rampkontroler
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Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Mon Nov 19, 2007 6:16 am

The saga of N862RW seems to be nearing completion as it made its debut today (Sunday 11/18) outside the Air Services hangar, for some much needed sunshine and an engine run-up which I believe to be its first since it ran off the runway in a snowstorm this past February. It's amazing the amount of work they've put into this aircraft...removing the engines, the nose, and the forward fuselage up to the wings, and putting it all back together. It's nice to see it back "on it's feet" again, and I bet it will be back in the air very soon.


Big version: Width: 300 Height: 210 File size: 45kb


Full size image here:

http://www.opshots.net/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-7007

The most recent of many archived threads here:
E170 From Feb CLE Incident Gets New "Head" (by Rampkontroler Sep 10 2007 in Civil Aviation)?threadid=3603059&searchid=3603059&s=n862rw#ID3603059
 
pilotboi
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Mon Nov 19, 2007 6:38 am



Quoting Rampkontroler (Thread starter):
and I bet it will be back in the air very soon.

With new colors! Thanks for letting us know.
 
LASoctoberB6
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Mon Nov 19, 2007 7:03 am

Why wasn't this plane written off if they had to re-do its whole front section?
[NOT IN SERVICE] {WEStJet}
 
scrubbsywg
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Mon Nov 19, 2007 7:09 am

Quoting LASOctoberB6 (Reply 2):
Why wasn't this plane written off if they had to re-do its whole front section?

you understand what the term 'write off' means right?

A plane(or anything) is deemed written off when the costs to repair it are not worth it to the insurer. In this case, the insurer concluded that all the work that had to be done was more economical than paying out the owner for the insured cost. If they had written it off, they would have to pay the owner a sum of money, and try and recoup some of that with parting it out.

[Edited 2007-11-18 23:09:42]
 
N766UA
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Mon Nov 19, 2007 7:24 am

Wow, looks a little bit different than when I used to work on her! So what's the news, is she headed back to the Shuttle fleet?
This Website Censors Me
 
rampkontroler
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Mon Nov 19, 2007 2:02 pm



Quoting N766UA (Reply 4):
is she headed back to the Shuttle fleet?

That's what I hear.

Quoting Pilotboi (Reply 1):
With new colors! Thanks for letting us know.

I didn't even think of that...I'm sure that since it has to be repainted anyway that that would be it. I hope to catch it doing some test runs in the near future...I imagine they'll have to do that before they even try to fly it.
 
bok269
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 2:47 am



Quoting Rampkontroler (Reply 5):

I didn't even think of that...I'm sure that since it has to be repainted anyway that that would be it. I hope to catch it doing some test runs in the near future...I imagine they'll have to do that before they even try to fly it.

Aren't the 170s going over to UAX anyway? Maybe she'll get a generic paint job in the mean time? Either way, glad to see her back on her feet.
"Reality is wrong, dreams are for real." -Tupac
 
FutureFO
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 3:21 am

No they are not going over to UA. They will be staying at DL for a little while at least.
I Don't know where I am anymore
 
pilotboi
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 3:25 am



Quoting Bok269 (Reply 6):
Aren't the 170s going over to UAX anyway?

If so, that leaves nothing for DLX, as that's all that they provide.
 
EMBQA
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 3:29 am

Quoting Pilotboi (Reply 1):
With new colors!

Who said anything about new colors.......???

Quoting Rampkontroler (Reply 5):
.I'm sure that since it has to be repainted anyway that that would be it.

My guess would be they'll just paint the nose... not the entire plane. That aircraft was all but brand new when the event happened so the rest of the paint is still in great shape. The extra lost time and labor required to re-paint the entire plane is just a waste. They can mask off the nose and have all the paint down in two days -v- a week or more for the entire plane.

[Edited 2007-11-19 19:41:10]
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
pilotboi
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 3:30 am



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 9):
Who said anything about new colors.......???

Well it would be kind of dumb to paint it in wavy gravy, don't you agree?
 
floridaflyboy
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 5:10 am



Quoting Pilotboi (Reply 8):
Quoting Bok269 (Reply 6):
Aren't the 170s going over to UAX anyway?

If so, that leaves nothing for DLX, as that's all that they provide.

Actually, what's happening is the E-170s will go over to the United Express operation and will be replaced one for one by E-175s on the Delta Connection side. Not sure when that's scheduled to start.
Good goes around!
 
loggat
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 3:51 pm



Quoting Floridaflyboy (Reply 11):
Actually, what's happening is the E-170s will go over to the United Express operation and will be replaced one for one by E-175s on the Delta Connection side. Not sure when that's scheduled to start.

Mostly true. 10 of the DL 170's are going to UA, 5 are going to F9 and 1 is unassigned for the time being.
There are 3 types of people in this world, those that can count, and those that can't.
 
pilotboi
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 4:06 pm



Quoting Floridaflyboy (Reply 11):
Actually, what's happening is the E-170s will go over to the United Express operation and will be replaced one for one by E-175s on the Delta Connection side. Not sure when that's scheduled to start.



Quoting Loggat (Reply 12):
Mostly true. 10 of the DL 170's are going to UA, 5 are going to F9 and 1 is unassigned for the time being.

Anyone else have any more info on this? When are they moving? When are the 175s coming?
 
safetyDemo
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 4:41 pm



Quoting Pilotboi (Reply 13):
Anyone else have any more info on this? When are they moving? When are the 175s coming?

As far as I know, the -175s start arriving for Shuttle America the end of spring/beginning of summer next year.

-safetyDemo
Please direct your attention to the flight attendants in the cabin...
 
richierich
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 6:27 pm



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 9):
My guess would be they'll just paint the nose... not the entire plane. That aircraft was all but brand new when the event happened so the rest of the paint is still in great shape. The extra lost time and labor required to re-paint the entire plane is just a waste. They can mask off the nose and have all the paint down in two days -v- a week or more for the entire plane.



Quoting Pilotboi (Reply 10):
Well it would be kind of dumb to paint it in wavy gravy, don't you agree?

Logically it make sense to have the whole plane repainted in Delta's new colors, but I suspect EMBQA is right here. As it is a new aircraft and probably a long way from its nearest major C- or D-check, I'm guessing they'll repaint in the colors that it already partly wears: wavy gravy.
Not to mention that the rest of the E-fleet is in wavy gravy colors, if I am not mistaken.

When can we expect this bird to fly again? I understand its a purely business decision but I am glad to see this plane get a new lease on life. This 'frame will have a story to tell until it meets the airplane graveyard many years from now.....
None shall pass!!!!
 
pilotboi
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 6:48 pm



Quoting Richierich (Reply 15):
Not to mention that the rest of the E-fleet is in wavy gravy colors, if I am not mistaken.

Your first point makes sense. This one, however, doesn't have much meaning though, because almost all the other Delta fleets have a very small percentage painted so far. Gotta start somewhere. But anyway, I guess we've figured out that they aren't even goign to Delta anymore, so we can forget about this, lol.
 
richierich
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 7:19 pm



Quoting Pilotboi (Reply 16):
Your first point makes sense. This one, however, doesn't have much meaning though, because almost all the other Delta fleets have a very small percentage painted so far. Gotta start somewhere. But anyway, I guess we've figured out that they aren't even goign to Delta anymore, so we can forget about this, lol.

Yes, it could be a moot point but all I was saying was that somewhere down the list, you'd have to figure that fleet consistency is an issue. Then again, I counted four different DL liveries at JFK last week (including several Song 757s) so that theory isn't necessarily true...!
None shall pass!!!!
 
safetyDemo
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 7:36 pm



Quoting Richierich (Reply 17):
Yes, it could be a moot point but all I was saying was that somewhere down the list, you'd have to figure that fleet consistency is an issue. Then again, I counted four different DL liveries at JFK last week (including several Song 757s) so that theory isn't necessarily true...!

The -175 deliveries are scheduled to be the first Shuttle America aircraft in the new Delta Connection livery. They will also receive new interiors from what I hear. Has anyone been on a Delta mainline aircraft in the new colors? Do they have updated interiors? What do they consist of if they do?

-safetyDemo
Please direct your attention to the flight attendants in the cabin...
 
floridaflyboy
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 7:49 pm



Quoting SafetyDemo (Reply 18):
The -175 deliveries are scheduled to be the first Shuttle America aircraft in the new Delta Connection livery. They will also receive new interiors from what I hear. Has anyone been on a Delta mainline aircraft in the new colors? Do they have updated interiors? What do they consist of if they do?

A lot of DL aircraft have updated interiors with leather seats, new overhead bins (at least on the 757s and MD-88s), and some have a new PTV system with satellite TV and movies and music and games. It's really very nice!!
Good goes around!
 
EMBQA
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 8:46 pm



Quoting SafetyDemo (Reply 18):
They will also receive new interiors from what I hear.

The E175 offers no interior options. About the only thing you'll get will be the color of the leather seats and the color of the carpets. Nothing special.....
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
safetyDemo
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Tue Nov 20, 2007 8:52 pm



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 20):
The E175 offers no interior options. About the only thing you'll get will be the color of the leather seats and the color of the carpets. Nothing special.....

Well its going to be some sort of upgrade over the current interiors. Perhaps the seats will be like the seats on the RW -175s?

-safetyDemo
Please direct your attention to the flight attendants in the cabin...
 
rampkontroler
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Wed Nov 21, 2007 5:34 am

UPDATE: 2230h 11/20/07: Dee dee-dee lee, Dee- dee-dee lee...(newschannel noises...!) Unconfirmed reports have come to our attention that this aircraft will be making some test runs tomorrow, November 21, with a possible departure on Thanksgiving day, heading to Memphis for painting. I repeat, this is an unconfirmed rumor from a generally reliable source!

This message brought to you by...the Popeil Pocket Fisherman!
 
EMBQA
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Wed Nov 21, 2007 7:30 pm



Quoting Rampkontroler (Reply 22):
departure on Thanksgiving day, heading to Memphis for painting

Where is there a paint shop in MEM...???
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
rampkontroler
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Wed Nov 21, 2007 7:59 pm



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 23):

Quoting Rampkontroler (Reply 22):
departure on Thanksgiving day, heading to Memphis for painting

Where is there a paint shop in MEM...???

I do not know, and that's a very good question! Well....my source is generally about 75% accurate, usually erring on the "minor" subjects like dates, times and locations (!), but the gist of what he says always has something to it. Then again, I don't believe it ever got out of the hangar today either, so I'm starting to wonder...

Sorry for jumping the gun.
 
bok269
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:19 pm



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 23):

Where is there a paint shop in MEM...???

Werent some of the Freedom E145s painted there?
"Reality is wrong, dreams are for real." -Tupac
 
User avatar
United_fan
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:29 pm

That plane will never be 'right' again.....
Champagne For My Real Friends,and Real Pain For My Sham Friends
 
EMBQA
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:34 pm



Quoting Bok269 (Reply 25):
Werent some of the Freedom E145s painted there?

No... most of Freedom's E145's were painted in Nashville.
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
bok269
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:17 pm



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 27):
No... most of Freedom's E145's were painted in Nashville.

 banghead  I stand corrected.
"Reality is wrong, dreams are for real." -Tupac
 
rampkontroler
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sat Nov 24, 2007 1:01 am

Well...at 1950 (7:50) this evening (11/23), she was doing some taxi testing under its own power! Using the callsign "Chautauqua 862 Maintenance", it rolled all the way down juliet to south cargo, then turned around and headed back to the northeast corner and the 28 run-up pad.

First flight sure seems imminent.  Smile
 
EMBQA
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sat Nov 24, 2007 3:22 am



Quoting Rampkontroler (Reply 29):
Using the callsign "Chautauqua 862 Maintenance",

Odd callsign because it's not a CHQ aircraft........
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
loggat
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sat Nov 24, 2007 4:13 am

It may have been CHQ mechanics doing the taxi. S5, RP, RW, all the same mechanics. Doesn't overly matter what callsign they use for ground taxi. At IND, they usually refer to themselves as "Shuttle Maintenance 863RW" etc. RP has mx in CLE, so they may have gotten a couple of mechs from there to go along for the ride and work the radios.
There are 3 types of people in this world, those that can count, and those that can't.
 
EMBQA
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sat Nov 24, 2007 4:43 am

Quoting Loggat (Reply 31):
S5, RP, RW, all the same mechanics.

Actually no they're not. All three have their own operating certificate, their own GMM, their own chain of command, their own directors, managers and leads.Each has their own specific way of doing paper work and each has their forms. It's not quite as clear cut as that.

[Edited 2007-11-23 20:44:52]
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
rampkontroler
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sat Nov 24, 2007 6:39 am

That was definitely the callsign they were using, and we found it interesting as well. We just assumed it was CHQ mechanics who were running it about.
 
RJwrench85
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sat Nov 24, 2007 9:29 am



Quoting Rampkontroler (Reply 33):
That was definitely the callsign they were using, and we found it interesting as well. We just assumed it was CHQ mechanics who were running it about.

Well someone must have screwed up big time as said above they are different. I was an S5 employee and everytime we taxi A 170 we are "Shuttle MX" or the 145 was "Chautauqua MX" and the 175 we were "Brickyard MX" that company sucks for transferring of tooling between the three. If you change a tire on a Republic with a Shuttle Torque wrench its like your contract MX and have to write the S/N of the wrench etc etc. Not to mention the quals that didn't transfer to all 3. But I digress. I was in CLE the day this event happened but I was in a Hangar fixing a OOS plane for the other company I worked for. It was a crazy day and there was alot of snow we had issues towing our aircraft to the ramp due to the low wings and he rather large snowbanks. Plus the MX hangar we were at only was used to Citations so they didn't have the need to plow bigger.

Glad to see another amazing 170 back on its feet. What a great aircraft to fly on and work on!
"Improvise, Adapt, Overcome"
 
rampkontroler
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sat Nov 24, 2007 3:58 pm



Quoting RJwrench85 (Reply 34):
Well someone must have screwed up big time as said above they are different. I was an S5 employee and everytime we taxi A 170 we are "Shuttle MX" or the 145 was "Chautauqua MX" and the 175 we were "Brickyard MX" that company sucks for transferring of tooling between the three. If you change a tire on a Republic with a Shuttle Torque wrench its like your contract MX and have to write the S/N of the wrench etc etc. Not to mention the quals that didn't transfer to all 3.

That's really odd then. If it's running about today I'll be sure to catch the callsign again. I'm sure there's an explanation there somewhere.
 
EMBQA
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sat Nov 24, 2007 4:02 pm



Quoting Rampkontroler (Reply 35):
If it's running about today I'll be sure to catch the callsign again.

They'll also have to go through a pretty extensive process to re-align the flight computers. That will take a day or two before they can fly.
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
rampkontroler
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:02 pm

Well, I just got to work to find out I missed its first flight. (Oh well, can't catch them all!) It took a test hop this morning, and is back here in Cleveland. It flew under its N number, and I find it interesting that they Flight Aware labels it as an E-175....something they were joking about making it into!

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/N862RW

First pic:

http://www.opshots.net/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-7089

[Edited 2007-11-24 11:06:08]
 
RJwrench85
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:16 pm

Are you sure that isnt the new super secret Delta Livery. I think they call it "Frankenstein" but shhh dont tell anyone else its classified.

Quoting Rampkontroler (Reply 37):
Flight Aware labels it as an E-175....something they were joking about making it into!

I wonder what that actually would be possible??


I am willing to bet she might have some ghosts to work out when she gets back in service. Kind of like the one that had the nose gear up landing (For the life of me cant remember the N number but she was a pain in my butt for a couple months.
"Improvise, Adapt, Overcome"
 
rampkontroler
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:21 pm



Quoting RJwrench85 (Reply 38):

I am willing to bet she might have some ghosts to work out when she gets back in service. Kind of like the one that had the nose gear up landing (For the life of me cant remember the N number but she was a pain in my butt for a couple months

I think you got that right...Upon closer inspection, it would appear that a panel has popped open as well! The one outlined in red in this shot:

http://www.opshots.net/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-1337
 
EMBQA
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:34 pm

Quoting Rampkontroler (Reply 39):
.Upon closer inspection, it would appear that a panel has popped open

No.... I'm sure that was planned. That is the RAT and I'm sure it was one of the tests they performed during the test flight. It would have also been VERY loud in the cockpit and cabin.... and on the ground you can hear it coming a mile away

Quoting RJwrench85 (Reply 38):
I wonder (if) that actually would be possible??

Well, they'd need to add a plug aft of the wing as well.... but other then that the planes are identical.

Quoting RJwrench85 (Reply 38):
For the life of me cant remember the N number but she was a pain in my butt for a couple months.

N859RW

[Edited 2007-11-24 11:42:37]
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
rampkontroler
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:37 pm



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 40):
No.... I'm sure that was planned. That is the RAT and I'm sure it was one of the tests they performed during the test flight. It would have also been VERY loud in the cockpit and cabin.... and on the ground you can hear it coming a mile away

Ahhhh....very interesting! Makes sense to me. Would love to have heard that!
 
loggat
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sun Nov 25, 2007 3:08 am

862RW is scheduled to leave CLE for somewhere in MS tomorrow (11/25) to be painted. It's somewhere in the middle of nowhere that Republic Airways usually sends their birds for painting. I wanna say Greenville, or Clarksville, or something like that.
There are 3 types of people in this world, those that can count, and those that can't.
 
safetyDemo
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sun Nov 25, 2007 5:05 am

The aircraft that went nose gear up in IAD was 651. I worked on it the week it came back into service - looked like nothing had ever happened to it from the ramp.

-safetyDemo
Please direct your attention to the flight attendants in the cabin...
 
rampkontroler
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sun Nov 25, 2007 7:59 pm

Well, Frankenplane made its departure today:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/TCF9400

Off to the paintshop in Greenville Mississippi for painting. (where Commutair's Dash 8's are/were painted).

Looks like it'll be back on-line before too long. It will be interesting to see how it comes out of the paintshop.
 
EMBQA
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sun Nov 25, 2007 9:17 pm



Quoting SafetyDemo (Reply 43):
I worked on it the week it came back into service - looked like nothing had ever happened to it from the ramp.

Thanks...

It will be interesting to see if it comes out with just the nose re-painted. (my guess) .. or new Delta colors
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
safetyDemo
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sun Nov 25, 2007 9:23 pm

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 45):
It will be interesting to see if it comes out with just the nose re-painted. (my guess) .. or new Delta colors

My guess would be they only repaint the affected portion into the old Delta colors. Starting next summer, this and all other Delta -170s at Shuttle America will be transferring over to the United Express side or the Republic/Frontier side. So I don't see them spending the money to repaint the entire aircraft if they're only going to repaint it again next year. If their history with Chautauqua spares is any indication...

-safetyDemo

[Edited 2007-11-25 13:36:38]
Please direct your attention to the flight attendants in the cabin...
 
OB1504
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sun Nov 25, 2007 9:29 pm



Quoting Rampkontroler (Reply 37):
It flew under its N number, and I find it interesting that they Flight Aware labels it as an E-175....something they were joking about making it into!

For some reason, FlightAware labels any E170 as an Embraer 175.
 
N766UA
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Mon Nov 26, 2007 3:49 am



Quoting OB1504 (Reply 47):

For some reason, FlightAware labels any E170 as an Embraer 175.

Interesting, since the E175 is technically an E170-200!
This Website Censors Me
 
777wt
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RE: Shuttle America N862RW Back On Its Feet

Sat Dec 08, 2007 3:22 am



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 9):
My guess would be they'll just paint the nose... not the entire plane. That aircraft was all but brand new when the event happened so the rest of the paint is still in great shape. The extra lost time and labor required to re-paint the entire plane is just a waste. They can mask off the nose and have all the paint down in two days -v- a week or more for the entire plane.



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 45):
It will be interesting to see if it comes out with just the nose re-painted. (my guess) .. or new Delta colors



Quoting EMBQA (Reply 45):



Quoting SafetyDemo (Reply 46):
My guess would be they only repaint the affected portion into the old Delta colors. Starting next summer, this and all other Delta -170s at Shuttle America will be transferring over to the United Express side or the Republic/Frontier side. So I don't see them spending the money to repaint the entire aircraft if they're only going to repaint it again next year. If their history with Chautauqua spares is any indication...

-safetyDemo

The ENTIRE aircraft was repainted...

How do I know? QA inspector had to inspect the paintwork and I saw the logbook of 862 when it went out of service at LGA due to eng fire bottle fail...

the paint shop and inspector had a logbook entry stating the aircraft was completey repainted

While working on it, I noticed the paint is shiny and new, even fresh knife and scribe marks around the panels and doors...


BTW test pilots from Embraer was flown in to test fly the plane...they almost had a perfect test flight other than a few things needed to be adjusted...

As for 175's, RW gets them first for US airways express, then S5 will get them eventually...

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