LHRGregSE4
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AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 8:09 pm

I'm flying LHR-YOW this January and was wondering how many 767s has AC converted already.

Anyone have any information?
 
sebring
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 8:13 pm

The AC website shows 11 of 29 done. Another three are in the shop and at least two of those will be finished by Xmas, and the third in early January, so the number when you fly will be 13 or 14.
 
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yowza
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 8:45 pm

For the record I have done this run many times and have somehow never been lucky enough to be on an XMed one  Sad

YOWza
 
N43W79
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 9:26 pm

Generally I think that the modified 763s are being locked on the YYZ-LHR, YYZ-FRA routes when flying to Europe. It might be a bit of a wait before YOW will see them consistently.
 
HAL
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 9:42 pm

OK, I'll bite. What is a -300XM? Since I fly the -300ER for Hawaiian, I though I knew everything there was to know about the 767, but this one is new to me.

HAL
One smooth landing is skill. Two in a row is luck. Three in a row and someone is lying.
 
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Siren
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 9:43 pm



Quoting HAL (Reply 4):
OK, I'll bite. What is a -300XM?

I don't know the answer myself, but I'm guessing it has to do with XM Satellite Radio.
 
ACFA
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 9:46 pm

XM (Extreme Makeover), an AC designation for aircraft that have undergone cabin interior upgrades which feature AVOD and lie flat seats in international J.
 
bakersdozen
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 9:46 pm



Quoting HAL (Reply 4):
OK, I'll bite. What is a -300XM? Since I fly the -300ER for Hawaiian, I though I knew everything there was to know about the 767, but this one is new to me.

Hal it's the normal 767-300 that has had the new "xtreme-makeover" interior redesign by AC. New seats and PTV's
 
N43W79
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 9:46 pm

XM is Air Canada's cabin refurbishment program. It involves new business and economy seats with AVOD.
 
Jayhawk
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 9:46 pm

xm = extreme makeover

Jayhawk
 
YULYMX
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 9:46 pm



Quoting Siren (Reply 5):

I don't know the answer myself, but I'm guessing it has to do with XM Satellite Radio.

It is the refurbish of the interior of the aircraft for international flight... Business is overall 180 degree and economy gets private TV?
 
kiwiandrew

RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 9:46 pm



Quoting HAL (Reply 4):
OK, I'll bite. What is a -300XM?

it is AC's own inhouse term for their newly refurbished ( Xtreme Makeover) aircraft , true lie flat beds in J , AVOD PTVs in all seats etc
 
SNATH
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 9:49 pm



Quoting HAL (Reply 4):
OK, I'll bite. What is a -300XM? Since I fly the -300ER for Hawaiian, I though I knew everything there was to know about the 767, but this one is new to me.



Quoting Siren (Reply 5):
I don't know the answer myself, but I'm guessing it has to do with XM Satellite Radio.

Nope. XM stands for eXtreme Makeover. Basically, they put a different product into the B767s (new lie-flat seats in executive first, new economy seats, video-on-demand, etc.) which is equivalent to the product that their newest planes (B777s) have out-of-the-box. They also have a similar makeover program for their narrow-body fleet (A32X).

Tony
Nikon: we don't want more pixels, we want better pixels.
 
Someone83
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 9:53 pm



Quoting N43W79 (Reply 3):
Generally I think that the modified 763s are being locked on the YYZ-LHR, YYZ-FRA routes when flying to Europe.

What about LHR-YVR? Will probably be flying this route in the end om February and on AC website do they claim it to be an XM....although I don't really trust it.
 
Arrow
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 9:56 pm

I flew on one of these, business class, from Maui to Vancouver back in September. I had no idea AC was using them on this run. The lie-flat seat was great because it's an overnight flight and you can sleep. But the window seats are angled such that it's very hard to look out, and you are by yourself -- very hard to talk to your companion. My wife was one behind, and we had to wave hand signals at each other.

If you want to sleep, they're great. But I didn't like the rest of the set-up.
Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
 
JMULAH
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Wed Nov 28, 2007 10:18 pm

I' ve flown LHR-YOW 4 times this year and same old 763... I might been unlucky but last time i was on, there was some duct tape around..... Very dissapointing but at least service was just above average. I hope you get better luck!
 
manu
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:24 am

I'm on Zurich-YYZ on Saturday (coming in from BOM on Swiss). I doubt my AC will be upgraded, but I managed to get a bulkhead. Unfortunately there are 4 versions of the 767-300ER for Air Canada including the XMed one. Any chance I can know what version I am on so I know if 12K will be a good seat or not???
 
cf105arrow
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:39 am



Quoting Siren (Reply 5):
I don't know the answer myself, but I'm guessing it has to do with XM Satellite Radio.

Project XM (Extreme Makeover) also happens to include XM radio on every seat.

New cabin features include:

In Executive First, new horizontal fully-flat Executive First Suites in a 'herringbone pattern'.
New cabins in all classes on all aircraft (except the A340s and some B767-200s).
Personal AVOD (8.9" touch-screen LCD) in Economy class (domestic and international) providing over 200 hours of video and audio entertainment. Larger AVOD screens available in Executive First Suites.
Interactive games at all seats.
3-prong 120 VAC plugs for laptops in both classes.
USB ports to recharge iPods, BlackBerry, and other devices.
USB ports for game controllers.
XM Radio Canada available at every seat.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Canada
 
Someone83
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 10:10 am

Will the 330-300 also eventually be XM'ed? If so, when will they begin on these?
 
cf105arrow
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 1:04 pm



Quoting Someone83 (Reply 18):
Will the 330-300 also eventually be XM'ed? If so, when will they begin on these?

They will be XM'd after the 767 are done because their interior is newer.
 
naritaflyer
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 1:28 pm

I flew the 777 from NRT and I did not like the new J Class seats. It lies flat and you can sleep which is what I did but the seats are very narrow and angled in an awkward way and somehow the seats seemed too high for me. All in all this J product is a dud vs. what else is out there in the market today.
 
ManchesterMAN
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 1:43 pm



Quoting Manu (Reply 16):
I'm on Zurich-YYZ on Saturday (coming in from BOM on Swiss). I doubt my AC will be upgraded, but I managed to get a bulkhead. Unfortunately there are 4 versions of the 767-300ER for Air Canada including the XMed one. Any chance I can know what version I am on so I know if 12K will be a good seat or not???

Go to aircanada.com and do a dummy booking. After you enter your dates you get a list of possible flights. Click the button next to the flight/class that you are on and click for the seat map. Cross reference this against the various 763 seat maps published elsewhere on the website. If you check Biz class this is a good way of seeing if your flight is scheduled to be an XM plane or not. Of course changes are often made at the last minute but it gives you an idea.
Flown: A300,A319,A320,A321,A330,A340.A380,717,727,737,747,757,767,777,DC9,DC10,MD11,MD80,F100,F50,ERJ,E190,CRJ,BAe146,Da
 
dmanmtl
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 2:29 pm



Quoting Naritaflyer (Reply 20):
I flew the 777 from NRT and I did not like the new J Class seats. It lies flat and you can sleep which is what I did but the seats are very narrow and angled in an awkward way and somehow the seats seemed too high for me. All in all this J product is a dud vs. what else is out there in the market today.

I tend to agree to some degree with this comment - I recently did YYZ-LHR on a 77W in J and although the service is great and the plane is awesome (I love the self serve Bar!), the seats are narrow. I'm not a huge guy but 6'1'' and about 190lbs and I find the seats a little small - I can't stretch out completely and the side to side room is tight, also feels a bit like you are in a box when fully reclined.

I flew back on an A330 and although the seats don't recline completely, the open space and width of the seats is nice.

I'm still not sure which I prefer. I am doing YUL-HKG and back in Jan - outbound on a 77L from YYZ and back through YVR on a 343 - this should give me a good comparison due to the length of the flight.

D In Mtl
 
imatams
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 2:53 pm

The XM aircraft don't seem to be as locked to certain routes as previously said in other threads. I flew SCL-YYZ on monday and it was on an XM aircraft (fin 633) And since I also managed to upgrade it was a fabulous flight!
Though 3 weeks earlier on the way out there was a non-XM one on that route (the Free Spirit one, very old ex-Canadian interior)

IM
 
pnwtraveler
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:11 pm

I think this thread qualifies for the award for the most number of people saying the same thing in a row. Either that or everyone was answering simultaneously.

Personally I am finding these new first class "pods" a little claustrophobic. I also think I would feel the same way for the "suites". The suites to me seem a bit like flying in a very well appointed washroom cubicle. I like to look out the window and the pods and certainly the suites block site lines. Mind you I don't sleep well on aircraft anyways so the privacy is not an issue for me. I think I actually prefer the standard first class with laydown seats but no barriers.
 
FLYACYYZ
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:19 pm



Quoting Pnwtraveler (Reply 24):
I think this thread qualifies for the award for the most number of people saying the same thing in a row. Either that or everyone was answering simultaneously.

And interestingly, the thread seems to be reflective of AC travelers. Essentially the same herringbone angled suites are found on Virgin, Air New Zealand and Jet Airways, but seemingly a non-issue on the other carriers. ??????
Above and Beyond
 
ayqzbr
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:27 pm



Quoting ManchesterMAN (Reply 21):
Go to aircanada.com and do a dummy booking. After you enter your dates you get a list of possible flights. Click the button next to the flight/class that you are on and click for the seat map. Cross reference this against the various 763 seat maps published elsewhere on the website. If you check Biz class this is a good way of seeing if your flight is scheduled to be an XM plane or not.

This does work but usually only a day before the flight. In mid October, I flew from YYZ to SYD, and realized when at YYZ that the A/C at my gate, FIN 634, was XM'd and sure enough, it operated to YVR and then on to SYD. I think that the seat is fabulous, because it can be adjusted in many ways other than just flat (which is probably the least comfortable). The main complaints seem to be lack of storage space (no "under the seat in front of you" and no seat pocket for a book or portable computer) and how to travel with a companion. On the 763, it is likely seats F & K, which are across the aisle from each other. On the 777, it is supposed to be the two middle seats, but also on the 777, the window/middle row numbers do not line up, so if you want to be across the aisle, you need 1A/2D etc. Look up the seat plans on the AC website. My only complaint with the XM layout was the headsets - they are supposed to be noise cancelling but were not very good. I think that AC's old J headsets are in fact better. And finally, it is also my impression that although AC is trying to maintain some consistency in the routes on which XM'd A/C fly, you just never know what you will actually get. (Coming back from SYD, the A/C was not XM'd, but I did get to see the SQ 380 at the adjacent gate - you can't have everything!)
 
FLYACYYZ
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:31 pm

The which aircraft am I going to get million dollar question, will only become a non-issue once the entire fleet has been "XM-d".

While every effort is being made to dedicate refurbished aircraft to certain routes, last minute changes can and WILL occur. As pointed out before, every station (and then some) has had the 763 XM aircraft at one point or another, and will remain a bit of a crap shoot until such time that the conversion is 100% completed.
Above and Beyond
 
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auroralives
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 3:32 pm



Quoting Pnwtraveler (Reply 24):
I think this thread qualifies for the award for the most number of people saying the same thing in a row. Either that or everyone was answering simultaneously.

Given that posts 6-11 were all done within a 53 second span, simultaneousness looks like the right call here  Smile
 
YYZatcboy
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 5:57 pm

Funny though eh? How long does it take to XM a 763? I read somewhere it was taking 2-3 months to do an A32x, but I think they were repainting and doing heavy MX checks done at the same time. Same for the 763?
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dmanmtl
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:28 pm

The last time I was on one of the XM 320s, I tried to figure exactly what had changed. It seems to me that the seats are all the same frames but just have new padding and the new AVOD system installed, the Bins are all original and the interior paneling seems the same. Carpet is new, galleys look old. So it's really just seat covers, AVOD and carpet, from what I can tell...How could that take 3 months?

D In Mtl
 
beechnut
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:41 pm



Quoting Pnwtraveler (Reply 24):
I think this thread qualifies for the award for the most number of people saying the same thing in a row. Either that or everyone was answering simultaneously.

Well, 6 of the replies were within 53 seconds of each other, so there were plenty of AC buffs active late yesterday afternoon!

Beech
 
yfbflyer
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:01 pm



Quoting CF105Arrow (Reply 17):
XM Radio Canada available at every seat.

It's not actually satellite radio. The audio channels are programed by xm radio now.
 
FLYACYYZ
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:03 pm



Quoting Dmanmtl (Reply 30):
The last time I was on one of the XM 320s, I tried to figure exactly what had changed. It seems to me that the seats are all the same frames but just have new padding and the new AVOD system installed, the Bins are all original and the interior paneling seems the same. Carpet is new, galleys look old. So it's really just seat covers, AVOD and carpet, from what I can tell...How could that take 3 months?

The seats both J & Y are completely brand new - I believe manufactured by Contour Seating (same people who manufacture the J/C suites). The plane was gutted, bins and sidewalls were repainted. On the narrow-bodied fleet (A319/320/321), galleys are unchanged - not really sure how you think they should have changed. On the 763's, given the hodge-podge aircraft, the plan was to streamline and reduce the number of galley configurations by at least 50%.

The first couple of XM'd aircraft took a while, as it was a bit of a learning curve. With practice, the conversion time has drastically been cut down, and nowhere near 3 months. They've also stepped up the pace and this whole "old versus new" topic should be history very shortly.
Above and Beyond
 
cayman
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Fri Nov 30, 2007 1:59 am



Quoting FLYACYYZ (Reply 33):
The first couple of XM'd aircraft took a while, as it was a bit of a learning curve. With practice, the conversion time has drastically been cut down, and nowhere near 3 months. They've also stepped up the pace and this whole "old versus new" topic should be history very shortly.

As to the narrow bodies is it true that most of the 320s have been done, but few of the 319s or 321s have been started?

Any chnace any of the over water equipped 319s being done yet? I am flying CCS YYZ in a few weeks would be nice to luck out and get an XM319. AC has never operated a 320 on the route that I know of I gather none of their 320s have the required certification for YYZ-POS-CCS-YYZ? Might that change when the YYZ CCS leg reverts to a stand-alone flight again in the spring?
 
Viscount724
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Fri Nov 30, 2007 2:14 am



Quoting CayMan (Reply 34):
As to the narrow bodies is it true that most of the 320s have been done, but few of the 319s or 321s have been started?

AC shows the following XM status as of November 21:

Completed:
763 - 10
319 - 24
320 - 30
321 - 3

In progress:
763 - 3
321 - 3
 
SB
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Fri Nov 30, 2007 2:29 am

I got to try out the new J in YUL when the first 77W arrived and I really wasn't impressed. The seats are worryingly narrow and the dividers too high IMO. I felt like I was in a very little box, especially with the screen out.

Although old and somewhat rickety I much prefer the 333/343 J class, with the huge sofa-style seat. Service on my last flight (YUL-LHR) was appalling though - I'll take BA over AC any time.

S.
"Confirm leave the hold and maintain 320kts?!"
 
FLYACYYZ
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Fri Nov 30, 2007 5:03 am



Quoting CayMan (Reply 34):
Any chnace any of the over water equipped 319s being done yet?

I'd have to go back and check, but at least two of the A319's had been XM'd last year to coincide with the YYT-LHR flights, which proved financially unviable, and not returning this year.
Above and Beyond
 
cayman
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RE: AC 767-300XM

Fri Nov 30, 2007 1:45 pm



Quoting FLYACYYZ (Reply 37):
I'd have to go back and check, but at least two of the A319's had been XM'd last year to coincide with the YYT-LHR flights, which proved financially unviable, and not returning this year.

From previous threads I seem to recall that only certain 319s in AC fleet were able to do YYZ POS CCS, not because of any ETOPS issues but because of, if memory serves, need for life rafts and other incidentals for the amount of over water time that flight often spends.

Does anybody know if there are only certain 319s among all of the AC 319s that can operate YYZ CS and I assume YYZ BOG as well? I assume whatever the additional safety requirement is that none of the 320s have this requirement because it seems odd to have never seen a 320 subbed into CCS or BOG, although perhaps I have missed it.

I used to fly frequently YYZ GCM (Grand Cayman) and although the schedule almost always showed 319s, more often than not they would sub a 320 or even a 321, and occasionally a 762 on the route. I assume that the flight plan to GCM (in addition to being considerably shorter range than either CCS or BOG obviously) did not require the same over water additional certifications?

Actually though YYZ GCM spends very little time at all over water.

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