gwyire
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DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:38 pm

DL is restarting service ATL - SNN in May 08 with a 757 with 16 business seats. This must be right at the limits of the 757.

This is the first TA flight from ATL with a 757 I believe
 
flynavy
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:42 pm

Please see: Two More Ex-AA/TW 757s For DL (by Flynavy Dec 18 2007 in Civil Aviation) for info. on the source of these aircraft.
Change is: one airline, six continents!
 
AV8AJET
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:43 pm

Wow..neat. This is better than not offering the flight at all. Now I wish DL would bring back EDI to ATL with the 757 or better yet come on DL lets do ATL-GLA with a 763ER!!! Don't make us go to Scotland via JFK! (Argh).

[Edited 2007-12-18 06:44:33]
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flynavy
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:44 pm

Can we say Casablanca? Warsaw? Oslo?
Change is: one airline, six continents!
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:03 pm



Quoting GWYIRE (Thread starter):
This must be right at the limits of the 757.

Though it's not even the longest 757 route for DL. That title still belongs to JFK-FRA, at a whooping 13nm more than ATL-SNN  Wink .

Quoting GWYIRE (Thread starter):
This is the first TA flight from ATL with a 757 I believe

That would be correct.
 
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chrisnh
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:08 pm

It's nice that people can look out the window on this ATL-SNN flight and point to Logan Airport and its...nice...underutilized...white-elephant...Delta...terminal...which...should...have...its...own...nonstop...to...Shannon.

Or, put another way, the folks at Massport will be able to look up as this flight contrails overhead. Big grin
 
EWRCabincrew
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:23 pm



Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 4):
Though it's not even the longest 757 route for DL. That title still belongs to JFK-FRA, at a whooping 13nm more than ATL-SNN .

CVG-AMS will be longest for DL's 757 routes.

JFK-FRA 3855 miles
ATL-SNN 3841 miles
CVG-AMS 4142 miles
DL AMS-CVG With 757 (by LIPZ Nov 15 2007 in Civil Aviation)?threadid=3706399&searchid=3710094&s=CVG-AMS#ID3710094
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gkirk
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:35 pm

ATL-EDI also being re-introduced for S08 using 757s
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EWRCabincrew
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:40 pm



Quoting Gkirk (Reply 7):
ATL-EDI

ATL-EDI is 4009 miles.
You can't cure stupid
 
EIDAA
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:56 pm

Great news for SNN...

I presume this runs in parallel with the 757 to JFK and then the two 763ERs from DUB to JFK and ATL? Great to see the extra presence with nonstop services.

I am actually looking forward to my first Delta flight on Thursday morning... the DL165 from DUB to JFK. Have heard plenty of good things about DL across the pond lately. Not really looking forward to the Comair flight to PWM though!

[Edited 2007-12-18 07:57:17]
Most Flown:- G-BUVA (20 Flights), EI-DEB (12 Flights), EI-JFK (11 Flights)
 
panamair
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 4:13 pm

Quoting EIDAA (Reply 9):
the two 763ERs from DUB to JFK and ATL?

DUB-ATL will be a 764ER next summer.

As for the 752s being introduced into transatlantic service from ATL and CVG, my guess is that some of that flying was originally intended for JFK (e.g, JFK-CMN) but because of the congestion issue at JFK, DL has had to postpone/cut down on some of the planned 752 flying out of JFK and only concentrate on the 'priority' ones

[Edited 2007-12-18 08:17:12]
 
styles9002
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 4:22 pm

Will the JFK SNN JFK be with an all economy service aircraft while the ATL SNN ATL will be two cabin service? Is this because DL hasn't fitted out all the B757s the same way? If so, do they intend to do so?
It is what it is.
 
panamair
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 4:22 pm



Quoting Gkirk (Reply 7):
ATL-EDI also being re-introduced for S08 using 757s

Yes, the JFK and ATL 752s will rotate at EDI (i.e., the JFK-EDI aircraft becomes the EDI-ATL flight, and vice versa).
 
bobnwa
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 4:27 pm



Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 5):
It's nice that people can look out the window on this ATL-SNN flight and point to Logan Airport and its...nice...underutilized...white-elephant...Delta...terminal...which...should...have...its...own...nonstop...to...Shannon.

Or, put another way, the folks at Massport will be able to look up as this flight contrails overhead.

I really believe that if Delta wanted customs in Terminal A it couldlean on Massport and US Customs and it woild have it. It is not as simple as Massport saying no.
 
sxf24
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 4:27 pm



Quoting Styles9002 (Reply 11):
Will the JFK SNN JFK be with an all economy service aircraft while the ATL SNN ATL will be two cabin service? Is this because DL hasn't fitted out all the B757s the same way? If so, do they intend to do so?

JFK-SNN will be sold as two class service once the aircraft has been modified with B/E seats and AVOD in both classes.
 
flyf15
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 4:33 pm



Quoting GWYIRE (Thread starter):
This must be right at the limits of the 757.

In addition to the previously mentioned CVG-AMS, the current longest 757 flight (that I know of, feel free to correct me) is Northwest's DTW-DUS, which is roughly 200nm longer than ATL-SNN.
 
Cubsrule
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 4:44 pm



Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 13):
I really believe that if Delta wanted customs in Terminal A it couldlean on Massport and US Customs and it woild have it. It is not as simple as Massport saying no.

Indeed not. CBP has categorically told Massport that they will not staff a second FIS facility at BOS.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
Junction
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 5:07 pm

What??? No more whining about transatlantic 757 service...Could it be everyone has finally gotten over that?
 
bobnwa
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 5:36 pm



Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 5):
It's nice that people can look out the window on this ATL-SNN flight and point to Logan Airport and its...nice...underutilized...white-elephant...Delta...terminal...which...should...have...its...own...nonstop...to...Shannon.

Or, put another way, the folks at Massport will be able to look up as this flight contrails overhead.

Chris,
Delta could begin SNN-BOS tomorrow if the wanted into terminal A. SNN has pre-clearence to the US. No need to go to Terminal E. It appears that it is DL's decision not to begin the service.
 
Delta4eva
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 5:39 pm

Looks like ATL-DUB gets a 764 next summer. Another notable 764 route will be ATL-SVO.
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DAL767400ER
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 5:42 pm



Quoting EWRCabincrew (Reply 6):
CVG-AMS will be longest for DL's 757 routes.

My bad, I tend to conveniently forget that CVG still has service to Europe (somewhat like DL's management  Silly ).

Quoting Panamair (Reply 12):
Quoting Gkirk (Reply 7):
ATL-EDI also being re-introduced for S08 using 757s

Yes, the JFK and ATL 752s will rotate at EDI (i.e., the JFK-EDI aircraft becomes the EDI-ATL flight, and vice versa).

So EDI will actually see more capacity in S08 than in S07, interesting and somewhat surprising development.
 
gwyire
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 5:49 pm

Shannon is also scheduled to get US customs clearance so any US bound flight can arrived both Imigration and customes cleared. Will be great for those connecting as there will be no need to reclaim bags
 
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chrisnh
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 6:14 pm



Quoting Bobnwa (Reply 18):
Delta could begin SNN-BOS tomorrow if the wanted into terminal A. SNN has pre-clearence to the US. No need to go to Terminal E. It appears that it is DL's decision not to begin the service.

Thanks...that is true between Boston and Shannon. But the larger issue is the collapse of plans Delta originally had for several transatlantic routes from Boston...not just Ireland. And while Delta would have been able to field a Shannon route out of their own terminal, they wouldn't have been able to do so on other European routes. And that's where the whole Delta-Massport snafu came into play (relative to Massport's insistence that international flights launch from their Terminal E rather than Delta's Terminal A).

This is about Atlanta, not Boston, so I'll stop here. But the irony didn't escape me that Delta has pretty much frozen its Boston operations in place while expanding elsewhere.
 
2travel2know
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 6:45 pm



Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 5):
It's nice that people can look out the window on this ATL-SNN flight and point to Logan Airport and its...nice...underutilized...white-elephant...Delta...terminal...which...should...have...its...own...nonstop...to...Shannon.

BOS-Eire, nice to see on B737-700  Wink
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 7:01 pm

As a side, how routes are now officially scheduled with the 757? Providing I counted wrong, it should now be 12 flights,
ATL-EDI*/SNN, CVG-AMS, JFK-AGP*/BRU/CDG/FRA/LYS*/MAN/ORY*/SNN. And are those 4 routes marked with a star the only non-daily routes, and would the timings allow DL to use only 3 757s to operate those 4 flights?
 
ScottishLaddie
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 7:13 pm



Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 24):
As a side, how routes are now officially scheduled with the 757? Providing I counted wrong, it should now be 12 flights,
ATL-EDI*/SNN, CVG-AMS, JFK-AGP*/BRU/CDG/FRA/LYS*/MAN/ORY*/SNN. And are those 4 routes marked with a star the only non-daily routes, and would the timings allow DL to use only 3 757s to operate those 4 flights?

ATL-EDI is 3x weekly in June rising to daily for the rest of summer, currently stops at the end of September though. You haven't mentioned JFK-EDI there either. As already mentioned the EDI aircraft will operate ATL-EDI-JFK and JFK-EDI-ATL.
 
Delta4eva
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 7:19 pm



Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 24):
As a side, how routes are now officially scheduled with the 757? Providing I counted wrong, it should now be 12 flights,
ATL-EDI*/SNN, CVG-AMS, JFK-AGP*/BRU/CDG/FRA/LYS*/MAN/ORY*/SNN.

I believe SLC-OGG is scheduled for a 757 next summer. Will this be the ex-TWA or the ex-ATA birds?
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EI321
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 7:30 pm



Quoting Panamair (Reply 10):
Quoting EIDAA (Reply 9):
the two 763ERs from DUB to JFK and ATL?

DUB-ATL will be a 764ER next summer.

Great! My fav plane returns!! Will it be all coach or is there business class?
 
panamair
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 7:45 pm



Quoting EI321 (Reply 27):
Great! My fav plane returns!! Will it be all coach or is there business class?

ATL-DUB will have Business on the 764ER. Actually, there won't be any all-coach 764s plying the Atlantic next year. The routes flown last summer with the all-coach domestic 764s such as ATL-FCO (DL76), CVG-FCO are all going to be 763ERs, while ATL-SNN will be the 752.

Here's a list of the summer transatlantic flights operated by the 764ER and 752s:

764ER (with 41 Business seats for sale; actually has 42 seats but one is the pilot rest seat):

DL 12 ATL-LGW
DL 14 ATL-FRA
DL176 ATL-DUB
DL 28 ATL-CDG
DL 38 ATL-AMS
DL130 ATL-MUC
DL 74 ATL-MXP
DL 46 ATL-SVO
DL108 ATL-MAD
DL105 ATL-GRU (requires 2 764ERs)
DL 34 ATL-DKR-JNB (requires 2 764ERs)

752 (ex-TWA):

DL102 JFK-SNN (still showing selling as all-coach for now)
DL106 JFK-FRA
DL154 JFK-MAN
DL 96 JFK-EDI
DL 5 JFK-LGW
DL118 JFK-CDG
DL 54 JFK-ORY
DL174 JFK-LYS
DL140 JFK-BRU
DL162 JFK-AGP
DL 42 CVG-AMS
DL196 ATL-EDI
DL156 ATL-SNN

All other US-Europe flights will be using the 763ER.
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 7:46 pm



Quoting EI321 (Reply 27):
Great! My fav plane returns!! Will it be all coach or is there business class?

Should feature BizE by next summer, IIRC, the majority, if not all, of the 764s headed for transatlantic flights are already being re-fitted with a BizE cabin.

Quoting Delta4eva (Reply 26):
I believe SLC-OGG is scheduled for a 757 next summer. Will this be the ex-TWA or the ex-ATA birds?

I believe the thinner Hawaii routes (LAX-KOA/LIH and SLC-OGG) will see the ex-ATA birds, not the ex-TW birds. Too much potential for those birds than to waste them to Hawaii.
 
heebeegb
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 8:10 pm

LGW-JFK to be downgraded to a 752 for s08? Once or double daily?
 
panamair
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 8:13 pm



Quoting HeeBeeGB (Reply 30):
LGW-JFK to be downgraded to a 752 for s08? Once or double daily?

LGW-JFK will go 752 as soon as LHR-JFK starts at the end of March 2008. At that time, DL will be operating 2x daily JFK-LHR (763ER), and 1x daily JFK-LGW (752).

Some would consider the 752 an 'upgrade' in terms of amenities ( PTVs at every seat in Economy)...
 
Delta4eva
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 8:13 pm



Quoting HeeBeeGB (Reply 30):
LGW-JFK to be downgraded to a 752 for s08? Once or double daily?

LGW-JFK will be downgraded to once daily 752 next summer, due to 2x LHR-JFK.
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flynavy
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 8:18 pm



Quoting Delta4eva (Reply 26):

The Hawaii operation will be staffed with all the ex-TZ birds. There are talks about fitting these birds with the same AVOD system being deployed throughout the rest of the fleet.

Quoting Styles9002 (Reply 11):

The JFK-SNN sector at present is served with the 757-200ERs we're talking about in this thread but in the interim/pre-BusinessElite interior. This product is truly inferior to Delta's overall brand and for that reason is being sold as an all-coach service. The first 757-200ER to receive the BusinessElite + cabin-wide AVOD is already at KBFM being gutted and refitted by ST Aerospace.
Change is: one airline, six continents!
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 8:34 pm



Quoting Panamair (Reply 28):
752 (ex-TWA):

Guess I forgot about JFK-LGW being downgraded to a 757 as well. So, a total of 13 757s assigned, and 4 more that are not yet assigned. Hmm, let the guessing begin. JFK-LIS/OSL/ARN/HAM? (I know, the last one only in my dreams).
 
flynavy
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 8:35 pm

I'd love to see Casablanca!
Change is: one airline, six continents!
 
COEI2007
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:40 pm



Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 5):
It's nice that people can look out the window on this ATL-SNN flight and point to Logan Airport and its...nice...underutilized...white-elephant...Delta...terminal...which...should...have...its...own...nonstop...to...Shannon.

Or, put another way, the folks at Massport will be able to look up as this flight contrails overhead.

Yeh but BOS has a daily 330 to SNN with EI.....
 
B752OS
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:45 pm



Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 22):
Thanks...that is true between Boston and Shannon. But the larger issue is the collapse of plans Delta originally had for several transatlantic routes from Boston...not just Ireland. And while Delta would have been able to field a Shannon route out of their own terminal, they wouldn't have been able to do so on other European routes. And that's where the whole Delta-Massport snafu came into play (relative to Massport's insistence that international flights launch from their Terminal E rather than Delta's Terminal A).

This is about Atlanta, not Boston, so I'll stop here. But the irony didn't escape me that Delta has pretty much frozen its Boston operations in place while expanding elsewhere.

It would be nice to see DL do a BOS-SNN run, the market is much larger than ATL-SNN, then again DL has a fortress hub in ATL gets connections to make the flight work.

In any event, DL is expanding out of the places people expect them to, JFK and ATL their largest TATL gateways so no surprise there.

Quoting Delta4eva (Reply 32):

Quoting HeeBeeGB (Reply 30):
LGW-JFK to be downgraded to a 752 for s08? Once or double daily?

LGW-JFK will be downgraded to once daily 752 next summer, due to 2x LHR-JFK.

How realistic would it be for DL to get more JFK-LHR slots and really compete with AA and the 6 x daily 772 service?
 
Delta4eva
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 11:06 pm



Quoting B752OS (Reply 37):

How realistic would it be for DL to get more JFK-LHR slots and really compete with AA and the 6 x daily 772 service?

I don't see it happening. Maybe one or two more JFK-LHR frequencies through the years as slots come available, but the expense of new slots is immense. DL got its current slots from AF for free (in exchange for the join venture) and AF is running low on LHR slots. I doubt they will be willing to give anymore to DL.
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EI564
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 11:30 pm



Quoting B752OS (Reply 37):
would be nice to see DL do a BOS-SNN run, the market is much larger than ATL-SNN, then again DL has a fortress hub in ATL gets connections to make the flight work.

Yes, that makes sense. Fly the biggest SNN market (JFK) all year round and throw in the extra ATL service during the peak summer months, where the hub should fill the plane. BOS is already served with EI, so is not as easy a target. And it sounds like DL has other issues with BOS anyhow, which needs to be sorted before any international services are examined.
 
worldtraveler
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Tue Dec 18, 2007 11:37 pm



Quoting Delta4eva (Reply 38):
Quoting B752OS (Reply 37):

How realistic would it be for DL to get more JFK-LHR slots and really compete with AA and the 6 x daily 772 service?

I don't see it happening.

just one more reason to go after UA.
 
aviateur
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Wed Dec 19, 2007 1:58 am

Quoting EWRCabincrew (Reply 8):
ATL-EDI is 4009 miles.

ATL to EDI is 3484 nautical miles. The above citation is, I think, for statute miles. If we're going to be talking airline/aircraft ranges, we should always stick with nautical.

As for the above poster who suggests that Delta's terminal A be used to pick up some of the carrier's transatlantic slack...keep dreaming. A good idea though, and one that was brought up in this article...

http://www.salon.com/tech/col/smith/2006/03/10/askthepilot177/

That article, praising Delta's global expansion, is now well over a year old. The carrier has outdone itself in that span.

The next batch of cities has already been announced. I doubt we'll see more before the summer of '09, but who knows.

I still find it very peculiar that no U.S. carrier serves Poland. WAW would be a natural from New York. Odd that DL would pick, for example, Malaga, Spain, and not Warsaw. There must be some politics that have kept U.S. airlines away.

[Edited 2007-12-18 18:00:14]
Patrick Smith is an airline pilot, air travel columnist and author
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Wed Dec 19, 2007 9:57 am



Quoting Aviateur (Reply 41):
I still find it very peculiar that no U.S. carrier serves Poland. WAW would be a natural from New York. Odd that DL would pick, for example, Malaga, Spain, and not Warsaw.

AGP offers incentives for longhaul flights and is within 757 range from JFK. Neither applies to WAW.

Quoting Aviateur (Reply 41):
There must be some politics that have kept U.S. airlines away.

Doubt it, it's more economics. UA (and US) are likely happy with just codesharing, AA is more focused on the UK and other bigger markets in Europe (MXP for example), CO doesn't really have the equipment, as WAW is out of 757 range and the 762s are needed elsewhere. And about DL, all planes were already assigned for other routes where DL sees more demand. Of course, who knows, with the additional 757s coming, that could free up a 763ER to do JFK-WAW.
 
Thrust
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:09 am

Of course, the 757s that will be used will be the ex-TWA ones, as they are the only ETOPS certified ones in DL's fleet now.
Fly one thing; Fly it well
 
bambicruz
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:59 am



Quoting Flynavy (Reply 35):
I'd love to see Casablanca!

Would be a great Idea in my opinion. Since DL codeshares with AT (which was considering ATL some time ago), I believe they can take some of the African traffic bound for the US transiting through CMN.
F*** Me Im Famous!
 
Cubsrule
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RE: DL Restarts ATL - SNN With 757

Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:03 pm



Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 42):
And about DL, all planes were already assigned for other routes where DL sees more demand. Of course, who knows, with the additional 757s coming, that could free up a 763ER to do JFK-WAW.

The old terminal would be hard-pressed to handle another widebody from the US. We won't see an American carrier in WAW until 2009 at the earliest.
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more

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