 2008 in Serie A!!!!
 
LipeGIG
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Wed Nov 14, 2007 11:33 pm



Quoting Incitatus (Reply 44):
You are forgetting that a very large aircraft like the A380 will be a desincentive for TAM to open longhaul routes outside of GRU. For example, in a market like Brazil to Italy, it is much more attractive to have multiple routes with smaller aircraft instead of a single route with a large one. Instead of doing GRU-MXP with an A380, TAM could serve GRU-MXP, GRU-FCO and GIG-MXP with smaller aircraft. If Varig comes out with a 787 fleet, it will be better positioned to cover more of the market compared to a TAM equipped with A380s - even considering only the destinations TAM would place A380s.

I agree with you and has been my main comment here on A.Net, more routes to more pairs of city's instead of the massive concentration at GRU. But with slot restrictions, i believe TAM will try to get all the advantage it can at GRU but GIG will be also focus for destinations already served from GRU.

Quoting Donzilasse (Reply 45):
Richard mentioned in another forum the possibility of this however it did not sound like this could be the news for the 21st. What's your opinion? Could a possible A380 order be this close for TAM? I could see some routes where slots might be scarce and it could make sence.

I really believe TAM will be buying at least more A332 and A350 plus some A318 (now it's clear there are markets the A320 is not feasible to serve like CCM which will be axed on Dec 10). The A380 would come as a surprise, but not for me considering the current demand levels and slot restrictions at GRU.

Quoting Donzilasse (Reply 45):
P.S. Heading back to Ipatinga next Wednesday on JJ8095. Ipatinga 2008 in Serie A!!!!

I just return from Rio last weekend on JJ8080 and my bag arrived 12 hours later  Sad Good lucky for you and also for Ipatinga next year !
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EddieDude
Posts: 6390
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RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Thu Nov 15, 2007 12:53 am



Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 42):
remember JJMNGR mentioned about ZRH, MEX and others, and IMO, TAM will need more planes to fill the upcoming growing of Brazil

But with both Ocean Air and the new Varig flying to MEX, there is no room for JJ to apply for MEX authority, is it?

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 42):
CDG-GRU 2x A380
LHR-GRU 2x A380
MXP-GRU 2x A380

Can LHR and MXP support this capacity??? JJ has no allies with hubs at LHR and MXP, so that won't help.
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donzilasse
Posts: 206
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2004 12:06 am

RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Thu Nov 15, 2007 2:55 am

Felipe,

Very interesting news. I guess that we will have to wait and see about the A380,s.
I am a little bit surprised because I always considered TAM very conservative however it might make sence on routes where slots might be an issue.

You have to let me know if you are visiting Miami.

Lasse
 
C010T3
Posts: 1670
Joined: Wed Jul 19, 2006 5:48 am

RE: Airbus To Announce Mega Order In Brazil!

Thu Nov 15, 2007 3:11 am



Quoting EddieDude (Reply 47):

But with both Ocean Air and the new Varig flying to MEX, there is no room for JJ to apply for MEX authority, is it?

No, there isn't, but there are 4 frequencies left on the bilateral to any other destination in Mexico.

Frequencies list for October:
http://www.anac.gov.br/arquivos/pdf/frequenciasOutubro07.pdf

Summarized bilateral with Mexico:
http://www.anac.gov.br/arquivos/pdf/acordosBilaterais/M/Mexico.pdf

Infos about other countries try taking a look here:
http://www.anac.gov.br/anac/sri/sri.asp

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