Stabilator
Topic Author
Posts: 680
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2010 5:42 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Thu Sep 08, 2011 2:59 pm

Just as the title says. I believe this is different than those who took buyouts. Hopefully they'll find new jobs!

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Delta-...yonthewall-625958781.html?x=0&.v=1
So we beat on against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past.
 
User avatar
enilria
Posts: 6173
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 7:15 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Thu Sep 08, 2011 3:07 pm

I wonder what that really means. Administrators is rather vague. I suspect it means "management".
 
User avatar
mayor
Posts: 6188
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:58 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Thu Sep 08, 2011 3:16 pm

Perhaps they're laying off those unnecessary layers of managment........more analysts than you could shake a stick at, etc.  


This, from the AJC:


http://www.ajc.com/business/delta-la...pe=rss_business_87628

size=-4>[Edited 2011-09-08 08:17:37]


[Edited 2011-09-08 08:18:14]
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen
 
rojo
Posts: 2254
Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2000 6:08 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Thu Sep 08, 2011 3:37 pm

They should lay off more managers and less analysts... analyst are the ones doing he job (excel, pp, sql, etc) while managers are mostly networking trying to get a VP position. At last thas what I've seen in US legacy airlines.
 
Stabilator
Topic Author
Posts: 680
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2010 5:42 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Thu Sep 08, 2011 4:17 pm

It seems like the 2000 employees who were bought out didn't save enough money, so they laid off 200 more. I'd link the site, but I'm on my iPhone and it's a mobile link.
So we beat on against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past.
 
Josh32121
Posts: 232
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 1:02 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Thu Sep 08, 2011 4:51 pm

"Administrators" is inaccurate and misleading. The article said "administrative staff." These are low- to mid-level corporate HQ type office jobs.
 
bobnwa
Posts: 4460
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2000 12:10 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Thu Sep 08, 2011 4:52 pm

Quoting Stabilator (Reply 4):
It seems like the 2000 employees who were bought out didn't save enough money, so they laid off 200 more. I'd link the site, but I'm on my iPhone and it's a mobile link.

The 200 being laid off were not eligabe for the buyout, since they are "at will employees". They can be terminated at any time without cause and no recourse.
 
simairlinenet
Posts: 696
Joined: Sat Oct 29, 2005 2:24 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Thu Sep 08, 2011 5:12 pm

Quoting bobnwa (Reply 6):
The 200 being laid off were not eligabe for the buyout, since they are "at will employees".

Pretty much all management employees were eligible for the buyout--anyone hired prior to 2011 was eligible.
 
OOer
Posts: 920
Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2005 2:10 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Thu Sep 08, 2011 5:16 pm

Quoting simairlinenet (Reply 7):
Pretty much all management employees were eligible for the buyout--anyone hired prior to 2011 was eligible.

That is incorrect, you needed to have at least 5 years of service to be eligible for the buyout.
 
rivervisual
Posts: 40
Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2009 12:49 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Thu Sep 08, 2011 5:37 pm

Quoting ooer (Reply 8):
That is incorrect, you needed to have at least 5 years of service to be eligible for the buyout.

THAT is actually incorrect. All Merit Employees hired before January 1 2011 were eligible regardless of number of years in service.
 
bennett123
Posts: 7426
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:49 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Thu Sep 08, 2011 8:29 pm

What is a "Merit" employee.
 
delta2ual
Posts: 558
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2007 11:18 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Thu Sep 08, 2011 10:36 pm

Quoting Bennett123 (Reply 10):
What is a "Merit" employee.

People whose yearly raises are based on "merit" vs. an automatic step increase like those on published payscales. Usually, they are considered "management".
From the world's largest airline-to the world's largest airline. Delta2ual
 
catiii
Posts: 2387
Joined: Mon Mar 31, 2008 1:18 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Thu Sep 08, 2011 10:37 pm

Quoting rojo (Reply 3):
They should lay off more managers and less analysts... analyst are the ones doing he job (excel, pp, sql, etc) while managers are mostly networking trying to get a VP position. At last thas what I've seen in US legacy airlines.

Based on what experience? That's a blanket statement by you.
 
User avatar
usdcaguy
Posts: 1030
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2004 12:41 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Fri Sep 09, 2011 12:05 am

Quoting rojo (Reply 3):
They should lay off more managers and less analysts... analyst are the ones doing he job (excel, pp, sql, etc) while managers are mostly networking trying to get a VP position.

This is a gross generalization, but it's basically correct. At a number of airlines, the analysts are bending over backwards running many of the administrative functions while managers discuss issues and produce little in the way of productive change. Except, of course, new ways to cut costs by reducing headcount.

Speaking of which, this is the second round of administrative layoffs Delta has had in the past couple of years. If I remember correctly, there was another one in early 2010. Why so many cuts? Did they retain too many people from the merger? Why is Delta shrinking so much more rapidly than other carriers?
 
FlyASAGuy2005
Posts: 3964
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2007 4:55 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Fri Sep 09, 2011 12:23 am

You see it all the time. Continental was in the spotlight not too long ago. Company x may need 10 people to operate and company y may need 10 as well. Combinationed doesn't automatically mean they need 20.
What gets measured gets done.
 
bobnwa
Posts: 4460
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2000 12:10 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Fri Sep 09, 2011 12:44 am

Quoting usdcaguy (Reply 13):
Why is Delta shrinking so much more rapidly than other carriers?

I don't believe Delta is shrinking more rapidly than AA or UA/CO or US for that matter. All airlines have drawn back because of the recession and fuel costs. In that regard DL is the same as the others.
 
VC10DC10
Posts: 605
Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2006 9:56 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Fri Sep 09, 2011 12:54 am

Quoting usdcaguy (Reply 13):
Why is Delta shrinking so much more rapidly than other carriers?

I don't know this for a fact, but is it possible that Delta hired a lot of behind-the-scenes people in the meantime? (Layoffs always make headlines, but companies don't usually put out press releases saying "we're gonna hire 3,000 new middle managers to fill the office.")
 
BCEaglesCO757
Posts: 178
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:16 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Fri Sep 09, 2011 12:59 am

Quoting bobnwa (Reply 6):
The 200 being laid off were not eligabe for the buyout, since they are "at will employees". They can be terminated at any time without cause and no recourse.

This is the very reason I'm glad I left my "office" job at CO. As well as not considered for a few jobs at HQS I had applied for.

I'd certainly be out of an job right now without a doubt with the current merger.

I think a former user on here MSPCO I believe had been CO ramp in MSP and went to HQS. I'm not sure if he is with UA/CO any longer.

The problem with those type of jobs is that when they let you go that is it. You're non-rehireable and it's not like you can go to another station in the system if there is a spot available.
 
n7371f
Posts: 931
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:54 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Fri Sep 09, 2011 3:11 am

They ought to lay off the clowns at SkyMiles who keep devaluing the program. Thought of the guy who runs that program with his tag line "you're the reasong we fly" when waiting in a jet bridge with the "Loyalty Programs Should Be Loyal" poster.  
 
brons2
Posts: 2462
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2001 1:02 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Fri Sep 09, 2011 3:24 am

Quoting BCEaglesCO757 (Reply 17):
The problem with those type of jobs is that when they let you go that is it. You're non-rehireable

Why? If you haven't violated any policies or anything like that, why would they not consider you for a re-hire? The way you put it sounds more like there was a job performance issue, not a layoff due to economics.
Firings, if well done, are good for employee morale.
 
Dalmd88
Posts: 2391
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2000 3:19 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Fri Sep 09, 2011 9:41 am

Quoting brons2 (Reply 19):
Why? If you haven't violated any policies or anything like that, why would they not consider you for a re-hire? The way you put it sounds more like there was a job performance issue, not a layoff due to economics.

The way these layoffs are handled they are performance based. Say engineering needs to cut two spots. The two lowest performing employees get cut. They might not be bad employees, just the lowest in that group. The next group over might be filled with slackers. The second group's manager might just be better at showing a need for an inflated headcount.

In the end both decent and less than stellar people get let go. At least that is how I've seen it. We heard a few of the names in Tech Ops. For some it was their time. For others we were shocked.
 
User avatar
RWA380
Posts: 4441
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:51 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Fri Sep 09, 2011 11:00 am

Quoting n7371f (Reply 18):

Funny, they may be running out of all the millions of sky miles Amex gave them as a financial boost back when Amex and Delta inked the deal for the skymiles card.
Next Flights: PDX-HNL-OGG-LIH-PDX On AS, WP & HA
 
bhmdiversion
Posts: 271
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2008 2:41 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Fri Sep 09, 2011 12:29 pm

From what I heard, there was also a BIG shakeup from the ACS Station Management side as well... There were some very Senior Manager that were asked to Retire -OR- they were walked out.
 
BCEaglesCO757
Posts: 178
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2011 10:16 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Fri Sep 09, 2011 11:23 pm

Quoting brons2 (Reply 19):
Why? If you haven't violated any policies or anything like that, why would they not consider you for a re-hire? The way you put it sounds more like there was a job performance issue, not a layoff due to economics.

Thats a good question. Generally if you were let go from a position downtown with CO in an office, you could not apply for a job in operations or anywhere at the airport. Or to come back downtown to my knowledge. Somebody on here at CO must be able to confirm this.

When people did usually they knew somebody or knew somebody who knew somebody at the airport,inflight,maintenanace,etc.


I always thought it odd myself. Still don't know why CO did that.
 
FlyASAGuy2005
Posts: 3964
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2007 4:55 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Sat Sep 10, 2011 7:06 am

Quoting bhmdiversion (Reply 22):

Yep. Quite a few station manager positions have become available in the past week. I also know of at least one PL in Atlanta that is now showing as a regular ramp agent in the directory as of yesterday...
What gets measured gets done.
 
swa4life
Posts: 94
Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2009 11:20 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:26 am

Quoting Dalmd88 (Reply 20):
The way these layoffs are handled they are performance based. Say engineering needs to cut two spots. The two lowest performing employees get cut. They might not be bad employees, just the lowest in that group. The next group over might be filled with slackers. The second group's manager might just be better at showing a need for an inflated headcount.

In the end both decent and less than stellar people get let go. At least that is how I've seen it. We heard a few of the names in Tech Ops. For some it was their time. For others we were shocked.

Are you sure it's the lowest performing employees being let go and not the highest earning? Oh the joys of a non-union shop..
 
sgtusmc96
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 3:11 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Sat Sep 10, 2011 9:04 am

What do you mean by that statement swa4life? A union would have no affect on these cuts. These are management jobs, wether we had a union or not would not affect these cuts at all. I do know that two of the managers that we have that were cut were offered technician jobs but chose to retire. So, the company is trying to help where they can some have just chosen not to roll back. If there had been a union I would highly doubt that would have even been an option. Unions aren't the answer to everything and I for one am extremely glad we are not union and don't ever want to be again. I have work both sides, union and non-union and am much happier as non-union.
 
Dalmd88
Posts: 2391
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2000 3:19 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:14 pm

Quoting swa4life (Reply 25):
Are you sure it's the lowest performing employees being let go and not the highest earning? Oh the joys of a non-union shop.

Some of these positions I heard of were non scale stores positions and one was a pretty high up Tech Ops management position. I think he was one step below the VP of Tech Ops. I always liked him. When I hired on he was the Bay manager for my first assignment. Back then he was one of the rocket to the top types. Years later he still chatted with his old crew when ever he walked through the hangar.
 
User avatar
usdcaguy
Posts: 1030
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2004 12:41 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:19 pm

Quoting sgtusmc96 (Reply 26):
These are management jobs, wether we had a union or not would not affect these cuts at all.

Likely not the cuts themselves, but a union may be able to negotiate better severance terms, or at least get upper management to make the employees eligible for rehire, as long as they were in good standing.

Quoting swa4life (Reply 25):
Are you sure it's the lowest performing employees being let go and not the highest earning? Oh the joys of a non-union shop..

...or how can one be sure it wasn't those who were simply unpopular and let go for a list of vague reasons thought of at the last minute? You have no protection without a union and are responsible for making the right people smile at any given time.

Quoting sgtusmc96 (Reply 26):
Unions aren't the answer to everything and I for one am extremely glad we are not union and don't ever want to be again.

Any particular reason why your experience was bad and not beneficial?
 
NWAESC
Posts: 859
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2007 1:02 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:58 pm

Quoting bhmdiversion (Reply 22):
From what I heard, there was also a BIG shakeup from the ACS Station Management side as well... There were some very Senior Manager that were asked to Retire -OR- they were walked out.

Definitely lots of station openings and/or movement lately... I know at least 2 took the early out; I'm sure there were others. There's also been a realignment in Field Directors for ACS, with 2 of them no longer with the company.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
DL747400
Posts: 294
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2008 4:04 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Sat Sep 10, 2011 4:13 pm

Quoting enilria (Reply 1):
Administrators is rather vague. I suspect it means "management".

Personally knowing several individuals who were affected, I can tell you that yes, this means management.
From First to Worst: The history of Airliners.net.

All posts reflect my opinions, not those of my employer or any other company.
 
DL747400
Posts: 294
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2008 4:04 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Sat Sep 10, 2011 4:18 pm

Quoting usdcaguy (Reply 13):
Speaking of which, this is the second round of administrative layoffs Delta has had in the past couple of years. If I remember correctly, there was another one in early 2010. Why so many cuts? Did they retain too many people from the merger? Why is Delta shrinking so much more rapidly than other carriers?

One word: EFFICIENCY. My perception is that they are getting rid of the last of the overlapping positions and redundant personnel created as a result of the NW acquisition. A small percentage of these are also positions made unnecessary by contractual changes, or by technology and automation advances.
From First to Worst: The history of Airliners.net.

All posts reflect my opinions, not those of my employer or any other company.
 
DL747400
Posts: 294
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2008 4:04 pm

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Sat Sep 10, 2011 4:32 pm

Quoting RWA380 (Reply 21):
Funny, they may be running out of all the millions of sky miles Amex gave them as a financial boost back when Amex and Delta inked the deal for the skymiles card.

Well, not exactly....... AMEX didn't "give" DL any SkyMiles and never has. The reality is the other way around. AMEX purchases SkyMiles from DL. And I can tell you that those miles to which you refer in your quote are not only long gone, having been dolled out to Delta SkyMiles credit card holders, but AMEX has since purchased many, many, many more SkyMiles from DL and continues to do so.

I think what you are referring to is the $600 million advance purchase of SkyMiles by AMEX which contributed to the overall liquidity which helped DL successfully navigate the Chapter 11 Reorganization process. This was AMEX making a huge and very public vote of confidence in the future of DL at the time. Certainly, DL made that deal very good for AMEX, but it is without question that this was a core financial piece of what helped DL reorganize and is still enormously appreciated by longtime DL employees.
From First to Worst: The history of Airliners.net.

All posts reflect my opinions, not those of my employer or any other company.
 
SkyPriorityDTW
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 3:48 am

DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Sat Sep 10, 2011 5:02 pm

An above-wing GM and operations/hub control center Corporate Director at DTW were let go in the past few weeks. This is the first *big* cut I've seen since the merger took place.
Keep Climbing...
 
FlyASAGuy2005
Posts: 3964
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2007 4:55 am

RE: DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Sun Sep 11, 2011 3:45 am

Quoting swa4life (Reply 25):

Wrong. These are all non-scale positions to which the unions would have ZERO control over.

Let's keep them out of things for once, please.
What gets measured gets done.
 
Flighty
Posts: 7651
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2007 3:07 am

RE: DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Sun Sep 11, 2011 4:00 am

Quoting DL747400 (Reply 31):
A small percentage of these are also positions made unnecessary by contractual changes, or by technology and automation advances.

Imagine that. Not that DL is a poster child for corporate excellence (not with Ch 11 in its trailing 5 year record... sorry... it's not eligible for any honors). But laying people off is just as important as hiring good people. Sometimes, it's one and the same.

This is why government and the post office are insolvent. They never lay people off to make the organization leaner. Companies do... it sucks sometimes, but it serves a purpose.
 
User avatar
mayor
Posts: 6188
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2008 3:58 pm

RE: DL To Lay Off 200 Administrative Employees

Sun Sep 11, 2011 4:45 am

Quoting Flighty (Reply 35):
Imagine that. Not that DL is a poster child for corporate excellence (not with Ch 11 in its trailing 5 year record... sorry... it's not eligible for any honors). But laying people off is just as important as hiring good people. Sometimes, it's one and the same.

DL's history of employee relations didn't just start in the last 5 years.......you might want to check back further than you have to see how it has been in the past. Also, you might check how DL handled ANY layoffs that they've had. They've done what's possible to reduce the headcount BEFORE they actually had to do any layoffs....i.e. early retirements, leaves of absence, etc. Even those that were actually layed off got some kind of severance from the company, whether it was monetary, travel benefits, etc.


It's funny how CO is lauded for its corporate excellence, when they've had 2 bankruptcies. Why is it ok for them and not DL? Why do you suppose it took all that while before DL ever had to file? Could it be that they were better managed? Ya think? I always thought that DL going into BK was a last ditch effort on their part......they did everything they could to stave off BK before they ever filed. It wasn't something that was taken lightly by management, that's for certain.
"A committee is a group of the unprepared, appointed by the unwilling, to do the unnecessary"----Fred Allen

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: 817Dreamliiner, alski, aviationaware, dk44, euroflyer, Google Adsense [Bot], KarelXWB, LA704, LAX772LR, Ncfc99, qf789, sirtoby, SoJo, springtx, Tvilum, Yahoo [Bot] and 211 guests