United Airline
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BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Mon Aug 29, 2011 7:24 pm

From what I heard, BA will go ALL B 777 on HKG-LHR. Can anyone confirm that?
 
1stfl94
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:18 pm

Current plan for this winter is 1 x 744 (BA25/26), 1 x 772 (BA31/32) and 1 x 773 (BA27/28) per day
 
cslusarc
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Tue Aug 30, 2011 2:41 am

Speaking of LHR-HKG, why don't CX and BA code-share with each other on this route since both airlines are OneWorlld members and both fly 340 and 777 aircraft often within 30 minutes of each other? If BA and AA can have a JV why can CX and BA?

(Fri 30March2012)
BA0031 LHR 12:00 HKG 06:55+1 777
CX252 LHR 12:30 HKG 07:05+1 74A
CX250 LHR 18:20 HKG 13:05+1 74A
BA0025 LHR 18:40 HKG 13:15+1 747
CX256 LHR 20:15 HKG 15:20+1 34B
BA0027 LHR 22:00 HKG 16:50+1 777
CX254 LHR 22:20 HKG 17:05+1 EQV


(Sat 31March2012)
CX255 HKG 00:35 LHR 06:20 74A
BA0032 HKG 09:00 LHR 15:00 777
CX257 HKG 09:55 LHR 16:00 74A
CX253 HKG 14:40 LHR 20:30 EQV
BA0026 HKG 23:15 LHR 04:55+1 747
BA0028 HKG 23:45 LHR 05:40+1 777
CX251 HKG 23:55 LHR 05:40+1 74A
--cslusarc from YWG
 
CX Flyboy
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Tue Aug 30, 2011 3:10 am

Quoting cslusarc (Reply 2):
If BA and AA can have a JV why can CX and BA?

CX can easily fill its flights all by itself. LHR remains one of the most profitable routes on the network. No need to 'get help' by starting a JV or even codeshare with BA.
 
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EK413
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Tue Aug 30, 2011 5:16 am

Quoting United Airline (Thread starter):

Considering QF will drop the QF29 HKG-LHR sector I doubt BA will downgrade to B772 equipment...

EK413
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
United Airline
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Tue Aug 30, 2011 7:28 am

Will HKG-LHR go triple daily again? And will they all go B747-400? I mean eventually?
 
AA767LOVER
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:45 am

Too bad they may drop the HKG-LHR sector. I'm glad I got to fly it at least once. Will the Kiwis do the same?
J.I. Tsui, American Advantage Member, United Mileage Plus (Premier)
 
lhr380
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Tue Aug 30, 2011 9:02 am

Quoting United Airline (Reply 5):
Will HKG-LHR go triple daily again? And will they all go B747-400? I mean eventually?

As per the above comments, a third flight is being added, but I don't believe it is every day. It will work well with a 772 773 and 744 on the route.
(The views on this site are my own and no one elses)
 
robso2
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Tue Aug 30, 2011 9:55 am

It seems it will be operated by 1x744, 1x722 and 1x77W

Quoting flythere (Reply 18):
BA031 LHR1200 – 0655+1HKG 777 357
BA025 LHR1840 – 1315+1HKG 744 D
BA027 LHR2200 – 1650+1HKG 77W D

from: BA 77W W11 Routes (by B747forever Aug 18 2011 in Civil Aviation)#1
733/4/5/6/7/8/9, 319/20/21, 752, 744, 772/W, 332/3, 343/6, E70/90, AT43, AR85/1, D38, D10, M82
 
skipness1E
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Tue Aug 30, 2011 10:07 am

Quoting lhr380 (Reply 7):
As per the above comments, a third flight is being added, but I don't believe it is every day. It will work well with a 772 773 and 744 on the route.

When I first moved down back in 2005 they had three B744s daily on LHR-HKG, so it's still a little down on what it's been quite recently. The B77W is a good product immprovement though!
 
LHRFlyer
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Tue Aug 30, 2011 8:15 pm

Quoting cslusarc (Reply 2):
Speaking of LHR-HKG, why don't CX and BA code-share with each other on this route since both airlines are OneWorlld members and both fly 340 and 777 aircraft often within 30 minutes of each other? If BA and AA can have a JV why can CX and BA?

The competition authorities would not allow it as they would dominate the route where the only competition is VS and NZ.

I don't think BA and CX are the best of buddies either.
 
United Airline
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Tue Aug 30, 2011 9:30 pm

Quoting skipness1E (Reply 9):
When I first moved down back in 2005 they had three B744s daily on LHR-HKG, so it's still a little down on what it's been quite recently. The B77W is a good product immprovement though!
Quoting skipness1E (Reply 9):
When I first moved down back in 2005 they had three B744s daily on LHR-HKG, so it's still a little down on what it's been quite recently. The B77W is a good product immprovement though!

Will this return?

What a downgrade!
 
vv701
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 12:10 am

Quoting United Airline (Reply 11):
Will this return?

In the shorter term I think this will depend on the success of the new arrangement between QF and BA whereby the new three-times-weekly BA rotation to HKG will be timed to link with the QF rotation.

Previously only VS, NZ and CX have timed flights to link the UK to Australasia through HKG. The BA and QF JSA routings have been through BKK and SIN. If customers give the thumbs up to the new QF/BA arrangement then I can see the three-times-weekly flight quickly expanding to five, six or seven times weekly. With the QF cut backs and BA adding a 744 and three 77Ws to their active fleet in the coming months there seems no problem in finding the metal to do this. The only problem might be slots at LHR.

If customers do not like the change of aircraft at HKG then the BA/QF caution in starting with a three-times-a-week service will be justified. But I do not see why this should be a problem with the success that the likes of EK and SQ have had on the Kangaroo route as their services almost inevitably require a change of aircraft at DXB and SIN respectively.
 
United Airline
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 5:23 am

So you mean there is a chance that QF's HKG-LHR will return if people are not happy with the current arrangement?
 
Gasman
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 6:18 am

Hmmmm. The 777 is a lovely aircraft to look at (especially the 300-ER variant with its massive powerplants) and certainly keeps an airline's bean-counters pretty happy........ however as a long haul aircraft, from a pax point of view, it's a significant downgrade from a 744 or A380. Feels far less spacious inside, has less reduntant "walk around" room, is only single deck, and 10 abreast - which is becoming commonplace in Y - is awful.

When I fly anything over eight hours these days I specifically seek out airlines that operate an A-380 or 744 on the route.
 
UAL777UK
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 8:57 am

Quoting gasman (Reply 14):
Feels far less spacious inside, has less reduntant "walk around" room, is only single deck, and 10 abreast - which is becoming commonplace in Y - is awful.

BA's 777s are not 10 abreast........are they. Please say no. 10 abreast on a 77 is rediculous. I would avoid any airline like the plaque if I was faced with that. THat said if its 9 abreat or even flying up front the 777 is my favourite aircraft and would happily take it, there is more than enough room to have a little wander if thats what you want to do (within reason)

As for BA and CX, I think irrespective of how well LHR - HKG performs they should work more closely together. THat seems to have been a probelm in the past with JL on OW. The S### hit the fan with them and then the light bulb came on with OW carriers who realised they would be in a lot of pain if they lost them and now working forward I am sure working closer together they will all see the benefits.
 
qf002
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 8:57 am

Quoting VV701 (Reply 12):
In the shorter term I think this will depend on the success of the new arrangement between QF and BA whereby the new three-times-weekly BA rotation to HKG will be timed to link with the QF rotation.

I'm not sure that the flights are actually going to link are they? At BKK there is a 5+ hour wait in each direction with the new QF flight, so they are obviously trying to funnel LHR/SYD pax through SIN rather than HKG or BKK.

Quoting United Airline (Reply 13):
So you mean there is a chance that QF's HKG-LHR will return if people are not happy with the current arrangement?

Not going to happen. Those travelling to LHR (or SYD) will be funneled through SIN, with the new arrangement more interested in keeping the market that likes to break the journey (which is a big chunk of the market, I would imagine).

Quoting gasman (Reply 14):
it's a significant downgrade from a 744 or A380. Feels far less spacious inside, has less reduntant "walk around" room, is only single deck, and 10 abreast - which is becoming commonplace in Y - is awful.

I don't agree. The 777 in 9 abreast has wider aisles and seats, much more modern bathrooms and galleys, bigger bins and (generally) better IFE. The upper deck is only relevant for J pax. 10 abreast is not becoming commonplace - there are only a handful out of the dozens of operators, so that's a major exaggeration IMO. Besides BA has 9 abreast with a product that looks like it totally smashes the seats/IFE on the 747s. There were never any A380s on HKG-LHR anyway...
 
Gasman
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 9:25 am

Quoting qf002 (Reply 16):
The 777 in 9 abreast has wider aisles and seats

Yes - agree - a 9 abreast 777 is quite competitive in terms of pax comfort to a 10 abreast 744.

I still maintain the 744 cabin "feels" more spacious though. Is it something to do with the sidewalls being more vertical? I don't know, but I perceive this greater spaciousness even looking at the cabin pictures on a.net.
 
qf002
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 1:21 pm

Quoting gasman (Reply 17):
I still maintain the 744 cabin "feels" more spacious though. Is it something to do with the sidewalls being more vertical? I don't know, but I perceive this greater spaciousness even looking at the cabin pictures on a.net.

True -- I think the shape of the bins plays a big role as well (ie being able to see higher up the walls). The 747 is by no means a cramped aircraft in any case...
 
speedmarque
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 1:50 pm

BAs 777s are all 9 abreast.
 
jacobin777
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:30 pm

Quoting UAL777UK (Reply 15):
As for BA and CX, I think irrespective of how well LHR - HKG performs they should work more closely together. THat seems to have been a probelm in the past with JL on OW. The S### hit the fan with them and then the light bulb came on with OW carriers who realised they would be in a lot of pain if they lost them and now working forward I am sure working closer together they will all see the benefits.

I agree. Both BA and QF need to work closer with CX. The last thing OneWorld needs is for CX to bolt to say Star - especially given their close relationship with AC.
"Up the Irons!"
 
qf002
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:43 pm

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 20):
The last thing OneWorld needs is for CX to bolt to say Star - especially given their close relationship with AC.

That's a ridiculous idea... QF work just as closely with AF - are they now about to bolt to Skyteam? QF works very closely with SA - sign that they're about to jump ship to Star? CX knows that being in Star would be just as bad if not worse - they'd have major SQ and TG issues... OW is the only alliance lacking in China, and CX will take advantage of that.
 
CXB77L
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 2:43 pm

Quoting gasman (Reply 14):
however as a long haul aircraft, from a pax point of view, it's a significant downgrade from a 744 or A380. Feels far less spacious inside, has less reduntant "walk around" room, is only single deck, and 10 abreast - which is becoming commonplace in Y - is awful.

As mentioned, BA's 777s are not 10-abreast, but 9-abreast, which in my view, is more spacious than a 10-abreast 744.
Boeing 777 fanboy
 
UAL777UK
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 4:47 pm

Quoting qf002 (Reply 21):
That's a ridiculous idea... QF work just as closely with AF - are they now about to bolt to Skyteam? QF works very closely with SA - sign that they're about to jump ship to Star? CX knows that being in Star would be just as bad if not worse - they'd have major SQ and TG issues... OW is the only alliance lacking in China, and CX will take advantage of that.

With respect, you missed the former point of what I and Jacobin777 were putting across. CX should be working closer with its current OW members than what they are. If they (and others) want to have code shares, whatever with other carriers so be it but for too long a lot of carriers in OW have been "going there own way". They should get tighter and work together.
Its hardly surprising QF have those code shares in place you mention, they are retreating the QF brand are they not and just sticking to core routes.
 
cslusarc
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 6:21 pm

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 20):
The last thing OneWorld needs is for CX to bolt to say Star - especially given their close relationship with AC.

Can you elaborate on the relationship between AC and CX? They don't code-share, or have any reciprocal frequent flier relationship anymore. They might interline pax and cargo more frequently than between CX and WS.
--cslusarc from YWG
 
jacobin777
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Wed Aug 31, 2011 6:24 pm

Quoting qf002 (Reply 21):
Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 20):
The last thing OneWorld needs is for CX to bolt to say Star - especially given their close relationship with AC.

That's a ridiculous idea... QF work just as closely with AF - are they now about to bolt to Skyteam? QF works very closely with SA - sign that they're about to jump ship to Star? CX knows that being in Star would be just as bad if not worse - they'd have major SQ and TG issues... OW is the only alliance lacking in China, and CX will take advantage of that.

Air China has an investment in Cathay (IIRC the converse is true as well). That is a bit different than say working closely together.

Quoting UAL777UK (Reply 23):
Quoting qf002 (Reply 21):
That's a ridiculous idea... QF work just as closely with AF - are they now about to bolt to Skyteam? QF works very closely with SA - sign that they're about to jump ship to Star? CX knows that being in Star would be just as bad if not worse - they'd have major SQ and TG issues... OW is the only alliance lacking in China, and CX will take advantage of that.

With respect, you missed the former point of what I and Jacobin777 were putting across. CX should be working closer with its current OW members than what they are. If they (and others) want to have code shares, whatever with other carriers so be it but for too long a lot of carriers in OW have been "going there own way". They should get tighter and work together.
Its hardly surprising QF have those code shares in place you mention, they are retreating the QF brand are they not and just sticking to core routes.

Thanks!     

Quoting cslusarc (Reply 24):
Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 20):
The last thing OneWorld needs is for CX to bolt to say Star - especially given their close relationship with AC.

Can you elaborate on the relationship between AC and CX? They don't code-share, or have any reciprocal frequent flier relationship anymore. They might interline pax and cargo more frequently than between CX and WS.

Apologies, I meant Air China....  
"Up the Irons!"
 
qf002
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Thu Sep 01, 2011 1:08 am

Quoting UAL777UK (Reply 23):
With respect, you missed the former point of what I and Jacobin777 were putting across. CX should be working closer with its current OW members than what they are. If they (and others) want to have code shares, whatever with other carriers so be it but for too long a lot of carriers in OW have been "going there own way". They should get tighter and work together.

Fair point to make -- I was merely pointing out that suggesting that CX was going to jump ship is a ridiculous notion. The thing with CX is that they are a very independent carrier -- they have very little need to be within an alliance at all IMO. Sure they can access feed etc at the cities they fly to, but they'd be better off selecting individual partners to source pax with. I don't think OW as a whole can be described as being disjointed though - Kangaroo JV, Atlantic JV, IAG, QF-LA relationship, Jetstar Japan etc - I think it's CX who's been going their own way.

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 25):
Air China has an investment in Cathay (IIRC the converse is true as well). That is a bit different than say working closely together.

Sorry - I thought you were referring to Air Canada (just as a side note - is there a relationship there? I thought I had seen a thread about CX-AC having to compromise on routes? Or was that SQ?). Even so, why couldn't CA defect to the OW camp instead? Or, might it be a considerable advantage to have one foot in both camps?
 
SCL767
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Thu Sep 01, 2011 1:53 am

Quoting qf002 (Reply 26):
I don't think OW as a whole can be described as being disjointed though - Kangaroo JV, Atlantic JV, IAG, QF-LA relationship, Jetstar Japan etc - I think it's CX who's been going their own way.

Cathay Pacific and LAN have a very good relationship, along with a bilateral code-share agreement on various routes. For example, CX places its code on LAN's SCL-AKL, SCL-JFK, SCL-LIM-JFK, LIM-LAX, and LIM-SFO routes. In turn, LAN places its code on CX's AKL-HKG, JFK-HKG, LAX-HKG, and SFO-HKG routes.
 
vv701
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Thu Sep 01, 2011 5:12 pm

Quoting UAL777UK (Reply 23):
CX should be working closer with its current OW members than what they are. If they (and others) want to have code shares, whatever with other carriers so be it but for too long a lot of carriers in OW have been "going there own way". They should get tighter and work together.

I get the feeling - but I may be wrong - that because BA and CX do not put their codes on each others flights between LHR and HKG there is a view that CX does not work together with its oneworld partners. So I took a look at flights arriving at LHR this afternoon in the five hours between 13.00 and 18.00 hrs. Here is what I found:

BA1395. MAN-LHR. Code share CX1262
BA347. NCE-LHR. CX7232
BA1333. NCL-LHR. CX1210
BA969. HAM-LHR. CX7150
BA815. CPH-LHR. CX7198
AY839. HEL-LHR. CX1412
BA993. TXL-LHR. CX7152
BA716. ZRH-LHR. CX7200
BA507. LIS-LHR. CX7206
BA1399. MAN-LHR. CX1232
BA345. NCE-LHR. CX7236
BA941. DUS-LHR. CX7142
AY833. HEL-LHR. CX1414
BA779. ARN-LHR. CX7104
BA861. PRG-LHR. CX7122
BA953. MUC-LHR. CX7162
BA817. CPH-LHR. CX7192
BA985. TXL-LHR. CX7184

Interestingly the above (3.6 code share arrivals per hour) was gleaned from the BAA Heathrow arrivals board. But by no means all of these code shares appear in the oneworld on-line timetable.
 
flythere
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Thu Sep 01, 2011 6:08 pm

Quoting VV701 (Reply 28):
I get the feeling - but I may be wrong - that because BA and CX do not put their codes on each others flights between LHR and HKG there is a view that CX does not work together with its oneworld partners. So I took a look at flights arriving at LHR this afternoon in the five hours between 13.00 and 18.00 hrs. Here is what I found:

On the other hand BA places it's code on some Asia routes on CX metal, for instance, Jarkarta, Penang, HoChiMinh, Seoul, Surabaya etc.

We cannot say they don't cooperate, and it actually makes very much sense indeed, and I bet they are very happy about the arrangement so far. They keep customers on their own long-haul flights and expand the network by placing codes at the other end, why not? JV isn't always possible with cost structure and yield level so different between airlines.
 
David_itl
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Thu Sep 01, 2011 7:19 pm

Quoting flythere (Reply 29):
We cannot say they don't cooperate, and it actually makes very much sense indeed, and I bet they are very happy about the arrangement so far. They keep customers on their own long-haul flights and expand the network by placing codes at the other end, why not?

Yet when CX was operating into MAN, they were more interested in getting codesharing in place on the LHR shuttle rather then develop the MAN service that was already in place. Now there's a large markert routing via LHR for no reason at all, and by squeezing capacity on LHR-HKG, it means that LH and the Gulf carriers will continue to thrive at MAN by getting them though their home airports. Such clever, coherent planning!
 
lhr380
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RE: BA To Go All B777 On HKG-LHR?

Thu Sep 01, 2011 8:09 pm

Quoting david_itl (Reply 30):
Now there's a large markert routing via LHR for no reason at all, and by squeezing capacity on LHR-HKG, it means that LH and the Gulf carriers will continue to thrive at MAN by getting them though their home airports. Such clever, coherent planning!

So LH and the Gulf carriers are taking customers to their hubs, just like BA are, and with the codeshareing CX get fantastic feed from the European (And worldwide) Oneworld Network. What's wrong there?
(The views on this site are my own and no one elses)