814NAS
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BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:22 pm

According to the BBC, Friday's British Airways flight, BA1503 Manchester-New York, was cancelled after police followed up reports that the cabin crew were partying in a city centre hotel til the early hours of Friday morning. The flight was due to leave at 10am that morning. The report also states that the pilots were not implicated.

Check out the link for the full story.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/manchester/7111059.stm
 
B747forever
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:23 pm

BA should have a better control over their crews. Things like this should not happen.
Work Hard, Fly Right
 
CAL
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:26 pm

Long as the crew was not intoxicated and they stopped drinking 8 hours prior.. let them party!
CAL........Continental Airlines....... Work Hard, Fly Right
 
814NAS
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:31 pm



Quoting CAL (Reply 2):
Long as the crew was not intoxicated and they stopped drinking 8 hours prior.. let them party!

According to the report the crew were still apparently still partying with less than six hours til flight time.
 
BlueShamu330s
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:33 pm



Quoting B747forever (Reply 1):
BA should have a better control over their crews. Things like this should not happen.

So, for a crew which is away from its home base, in a hotel, what are you suggesting? an Air Nanny?  Yeah sure
So I drive a 4x4. So what?! Tax the a$$ off me for it...oh, you already have... :-(
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:37 pm

How does partying implicate that they were drunk.The crew could just be enjoying the Music & fullfill the required sober period prior to flight.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
Speedbird2155
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:38 pm

Quoting B747forever (Reply 1):
BA should have a better control over their crews. Things like this should not happen.

Please note, this was merely an allegation and there is nothing in the BBC report to say that it was true. BA cancelled the flight as a precaution, after being made aware of the allegation.

Crew members are adults and have to take responsibility for their actions, if the allegations are true then it is up to the member or members of the crew responsible and I am sure that they will be dealt with by BA internal procedures.

Please note that the police have said no offences were committed and there is no further police involvment.

[Edited 2007-11-24 11:40:00]
 
airmale
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:38 pm

Have worked at a hotel where we had crews from a few different airlines staying over. By far, BA was the worst. Partying and drinking into the early morning hours, even disturbing other guests...... moving hotel plants into hotel elevator for fun and stuff. Worse than children.
.....up there with the best!
 
rdwootty
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:42 pm

I do not understand the reason for crews to party like this in public or even private. They have an important job to undertake and if they do not want the responsibility then they need to get out of the job.
 
G-CIVP
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:56 pm

I think the word 'allegedly' ought to be used in this thread as BA will not take kindly to this being quoted as fact!
 
B747forever
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 7:56 pm



Quoting Rdwootty (Reply 8):
I do not understand the reason for crews to party like this in public or even private. They have an important job to undertake and if they do not want the responsibility then they need to get out of the job.

So you mean that crews cant party??? What life is that???
Work Hard, Fly Right
 
by188b
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 8:23 pm



Quoting B747forever (Reply 1):
BA should have a better control over their crews. Things like this should not happen

Its in no way confirmed that it did happen! An anonymous call was made to the Police. I work for the police and you would be very surprised over how many malicious calls are made. Innocent untill proven guilty.
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B747forever
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 8:29 pm



Quoting BY188B (Reply 11):
Its in no way confirmed that it did happen!

Okey, so this is just a guess from BBC???
Work Hard, Fly Right
 
SPREE34
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 8:32 pm



Quoting B747forever (Reply 1):
BA should have a better control over their crews. Things like this should not happen.

What measures would  point  YOU use in controlling the crews?

Quoting HAWK21M (Reply 5):
How does partying implicate that they were drunk.The crew could just be enjoying the Music & fullfill the required sober period prior to flight.

Nicely said! Anonymous allegations and no Police action taken. Someone have an agenda here?  scratchchin 

Quoting Speedbird2155 (Reply 6):
Please note, this was merely an allegation and there is nothing in the BBC report to say that it was true. BA cancelled the flight as a precaution, after being made aware of the allegation.

Crew members are adults and have to take responsibility for their actions, if the allegations are true then it is up to the member or members of the crew responsible and I am sure that they will be dealt with by BA internal procedures.

Please note that the police have said no offences were committed and there is no further police involvment.

Oh no. More facts.  thumbsup  You'll never make it as a tabloid editor.  praise 

Quoting Rdwootty (Reply 8):
I do not understand the reason for crews to party like this in public or even private. They have an important job to undertake and if they do not want the responsibility then they need to get out of the job.

Your first 4 words say a lot. Along with not understanding, you do not have all of the facts necessary to judge yet. None of us do.

Quoting G-CIVP (Reply 9):
I think the word 'allegedly' ought to be used in this thread as BA will not take kindly to this being quoted as fact!

I agree with you on the "allegedly" as these employees haven't had their say yet. BA will have no recourse other than contradictory press releases.
I don't understand everything I don't know about this.
 
B747forever
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 9:10 pm



Quoting SPREE34 (Reply 13):
What measures would YOU use in controlling the crews?

I dont know because that is not my work
Work Hard, Fly Right
 
crj200faguy
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 9:11 pm

I believe if the police would check who made the call. They would find out it came from the home of someone named R. Branson.  Smile
 
allstarflyer
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 9:13 pm



Quoting BlueShamu330s (Reply 4):
So, for a crew which is away from its home base, in a hotel, what are you suggesting? an Air Nanny?

For crewmembers who do this sort of thing, I guess we can't expect all of them to be responsible away from the nest.  sarcastic 

Quoting Airmale (Reply 7):
moving hotel plants into hotel elevator for fun and stuff.

 rotfl  Good, simple stuff.

Quoting SPREE34 (Reply 13):
BA will have no recourse other than contradictory press releases.

Stinks that appearances make for reality in some people's eyes, eh?
Living the American Dream
 
AlanUK
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 9:20 pm



Quoting Rdwootty (Reply 8):
They have an important job to undertake and if they do not want the responsibility then they need to get out of the job.

Maybe it is the responsibilities and stress that causes cabin crew to want to party when they can! I mean doctors and nurses are some of the biggest party goers I know of... Simply to offload some of the more difficult aspects of their job aside for an evening!
 
SPREE34
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 10:23 pm



Quoting Allstarflyer (Reply 16):
Stinks that appearances make for reality in some people's eyes, eh?

Yep! How'd that song about TV news go?....."give us dirty laundry"

Quoting B747forever (Reply 14):
I dont know because that is not my work

The line of work is irrelevant. You suggested controlling a group of people in their off time. What measures do you think a company, any company, should be permitted to take in controlling employee behavior or lifestyle?
I don't understand everything I don't know about this.
 
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FlyCaledonian
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 10:57 pm

An allegation was made in the arly hours of the morning. BA, to my mind, made a quite good response. They could have just ignored the allegation, let the crew report for work, do drug and alcohol tests and then find they had a problem. Note it says in the article that the crew never even reported for duty. By acting promptly BA good make it's own further internal investiagtions and at the same time it had plenty of time to make the necessary arrangements to get the passengers from MAN routed via LHR onto other flights. An inconvenience for those passengers, but less of one than if the flight was cancelled say an hour before departure.

Lots of perception in all this, and even if the crew did nothing wrong they appeared to whomever made the tip off to be doing something they shouldn't I work in the railways and we have a very strict drug and alcohol policy. In addition, it is constantly stated that it is our responsibility to ensure we are fit for duty. So if the crew weren't drinking did they really have to be up so late? Or if they were and felt it would not affect their duties, then maybe it's a case of being more discrete. They may not have been on duty but they were being paid by their company to stay in that hotel.
Let's Go British Caledonian!
 
sh0rtybr0wn
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 11:32 pm



Quoting B747forever (Reply 10):
What life is that???



Quoting SPREE34 (Reply 18):
You suggested controlling a group of people in their off time. What measures do you think a company, any company, should be permitted to take in controlling employee behavior or lifestyle?



Uhhhh... I'm all for controlling a very large group of people in their " off time " as you so quaintly put it.

I dont want my ATC personnel showing up drunk, or police , or surgeon, or my kids teachers showing up drunk or stoned during work.... and many other professionals, if not all professionals ( everybody else too I suppose ) should show up for work sober.

This crew could have partied for 12 days straight, and that would be fine with me... but if they end their partying too close to the morning that they have to show up at work, then its a safety issue.

So the idea of "controlling people" in non work hours is really designed to make sure employees show up for work not drunk, and not under the influence of any other drug. Whats wrong with that?
 
davescj
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 11:33 pm



Quoting CAL (Reply 2):
Long as the crew was not intoxicated and they stopped drinking 8 hours prior.. let them party!

So long as they weren't drinking....and would be fit to fly .....fine.

That is a matter for BA's investigation. BA took steps, obviously they will investigate. I can't believe the crew is unaware of the rules.......and remember, NO ONE has yet to be charged with wrong doing.

As others have said, you have to expect adults to behave like adults. If they can't, they lose their jobs. It is as simple as that. Remember, others recently have been accused of drinking and it turned out not to be true. I'm sure the BA investigation will resolve any questions about fitness to fly.

Way to go BA for stepping in quickly.

Dave
Can I have a mojito on this flight?
 
BlueShamu330s
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sat Nov 24, 2007 11:40 pm

The alcohol issue will be tested, tried and a verdict reached.

What really worries me is that these cabin crew positioned up to Manchester the day before, and then, whether they were drinking or not, they were found in the bar of a hotel at 0415, when their hotel pick-up was scheduled for no later than 0730 prior to a 1000 departure to JFK (7hrs 50 block).

For me, fatigue is the immediate  redflag  here. Would they have been fit and refreshed for duty? How would they have coped with an emergency situation/evacuation?

Undoubtedly, their actions are now public knowledge, and they have brought the company who pays their wages into disrepute.

Shamu
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jetdeltamsy
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 12:39 am



Quoting B747forever (Reply 1):
BA should have a better control over their crews.

What do you mean, "control over their crews"?

When crew members are off duty, as long as they are out of uniform, they are free to do whatever they like as long as it is legal.
Tired of airline bankruptcies....EA/PA/TW and finally DL.
 
Rivet42
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 1:11 am



Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 23):
When crew members are off duty, as long as they are out of uniform, they are free to do whatever they like as long as it is legal.

That's clearly not true, for airline staff or anyone else working in a position that carries/poses any kind of responsibility for the safety/wellbeing of others. All such jobs will have fairly strict conditions of ableness, and a person doing such a job will have a contractual obligation to satisfy those conditions, so no, they are no free to do whatever they like in their 'off' time when it is immediately prior to clocking back on again.

Actually, the title of this thread is a bit ambiguous, I though initially that the crew had dismissed themselves!  banghead 

Riv'
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SPREE34
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 1:11 am



Quoting Sh0rtybr0wn (Reply 20):
So the idea of "controlling people" in non work hours is really designed to make sure employees show up for work not drunk, and not under the influence of any other drug. Whats wrong with that?


I never suggested, or said there was anything wrong with that. (above quote) I asked about the measures one thinks should be permitted.

I'll quote that question again below. That question still stands.

Quoting SPREE34 (Reply 18):
The line of work is irrelevant. You suggested controlling a group of people in their off time. What measures do you think a company, any company, should be permitted to take in controlling employee behavior or lifestyle?

I am former ATC and a pilot. I'm familiar with the regs. and have been subject to random alcohol and drug testing. I'm talking about rules here.
My question asks about actions a company should be permitted to use.

Quoting Davescj (Reply 21):
Remember, others recently have been accused of drinking and it turned out not to be true.

Guilty until proven innocent. You have to love the court of media and uninformed public opinion.

Quoting BlueShamu330s (Reply 22):
For me, fatigue is the immediate    redflag    here. Would they have been fit and refreshed for duty? How would they have coped with an emergency situation/evacuation?

What had their schedule been for the previous week. Their bodies may have been on Tokyo time for all we know. It's another unknown yet. Are they supposed to lay awake in a bed staring at the ceiling? Like that would make you fit for duty. Not!

Quoting BlueShamu330s (Reply 22):
Undoubtedly, their actions are now public knowledge, and they have brought the company who pays their wages into disrepute.

Negative. An accusation was made by an un-named source. That source has brought the disrepute on the company AND these employees until proven otherwise.

I have no criticism of BA and their handling of the situation. If no infractions occurred the crew needs to be made whole as far as any lost compensation. If the crew fouled up I'm sure BA will take appropriate actions per the employment agreement and applicable UK regulations.
I don't understand everything I don't know about this.
 
iairallie
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 1:51 am



Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 19):
So if the crew weren't drinking did they really have to be up so late?



Quoting Sh0rtybr0wn (Reply 20):
Uhhhh... I'm all for controlling a very large group of people in their " off time " as you so quaintly put it.

I dont want my ATC personnel showing up drunk, or police , or surgeon, or my kids teachers showing up drunk or stoned during work

That would be during work hours not their off time.

Quoting FlyCaledonian (Reply 19):
So if the crew weren't drinking did they really have to be up so late?



Quoting SPREE34 (Reply 25):
Their bodies may have been on Tokyo time for all we know

These last two weeks would be a perfect example. To many redeye flights and I am totally backwards. In germany I kept waking up around 1or 2 am local time. Sometimes the only thing open at that time of night is the bar if you want a snack or are just bored in your room.
Enough about flying lets talk about me!
 
by188b
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 6:27 am



Quoting B747forever (Reply 12):
Okey, so this is just a guess from BBC???

of course not, read the source again, and then read my post again. Both of them state an anonymous phone call was made to police.
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AlanUK
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 8:09 am



Quoting BlueShamu330s (Reply 22):
What really worries me is that these cabin crew positioned up to Manchester the day before, and then, whether they were drinking or not, they were found in the bar of a hotel at 0415, when their hotel pick-up was scheduled for no later than 0730 prior to a 1000 departure to JFK (7hrs 50 block).

Not quite true... the MAN-JFK flights are operated by LHR crew on a "W" leg:

Day 1: LHR-EWR
Day 2: JFK-MAN
Day 4: MAN-JFK
Day 6: EWR-LHR

So they didn't "position" up to MAN the night before, not from LHR anyway...
 
davescj
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 9:59 am



Quoting AlanUK (Reply 28):
Not quite true... the MAN-JFK flights are operated by LHR crew on a "W" leg:

Day 1: LHR-EWR
Day 2: JFK-MAN
Day 4: MAN-JFK
Day 6: EWR-LHR

Why is this called a "W" route? Because airports between connections aren't the same?

Doesn't it make it more expensive for BA to have to do this kind of routing? I'd think the fees between airports (esp EWR -- JFK, even w/ corporate deal) would be expensive.

Why not simply LHR EWK -- one day off -- and return?

Thanks!

Dave
Can I have a mojito on this flight?
 
EK20
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 10:10 am

Officers received an anonymous tip-off that eight crew members had been drinking at the Arora International hotel in Princess Street at 4.15am yesterday less than six hours before the Manchester-New York flight was due to take-off.

Police told British Airways about the allegation and airline officials went to the hotel to interview all the London-based stewards and stewardesses. No allegations were made against the Boeing 767's two pilots.

A BA spokeswoman said the airline cancelled flight BA1503, which was due to leave at 10am, because of a "crew shortage".
 
Stealthz
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 10:20 am



Quoting Davescj (Reply 29):
Doesn't it make it more expensive for BA to have to do this kind of routing?

Makes some sense to me, with the main crew domicile being London(I presume) it gives more flexibility in scheduling.
The costs in NYC transferring between EWR-JFK would be negligble to nonexistant. Assuming the crews overnight in NYC one could also assume they would be accomodated in Manhattan so the difference in transferring back to EWR or onwards to JFK would be as close to zero as to not matter.

Cheers
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Stealthz
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 10:28 am



Quoting Davescj (Reply 29):
Doesn't it make it more expensive for BA to have to do this kind of routing?

Makes some sense to me, with the main crew domicile being London(I presume) it gives more flexibility in scheduling.
The costs in NYC transferring between EWR-JFK would be negligble to nonexistant. Assuming the crews overnight in NYC one could also assume they would be accomodated in Manhattan so the difference in transferring back to EWR or onwards to JFK would be as close to zero as to not matter.

Cheers
If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!
 
mozart
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 10:46 am

Funny how those alcohol-related stories, be it crews or pax, tend to come from the same few countries most of the time, UK being one of them. Certainly the UK has very strict rules and does a lot about enforcing them (thus more cases are made public), but there seems to be an overall problem of alcohol/drinking/misbehaviour in the UK. Why is that so?
 
theginge
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 11:42 am



Quoting BlueShamu330s (Reply 22):
For me, fatigue is the immediate here. Would they have been fit and refreshed for duty? How would they have coped with an emergency situation/evacuation?

Leaving aside the Manchester 'Incident' with fatigue do you expect all crews operating all long haul flights have been able to manage an 8 hour sleep before flying??
For example a UK based crew flying back from the USA will be leaving there at say 2300 UK time to get back the UK in the morning? How much sleep do you expect they got imediatly before it?? I would say probably not much!!!
 
rwy04lga
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 12:13 pm



Quoting G-CIVP (Reply 9):
I think the word 'allegedly' ought to be used in this thread as BA will not take kindly to this being quoted as fact!

Hence the word 'claimed'. It didn't say crew 'was' drunk.
Just accept that some days, you're the pigeon, and other days the statue
 
ltbewr
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 12:34 pm

BA took the actions they did when they got some tip of such beheavor. They will investigate further and take the appropiate actions upon completion under company laws and UK/EC laws.

Even if one stops drinking 8 hours before work, you may still have a hangover if one drinks enough. Alcohol use also affects affects sleep patterns, so you could be quite tired and affect your judgement. With today's security situations, demanding pax, as well as pressure to give good service from your employer airline, even cabin crew member has to have clear heads and eyes and thus a good period of sleep prior to work.

As to the pranks, that isn't a good idea either as it suggests a certain level of childish, unprofessional behavior and attitude. Also if the perps are known to be airline staff, then the facility may choose not to have them or other staff of that airline stay with them in the future as well as affect customer's view of them. They may also damage property and cause themselves or others to be injured.
If you want to party, then do it at home well before you have to show up to work.

[Edited 2007-11-25 04:37:47]
 
davescj
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 1:09 pm



Quoting Mozart (Reply 33):
Certainly the UK has very strict rules and does a lot about enforcing them (thus more cases are made public), but there seems to be an overall problem of alcohol/drinking/misbehaviour in the UK.

I wonder how much of this is the idea that scandal sells papers? I'm not sure (personally) that this is a bigger problem in the UK (or US) than anywhere else.

Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 36):
Even if one stops drinking 8 hours before work, you may still have a hangover if one drinks enough. Alcohol use also affects affects sleep patterns, so you could be quite tired and affect your judgement. With today's security situations, demanding pax, as well as pressure to give good service from your employer airline, even cabin crew member has to have clear heads and eyes and thus a good period of sleep prior to work.

This is certainly true. I know a couple of flights that left late due to crew fatigue, even when no alcohol was involved. The crew realized they were exausted and waited a couple hrs more, slept, and then flew much more safely. I think it was a BA flight, but not sure now. MUCH better safe than sorry. If it came to that, I'm sure BA has reserve crews they could call if they needed to, no?

Though that did surprise me about the Manchester incident. I thought it was a flight crew base, and BA could call reserve FA's (as they seemed to be the ones effected) and simply go out with a reserve crew (rather than the one scheduled).

Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 36):
Also if the perps are known to be airline staff, then the facility may choose not to have them or other staff of that airline stay with them in the future as well as affect customer's view of them

I agree. You'd think one letter from one manager to another would quickly resolve the whole thing discreetly. Something on the order of "even off duty your crew represent you, and we expect the same behavior of them that we do any guest." That way the BA staff could gently remind people not to make the airline or themselves look foolish.

Dave
Can I have a mojito on this flight?
 
Beaucaire
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 1:31 pm

Strangely enough countries who produce for instance large quantity of wine like France,Italy or Spain do have a very "reasonable" amount of drunks or alcohol related problems.
The reasonable and even regular consumption of alcohol is quite normal and accepted by most in those counties .
I figured out that Scandinavia ,parts of Germany,Poland ,Ireland and the UK have definitely a booze problem -is it tied to the weather,the cost of alcohol ,stress or just frustration???
Fact of life is the more you go south and see the sun, the less you are inclined to spend your nights getting drunk.
(Except Kos-island in Greece,where tons of drunk Scandinavians tend to cover the place and parts of down-town Palma,where Sangria and Beer-infested Germans and Bri'ts give headaches to locals..)
PS -I love good alcoholic beverages and are NOT trying to be more catholic than the pope-but you guys in the UK do defenitely have an issue with booze...
Please respect animals - don't eat them...
 
edina
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 2:01 pm



Quoting Davescj (Reply 37):
I thought it was a flight crew base, and BA could call reserve FA's (as they seemed to be the ones effected) and simply go out with a reserve crew (rather than the one scheduled).

Since BA sold the BAConnect operation to FlyBe there have been no BA crews based in MAN. BAConnect (formerly CitiExpress & BA Regional) used to crew the MAN-JFK service, since the sell off LHR Mainline crews have worked the flight via the aforementioned "W" pattern. BA also closed their Mainline crew base (who only operated the LHR shuttles) last March.
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Mortyman
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 2:11 pm

I believe there was a BA crew that were held back at Oslo Airport Gardermoen in Norway some years back, because they were drunk...

So if this story is true, it would'nt be the first time...
 
tymnbalewne
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 3:33 pm



Quoting Davescj (Reply 29):
Why is this called a "W" route? Because airports between connections aren't the same?

LHR...MAN...LHR
--------------------------
..X.......X.......X..
...X.....XX.....X...
....X...X..X...X....
.....X.X....X.X....
......X........X.....
-------------------------
....NYC....NYC...

That's why it's called a "W".
(Way OT Trivia...what movie had a group of people looking for money buried "under the big W")

C.
Dewmanair...begins with Dew
 
wrighbrothers
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 5:33 pm

Ah yes I saw this in a newspaper yesterday, my grandmother flew down with them on their repositioning flight to LHR yesterday (not that she was one of the cabin, too old hehe)
Well, in 'theory' they've done nothing wrong. They were drinking, but since they didn't report for duty, there's no saying that they weren't mearly going to call in to work and say they couldn't fly because they had been drinking. It's not illegal to drink so the police can't do anything and since they didn't report for duty, BA can't discipline them for flying drunk. All they can put against them is that they were drinking after the 8hr before the flight time had past.
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ADXMatt
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 5:34 pm



Quoting B747forever (Reply 1):
BA should have a better control over their crews. Things like this should not happen.

There are regulations in place. If you violate them and get caught there are consequences.

By BA having the crew remain at the hotel was a blessing for the F/A if in fact they were/still intoxicated. By not reporting for duty they could avoid arrest. possibly saving their jobs.

If there wasn't some truth to the story BA wouldn't have taken this action.
 
iairallie
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 6:15 pm



Quoting Mozart (Reply 33):
Funny how those alcohol-related stories, be it crews or pax, tend to come from the same few countries most of the time,

Not really that funny. Those countries carry a higher percentage of the overall global flying. Statisticaly based on the number of flights they fly you would have more incidents.
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mozart
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 6:33 pm



Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 38):
Strangely enough countries who produce for instance large quantity of wine like France,Italy or Spain do have a very "reasonable" amount of drunks or alcohol related problems.
The reasonable and even regular consumption of alcohol is quite normal and accepted by most in those counties .
I figured out that Scandinavia ,parts of Germany,Poland ,Ireland and the UK have definitely a booze problem -is it tied to the weather,the cost of alcohol ,stress or just frustration???
Fact of life is the more you go south and see the sun, the less you are inclined to spend your nights getting drunk.
(Except Kos-island in Greece,where tons of drunk Scandinavians tend to cover the place and parts of down-town Palma,where Sangria and Beer-infested Germans and Bri'ts give headaches to locals..)
PS -I love good alcoholic beverages and are NOT trying to be more catholic than the pope-but you guys in the UK do defenitely have an issue with booze...

Sounds very much like what I wrote in that other forum  Wink But I still agree.

Quoting IAirAllie (Reply 44):
Not really that funny. Those countries carry a higher percentage of the overall global flying. Statisticaly based on the number of flights they fly you would have more incidents.

Actually there are countries which have higher number of incidents (Russia) - althouth they aren't necessarily all alcohol-related. In other countries, like the UK, there are "avoided incidents", i.e. good controls prevent the incidents from happening. But cases of crew being drunk are more frequent than elsewhere.
 
davescj
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Sun Nov 25, 2007 7:08 pm



Quoting Wrighbrothers (Reply 42):
All they can put against them is that they were drinking after the 8hr before the flight time had past.

Isn't that a violation of the employee regs? And in so doing, I"m sure a penalty discipline if anything actually happened -- which still hasn't been established w/o doubt yet.

Dave
Can I have a mojito on this flight?
 
wrighbrothers
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Mon Nov 26, 2007 11:03 pm



Quoting Davescj (Reply 46):
Isn't that a violation of the employee regs? And in so doing, I"m sure a penalty discipline if anything actually happened -- which still hasn't been established w/o doubt yet.

I'm not 100% sure, however, as far as I'm aware, it's only disciplinary if they report for duty drunk,. if, like in this case, you do not actually turn up for duty, you can claim you were going to call in and say you couldn't fly.
The airline can only control you and what you do when you're on duty/ in uniform.
It's not an offence to drink, but it is to turn up for duty over the limit, hence why, since they didn't turn up for duty, nothing can be done.

Wrighbrothers
Always stand up for what is right, even if it means standing alone..
 
art
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Tue Nov 27, 2007 12:09 am



Quoting Airmale (Reply 7):
Partying and drinking into the early morning hours, even disturbing other guests......



Quoting BY188B (Reply 11):
I work for the police and you would be very surprised over how many malicious calls are made.

Perhaps someone got tired of the noise the crew was making which was disturbing them or preventing them sleeping and decided make a call to get the crew to stop or to punish them for being inconsiderate.
 
VS239
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RE: BA Cancels Flight, Crew Claimed To Be Drunk

Tue Nov 27, 2007 7:55 am



Quoting TymnBalewne (Reply 41):
(Way OT Trivia...what movie had a group of people looking for money buried "under the big W")

Way O-T answer - "It's a Mad Mad Mad Mad World". Come to think of it, not far off the truth.
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