AA737-823
Topic Author
Posts: 4898
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2000 11:10 am

TWA And Carlie And Karaboo

Wed Sep 06, 2000 8:29 am

I know something about TWA's future is hazy. I read that in Airways, I think. Something about Carl Icahn's policies ending in 2003. I made a comment on another board about this today and someone referenced "Karaboo" By the way, the animal is Caribou, not Karaboo; but that is not to say that Carl Ichan knows what he was doing or how to spell it. So someone please fill me in on what Karaboo is and how it affects TWA and what happens in 2003.
R
 
varig md-11
Posts: 1112
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2000 7:17 pm

RE: TWA And Carlie And Karaboo

Wed Sep 06, 2000 9:10 pm

hi
I don't know all the details about karaboo (not even sure they spell it like that!)
what I know is that icahn was involved in a financial trick which consequence is that TW owes him some money now! TW having no money but debts,they came to an agreement:icahn could buy TW tickets half the regular price and sell them thru karaboo at a price 20 to 30% lower than TW itself!!! this agreement is valid for all TW flights except those in and out of STL hub (thank god!).consequence for TW:they loose money on destinations where karaboo sales are strong:that was the case of MAD,BCN,and FCO,and that's why they don't fly there anymore  
this terrible agreement cripples TW until 2003,after that the courageous TW people will be free
AF TW AA NW DL UA CO BA U2 TP UX LH SK AZ MP KL SN VY HV LS SS TK SQ PC RG IW SE LI TN
 
propilotjw
Posts: 520
Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2000 1:02 pm

RE: TWA And Carlie And Karaboo

Wed Sep 06, 2000 9:33 pm

okay...this is the REAL story and this is exactly how it goes. I will start with a brief history to blend into the Karabu agreement.

...Employee moral, and consequently customer service, suffered. In 1991, Icahn sold soem of TWA's flagship Trans Atlantic routes to American Airlines, in a single sweep of the pen giving up the priceless rights at London-Heathrow. While it may have put cash in his pocket, it was a humiliating retreat for the employees who saw the company grow from Ford Tri-motors to flying the US flg around the world. According to Compton, heathrow flights were the most important part of TWA's operation. Icahn sold them for $445 Million, and TWA was getting $500 million in revenue from them.The year after Icahn sold heathrow, revenue went down by $1 Billion.
Icahn was finially outest from the broken shell of a company he promised to save but he exacted a higher price for leaving. In June, 1995, as TWA was about to declare bankruptcy for the second time, Icahn realized it would default on a loan he had gauranteed when he was chairman. He negotiated a payout in tickets through one of his companies, Karabou INc. Simply put, Icahn recieved the right for karabou to pay only 55% of any TWA published fare, except for passesngers having St louis as an origin or destination. Thus if TWA introduces a promotional fare of $100, Karabou can sweep in and buy as many tickets as it likes for $55, then sell them direct to the public for $75. Icahn maked $20 per ticket with no risk, TWA's yield is devastated, the passenger pays $75 to Karabou when they would have payed $100 to TWA. One industry analyst estimates that TWA is losing $150 million a year to Karabou Tickets.

Now you know the truth. If anyone has any questions or coments please e-mail me for any info on TWA you may have. my e-mail address is PropilotJW@aol.com
 
EyeSky
Posts: 317
Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2000 4:52 am

RE: TWA And Carlie And Karaboo

Wed Sep 06, 2000 9:49 pm

Thanks for the info. I had heard something about this several years ago, but I never got the full story.

What a pirate!
 
Guest

Propilot_JW

Thu Sep 07, 2000 1:13 am

So Propilot, is the Karabou ordeal the reason why when I buy tickets online TWA is the cheapest to fly on. I mean I bought a roundtrip (LGA-PBI-LGA) for $134.26. And if I would've purchased it two days before my original purchase date it would've been $109.54. Now that is cheap. Specially when the next fare was for $195.00 on Delta. I also purchased a round trip for my mom (JFK-POP-JFK) and that was an amazing $326.50 on TWA when American (the ones who have a monopoly at POP) flies there for over $450 dollars.

Thanks,
Alexander.
 
propilotjw
Posts: 520
Joined: Mon Mar 27, 2000 1:02 pm

Answer To AA777dr's?

Thu Sep 07, 2000 8:30 am

Well, it depends on where you got your ticket. There is a certain online ticket place that is owned by Icahn and that is where he sells his tickets. If you bought it from there, yes. There are certain risks involved when you buy his tickets b/c TWA does not like his escapades. If the flight is cancelled for some reason...too bad, there are no gaurantees with his ticktes. We have no pity for people that buy his tickets.
 
Guest

Propilot_JW

Thu Sep 07, 2000 5:24 pm

I bought them at lowestfare.com
I should be o.k. right?
 
flybulldog
Posts: 351
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2000 10:26 pm

RE: TWA And Carlie And Karaboo

Thu Sep 07, 2000 7:32 pm

I guess I'll shop at Karabou. Gotta love those pirates!
 
VirginA340
Posts: 2556
Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2005 12:35 pm

RE: TWA And Carlie And Karaboo

Thu Sep 07, 2000 8:30 pm

It's too bad that a die hard TWA fan or a disgruntled employee didn't put a bullet in Ichan's head before he singed LHR routes to AA. Now before anyone jumps down my throat on how could you say this to poor Carl Why not think of the hard working and dedicated men and women who really worked hards to try and save the airline only to be screwed over by false promises by Ichan.... The man bought in to save TWA and not to ax it piece by piece and sell it of to other airlines and alot of employees standing in the unemployment line. I just wish he would have sold any other route I can care less if it was DCA-LAX or JFK-LAX but of all the bloody routes it had to be JFK-LHR. One of the most popular routes in the world. If BA,AA,VS, and then PAN AM 1 was forced to get rid of all but one international routes it would probably be JFK-LHR because ti it the biggest money making trans atlantic route. When Ichan signed it off to AA with a stroke of a pen he litterally destroyed a great portion of TWA's international status. I just hope when British Midland is allowed to fly to the US. TWA can get back into Terminla 4 LHR back where they belong since Delta will probably get the transpacific routes anyway.
"FUIMUS"
 
Guest

RE: TWA And Carlie And Karaboo

Thu Sep 07, 2000 11:56 pm

Virgn, I don't like the tone of your first sentence at all. I ask that Johann and the others who make decisions around here delete it from your post. Murder in no circumstance is acceptable, especially over money and commerce. Money, as I'm sure you've heard before, isn't everything, especially not a man's life. Shame on you for speaking and thinking like this. Please, please seek some help if you think that killing someone will ever resolve a problem. Your line: "Now before anyone jumps down my throat on how could you say this to poor Carl" is a painfully inadequate disclaimer. I speak for everyone when I ask you to please refrain from posting here anymore.
 
goingboeing
Posts: 4727
Joined: Sat Dec 04, 1999 1:58 am

AA777dr - Hate To Tell You, But

Fri Sep 08, 2000 12:23 am

lowestfare.com is the web site for Icahn. Ordinarily, there are no problems, but don't expect any special treatment should you need to change your ticket in any way.
 
VirginA340
Posts: 2556
Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2005 12:35 pm

RE: TWA And Carlie And Karaboo

Fri Sep 08, 2000 1:50 am

TWAneedsNOhelp; Stop trying to speak for everyone because you don't and I did not mention myself wanting to harm Carl in anyway. So stop acting like I want to kill the U.S President (which I won't). I said someone and in no way did I mention myself. If you don't like my tone ....Oh well... I had relatives who worked for TWA at LHR right before they lost their jobs because of Icahn's stupidity and as a result they were without jobs for quite sometime before finding work with BM and UAL right after PAN AM had left LHR. You've got no idea on what it was like to be laid off from a job after 15-20 years of service to an airline that cuts you off just like that. As for someone wanting to kill Ichan. Just take your pick; disgruntled ex employess, die hard TWA fans, poeple that he has screwed over in business deals and other companies that will suffer the same fate as TWA like GM and Nabisco. I have a friend who works for Nabisco as a public realtions consultant and he is afraid like other hard working employees that Ichan's money making schemes will cost them their jobs and the companies reputation suffering like he did with TWA. Keep in mind that Carl had everyone thinking that he will save TWA when instead he made his money by nearly sucking it dry. Johan; I'm merely telling people about this wolf in sheeps clothing is out to screw people over and that ceos must fight back if they value their company and employees very much. Unfortionatly TWA and my relatives found out the hard way. TWAneedsNOhelp; If you don't like a paritcular post that scares you in any way than don't read it and stop trying to dicatate what others can or cannot say!!!
"FUIMUS"