dl767captain
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DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 2:28 am

I was wondering the other day why DL hadn't placed an order for the 787 yet but they placed orders for the 772LR, and i thought that maybe DL would stick with the 777 for a while longer until they really needed the 787. The 772LR would compare with the 787-9 (closest i could find since the 787-10 is not official) they are close in seats (3-class according to wikipedia) and the 789 adds about 500NM to the 772LRs range. DL might not need a plane that can fly 8,000 nm. They are expanding quickly and need more planes, the 787s would not arrive for a while and the 777s are available sooner. My idea is they stick with the 777LR for international flights for now. Eventually the 767s will need to be replaced and then DL could order the 787-3 to replace its domestic 767s, the 767s can last a while longer and i'm sure DL would get a good deal on the poor selling 787-3s while leaving the largest international travel to the 777s.

Would this work or does someone see a 787 coming very soon?
 
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ER757
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 2:37 am



Quoting DL767captain (Thread starter):
Would this work or does someone see a 787 coming very soon?

I'm not sure how soon, but I'd say a 787 order is coming from DL. They can't use 777's for all the missions that the 787 would serve, the 777 is larger than the smaller variants of the 787 and as you know, DL has a boatload of 767's in their fleet. They may be OK for a while, but eventually they are going to need to be replaced.
 
baron95
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 2:49 am

If I am not mistaken, DL has simply converted existing 777-200ER to 777-200LR. These are existing orders. I think AA, UA and DL will extract another 8 years or so out of their 767s - hence the large refurb investment (777 style interior/bins, lie flat biz class, etc).
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breaker1011
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 2:52 am

I think a few things are holding both DL, UA, and AA back from a 787 commitment at the moment.

For one, there's the financials. While everyone's doing better than they were 2-5 years ago to be sure, balance sheets are still subpar even for an industry where the expected ROI is abyssmal. It's not a matter of "can they afford it" but more or less a condition of "do they need to" from a right-now standpoint.

Two, the atmosphere of M&A in the industry, real or just a figment of institutional investor's imaginations, would naturally make one hesitant for a huge order committment. Despite some of the feelings on here about fleet commonality, it's not so much about that as it is about dipping into a consolidation proposition with an attractive financial posture. As well, should consolidation occur, volume will certainly play a role in pricing. IE - Delta+United as one buyer will get a sweeter deal on 100 787's than either would score on 50 frames each. I feel (not an expert opinion here but just a gut) this is why you see Delta tip toeing with small committments for 77L's instead of making one larger committment for anything else.

Three, the 787's not exactly a demonstrated feat yet. It's not even flown. While I have high hopes and a big heart for this georgeous bird, that fact coupled with the "potential" of the 350XWB, these 3 legacies may want to just wait and see how it performs and whether it delivers what it promises and can truly command the price. Remember, both AA and DL in particular got BURNED by the MD-11 in relatively the same fashion. I'm certainly not comparing the ole MD to the 787, but it's something to consider when you wonder why they've not taken the leap of faith yet.

Just my non-expert thoughts, Im sure given A-net that someone else smarter than I will correct everything I've said.
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deltal1011man
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 3:52 am



Quoting Breaker1011 (Reply 3):
I feel (not an expert opinion here but just a gut) this is why you see Delta tip toeing with small committments for 77L's instead of making one larger committment for anything else.

well thats more or less because as soon as a early slot on the 777 line opens up Boeing gives Delta a call......not so much they didn't have the money or didn't want to commit but more of a "why order 12 now when we can order 12 over 6 months and get them 3 years ahead of if we order them all at one time"
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breaker1011
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 4:37 am



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 4):
"why order 12 now when we can order 12 over 6 months and get them 3 years ahead of if we order them all at one time"

Not sure I follow you there guy - can you explain your thought? DL's slots for these birds already existed, so there's not much of a sales effort involved on Boeing's part. The way I understand it right now, it's not extremely difficult to get a reasonable (T minus 2 yrs or so) delivery slot on a T7 right now as the delivery schedules for sales on the books are stretched out for years based on customer's needs (ie - not everyone needs their T7 fleet delivered ASAP.)

Hey - love the name by the way - nice to see another Tristar fan!
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dl767captain
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 4:54 am



Quoting Breaker1011 (Reply 3):
"can they afford it" but more or less a condition of "do they need to" from a right-now standpoint.

but they need to order it soon to get the planes when they need them.
 
dl1011
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:14 am

I wonder if DL would consider trying Airbus again? I think the odds might be higher now that there are 2 ex NW people running dl. Comments???
 
FlyASAGuy2005
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:15 am



Quoting Baron95 (Reply 2):
DL will extract another 8 years or so out of their 767s

I don't know about American but a good part of Delta's 767ER fleet was delivered in mid 90's. I expect the newer ones to be in the fleet for about another 12-14 years with the older ones being replaced within the next 6-8 years.
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Alitalia744
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 6:16 am

expect more 77Ls in DL's fleet over time...
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dl767captain
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 6:27 am



Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 9):
expect more 77Ls in DL's fleet over time...

can you give some more information?

Quoting DL1011 (Reply 7):
I wonder if DL would consider trying Airbus again? I think the odds might be higher now that there are 2 ex NW people running dl. Comments???

i seriously doubt it. They have a huge relationship with boeing already. They have their "gentlemen's agreement" which i'm sure helps DL a lot. Plus i think Boeing is/was one of DLs biggest creditors during bankruptcy. I just find it really doubtful that they would move back to airbus. besides... what would they get? A330s? They are technically outdated when looking at the time they could get some 787s to replace their 767s.
 
sh0rtybr0wn
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 6:32 am

Delta should order A350XWBs. Airbus would love such a big airlines business, and could probably sell them all 3 versions of the A350.
Delta will be waiting a while for either the 787 or A350. And they'll also be waiting while saving up lots of cash to pay for many new widebodies. In the mean time, Airbus might be willing to help them out with some creative down payment schedules.
Everybody probably has a lot of reasons why Delta won't order Airbus; but what are some reasons why they shouldn't?
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:08 am

Quoting Baron95 (Reply 2):
If I am not mistaken, DL has simply converted existing 777-200ER to 777-200LR. These are existing orders.

5 out of 6 . DL placed an order for 1 additional 777 earlier this year, and DL also has BOD approval for 2 more 77Ls for a total of 8 on order (for now), though those 2 do not yet appear on Boeing's site.

Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 8):
I don't know about American but a good part of Delta's 767ER fleet was delivered in mid 90's. I expect the newer ones to be in the fleet for about another 12-14 years with the older ones being replaced within the next 6-8 years.

Sounds about right. The first 763ERs were delivered in June 1990 and of the 53 763ERs DL bought directly from Boeing, only 14 were delivered before 1995, and the large majority of them were delivered 1995-2000, so the average age is probably around 10 years, so they most definitely still have quite some life in them. Not to mention the 764s of course, all delivered in 2000-2002, with an average age of around 7 years. Those could easily go with DL till 2020 or so.

Quoting DL1011 (Reply 7):
I wonder if DL would consider trying Airbus again?

Consider, yes. Actually order, I doubt.

[Edited 2007-12-19 02:20:11]
 
bobnwa
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 1:07 pm



Quoting DL1011 (Reply 7):
wonder if DL would consider trying Airbus again? I think the odds might be higher now that there are 2 ex NW people running dl. Comments???

Those two people had nothing to do with NWA ordering Airbus aircraft.
 
avek00
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 1:21 pm



Quoting Sh0rtybr0wn (Reply 11):
Everybody probably has a lot of reasons why Delta won't order Airbus; but what are some reasons why they shouldn't?

Delta would likely lose its access to preferential financial terms and delivery times it currently enjoys under its gentleman's agreement with Boeing.
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DAYflyer
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 1:24 pm

The US legacy carriers are not going to be in a position to order the 787 for a while yet, primarily due to financials.
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STT757
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 2:06 pm

.

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 15):
The US legacy carriers are not going to be in a position to order the 787 for a while yet, primarily due to financials.

Except for CO and NWA who ordered the 787 back when it was the 7E7 in 2004.
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 2:42 pm



Quoting DL1011 (Reply 7):
I wonder if DL would consider trying Airbus again? I think the odds might be higher now that there are 2 ex NW people running dl. Comments???

I doubt there is any chance of DL ordering Airbus, they will honor that 1990s commitment to Boeing, and Boeing will give DL, (as well as CO and AA) their best price.

Quoting Sh0rtybr0wn (Reply 11):
Delta should order A350XWBs. Airbus would love such a big airlines business, and could probably sell them all 3 versions of the A350.
Delta will be waiting a while for either the 787 or A350. And they'll also be waiting while saving up lots of cash to pay for many new widebodies. In the mean time, Airbus might be willing to help them out with some creative down payment schedules.
Everybody probably has a lot of reasons why Delta won't order Airbus;

Remeber, DL inharited the old PA A-310-300s, and didn't like them. I think DL will stay away from Airbus.
 
Evan767
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:10 pm



Quoting DL767captain (Reply 10):
Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 9):
expect more 77Ls in DL's fleet over time...

can you give some more information?

Don't expect any more out of Alitalia744 than a statement that will leave you guessing.
The proper term is "on final" not "on finals" bud...
 
davescj
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:30 pm



Quoting ER757 (Reply 1):
DL has a boatload of 767's in their fleet

This is a question I've wondered about. As the 787s come in, will the 767 leave the fleet, or be re -- assigned to new routes? Not only on DL, but other carriers as well. After all, the first 787 is due to fly next year (we hope!!).

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 15):
The US legacy carriers are not going to be in a position to order the 787 for a while yet, primarily due to financials.

On the other hand, with Boeing exporting so many planes, it does help the US trade deficit.

I think AA in particular will wait until labor has ratified contracts before purchasing anything big (except what has already been ordered).

I was surprised that CO has ordered as many as they have. They too have a decent number of 767s.

Dave
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baron95
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:55 pm



Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 8):
I don't know about American but a good part of Delta's 767ER fleet was delivered in mid 90's. I expect the newer ones to be in the fleet for about another 12-14 years with the older ones being replaced within the next 6-8 years.

You are of course correct on DL. AAs 767s are a bit older. Obviously how long they'd keep the 767 will depend on a number of factors. Fuel price, competition, the deal they can get from Boeing on a 787. I should have said "at least" 8 years since that is the average time for an A/C refurb to last (well except for the major US airlnes that are flying with 10+ years old interiors).

Furthermore, don't expect that the 787 will be a 1-1 replacement for 767ERs. It is clear that DL (in particular) + UA + AA will increasingly shift their mainline network to international service. I expect theis short haul fleet to decline slightly and their long haul fleet to grow. These airlines believe they fould the gold mine trail by staying away from LCC competition (except out of their fortress hubs), and banking on globalization, open-skies, etc to increase their more profitable international routes. I can see DL easily ordering 25+25 787s with the first few being for growth, the second batch being for 767 replacement.
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seabosdca
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 6:51 pm

Look at DL's order history over time... they have tended to shy away from the big order. Instead they gradually buy or lease planes as needed to fill specific missions.

I would expect DL to order 787s when, and only when, they have a mission where the 787s would be more cost-effective than either 763ERs or 772ER/LRs even considering the cost of acquiring the 787s. I think this will happen as some of their thinner medium-haul routes grow to the point where they could use more pax and cargo capacity than the 763ER has. If they don't need the extra capacity, they can acquire newer used 763ERs for cheap as 787s come into service with other airlines... but some routes just will work better with a 787 than with either of the older planes.

So I predict DL will put a small batch (like 6 or 8) of 787s into service around 2012-2013, when the 763ER is at more of a competitive disadvantage than it is now. The first batch might well be leased. As DL replaces the older birds in its 763ER fleet, which will need to be retired throughout the 2010s, it will place additional small orders. A large order wouldn't match market conditions or DL's history.

[Edited 2007-12-19 10:53:07]
 
bmacleod
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 6:55 pm

I'd love to see a 787 with "Spirit of Delta" in 1980s livery.

I understand this is currently planned for a 777LR.

[Edited 2007-12-19 10:55:52]
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 7:07 pm

Also, don't forget about a replacement for the domestic 767-300s. Most likely when the 787 replaces the 767-300ER on international routes, some of the remaining 767-300ERs may be converted to domestic configuration. However, since Delta is installing new seats and IFE on the domestic 767-300s, they are not going anywhere in the short term.
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Viscount724
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 7:27 pm



Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 17):
Remeber, DL inherited the old PA A310-300s, and didn't like them. I think DL will stay away from Airbus.

And 7 A310-200s. Of the 23 A310-300s, 9 were delivered new to DL in 1993, two years after PA shut down.
 
NYC777
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 7:52 pm

I think you can expect a DL 787 order by next summer IMHO.
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deltal1011man
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:11 pm



Quoting DL1011 (Reply 7):
I wonder if DL would consider trying Airbus again? I think the odds might be higher now that there are 2 ex NW people running dl. Comments???

no thats all i will say is no

Quoting Breaker1011 (Reply 5):
Not sure I follow you there guy - can you explain your thought? DL's slots for these birds already existed, so there's not much of a sales effort involved on Boeing's part. The way I understand it right now, it's not extremely difficult to get a reasonable (T minus 2 yrs or so) delivery slot on a T7 right now as the delivery schedules for sales on the books are stretched out for years based on customer's needs (ie - not everyone needs their T7 fleet delivered ASAP.)

Hey - love the name by the way - nice to see another Tristar fan!

from what i under stand Delta is now ordering the 77Ls as slots open up(the first 5 where 772ERs that where coming next year but now the are new orders)
yea love me some Tristars

Quoting DL767captain (Reply 10):
can you give some more information?

i can Delta is going to order more 77Ls (and soon if i had to guess)

if DL really wants to go to Asia from ATL the 77L is the better plane(much more cargo)
plus let us remember Delta asked for a new NRT slot(i would guess from JFK) a SYD,HKG,SIN slot when they talked about LHR and PVG

"Heathrow, Grinstein said Delta will seek routes to Hong Kong, Singapore, Sydney and another frequency to Japan. "

http://atlanta.bizjournals.com/atlan...ries/2007/04/30/daily3.html?page=3

all of which the 77L can do from ATL (at least thats what Boeing said so don't tell me I'm wrong because i don't want to hear it)
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1337Delta764
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 8:11 pm

Just to let you know, as I posted in an earlier thread, Delta has reserved registration numbers for 30 aircraft from N701xx-N730xx. Most of them feature a DN suffix, except for N704DK, N711DY, and N714DY. I know the first eight regs in that range are supposed to be for Delta's 777-200LRs. N701DN is already built, but is currently registered to Boeing. However, the model name shows Delta's customer code (32). This will be the first 777-200LR that will be delivered to Delta.

http://registry.faa.gov/aircraftinquiry/NNumSQL.asp?NNumbertxt=701DN

Could this be a hint of Delta acquring a fleet of 30 777-200LRs?
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HOOB747
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 9:52 pm



Quoting Baron95 (Reply 20):
These airlines believe they fould the gold mine trail by staying away from LCC competition (except out of their fortress hubs),

Query, what's "LCC" competition? Haven't heard that acronym before.
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nycbjr
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 9:53 pm



Quoting HOOB747 (Reply 28):
Query, what's "LCC" competition? Haven't heard that acronym before.

Low Cost Carrier, like Jetblue, or Airtran etc.

reguards
 
sh0rtybr0wn
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:33 pm



Quoting 1337Delta764 (Reply 27):
Could this be a hint of Delta acquring a fleet of 30 777-200LRs?

That would be bold. 30 ? Wow. Serious expansion possibilities with those planes. When would they get all of them? By when ?

But if I was buying planes for DL, I might order 30 A350s instead ; split between 15 900s and 15 1000s. With 30 options.
They'll have to wait longer to get them but they'll save 15% to 20 % on fuel as soon as they get them compared to the 777LRs. And they'll have the newest / latest technology.
 
mpdpilot
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:44 pm

I just had a thought. So I have heard and the Boeing website conferms that the 787 wingspan is considerably larger with the -8 and -9 compared to the 767. So could DL primarily but AA and UA too be waiting to use the 787 as more of a 777 replacement in the sense that with DL for sure you wouldn't be able to operate as many 787s internationally out of ATL as you would 767 because of the gate space. Now I realize that AA and UA with there sizable 777 and 747 fleets have much more space at their hubs for very large aircraft. But, does DL? Assuming they don't maybe they want to wait until the expansion at ATL is closer to being done and can handle more 787s and also at JFK. Just a thought tell me what you think?
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1337Delta764
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Wed Dec 19, 2007 11:09 pm

Quoting MPDPilot (Reply 31):
I just had a thought. So I have heard and the Boeing website conferms that the 787 wingspan is considerably larger with the -8 and -9 compared to the 767. So could DL primarily but AA and UA too be waiting to use the 787 as more of a 777 replacement in the sense that with DL for sure you wouldn't be able to operate as many 787s internationally out of ATL as you would 767 because of the gate space.

Good point. Howeve, most of Delta's international flights use Concourse E, in which all of its gates can handle a 777. With Concourse F being added, ATL is sufficient enough to handle the 787 if Delta were to order it as a 767 replacement. The only other widebody-sized gates in ATL are in Concourse T and Concourse A. Concourses T and A cannot handlea 777, however, they are used mostly by Delta's domestic widebodies, although there are a few international departures (not arrivals) from Concourse T. All of the 767-400ERs will be in international configuration by 2009, and once the time comes to replace the domestic 767-300s, Delta will probably simply convert some 767-300ERs to domestic configuration as 787s are being delivered. The L-1011 was once Delta's international workhorse, but became a domestic leisure hauler towards the end of their lives with Delta.

[Edited 2007-12-19 15:11:05]
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Alitalia744
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:03 am



Quoting Evan767 (Reply 18):
Don't expect any more out of Alitalia744 than a statement that will leave you guessing.

There is nothing more to be said really. If it wasn't clear, re-read it again.

Quoting 1337Delta764 (Reply 27):
Could this be a hint of Delta acquring a fleet of 30 777-200LRs?

30 is not the number.
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seabosdca
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:44 am



Quoting Sh0rtybr0wn (Reply 30):
They'll have to wait longer to get them but they'll save 15% to 20 % on fuel as soon as they get them compared to the 777LRs. And they'll have the newest / latest technology.

Neither the A350-900 nor the A350-1000 would make a remotely satisfactory 777-200LR replacement. They will probably have comparable capability to the 777-200ER (with the -900 having a bit more range and the -1000 having a few more seats) at lower seat cost, or comparable range and seat cost to a 787 but with higher capacity.

The great thing about the -200LR is its ability to carry a full load of cargo over distances where other long-range airplanes are restricted to carrying passengers only. If Delta is really serious about expanding its ATL-Asia and JFK-Asia business, the -200LR is the right plane to use because it will generate far more revenue on those routes than anything else. The only potential competitor is the A350-900R and that is *way* in the future.
 
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 12:58 am



Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 33):

30 is not the number.

Why comment at all if you aren't going to shed light to help us read between the lines?
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 1:20 am



Quoting Sh0rtybr0wn (Reply 11):
Delta should order A350XWBs. Airbus would love such a big airlines business, and could probably sell them all 3 versions of the A350

Commonality is one factor. They dumped their A310's as quickly as they could and the relationship with Boeing is just too strong. I see a trend back to sticking with one manufacturer with a few notable exceptions. DL is also very conservative and not likely to rock their own boat.
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deltal1011man
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 1:34 am



Quoting Sh0rtybr0wn (Reply 30):
That would be bold. 30 ? Wow. Serious expansion possibilities with those planes. When would they get all of them? By when ?

But if I was buying planes for DL, I might order 30 A350s instead ; split between 15 900s and 15 1000s. With 30 options.
They'll have to wait longer to get them but they'll save 15% to 20 % on fuel as soon as they get them compared to the 777LRs. And they'll have the newest / latest technology.

i hope your joking(all im going to say) o and if you did that have fun with the DALPA which "WILL NOT"fly scarebus

Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 33):
30 is not the number.

i would bet its more (at least i hope i want to see more 777s and 764s in Deltas fleet)
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MCOflyer
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 2:26 am



Quoting Alitalia744 (Reply 33):

30 is not the number.

Really, what is?

Hunter
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1337Delta764
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 2:49 am



Quoting MCOflyer (Reply 38):
Really, what is?

I have recounted, and have found out that the number is 29. However, are there any other registration ranges reserved by Delta? N701xx-N730xx are all reserved by Delta. All except N704DK, N711DY, and N714DY have a DN suffix. Looking through the database, all standard Delta suffixes (DL, DA, DN, DE, and DZ) are taken for those three numbers. However, it looks like N714MH is free, so why didn't Delta take that registration?
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FlyASAGuy2005
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 3:11 am

Just a quick question, are the 777's being delievered with the lay flat seats? If not, does Delta have someone already lined up to do the mod before they are put into service?
What gets measured gets done.
 
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1337Delta764
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 3:20 am



Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 40):
Just a quick question, are the 777's being delievered with the lay flat seats? If not, does Delta have someone already lined up to do the mod before they are put into service?

Yes, the 777-200LRs will feature the Contour Premium sleeper suites from the factory. Economy will feature slimline seats. I hope the economy seats feature winged headrests like on the 777-200ERs. I know the 737-800 slimline seats do not feature winged headrests, however, I believe the same model of Weber seats are available with winged headrests as an option.
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deltal1011man
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 3:27 am



Quoting FlyASAGuy2005 (Reply 40):
Just a quick question, are the 777's being delievered with the lay flat seats? If not, does Delta have someone already lined up to do the mod before they are put into service?

also note that all T7s and 767s will get the same lie-flat seats(just like ACs)all done by 2010

1337Delta764 i asked a good buddy who told me about the 77Ls seats and the 767s will get the same seats
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FlyASAGuy2005
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 4:23 am



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 42):
also note that all T7s and 767s will get the same lie-flat seats(just like ACs)all done by 2010

1337Delta764 i asked a good buddy who told me about the 77Ls seats and the 767s will get the same seats

Wow. I didn't know the 76's were getting it too. I thought it was only going on the 777's. I hate to seem to keep asking all these questions but i'm thinking that the seating capacity on the 767 will go down because of the amount of room that would be needed for the lay flapt seats. I know 50 won't be the number like BizElite. I'm guessing 40?
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MCOflyer
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:00 am

I would have thought DL would add headrest like CO has. Good to see 29 coming. I guess this will tie them with AA for number of T7's operated.

Hunter
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Delta4eva
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:10 am



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 42):
also note that all T7s and 767s will get the same lie-flat seats(just like ACs)all done by 2010

1337Delta764 i asked a good buddy who told me about the 77Ls seats and the 767s will get the same seats

Negative. The 767s will have different lie-flats. The ones that will be on the T7s are not optimal for the 76s.
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jacobin777
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 5:36 am



Quoting Sh0rtybr0wn (Reply 11):
Everybody probably has a lot of reasons why Delta won't order Airbus; but what are some reasons why they shouldn't?

...it doesn't help Airbus that Boeing is part of DL's creditor's committee... Wink


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mpdpilot
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 9:23 am



Quoting 1337Delta764 (Reply 32):

thanks for the info it was very informative.
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jetlanta
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 2:15 pm



Quoting DeltaL1011man (Reply 42):

also note that all T7s and 767s will get the same lie-flat seats(just like ACs)all done by 2010

1337Delta764 i asked a good buddy who told me about the 77Ls seats and the 767s will get the same seats

Your buddy is mistaken.

Quoting Delta4eva (Reply 45):

Negative. The 767s will have different lie-flats. The ones that will be on the T7s are not optimal for the 76s.

Delta4eva is correct. The 767's will get a new seat that will likely be considered quite superior to the 777 model. It's going to be very exciting to watch.
 
sh0rtybr0wn
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RE: DL To Order 777s Instead Of 787s?

Thu Dec 20, 2007 2:59 pm



Quoting SeaBosDca (Reply 34):
the -200LR is the right plane to use because it will generate far more revenue on those routes than anything else.

I dont think so. The A350s , all models, more than make up for the slightly less cargo capacity by blowing the 777s out of the water in fuel efficiency.
At the end of the year, the A350 900 and 1000 would have saved far more money in fuel costs than the 777200LR would have made in extra revenue from the small amount of extra freight.

Plus, the 777 era will soon be over, and the A350 era is just beginning. Delta should go with the future, not the past.

And whats with all this anti airbus / scarebus rhetoric? Delta should be flying A380s out of Atlanta and JFK. Atlanta is te largest hub for any airline in the world. They should make a good deal with Airbus for A350s and 10 A380s with 10 options. Then top off the current short term need with a few more 777s.

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