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Pohakuloa
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Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 10:56 pm



Quote:
Hawaiian Airlines said today it will invest up to $4.4 billion to acquire 24 new Airbus wide-body jets, in a deal that will allow the company to fly to Europe, Asia and other new long-range routes.
The state's largest airline said the new aircraft will be purchased over the next decade and will replace its existing fleet of 18 Boeing jets, which are used on its transpacific routes.

The snipit also goes on to say they will be getting airframes with Rolls Royce power plants. I knew that they would eventually be wanting to replace their 763ER's but I had no idea that it would come this soon. They don't say which aircraft they will get but even money says its an A330 and with the routes and expention hinted here im guessing they will likely be 332.

I think this was a pretty big shocker for me when I first read the article. It is an update and I am sure there will be more on it in tomorrow's paper, but I wanted to see what the masses here had to say about it.


Honolulu Advertiser Article

Quote:
First thread started and completed! Woo hoo!!

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mariner
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 10:59 pm

Here's some more:

http://money.cnn.com/news/newsfeeds/...es/prnewswire/LAW12828112007-1.htm

"Hawaiian has signed Memoranda of Understanding with Airbus and Rolls-Royce to acquire six wide-body A330-200 aircraft and six A350XWB (Extra Wide Body)-800 aircraft, with purchase rights for an additional six A330-200s and six A350XWB-800s"

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khobar
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus J

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:02 pm

6+6=24???

New math?
 
JetBlueGuy2006
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:03 pm

Is this a slap in the face to Boeing? It seems like they are a Boeing customer, and now they are going to the bus.

Just a question
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EXAAUADL
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:05 pm



Quoting JetBlueGuy2006 (Reply 3):
Is this a slap in the face to Boeing? It seems like they are a Boeing customer, and now they are going to the bus.

Just a question

well what exactly would they buy from boeing to replace their 767s??? They could stand in line and be #700 for the 787 or they could get the A330 now.
 
PlanesNTrains
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:06 pm

I think this a perfect fit for Hawaiian, as the aircraft would appear to offer the capacity and range that they would be looking for. Not the least bit surprising to me anyways.

And I'm assuming the 24 is "up to 24", including options.

-Dave
-Dave
 
SkyyMaster
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:06 pm

Quite shocking to me too. I would've assumed the 787 was in HA's future, but with those lines being booked for a few years, I guess the 332 was inevitable although the 350 really is a surprise.
 
KL808
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:06 pm

I always wondered why HA never got the A332 to replace the DC-10's they had instead of getting 763's.

Anyways congrats to both parties.

Drew

EDIT: So this will make HA the second North American A350XWB customer after US. wow thats good.

[Edited 2007-11-28 15:07:46]

[Edited 2007-11-28 15:08:13]
AMS-LAX-MNL
 
PlanesNTrains
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:08 pm



Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 4):
well what exactly would they buy from boeing to replace their 767s??? They could stand in line and be #700 for the 787 or they could get the A330 now.

True, though I think it would have been a great fit anyways. I really never expected them to go 787, as to me it seemed a pinch small - yes, I know that the aircraft are all generally the same size, but the 350XWB just made more sense to this armchair CEO.

-Dave
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PlanesNTrains
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:10 pm



Quoting KL808 (Reply 7):
I always wondered why HA never got the A332 to replace the DC-10's they had instead of getting 763's.

I've always wondered why they didn't get some 757-200's to go along with the 767-300's on the mainland-Hawaii routes. This would have allowed them to go into some of the smaller markets, and with a perhaps lower cost used narrowbody. And, yes, the 332/333 also seemed like a winning combo for them.

-Dave
-Dave
 
Airnerd
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:10 pm

I'm pretty surprised by this. Partly because HA has been a good Boeing customre, but also becase HA has had a difficult time acquiring even used aircraft in the past, and only just purchased its first new longhaul aircraft a few years ago from Boeing. On the other hand, good for them. The 332s are great planes, and the 358? well who knows... I would think they could use A333s pretty effectively to larger west coast destinations (SFO, LAX, SEA), for a better CASM.... Even with six 332s in the near term, I'd have to assume they'll be flying at least some of the 763s for quite a while. Their fleet will be more diverse.
 
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moo
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:13 pm



Quoting Khobar (Reply 2):
6+6=24???

New math?

No, not if you actually read the articles.

Hawaiian will invest $4.4b on 24 new jets, but buy them over the next decade. Their immediate order is for 12 aircraft, and they have taken 12 options. Their statement indicates that they will almost certainly firm those options up at some point in the next 10 years.

Makes perfect sense.
 
Alitalia744
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:17 pm

whats interesting is the first A332 won't be delivered until 2012... and the XWB in 2017...


http://investor.hawaiianairlines.com...-newsArticle&ID=1082294&highlight=
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jlbmedia
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:22 pm

Could this order be a combination of A330s and A350s? Just a thought.

Edit: Well it looks like I procrastinated a little before I posted. Better late than never?

[Edited 2007-11-28 15:25:31]
JLB54061
 
B6FA4ever
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:24 pm



Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 12):

i like this part of the article...

The first A350XWB-800 will join Hawaiian's fleet in 2017. The wide-body jet will seat 322 passengers in a two-class configuration (First and Coach) and have a range of 69,000 nautical miles, which will give Hawaiian the capability to fly nonstop between Hawaii and Asia, Australasia, the Americas and Europe. The A350 carries 24 percent more passengers and is 20 percent more fuel efficient per seat mile than Hawaiian's current fleet.

69,000 miles, huh?!? i know i know...just a typo.

i can't wait to see Pualani colors on the airbus. tho hopefully they'll add a touch of color to the engines.

congrats to Hawaiian!

~B6FA4ever
 
HAL
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:27 pm

This is great news for us, and I'm looking forward to flying the Airbus (again). From what I can gather from our company news release, we will get some A330's on lease starting in 2009, probably used aircraft. The first new deliveries will be in 2012, and the A350's will start in 2017.

http://investor.hawaiianairlines.com...-newsArticle&ID=1082294&highlight=

In addition, Mark Dunkerley, Hawaiian's president and CEO, said the agreements with Airbus and Rolls-Royce pave the way for the company to lease additional A330 aircraft for introduction into its fleet as early as 2009, providing for growth and replacement of aircraft with leases expiring during this timeframe.


It means growth, new markets, and hopefully good times for all concerned. Aloha hui hou!

HAL

[Edited 2007-11-28 15:37:40]

[Edited 2007-11-28 15:39:26]
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YULYMX
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:30 pm

i could see A333, but the A332? range is exceeding there current route? Unless they want to fly To BOS, PHL, EWR, JFK?
 
PlanesNTrains
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:34 pm



Quoting YULYMX (Reply 16):
i could see A333, but the A332? range is exceeding there current route? Unless they want to fly To BOS, PHL, EWR, JFK?

That may very well be what they want.  Smile

-Dave
-Dave
 
ual747-600
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:35 pm

What is up at BCA and how could they let these guys go Airbus? Maybe the bankruptcy experience they weren't through not too long ago could have poisoned the relationship but who knows. I don't understand why they would buy A330-200's in 2012 when used 767's will be plentiful and allow them to wait for 787.

I feel a complete lose of sales momentum at BCA. They need to stop talking about the improved 777 (ala 767-400, 747-500), grow a set of balls, and come out with a new high end 777 sized aircraft. Anybody else feel a sense of deja vu coming on with Boeing?

Congrats Airbus. Great turn-around this year.

UAL747-600
 
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:36 pm

Congrats to HA. It really would be great to see them here in Europe. I presume London would be on their list.
 
avek00
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:37 pm



Quoting YULYMX (Reply 16):
i could see A333, but the A332? range is exceeding there current route? Unless they want to fly To BOS, PHL, EWR, JFK?

Methinks HA finds the capacity of the 332 (220-250 seats) muc hmore manageable than that of the 333 (roughly 300-seater). And yes, the ability to offer nonstop services to the North American East Coast, or most anywhere along the Pacific Rim from Hawaii, is certainly a major plus.
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PlanesNTrains
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:38 pm



Quoting UAL747-600 (Reply 18):
What is up at BCA and how could they let these guys go Airbus? Maybe the bankruptcy experience they weren't through not too long ago could have poisoned the relationship but who knows. I don't understand why they would buy A330-200's in 2012 when used 767's will be plentiful and allow them to wait for 787.

I feel a complete lose of sales momentum at BCA. They need to stop talking about the improved 777 (ala 767-400, 747-500), grow a set of balls, and come out with a new high end 777 sized aircraft. Anybody else feel a sense of deja vu coming on with Boeing?

Congrats Airbus. Great turn-around this year.

Well, Boeing has sold over 1,000 aircraft this year, so it hasn't slowed too much  Smile. And while the 763 may become more plentiful, fuel won't. As for expansion to longer-haul routes, if the 763 doesn't have the legs, what do they do, wait?

Just my thoughts.

-Dave
-Dave
 
YULYMX
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:38 pm

HNL-London is reachable with A332? probably
 
srbmod
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:41 pm

It almost makes you wonder if an order for an A-320 family a/c could be down the pipeline as well. I also wonder if some of the issues between the airline and Boeing Capital during their bankruptcy played a role in this decision. HA did return a few of the 717s they were leasing from Boeing Capital, and there were some issues in regards to lease rates as well during the reorganization. Boeing Capital even went as far as to request a trustee to run HA during the Ch. 11 process. This probably did strain the relationship between the two parties. HA had been a loyal

Quoting KL808 (Reply 7):
I always wondered why HA never got the A332 to replace the DC-10's they had instead of getting 763's.

Mainly because there weren't a lot of A330s on the open market at that time. Some of their fleet came from airlines that had returned 763s to their lessors in the post-9/11 downturn and in some cases, bankruptcy reorganization, and some were new-build a/c that were destined for AN but ended up with HA after Ansett's folding.
 
BlueShamu330s
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:43 pm

So with the mention of Europe in the statement, and recent discussion on here regarding Hawaii - Europe, could this be a prelude to them commencing something like a twice weekly HNL-LGW non-stopwith the XWB?

Shamu
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YULYMX
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:44 pm

anyone know if Aloha airlines will go Airbus way?
 
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:45 pm



Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 21):
And while the 763 may become more plentiful, fuel won't. As for expansion to longer-haul routes, if the 763 doesn't have the legs, what do they do, wait?

What city pairs that they fly, or want to fly, can be served only by A330-200 range/payload-wise? I would especially thought the maintenance plus' of 787 would have won the day at a carrier that resides in the tropics.

Oh, well. I guess I know even less than I thought. What is it about the aging process that causes that? LOL

UAL747-600
 
lesismore
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:49 pm



Quoting B6FA4ever (Reply 14):
The wide-body jet will seat 322 passengers in a two-class configuration (First and Coach) The A350 carries 24 percent more passengers and is 20 percent more fuel efficient per seat mile than Hawaiian's current fleet.

Wow, they already know how many passengers the A350XWB will seat! Do they know how many passengers the A332 will accommodate?

How long will the current fleet of 767's continue to fly? I flew on a brand new one back in October 2003 on my honeymoon, I remember the flight attendants making a big deal about the "newness" of the plane. I'm hoping to fly on one of them again before they're phased out, as the 767 is my favorite plane.
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HAL
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:53 pm



Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 5):
And I'm assuming the 24 is "up to 24", including options.

Correct. 12 firm, 12 options, and probably more 330's leased starting in 2009.

Quoting PlanesNTrains (Reply 9):
I've always wondered why they didn't get some 757-200's to go along with the 767-300's on the mainland-Hawaii routes.

According to our management, the 757 has a higher seat-mile cost than the 767's, and except for a common pilot type rating, there's very little in 'common' between the two types requiring another full set of spares, maintenance tools, etc.

Quoting Airnerd (Reply 10):
Even with six 332s in the near term, I'd have to assume they'll be flying at least some of the 763s for quite a while. Their fleet will be more diverse.

Yes we'll keep the 763's for quite a while. The Boeing is a great airplane, but can't be everything to everyone. If we want to fly to mainland Asia, we need something with better range. And some of our routes are so busy we could easily use larger aircraft on them. Being a small company meant it was smart to keep to one fleet type for long-haul. Now that we're bigger (over $1B in sales this year, making us a major) it's time to expand.

Quoting YULYMX (Reply 16):
i could see A333, but the A332? range is exceeding there current route? Unless they want to fly To BOS, PHL, EWR, JFK?

I wouldn't be surprised to see one or more of those destinations announced soon.

Quoting UAL747-600 (Reply 18):
What is up at BCA and how could they let these guys go Airbus?

It really has more to do with the fact that at the moment Boeing doesn't have anything available that matches our needs as well as Airbus does. I've heard our CEO say that it was more the cost of the engines that drove the decision than the type of airframe since the engine cost (power-by-the-hour leasing) is the most expensive part of the equation. Yes, the 787 will be a great airplane. But as someone above said, it really is a bit too small for our needs now, whereas the 332 fits the bill just right.

Quoting Avek00 (Reply 20):
Methinks HA finds the capacity of the 332 (220-250 seats) muc hmore manageable than that of the 333 (roughly 300-seater).

Those capacities are for 3-class setups. Hawaiian has a 2-class operation that increases the seating. Our 763's seat about 260 on average, and the press releases say the 332's will seat 305, and the 358's will seat 322, both in 2-class setups.

I'm lookng forward to this a lot. We've done so much in the past few years to get past the bankruptcy, grow, and become a quality airline. This is going to be fun to participate in!

HAL
One smooth landing is skill. Two in a row is luck. Three in a row and someone is lying.
 
KL808
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:53 pm



Quoting Srbmod (Reply 24):
It almost makes you wonder if an order for an A-320 family a/c could be down the pipeline as well

I have been thinking this too, BUT I feel that maybe this is a bit too big. What about an ERJ order?

ERJ-170 would be a nice replacement for the B717 reducing capacity a bit but more economical and maybe even profitable against the other airlines plowing the Hawaiian Skies.

The bigger ERJ's can then probably fly to different islands within the pacific (Not too familiar with the range of the ERJ's or ETOPS certs).

A319's or A318's to replace B717, I dont know... seems to big of an aircraft for the local Hawaiian Market where there is fierce competition.

A330's for 2009 would be great. HNL-MNL on A330-200 wow that would be great.

Drew
AMS-LAX-MNL
 
HAL
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:03 am

I just put a 6900nm circle around HNL on the 'great circle mapper', and I got an image that covered everything except Africa and the middle east.

Obviously we could easily fly nonstop with the 358 to almost anywhere in northern Europe, and anywhere in Asia as far as India. So yes, a LHR-HNL nonstop is quite possible.

HAL

[Edited 2007-11-28 16:08:05]
One smooth landing is skill. Two in a row is luck. Three in a row and someone is lying.
 
HALFA
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:08 am

So the worst kept secret here at HA is finally out of the bag and now we can discuss it here. Exciting times for all of us at HA, but too bad we have to wait nearly TEN years for the first 350's! Look for route expansion announcements forthcoming!

Aloha,
HALFA
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PlanesNTrains
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:08 am



Quoting UAL747-600 (Reply 27):
What city pairs that they fly, or want to fly, can be served only by A330-200 range/payload-wise? I would especially thought the maintenance plus' of 787 would have won the day at a carrier that resides in the tropics.

I doubt a 763 could do HNL-LGW, or at least not profitably.

Quoting UAL747-600 (Reply 27):
Oh, well. I guess I know even less than I thought. What is it about the aging process that causes that? LOL

Join the club. It's called Dementia  Smile.

Quoting Lesismore (Reply 28):
Wow, they already know how many passengers the A350XWB will seat! Do they know how many passengers the A332 will accommodate?

I think I read 305, and that is mentioned above this post (but below yours) as well.

Quoting HAL (Reply 29):
According to our management, the 757 has a higher seat-mile cost than the 767's, and except for a common pilot type rating, there's very little in 'common' between the two types requiring another full set of spares, maintenance tools, etc.

Makes sense. I guess that settles that.

Quoting Srbmod (Reply 24):
It almost makes you wonder if an order for an A-320 family a/c could be down the pipeline as well.

Why? What's wrong with the 717? Or are the leases coming due?

Quoting KL808 (Reply 30):
have been thinking this too, BUT I feel that maybe this is a bit too big. What about an ERJ order?

While I like the ERJ, I would like to see AQ go that way before HA. The 717 seems well-integrated, and you can only take so many new aircraft at one time. Well, at least you should.  Smile

Unless you are talking about a mainland narrowbody feed operation out of LAX or something... Smile

-Dave
-Dave
 
koruman
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:11 am

Why are people surprised at the selection of the A350 over the 787?

Sure, the 787 is a generation ahead of the 777/A330, but the A350XWB is not only half a generation more advanced than the 787, but with 787 deliveries booked out so far ahead airlines can now wait for the A350 in 2013 and get a superior airplane.

Boeing has had an advantage in recent years in that the 787 was up against a pretty weak A350 until the XWB was designed.

But right now the A330 is already a superior airplane to the 767, and Qantas / Jetstar's economics with A330-200s flying SYD-HNL are far superior to Hawaiian's current 767-300. It's that direct head-to-head experience on the HNL-SYD route which, more than anything else, has shown Hawaiian that blindly purchasing from Boeing is unwise.
 
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aloha73g
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:11 am

Wonderful news for HA!!!!

Hopefully they will continue to grow and add new routes beyond the Rocky Mountains, and in Asia.

Again, Congrats to HA and all of its employees. Great news for a great company!!!

-Aloha!
Aloha Airlines - The Spirit Moves Us. Gone but NEVER Forgotten. Aloha, A Hui Hou!
 
Danny
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:16 am



Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 12):
whats interesting is the first A332 won't be delivered until 2012..

That is the earliest availability of A330 unless you go and shop around lessors.

A big surprise imo and slap in someone's face indeed.
 
PlanesNTrains
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:16 am



Quoting Koruman (Reply 34):
It's that direct head-to-head experience on the HNL-SYD route which, more than anything else, has shown Hawaiian that blindly purchasing from Boeing is unwise.

I doubt they needed that competition to figure it out. Numbers are numbers. The 763, while a great plane, is simply not up to the future requirements of Hawaiian, and I'm quite sure that they would not have "blindly" gone Boeing otherwise. Frankly, the 767-300ER has been a great fit for HA from my perspective, and the 717 has as well. I doubt there are any regrets on their behalf with them. But we're looking forward now, they are financially stable, and are now ready to place this order.

-Dave
-Dave
 
PlanesNTrains
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:18 am



Quoting Danny (Reply 36):
A big surprise imo and slap in someone's face indeed.

Who's face? Can an order not simply be an order? It seems like there is some sort of required emotional damage that must have been done everytime someone buys a plane. Does someone cry at Burger King everytime I buy a Big Mac???

-Dave
-Dave
 
ual747-600
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:22 am

Quoting Koruman (Reply 34):
Sure, the 787 is a generation ahead of the 777/A330, but the A350XWB is not only half a generation more advanced than the 787, but with 787 deliveries booked out so far ahead airlines can now wait for the A350 in 2013 and get a superior airplane.

Boeing has had an advantage in recent years in that the 787 was up against a pretty weak A350 until the XWB was designed.

But right now the A330 is already a superior airplane to the 767, and Qantas / Jetstar's economics with A330-200s flying SYD-HNL are far superior to Hawaiian's current 767-300. It's that direct head-to-head experience on the HNL-SYD route which, more than anything else, has shown Hawaiian that blindly purchasing from Boeing is unwise.

The A330-200 accounts for 50% or this order. The economic advantages of a 787-8 over the A330-200 will be very similar to the advantage the A330-200 has over the 767-300ER. The 787-9 advantage vs the A330-200 would be even more so than the 787-8.

UAL747-600

[Edited 2007-11-28 16:24:29]

[Edited 2007-11-28 16:24:52]
 
aveugle
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:24 am

Wow I never expected this. This is really surprising to me. Well I'm happy for them, I flew them last November and maybe ill be motivated to fly them again as soon as they acquire them.
 
EI321
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:29 am



Quoting EXAAUADL (Reply 4):
Quoting JetBlueGuy2006 (Reply 3):
Is this a slap in the face to Boeing? It seems like they are a Boeing customer, and now they are going to the bus.

Just a question

well what exactly would they buy from boeing to replace their 767s??? They could stand in line and be #700 for the 787 or they could get the A330 now.

They would still get the 787 before the A350s.

Why not order new 767-300s and 787s?

Quoting UAL747-600 (Reply 18):
grow a set of balls, and come out with a new high end 777 sized aircraft.

And grow a money tree while they are at it?  Smile Not only would an all new aircraft require $12b+ in funds, it would mean delaying the 737 replacment until after the all new Y3 is finished, while they continue to loose 737 customers to the A320. This is not unlike the pickle that Airbus were in two years ago.

Quoting YULYMX (Reply 22):
HNL-London is reachable with A332? probably

Could it even be done on a 777LR?
 
Boeing7E7
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:33 am



Quoting Koruman (Reply 34):
airlines can now wait for the A350 in 2013 and get a superior airplane.

On what do you base this superiority claim?
 
NYC777
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:37 am

Well just like Boeing converted some Airbus buyers into buying the 787, Airbus has now converted a Boeing buyer into buying the A350 and A330. Shocking with this one though.
That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
 
HAL
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:37 am



Quoting EI321 (Reply 41):
Why not order new 767-300s and 787s?

Because we have maxed out on the capabilities of the 763, and need something bigger and with longer range. Since the 332 is available long before the 787 is, that is the reason. And now, the 358 and 787 are really neck-and-neck as far as delivery dates available, so that just adds to the logic of going Airbus.

Quoting EI321 (Reply 41):
Could it even be done on a 777LR?

HNL-LHR = 6289nm, range of the A358 is 6900nm, range of the 777LR is 8865nm. Yes, it can be easily done.

HAL
One smooth landing is skill. Two in a row is luck. Three in a row and someone is lying.
 
EI321
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:49 am



Quoting UAL747-600 (Reply 39):
The A330-200 accounts for 50% or this order. The economic advantages of a 787-8 over the A330-200 will be very similar to the advantage the A330-200 has over the 767-300ER



Quoting Boeing7E7 (Reply 42):
Quoting Koruman (Reply 34):
airlines can now wait for the A350 in 2013 and get a superior airplane.

On what do you base this superiority claim?

The preliminary specs suggest lower costs in most areas, most importantly fuel burn. It wond be a huge difference though, probably similar to the 767 Vs A330.

There are others, inc greater range.

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 43):
Well just like Boeing converted some Airbus buyers into buying the 787, Airbus has now converted a Boeing buyer into buying the A350 and A330.

Albeit Airbus was only pitting the A350XNB back then. You have to ask yourself would the AC, NW orders have had the same outcome if the A350XWB was available.
 
Mir
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:52 am



Quoting YULYMX (Reply 22):
HNL-London is reachable with A332? probably

I doubt it. The 358 will have the legs, but the 332 would probably have to take some significant penalties on that route, particulary on the LHR-HNL segment.

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
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ER757
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:52 am

Congrats to HA - I must admit I'm a bit surprised by this one, but happy to see HA growing nonetheless.
I really love the flying experience on HA's 763's, I am hoping to get a taste of the A330's virtues in the not too distant future (hopefully with HAL at the controls  Smile ). Also looking forward to the chance to use my Hawaiian Miles to new and exciting destinations in the future - maybe even on the A350 - good luck to my frineds at HA  thumbsup 
 
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PM
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus J

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:52 am

Is this the first time we've so explicitly seen RR leverage A330s sales on top of an order for A350s? Boeing (and GE) have been doing this with the 777 and 787 for a while. Nice to see it working the other way too.
 
sandrozrh
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:56 am

Something tells me that this is a nice little win for Airbus, Congrats to them.

Quoting AirTran737 (Reply 23):
Part of me is holding out hope for HA to back out of their MOU and go with Boeing

And why would they do this?
 
NYC777
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RE: Hawaiian Air To Spend $4.4B On 24 New Airbus Jets

Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:56 am



Quoting Koruman (Reply 34):
It's that direct head-to-head experience on the HNL-SYD route which, more than anything else, has shown Hawaiian that blindly purchasing from Boeing is unwise.

Oh you've got to be kidding. Can the same be said for QR purchasing only Airbus until recently or NW or AC?
That which does not kill me makes me stronger.

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