LAXintl
Topic Author
Posts: 20183
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:15 pm

Continuation of airlines trying to drive added revenue, AA on Friday rolled a revised seating program where prefered seats such as aisles, windows, exit rows and seats towards the front of the cabin can be purchased for an additional $4 (starting price) per segment based on distance traveled and time of day.

AA and OW Elite's and those customers on full-fare tickets along with companions on the same reservation have access to the seats for no additional charge.

Story:
http://www.jaunted.com/story/2011/8/...+Window+and+Aisle+Seats+in+Economy

AA press release:
http://www.prnewswire.com/news-relea...-as-preferred-seats-128382343.html

Funny - how the bad news is slipped in on Fridays, while today AA goes through fanfare advising it will help tuck you into bed in premium classes on long-haul services.  spin 

[Edited 2011-08-29 11:19:11]
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
isitsafenow
Posts: 3413
Joined: Sun Feb 01, 2004 9:22 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:18 pm

When ya lose money, you do things like that.
Next comes priority boarding for non elites...$$$$$
another $5 bucks a bag....$$$$$$$$$
Printed boarding pass which is NOT in advance(on your computer)......$$$$$$$$

Ready or not, here they come.
safe   
If two people agree on EVERYTHING, then one isn't necessary.
 
commavia
Posts: 9802
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2005 2:30 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:22 pm

AA already allowed people to optionally pay more for better seats in Y - or you can still make a seat selection for free in less desirable Y seats, and premium/top-tier customers can still reserve seats for free. What's the news here?
 
delimit
Posts: 759
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 8:08 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:22 pm

Wait, all aisles and windows?
 
LAXdude1023
Posts: 4460
Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:16 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:24 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Thread starter):
Continuation of airlines trying to drive added revenue, AA on Friday rolled a revised seating program where prefered seats such as aisles, windows, exit rows and seats towards the front of the cabin can be purchased for an additional $4 (starting price) per segment based on distance traveled and time of day.
Quoting Delimit (Reply 3):
Wait, all aisles and windows?

Its the aisles and windows close to the front, not all ailses and windows.
It is what it is...
 
User avatar
Tugger
Posts: 6085
Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:38 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:24 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Thread starter):
Continuation of airlines trying to drive added revenue, AA on Friday rolled a revised seating program where preffered seats such as aisles, windows, exit rows and seats towards the front of the cabin can be purchased for an additional $4 (starting price) per segment based on distance traveled and time of day.

AA and OW Elite and those customers on full-fare tickets along with companions on the same reservation have access to the seats for no additional charge.

As corporate traveler (Fortune 100) with no choice but to go with the lowest cost flight options, I despise these changes. I fly about 35-50k per year and cannot gain status on any one airline because they are spread around various airlines (so far this year I have flown United, Southwest, Delta, American, and Virgin).

So now I will get the middle seat unless I fork out more of my own money to "upgrade". Pathetic.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. -W. Shatner
 
UAL777UK
Posts: 2142
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:16 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:29 pm

Quoting crAAzy (Reply 6):
This is just for window and aisle seats towards the front of the cabin. Not all window and aisles seats throughout the entire cabin.

So to clarify do you get a better view out of the window at the front of the aircraft or is the aisle wider up there or what? Sarcasm off! why pay more for thaty towards the front, I dont get it. Yes, charge more for that extra legroom on say Y + but please, this is a joke, surely? Come on AA you can do better than this.cant' you?
 
delimit
Posts: 759
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 8:08 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:30 pm

Quoting LAXdude1023 (Reply 4):
Its the aisles and windows close to the front, not all ailses and windows.

Thanks for clarifying that. It's not clear from the PR and that was just a tad too Spirit for me to process. I assume if they run out of the no-fee seats you are not forced to pay the extra? Not that I wouldn't, mind; just curious.

It's still pushing the Wal-Mart vibe a bit for me, of course, but bravo for trying to raise revenues I guess.
 
BostonBeau
Posts: 480
Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2000 11:55 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:30 pm

If they were smart, they would advertise it as a "discount" on the middle seats  
 
brons2
Posts: 2462
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2001 1:02 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:36 pm

I would pay $25ish for a guaranteed exit row. I am 6'7".
Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
 
atrude777
Posts: 4258
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 11:23 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:36 pm

Quoting UAL777UK (Reply 7):

So to clarify do you get a better view out of the window at the front of the aircraft or is the aisle wider up there or what?

From my understanding, first you have the bulkhead row, which provides more room as it is. Also, say, first 5-10 rows leading up to around exit row (depending on length of aircraft), if you are seated in that area, you're most likely to be the first one off. On tight connections in airports, this could make the difference in whether you make your flight or not.

That's the only thing I can think of as to why the front area of the aircraft.

This won't affect me too much, I prefer the back behind the wing anyway. Let everyone sit up front I'll have the empty spot in the back!  

Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
delimit
Posts: 759
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 8:08 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:38 pm

Quoting BostonBeau (Reply 9):
If they were smart, they would advertise it as a "discount" on the middle seats

I know you're joking, but...they can't. It's something that is done post-purchase. This is a fee. It's calculated above and beyond the fare.
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24597
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:42 pm

Misleading and entirely inaccurate thread title. AA has been doing this for a while, they are just rebranding it. Window a and asile seats are still free, as long as they are not in the "preferred" section which is held for elites.
a.
 
bonusonus
Posts: 228
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 3:49 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:47 pm

Quoting Delimit (Reply 13):
I know you're joking, but...they can't. It's something that is done post-purchase. This is a fee. It's calculated above and beyond the fare.

Right. The whole point is that competition is so intense on the fares alone, that they want to be able to charge more for some seats without actually advertising a higher price (and hence losing customers).
 
B747forever
Posts: 12855
Joined: Mon May 21, 2007 9:50 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:49 pm

Quoting tugger (Reply 5):
So now I will get the middle seat unless I fork out more of my own money to "upgrade". Pathetic.

Not really because they will not charge for all window and aisle seats.
Work Hard, Fly Right
 
LAXintl
Topic Author
Posts: 20183
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:54 pm

Quoting commavia (Reply 2):
What's the news here?

According to folks over at a FF website, they say the revised policy now covers many more seats then prior - upwards of 50-60 on a 757 for example, while someone else says on a 738 the restricted section(window/aisles) according to a map goes up to 5 rows behind the wing emergency exits!

Hey if AA manages to get people pay for all this great, just seems a bit too much for me by sub-diving the cabin into classes within classes.

[Edited 2011-08-29 11:57:50]
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
PI4EVER
Posts: 629
Joined: Wed May 06, 2009 10:29 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 7:10 pm

Oh let me.......paalleezzee start the speculation.......
AA adopts the "Choice Seat" selection charge ala US which must mean they're soon to announce their beloved merger......
and then on to their new paint scheme of red, white and blue................................   
watch what you want. you may get it.
 
ScottB
Posts: 5454
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2000 1:25 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 7:21 pm

Quoting UAL777UK (Reply 6):
So to clarify do you get a better view out of the window at the front of the aircraft or is the aisle wider up there or what? Sarcasm off! why pay more for thaty towards the front, I dont get it.

Pretty much it's all about the amount of time needed to alight from the aircraft after the flight. If you've ever been at the back of a full MD-80, you'd understand.
 
jimbobjoe
Posts: 450
Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2001 2:04 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 7:30 pm

Quoting Atrude777 (Reply 10):
That's the only thing I can think of as to why the front area of the aircraft.

I prefer sitting in the front because turbulence/chop is felt worse in the rear.

Not to mention that, since this is AA, it's a lot quieter in the front should you find yourself on an MD-80.
 
kl911
Posts: 3981
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2003 1:10 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 7:33 pm

What?? Not even Ryanair charges for seats, ( well exitrows they do.) What a very cheap and silly move.
 
HPRamper
Posts: 4603
Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 4:22 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 7:35 pm

Quoting ScottB (Reply 17):
Pretty much it's all about the amount of time needed to alight from the aircraft after the flight. If you've ever been at the back of a full MD-80, you'd understand.

Well, yeah, but technically the middle seats get out before the windows do...so it can't ALL be how far forward you are...middle seats must really be horrible. Maybe the next step is for airlines to just get rid of them

  
 
Grid
Posts: 253
Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 4:26 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 7:37 pm

AA should go to an all-767 fleet to maximize the opportunity to rake in the fees.
ATR72 E120 E140 E170 E190 Q200 717 727 737 747 757 767 777 A319 A320 A321 A330 A340 MD11 MD82 MD83 MD88 MD90
 
User avatar
AVLAirlineFreq
Posts: 777
Joined: Sat Jun 21, 2008 1:31 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 7:49 pm

If they were really smart they'd charge extra for all window and aisle seats on regional jets, too.  
 
sw733
Posts: 5307
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 6:19 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:04 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 15):
Hey if AA manages to get people pay for all this great

They will, because time and again people have proven that the base price is what they are interested in. Most people will see "$129 each way" and not calculate all the other costs until after they have purchased
 
RamblinMan
Posts: 785
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2010 3:57 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:07 pm

I have no problem with them extracting extra revenue. What I seriously dislike about this is that they will have waaaaaay more "preferred" seats blocked off than is necessary, such that if you make a booking less than a week out, and you don't want to pay extra, you'll probably have to wait until check-in for seat assignments.

Had this exact same problem on US recently, ended up in the last row on a 319 and in the middle of a 762. Grrrrrrrrrr.
 
aznmadsci
Posts: 1643
Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2007 8:02 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:37 pm

While these seats will usually be taken by elites, if they are the only ones that remain at the time of check-in/boarding, will they still charge the non-elites on a full flight?
The journey of life is not based on the accomplishments, but the experience.
 
ScottB
Posts: 5454
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2000 1:25 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:53 pm

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 20):
Well, yeah, but technically the middle seats get out before the windows do...so it can't ALL be how far forward you are...middle seats must really be horrible.

They apparently are not charging for the middle seats up-front, although I guess those will still be blocked for elites (if all windows/aisles are full in front) until the check-in window opens. And yeah, middle seats can really be pretty bad if you're stuck between two obese people or between two broad-shouldered males. Plus you don't even get one armrest to yourself. For Americans, at least, I think the middle seat really challenges our expectations of personal space, and there's no way to get away from your seatmates (the window passenger can lean into the wall, while the aisle passenger can lean into the aisle).
 
ukoverlander
Posts: 355
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 10:57 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:56 pm

Next thing you know there will be a coin slot on the toilet door and you'll have to insert 50 cents for taking a leak and $1.50 for pinching a loaf.........
 
User avatar
par13del
Posts: 6691
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2005 9:14 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:12 pm

Quoting LAXintl (Reply 15):
Hey if AA manages to get people pay for all this great, just seems a bit too much for me by sub-diving the cabin into classes within classes.

So what happens if they don't and someone not wanting these preferred seats makes a booking and those are the only seats left. Does the web site advise that the flight is full or advise you that only more expensive seats are available.

I guess its now like first class in the back cabin, a larger number of expensive seats to go unfilled. Time will tell how significant the program is, whether the additional revenue surpasses the number of empty seats.
 
bjorn14
Posts: 3552
Joined: Sat Feb 27, 2010 2:11 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:13 pm

Quoting AVLAirlineFreq (Reply 22):
If they were really smart they'd charge extra for all window and aisle seats on regional jets, too.

You beat me to it...I was gonna say I hope they don't buy any E-Jets or the like.
"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
 
HPRamper
Posts: 4603
Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 4:22 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:15 pm

Quoting sw733 (Reply 23):
They will, because time and again people have proven that the base price is what they are interested in. Most people will see "$129 each way" and not calculate all the other costs until after they have purchased

I've never used an airline website recently that did not itemize every charge multiple times for the buyer to see before they click "purchase" at the end. I find it hard to believe that anyone will keep that $129 figure fresh in mind as they click the buy button right below the $200.

Quoting ScottB (Reply 26):
They apparently are not charging for the middle seats up-front, although I guess those will still be blocked for elites (if all windows/aisles are full in front) until the check-in window opens.

I wonder if there will be any backlash from elites over the windows/aisles being less available now?
 
ckfred
Posts: 4734
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2001 12:50 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:17 pm

I've been reading Bob Lutz's book about his experience at General Motors and how he had to fight the bean counters in finance to improve GM cars, in terms of reliability, styling, and performance.

He argues that finance people simply don't understand the concepts of marketing and consumer satisfaction. He points out that when he was a senior executive at Ford/Europe, one model of car had a camshaft that wore out around 15,000 miles. He ordered a redesign of the camshaft to improve durability. The finance guy reminded him that he would see a reduction in parts profits, because they were making so much money off replacment camshafts. The camshafts generally failed after the warrenty expired.

Lutz pointed out that after the replacement of the camshaft, it was pretty much a given that those customers wouldn't buy another Ford vehicle.

When the finance guys start nickel and diming passengers to create extra revenue, you simply irritate the hell out of every passenger, even the elites who don't have to pay many fees.

If you look at hotels, the vast majority don't charge for making a reservation over the phone or in person. The don't charge for using bath toiletries, the pool, or the exercize room. Except in urban locations, parking is free.

And you wonder why people hate airlines, with the possible exception of Southwest.

Quoting tugger (Reply 5):
As corporate traveler (Fortune 100) with no choice but to go with the lowest cost flight options, I despise these changes. I fly about 35-50k per year and cannot gain status on any one airline because they are spread around various airlines (so far this year I have flown United, Southwest, Delta, American, and Virgin).

My wife used to be AAdvantage Gold. But if UA was cheaper, she had to fly. She once tried to explain to someone in corporate travel that with the checked bag fees on UA, the AA fare would wind up $10 cheaper on her expense report. The company didn't care, because of the contract with UA.

What I would like to see is a company negotiating a contract with a large carrier and the stance, "We aren't paying for checked bags. If you want our business, waive the fees, even if its an employee who only flies once a year."
 
polaris
Posts: 1131
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2000 7:03 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:27 pm

Quite frankly, this "nickle and diming" is getting quite tedious, in my opinion. Just turn me upside down and shake the change out of me!
 
Grid
Posts: 253
Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 4:26 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:33 pm

Quoting ckfred (Reply 31):
And you wonder why people hate airlines, with the possible exception of Southwest.

I hate Southwest because even if you add all the fees other airlines charge, Southwest is still more for any ticket I've priced lately but it still tries to sell itself as the low-cost carrier. Then again, I guess it's possible that it is an LCC; its costs are low but its fares are not.
ATR72 E120 E140 E170 E190 Q200 717 727 737 747 757 767 777 A319 A320 A321 A330 A340 MD11 MD82 MD83 MD88 MD90
 
catiii
Posts: 2394
Joined: Mon Mar 31, 2008 1:18 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:37 pm

Quoting polaris (Reply 32):
Quite frankly, this "nickle and diming" is getting quite tedious, in my opinion.

Why? Who is putting the gun to your head saying you have to pay the fees?
 
delimit
Posts: 759
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 8:08 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:38 pm

It's costs aren't that low anymore either.
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:42 pm

Looking at the aa.com ad with the guy in the green sweater, I've just one question. Which seat do I select to get all that legroom on AA for $4 more?
International Homo of Mystery
 
ScottB
Posts: 5454
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2000 1:25 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:46 pm

Quoting ckfred (Reply 31):
What I would like to see is a company negotiating a contract with a large carrier and the stance, "We aren't paying for checked bags. If you want our business, waive the fees, even if its an employee who only flies once a year."

I think that probably is the case for large companies when they negotiate it into their contracts. I know that my last large corporate employer had very favorable terms in its contracts with hotels (i.e. waived internet charges, free breakfast, etc.).

Quoting HPRamper (Reply 30):
I wonder if there will be any backlash from elites over the windows/aisles being less available now?

I believe the non-elites can only purchase those seats starting at 24 hours before departure. I'm a bit confused as to the difference between "Preferred" and "Preferred Plus."

Quoting aznmadsci (Reply 25):
While these seats will usually be taken by elites, if they are the only ones that remain at the time of check-in/boarding, will they still charge the non-elites on a full flight?

I presume it's like E+ at United; if there are no E- seats when you get to the gate, they give you a random seat in E+.
 
catiii
Posts: 2394
Joined: Mon Mar 31, 2008 1:18 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:49 pm

Quoting ScottB (Reply 37):
I think that probably is the case for large companies when they negotiate it into their contracts. I know that my last large corporate employer had very favorable terms in its contracts with hotels (i.e. waived internet charges, free breakfast, etc.).

Second that. I know a very large financial institution in NYC that negotiated certain terms with their carrier of choice.
 
polaris
Posts: 1131
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2000 7:03 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:50 pm

Quoting catiii (Reply 34):


Why? Who is putting the gun to your head saying you have to pay the fees?


...and that's why they get away with charging fees for every little thing. It's not just airlines, either. It's amusing to watch and a tad absurd, too. I see people in boardrooms asking, "What's now free? Can we charge for that? Let's do it."

[Edited 2011-08-29 14:51:47]
 
airbazar
Posts: 6943
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:52 pm

Quoting ScottB (Reply 17):
Pretty much it's all about the amount of time needed to alight from the aircraft after the flight. If you've ever been at the back of a full MD-80, you'd understand.

C'mon really? We're talking about an extra 5 minutes and you'll still be waiting for your bags at the luggage carousel. What's the point? If anyone is naive enough to pay for it, more power to AA. I'm going to say that people for whom those 5 minutes are really important are likely to be AA and OW Elites's for whom the extra fee doesn't apply.
 
NorthstarBoy
Posts: 1416
Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2005 12:53 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:54 pm

Quoting ckfred (Reply 31):
What I would like to see is a company negotiating a contract with a large carrier and the stance, "We aren't paying for checked bags. If you want our business, waive the fees, even if its an employee who only flies once a year."

I think once the GDSes introduce the functionality for travel agents to be able to charge for ancilaries at point of sale, which supposedly is coming, then I wouldn't be surprised if free ancillaries are negotiated into corporate contracts. As it is now, the contracts are linked to the functionality of the GDS systems, so, it's mostly about discounts, and possibly things like free upgrades for executives, things that can be put into the system as some kind of code that's linked back to the contract.
Yes, I'd like to see airbus go under so Boeing can have their customers!
 
catiii
Posts: 2394
Joined: Mon Mar 31, 2008 1:18 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 9:56 pm

Quoting polaris (Reply 39):
...and that's why they get away with charging fees for every little thing. It's not just airlines, either. It's amusing to watch and a tad absurd, too. I see people in boardrooms asking, "What's now free? Can we charge for that? Let's do it."

And yet they are a for profit institution trying to meet their fiduciary responsibility to their shareholder and actually create value in a dynamic and highly competitive industry. What;s the problem? Meanwhile, it is a free market, so vote with your feet. I for one bypass the fees by not checking a bag or buying on board. I don't begrudge an airline for charging them.
 
polaris
Posts: 1131
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2000 7:03 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:04 pm

Quoting catiii (Reply 42):
trying to meet their fiduciary responsibility to their shareholder

That's the problem right there. It's all about the shareholder. We have forgotten that it's about the customer. It's about customer relations. Not any more, though. Now it's about the shareholder.
 
glbltrvlr
Posts: 753
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2007 4:28 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:10 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 12):
AA has been doing this for a while, they are just rebranding it.

Yep. They started out with just a few rows, now it's half the aircraft. You can see where this is going: The end state is going to be if you want a seat assignment prior to showing up at the gate, you get to pay the surcharge.
 
AADC10
Posts: 1507
Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2004 7:40 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:14 pm

Quoting tugger (Reply 5):
As corporate traveler (Fortune 100) with no choice but to go with the lowest cost flight options, I despise these changes. I fly about 35-50k per year and cannot gain status on any one airline because they are spread around various airlines (so far this year I have flown United, Southwest, Delta, American, and Virgin).

So now I will get the middle seat unless I fork out more of my own money to "upgrade". Pathetic.

That is the point. If you only buy the cheapest ticket, there is no reason to compete for your business, so they might as well tack on fees. Why offer anything to passengers that will jump ship for whatever is the lowest fare? Since shopping purely by price is common among a large group of travelers, offering some features for free to elites rewards loyalty and increases revenue by getting loyalists to pay higher fares and getting price sensitive passengers to pay fees.
 
WROORD
Posts: 667
Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2009 5:36 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:16 pm

Before you know it AA will top Spirit in the number of extra charges they can get per pax. Sorry to see that the executives instead of improving the service and perhaps lifting some fees (WN gets loads of pax because it does not charge for bags) to drive the volume of passengers, they result to the cheap moves of slapping more fees.
 
delimit
Posts: 759
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 8:08 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:19 pm

I'd love to see that quantified.

If not charging for bags made more money than charging for bags, do you really think the airlines would persist in doing it?
 
catiii
Posts: 2394
Joined: Mon Mar 31, 2008 1:18 am

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:28 pm

Quoting polaris (Reply 43):
That's the problem right there. It's all about the shareholder.

As it should be because the corporation's assets legally belong to the shareholders, which is why management has a fiduciary responsibility to maximize that shareholder value first and foremost.

Now can you put customers ahead of investors? Sure you can. And many successful businesses do that, which in a profit-centered business means that customer happiness is merely a means to an end, in this case maximizing profits. But the fact of the matter is that when a company falls on hard times, and doesn't return value to its shareholders no matter how good the customer service is, then who do you think will win out? The customers? Or the shareholders who will boot out the management team?

So it's definitely a balancing act. As a free market libertarian I think corporations should try to create value for all of its constituencies: shareholders/investors, customers, employees, and suppliers. However from an investor's perspective the purpose of the business is to maximize profits.

For me, as a shareholder in an airline and also an elite FF with that same airline, unbundling and fees are a win/win. The unbundling allows me to not pay for things I don't use (checked bags, onboard food) and lowers the base fare (presupposing the airline actually does lower the base fare). As a customer this makes me happy.

As a shareholder, unbundling also allows my airline to charge fees outside of the current onerous tax structure levied on airline fares, and increases the bottom line, the overall financial well-being of the company, and returns value to me.

This value is also important to the employees and suppliers: a healthy airline means growth, means prospects for advancement for the employee, and more business for suppliers.

So yeah, it's easy to attack shareholders and value and say "what about the poor customer?" But doing so really is a "head in the sand" approach that fears a changing market place and doesn't reflect the competitive pressures of an incredibly competitive industry.

[Edited 2011-08-29 15:30:55]
 
User avatar
ADent
Posts: 930
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2006 12:11 pm

AA Adds Charge For Some Window And Aisle Seats

Mon Aug 29, 2011 10:29 pm

Quoting RamblinMan (Reply 24):
I have no problem with them extracting extra revenue. What I seriously dislike about this is that they will have waaaaaay more "preferred" seats blocked off than is necessary, such that if you make a booking less than a week out, and you don't want to pay extra, you'll probably have to wait until check-in for seat assignments.

You just described the UA process for us non-elites that sit in E-. Southwest's system usually works better for us.

Who is online