vulindlela744
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JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 1:37 am

Japan Airlines has announced that their first route with the 787 will be Boston to Narita beginning April 22, 2012. They stated in their press release that it would be available for booking on there website, however you still can't book it on JAL's website. Does anyone know why?
 
BOStonsox
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JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 1:45 am

I am very excited to see this. I can't seem to book any flights either. Maybe the booking system is being updated for this flight?
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SonomaFlyer
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JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 2:30 am

Its because all of you ANetters are jamming their website to book the flight!
 
ha763
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JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 5:01 am

Where exactly is the problem? I have no problem pulling up the flights on both the American region and Japanese websites' online booking systems. I went all the way up to the purchase screen with no problems.
 
Asiaflyer
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JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 5:55 am

Shouldn't the thread title be changed to "JAL to Boston" ?

AFAIK JAL is based at NRT so all their 787 will, at least initially, go to NRT.   
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BOStonsox
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JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 6:14 am

Ok, I've been able to get in now, I got stuck at the first screen and didn't make much effort last time.
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Scanorama
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JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 1:23 pm

Quoting Asiaflyer (Reply 4):
AFAIK JAL is based at NRT so all their 787 will, at least initially, go to NRT

lol my thought exactly!  
 
raptors
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JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 1:36 pm

Have any of the other carriers release their 787 schedules yet by any chance? I am off to Japan in October and would serioulsy consider a domestic flight if ANA use them on those routes initially.
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JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 1:39 pm

Quoting vulindlela744 (Thread starter):
Japan Airlines has announced that their first route with the 787 will be Boston to Narita beginning April 22, 2012. They stated in their press release that it would be available for booking on there website, however you still can't book it on JAL's website. Does anyone know why?

JAL has been talking about flying to Boston since 1990, they even open an office near the Boston Common back then. Couldn't a 777 3 time a week have been do able ?
 
Gemuser
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JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 2:00 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 8):
Couldn't a 777 3 time a week have been do able ?

And make money? Probably not because its too big for the traffic on offer, uses more fuel and three times a week does not attract premium passengers.

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ORDJOE
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JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 2:07 pm

I could see the 787 being able to pull this route off. Boston has a good deal of tech, finance, biotech, and academia that could fill those F and J seats
 
UAL747
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JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 2:17 pm

Does KE still fly to BOS? Are they planning a return if not? I remember back in my college days they flew the 744 into BOS.

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JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 2:26 pm

Quoting ordjoe (Reply 10):
Boston has a good deal of tech, finance, biotech, and academia that could fill those F and J seats

True. If only there were F seats available on this particular route!!!!!!
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AirFrance744
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JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 3:12 pm

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 11):
Does KE still fly to BOS? Are they planning a return if not? I remember back in my college days they flew the 744 into BOS.

IIRC, KE pulled out in 2005. Their flight had always been via IAD, and they found that the flight was no longer economically feasible to keep flying a very empty 744 into/out of BOS. I have not heard anything about KE coming back.
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LipeGIG
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 3:18 pm

Topic changed.

Lets please continue the discussion on JAL development of the 787 route to BOS.


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something
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 4:14 pm

I am happy to see BOS gain new service to Japan. For some reason though I have my doubts about the viability of this route. They don't have a very lucky hand with intercontinental flights.
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kgaiflyer
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 4:42 pm

Quoting something (Reply 15):
They don't have a very lucky hand with intercontinental flights.

You mean flights to the Pacifiic rim, don't you?

Flights to Europe and the mid-Atlantic islands (the Azores and the Cape Verde archipelago) have had a great deal of success.  yes 

[Edited 2011-08-20 09:45:03]
 
N766UA
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 4:54 pm

Quoting gemuser (Reply 9):
Probably not because its too big for the traffic on offer

Judging by the number of Asian tourists I see in Boston, you'd think they could fill dozens of 747s. I think it's about time there was a nonstop to the continent!
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luckyone
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 5:08 pm

Quoting N766UA (Reply 17):

Judging by the number of Asian tourists I see in Boston, you'd think they could fill dozens of 747s. I think it's about time there was a nonstop to the continent!

I'd imagine that many of them simply add a few days in Boston to a trip to New York. As such they either take the train or a domestic flight o Boston (or another area airport) and fly intercontinental in and out of a New York airport.
 
ORDJOE
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 5:16 pm

Quoting zrs70 (Reply 12):
True. If only there were F seats available on this particular route!!!!!!

No F on the 787, that is too bad, but if it better business wise then that is needed.
 
vulindlela744
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 11:02 pm

Felipe, I'd really like you to explain your reasoning for changing the title of my topic. If you read my post you would know that I was asking about BOS NRT. Not the other way around. Please leave my posts alone. Thank you
 
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 11:19 pm

Quoting vulindlela744 (Reply 20):
If you read my post you would know that I was asking about BOS NRT. Not the other way around.

Considering where JAL is based, logically the route will be Narita to Boston - not the other way around.
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vulindlela744
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sat Aug 20, 2011 11:34 pm

Once again, if you people would read my original post the question was about not being able to book on JAL.com from Boston to Tokyo. That I why the topic was titled Bos to Tokyo. I can't figure out why no one can seem to understand that
 
The Coachman
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sun Aug 21, 2011 1:01 am

Quoting luckyone (Reply 18):
I'd imagine that many of them simply add a few days in Boston to a trip to New York. As such they either take the train or a domestic flight o Boston (or another area airport) and fly intercontinental in and out of a New York airport.

Even if that were the case, this gives those tourists a chance to fly into BOS and then make their way to NYC (or vv) without having to pay for and waste time on 2 journeys (either on the bus, plane or train).
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MAH4546
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sun Aug 21, 2011 2:09 am

Quoting gemuser (Reply 9):
Quoting jfk777 (Reply 8):
Couldn't a 777 3 time a week have been do able ?

And make money? Probably not because its too big for the traffic on offer, uses more fuel and three times a week does not attract premium passengers.

A 777 is not too big for BOSTYO, which is a decent market, larger than many with current TYO service like DAL, MSP and HOU.
a.
 
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chrisnh
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sun Aug 21, 2011 2:19 am

I would also imagine that JAL will do quite well selling seats into Boston during the peak foliage season. I know Montreal gets some interesting flights from Asia thanks to this seasonal but strong demand.
 
Gemuser
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sun Aug 21, 2011 3:43 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 24):
A 777 is not too big for BOSTYO, which is a decent market, larger than many with current TYO service like DAL, MSP and HOU.

Arguable. Remember I was replying to post 8 which was for a three per week service. A B777 would be too big for such a service because there are so many alternatives to BOS - TYO that IMHO it would not attract sufficient premium passengers, given that it is almost a mantra around here that premium travelers require the flexibility of a daily service.

The question "which airline services are viable?" is a complex multi variable problem and such a simple response of reducing frequency is unlikely to be a complete solution. You know that! If BOS-TYO was viable with a B777 3, 5 or 7 days a week it would have happened long before this. JAL for one has obviously been watching the market for many years and has only jumped when the B787 has become available.

BTW DAL has TYO service? There goes the Wright amendment!  

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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sun Aug 21, 2011 3:54 am

Quoting vulindlela744 (Thread starter):
Japan Airlines has announced that their first route with the 787 will be Boston to Narita beginning April 22, 2012.

Wasn't this announced several months ago? I already knew JAL was bring the 787 into BOS but don't recall when it was announced.
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AA94
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sun Aug 21, 2011 4:21 am

Quoting QANTAS747-438 (Reply 27):
Wasn't this announced several months ago? I already knew JAL was bring the 787 into BOS but don't recall when it was announced.

I believe you're right. I don't remember exactly where I saw the news, but this isn't anything immediately new ...
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ikramerica
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sun Aug 21, 2011 4:27 am

Quoting vulindlela744 (Reply 22):
Once again, if you people would read my original post the question was about not being able to book on JAL.com from Boston to Tokyo. That I why the topic was titled Bos to Tokyo. I can't figure out why no one can seem to understand that

Because you left the word BOSTON or BOS out of the freaking thread title. It made no sense. Now, had you titled it correctly, you'd have a point. Rather than arguing, you could ask them to re-title it again as JAL Boston to NRT not bookable? That might have conveyed what you were asking about.
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VS11
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sun Aug 21, 2011 4:43 am

Not only is the BOS-NRT flight bookable on JAL US website: http://www.ar.jal.com/en/ but it is also bookable on AA.com
 
ORDJOE
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sun Aug 21, 2011 5:01 am

Quoting VS11 (Reply 30):
Not only is the BOS-NRT flight bookable on JAL US website: http://www.ar.jal.com/en/ but it is also bookable on AA.com

So nice to see the 787's getting loaded into the schedules.
 
jc2354
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sun Aug 21, 2011 9:53 am

A bit off topic, but why didn't NW, or anybody, try the route with the A330-200? the range, per the Airbus website, is 7250nm. And great circle shows BOS-NRT at 6702nm.

Congrats Boston!

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If not now, then when?
 
airbazar
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sun Aug 21, 2011 1:19 pm

Quoting vulindlela744 (Reply 22):
Once again, if you people would read my original post the question was about not being able to book on JAL.com from Boston to Tokyo. That I why the topic was titled Bos to Tokyo. I can't figure out why no one can seem to understand that

He's got a point there  
Not only did you guys change the title to something totally irrelevant to his question, but once you did that the discussion immediately changed to something other than the topic he had originally posted about.   
 
Gemuser
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sun Aug 21, 2011 1:33 pm

Quoting airbazar (Reply 33):
He's got a point there
Not only did you guys change the title to something totally irrelevant to his question, but once you did that the discussion immediately changed to something other than the topic he had originally posted about.

IMHO no he has not.

First sentence of original post:
QUOTE

Japan Airlines has announced that their first route with the 787 will be Boston to Narita beginning April 22, 2012

END QUOTE

I really, really doubt that JAL announced that their first 787 route would be BOS-NRT. NRT-BOS I do believe. To me that's what the topic was about., perhaps not what the OP intended, but his original heading was just asking for it to happen.
My opinion.

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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sun Aug 21, 2011 2:01 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 24):

Those are all hubs that funnel connecting passengers. BOS doesn't have the connections. Since this flight is aimed at O&D, the 787 is perfect.
It is what it is...
 
MAV88
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Sun Aug 21, 2011 10:47 pm

This is a great route for the Boston area, which is quite large and is a very important business market.

Hopefully this route works well and BOS eventually sees more Asia service, perhaps KE to ICN in a few years down the road.
 
vulindlela744
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Mon Aug 22, 2011 1:28 pm

Gemuser, the whole reason I started the topic and named it the way I did was because I want to book from BOS to NRT. I was simply asking any a.netters if they were having the same problem. I would be originating in BOS hence the title. Get it now?????
 
AA767LOVER
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Mon Aug 22, 2011 1:45 pm

IMHO, I don't see this as a money-maker. I bet you JAL will eventually re-filter back through JFK or ORD. But let's see how it turns out. I feel iffy about it.
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airbazar
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Mon Aug 22, 2011 1:53 pm

Quoting gemuser (Reply 34):
QUOTE
Japan Airlines has announced that their first route with the 787 will be Boston to Narita beginning April 22, 2012
END QUOTE

He was setting up his question, which was never about whether the 787 was the approapriat aircraft, or the route was going to be profitable or anything being debated in the thread. Talk about taking a thread waaaaay off topic  
Quoting vulindlela744 (Reply 37):
Gemuser, the whole reason I started the topic and named it the way I did was because I want to book from BOS to NRT. I was simply asking any a.netters if they were having the same problem. I would be originating in BOS hence the title. Get it now?????

That's exactly what I understood too  
 
Viscount724
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Mon Aug 22, 2011 2:23 pm

Quoting jc2354 (Reply 32):
A bit off topic, but why didn't NW, or anybody, try the route with the A330-200? the range, per the Airbus website, is 7250nm. And great circle shows BOS-NRT at 6702nm.

Your numbers are statute miles, not nm. BOS-NRT is 5823 nm.

BOS-NRT is beyond economic A332 range. Manufacturer range figures don't consider winds (which can be very strong on westbound transpacific flights) and only consider passengers and baggage, not cargo. I believe one of the longest (possbly the longest) current A332 nonstops is LAX-AKL on QF which is 5652 nm, and winds generally aren't as strong on South Pacific routes.
 
MAV88
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Mon Aug 22, 2011 3:38 pm

Quoting AA767LOVER (Reply 38):
IMHO, I don't see this as a money-maker. I bet you JAL will eventually re-filter back through JFK or ORD. But let's see how it turns out. I feel iffy about it.

Why is that?
 
BoeingGuy
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Mon Aug 22, 2011 4:31 pm

Great to see the 787 doing what it does best - enabling new non-stop routes to be offered and flown profitably.

What about the AA/JL joint venture adding SEA-NRT and SJC-NRT? I hope those are next. It would be nice if they were flown on AA metal so people in SJC and SEA could earn AS frequent flier miles.
 
commavia
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Mon Aug 22, 2011 5:08 pm

Quoting BoeingGuy (Reply 42):
What about the AA/JL joint venture adding SEA-NRT and SJC-NRT? I hope those are next. It would be nice if they were flown on AA metal so people in SJC and SEA could earn AS frequent flier miles.

Strategically, I think SEA-NRT is now by far the largest hole in the combined AA/JL U.S.-Japan/Asia network - and I think AA and JL both know it. I, too, hope to see that flight added back - probably as a JL 787 - in the future.
 
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ER757
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Mon Aug 22, 2011 5:43 pm

Quoting commavia (Reply 43):
Strategically, I think SEA-NRT is now by far the largest hole in the combined AA/JL U.S.-Japan/Asia network - and I think AA and JL both know it. I, too, hope to see that flight added back - probably as a JL 787 - in the future.

Both carriers have flown the route in the past. JL used to make it a stop on their NRT/ATL/NRT run. Once they got 744's, they could fly it non-stop both ways and bypassed SEA.
AA ran it with an MD-11 and then a 777 (first regularly scheduled 777 service to SEA by the way) but discontinued it several year ago. DL and UA are currently flying the route daily, not sure there's room for a 3rd carrier to make go of it
 
BoeingGuy
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Mon Aug 22, 2011 5:52 pm

Quoting ER757 (Reply 44):
AA ran it with an MD-11 and then a 777 (first regularly scheduled 777 service to SEA by the way) but discontinued it several year ago. DL and UA are currently flying the route daily, not sure there's room for a 3rd carrier to make go of it

Yeah, I've flown that flight several times. It was discontinued in about November 2001, soon after 9/11. SJC-NRT held on until 2006.

I can't speak for load factors, but I do know that Boeing people often have difficulty getting a seat on either SEA-NRT flight, especially in business class. From experience at least, it seems like the route could support a third flight. Likewise, SJC-NRT was always full the several times I flew it. It was a very popular flight until AA gutted SJC. I'll be either route could be made to work.

Problem with JL flying SEA-NRT or SJC-NRT is that they don't currently have a partnership with AS, which of course has a presence in SEA and now some precensce in SJC too for connection opportunities and FF program loyalty.
 
vulindlela744
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Mon Aug 22, 2011 6:47 pm

Thank-you Airbazar. Obviously there are a few us on here with some sense.
 
jc2354
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Mon Aug 22, 2011 9:48 pm

Viscount,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,thank you very much for helping me understand. I had thought of BOS-NRT as pretty much a north-south routing and winds would not be much of a factor. I appreciate your clarification.

Jack

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 40):
BOS-NRT is beyond economic A332 range. Manufacturer range figures don't consider winds (which can be very strong on westbound transpacific flights) and only consider passengers and baggage, not cargo. I believe one of the longest (possbly the longest) current A332 nonstops is LAX-AKL on QF which is 5652 nm, and winds generally aren't as strong on South Pacific routes.
If not now, then when?
 
airbazar
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Mon Aug 22, 2011 10:22 pm

Quoting jc2354 (Reply 47):
Viscount,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,thank you very much for helping me understand. I had thought of BOS-NRT as pretty much a north-south routing and winds would not be much of a factor. I appreciate your clarification.

The westbound route does go due north, just shy of it being a polar route, and the eastbound route will be a slightly more southerly route in order to take advantage of the strong tail wind. Just use JFK-NRT as an example. BOS-NRT won't be much different.
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/J...5/history/20110821/1725Z/KJFK/RJAA
http://flightaware.com/live/flight/J...6/history/20110822/0220Z/RJAA/KJFK
Nevertheless, it's still well beyond the economicaly viable operating range of the A332 when you factor in the distance, the cargo, and the short runway at BOS.
 
dynamicsguy
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RE: JAL To Boston On 787 In April 2012

Tue Aug 23, 2011 10:35 am

Quoting vulindlela744 (Reply 37):
I was simply asking any a.netters if they were having the same problem. I would be originating in BOS hence the title. Get it now?????

You may have intended to write it, but BOS was not in the original thread title.