Western727
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A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:33 am

Amanda Knox and her family/friends landed in SEA one hour ago on BA49, a 744 flight from LHR after she was acquitted in Italy:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/B...9/history/20111004/1415Z/EGLL/KSEA

My question: I read in the media earlier today that the group got the whole upper deck to themselves. The FAs supposedly prevented others from going upstairs while on the flight. How common is this type of arrangement? That they were able to get the upper deck to themselves with little notice is something. Any insight would be appreciated.

AND...given that this is an aviation form please refrain from discussing the murder case itself; I am only interested in discussing the circumstances of their two flights home: FCO-LHR and LHR-SEA. Thanks in advance.
Jack @ AUS
 
crosswinds21
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:37 am

It is also interesting that the group flew BA given that the victim in the case was British and that many people in the UK apparently believe that A. Knox was guilty (at least based on what I've read). Anyway, there were quite a few options to fly from FCO to LHR with one stop that didn't involve BA (such as LH, AA, etc.) so I wonder why they went with BA.
 
deltairlines
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:38 am

It does make some sense if the flight was not overly full in Club. From a management standpoint, it's easier to do crowd control by keeping people out of a rather secluded area rather than having a crush of people trying to get the first interview during the flight.

If you can keep distractions down, it makes it much easier for the flight crew to do their job rather than dealing with a sideshow.
 
Western727
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:41 am

Quoting crosswinds21 (Reply 1):
there were quite a few options to fly from FCO to LHR with one stop that didn't involve BA (such as LH, AA, etc.) so I wonder why they went with BA.

Now I wonder...perhaps it's because BA offers the only service to SEA from Europe that offers a relatively-small and, more importantly, an easily-isolated section from the rest of the plane...namely the 747 upper deck. LH and DL both use single-level aircraft (330s) to SEA.
Jack @ AUS
 
deltairlines
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:42 am

Quoting crosswinds21 (Reply 1):
It is also interesting that the group flew BA given that the victim in the case was British and that many people in the UK apparently believe that A. Knox was guilty (at least based on what I've read). Anyway, there were quite a few options to fly from FCO to LHR with one stop that didn't involve BA (such as LH, AA, etc.) so I wonder why they went with BA.

Likely due to scheduling. I believe they took a relatively late morning flight out of Rome, which limits options over Europe. Additionally, it's likely they wanted to arrive into Seattle and not connect over the States to try and minimize media coverage here in the States. That limits it to AMS, CDG, FRA and LHR from Seattle. My guess is BA made the most sense logistically from a handling standpoint.

I doubt the fact that she went over London specifically had anything to do with it. They likely went with the most prudent option, which BA seems to be here (that or KLM over Amsterdam). If the most prudent option was CDG or another airport, I'm sure it would have been chosen.
 
jfk777
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:44 am

Surprised they didn't fly nonstop from Rome to JFK then to SEA.
 
Viscount724
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:54 am

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 5):
Surprised they didn't fly nonstop from Rome to JFK then to SEA.

Why do that when it's much faster and more convenient to connect in Europe and take a nonstop to SEA than to connect at an east coast US airport, especially JFK which is one of the most delay-prone airports in the US. FCO-LHR-SEA is almost 900 nm shorter than FCO-JFK-SEA. In flying time alone that's a saving of at least 2 hours.
 
deltairlines
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:11 am

Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 6):
Why do that when it's much faster and more convenient to connect in Europe and take a nonstop to SEA than to connect at an east coast US airport, especially JFK which is one of the most delay-prone airports in the US. FCO-LHR-SEA is almost 900 nm shorter than FCO-JFK-SEA. In flying time alone that's a saving of at least 2 hours.

Not to mention from a PR handling perspective, she'd be "welcomed" to the States upon getting off at JFK. At least at Heathrow, it's an airside transfer, so no seeing the British media there and then allows them to control the press more upon a return at Seattle.
 
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notaxonrotax
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:36 am

Cold question: who paid for the whole upperdeck?
Is it business class?

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qf002
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:50 am

Quoting notaxonrotax (Reply 8):
Cold question: who paid for the whole upperdeck?

Nobody I'm guessing -- they just didn't fill the additional seats. I imagine the seats for those seated up there were paid for by the family -- they're hardly going to be short of money over the next little while.

As for my opinion on this -- why not? It keeps the media furor down, it gives paying passengers a quieter and less disrupted trip, makes the job of the crew that much easier and allows this particular passenger (guilty or not) some peace and quiet on her trip home. In any case, I doubt that J is packed flying LHR to SEA so I doubt that this move actually cost the airline any money in lost fares -- it might have annoyed one or two pax who enjoy the upper deck but that's all.
 
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 4:46 am

I also noticed than when the 744 was taxiing to the gate at SEA that there was only a winglet on the right wing. Is that a normal occurence?
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gunsontheroof
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 5:13 am

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 5):
Surprised they didn't fly nonstop from Rome to JFK then to SEA.

Initial rumors indicated that this was the case. As far as I know, the fact that she was on a BA flight didn't surface until the plane arrived at SEA. I saw BA49 approaching final today and had no idea that it was the "celebrity" flight at the time...
 
RamblinMan
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 6:09 am

Quoting Gunsontheroof (Reply 13):
Initial rumors indicated that this was the case. As far as I know, the fact that she was on a BA flight didn't surface until the plane arrived at SEA.

No, it was well-known what flight she was on. There were even some pictures this morning of her party transferring at LHR. British news site whose name I can't recall.
 
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jetjack74
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 6:42 am

The Telegraph reported her trip through LHR late last night
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nighthawk
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 7:35 am

Quoting RamblinMan (Reply 15):
No, it was well-known what flight she was on. There were even some pictures this morning of her party transferring at LHR. British news site whose name I can't recall.

It was indeed well known, at least here in the UK. It was on the BBC Radio 1 news all day that she was flying through Heathrow, even before her flight had left Rome.
 
Jamake1
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 7:46 am

I believe the upper deck on BA is World Traveler (Economy) is it not?

Traveling via a connection over a European hub is much more preferable than having to clear customs at the first point of entry into the U.S.
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Upperdeck
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 7:56 am

Quoting jamake1 (Reply 18):
I believe the upper deck on BA is World Traveler (Economy) is it not?

Nope...all Club World.
 
Eagleboy
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 9:01 am

Quoting DeltAirlines (Reply 2):
It does make some sense if the flight was not overly full in Club. From a management standpoint, it's easier to do crowd control by keeping people out of a rather secluded area .............
If you can keep distractions down, it makes it much easier for the flight crew to do their job rather than dealing with a sideshow.

This is the correct answer. BA would want to keep her presence discreet onboard so I'm sure a mgnr/supervisor was smart enough to keep other seats in that area free.
 
nclmedic
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 9:12 am

Quoting Gunsontheroof (Reply 13):
Initial rumors indicated that this was the case. As far as I know, the fact that she was on a BA flight didn't surface until the plane arrived at SEA. I saw BA49 approaching final today and had no idea that it was the "celebrity" flight at the time...

This just isn't true! I suppose the time difference means much of the overnight media coverage in the USA was missed, but there was lots of footage of Amanda et al boarding through the BA gate at FCO, and then transferring at LHR. Seeing as there's only 1 flight from LHR to SEA from T5, it was always going to be BA49.

In terms of the organisation of the whole trip, I still very much doubt this was all booked online at BA.com and the whole party turned up for normal check-in. She has a fairly high profile PR team who would have been talking through their options overnight with BA. If the flight was already rammed full they may well have taken another carrier.
 
Bongodog1964
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 9:43 am

I would doubt there were many seats left on the upper deck once the Knox party had boarded. She seemed to be accompanied by a fairly sizeable entourage, enough to take the majority of the 20 seats upstairs. BA won't have been doing this for the publicity, as far as the UK media is concerned we only saw fleeting glimpses, enough for aviation enthusiasts to know who the carrier was, but no sight of tailplanes etc.

Is LHR - SEA normally flown with Mid J or Hi J ? if its usually Mid J, they might have swapped planes in order to provide more J seats. This of course would only work if WT was underbooked.
 
JEKY
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 10:26 am

Side toughts:

apart from all the guessing on who paid what for her flight home, how comes she obtained new passport (old beeing expired) in just 2/3 hours at FCO (according to the media), when we have to wait the holy bible time for ours to be renewed here in Italy?
All in all it smells of another mess from italian autorithies....
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dellatorre
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:13 am

Quoting JEKY (Reply 23):

Side toughts:

apart from all the guessing on who paid what for her flight home, how comes she obtained new passport (old beeing expired) in just 2/3 hours at FCO (according to the media), when we have to wait the holy bible time for ours to be renewed here in Italy?
All in all it smells of another mess from italian autorithies....

Oh please don't be so naive....Do you really think a simple passport would be stopping her show... Awaiting Amanda Knox in the next season of Dancing with the stars.....
 
ordbosewr
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:14 am

Quoting JEKY (Reply 23):
apart from all the guessing on who paid what for her flight home, how comes she obtained new passport (old beeing expired) in just 2/3 hours at FCO (according to the media), when we have to wait the holy bible time for ours to be renewed here in Italy?

The passport would have been issued by the US Embassy, given she is a US citizen. Given the high profile nature of the case the US embassy would have put a rush on the request and it can be done very quickly if they need or want it to be.
I am guessing that the request for the passport was made immediately following the verdict announcement (by other members of the Knox family or support team). This would have given the embassy overnight to do what needed to be done with the italian authorities.
 
gunsontheroof
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:26 am

Quoting RamblinMan (Reply 15):
No, it was well-known what flight she was on. There were even some pictures this morning of her party transferring at LHR. British news site whose name I can't recall.
Quoting nclmedic (Reply 21):
This just isn't true! I suppose the time difference means much of the overnight media coverage in the USA was missed, but there was lots of footage of Amanda et al boarding through the BA gate at FCO, and then transferring at LHR. Seeing as there's only 1 flight from LHR to SEA from T5, it was always going to be BA49.

I spent most of the early part of this week working overnight. What little information about this that I acquired indicated that A. Knox was flying FCO-JFK-SEA, though all the stories I read were breaking at the time and have since been updated rather than archived. It was false information, but I assure all of you that it was out there for some time early Tuesday morning. I didn't realize that BA49 was the flight we're talking about here until several hours ago...I've seen that plane come into SEA for most of my life and didn't think anything of it until I had a chance to check the news. You're both correct, but I assure you that there was misleading information printed in the local press yesterday that has since been revised.
 
dfambro
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:28 am

Quoting JEKY (Reply 23):
apart from all the guessing on who paid what for her flight home, how comes she obtained new passport (old beeing expired) in just 2/3 hours at FCO (according to the media), when we have to wait the holy bible time for ours to be renewed here in Italy?

If she obtained/renewed her US passport prior to her study abroad trip, then it's got ~6 years left before expiration.
 
elmothehobo
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 12:00 pm

Quoting JEKY (Reply 23):
apart from all the guessing on who paid what for her flight home, how comes she obtained new passport (old beeing expired) in just 2/3 hours at FCO (according to the media), when we have to wait the holy bible time for ours to be renewed here in Italy?

You can get an emergency passport same day. IIRC it does not have the biometrics that the new permanent passports have, and it's laminated rather than printed onto that special paper.
 
Bongodog1964
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 12:06 pm

It was known in advance that the verdict was expected on Monday, due to the high profile of the case the US consulate will have been involved in the case all along. if there were a need for a new passport this would surely have been highlighted earlier (or ought to have been) Does being in gaol stop you from renewing your passport ?

As to the flight routing confusion, was this just a case of sloppy journalism ? Instead of checking facts much of the media seems to work on the principle that if you can read it somewhere else it must be true and ok to print. I can see that the US media might well assume that a US citizen travelling under these circumstances would automatically choose a US airline, look to see what flights fitted, and the next thing its transmitted as fact.
 
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notaxonrotax
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 12:24 pm

Sorry to bang on about this, but sending 20+ people Business Class; WHO on earth paid for that?
Please correct me, but we're talking US$ 35.000+ here, probably a lot more.

The Knox-family apparently mortgaged all they own; up to the dog-house in the yard......
They went over budget for a 4 year Italian language course; shall we say.
"Rosetta" would have been more economic.
Yet they fly home business??

Something doesn't add up......

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Bongodog1964
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 12:53 pm

Quoting notaxonrotax (Reply 30):
Sorry to bang on about this, but sending 20+ people Business Class; WHO on earth paid for that?
Please correct me, but we're talking US$ 35.000+ here, probably a lot more.

The Knox-family apparently mortgaged all they own; up to the dog-house in the yard......
They went over budget for a 4 year Italian language course; shall we say.
"Rosetta" would have been more economic.
Yet they fly home business??

Something doesn't add up......

Unless Italian justice is unlike here in the UK, the prosecution will now have to pick up the Knox family legaL bills. In addition the media here has already mentioned quite astronomical sums of money for wrongful imprisonment. Then we have the amount the family will sell their story for.

When the media have an exclusive deal with a family, they usually pull out all the stops to ensure that the exclusive stays exclusive. Bearing this in mind, one of the US media giants was probably picking up the bill. If they have paid $1m for the story, £35k on clubworld is small change. They wouldnt want to run the risk of a journalist from a competitor making a last minute reservation for an adjacent seat would they ? hence booking the entire upper deck. Private jet privacy at scheduled prices.

The shots at LHR showed the family coming down steps from the airbridge straight onto a bus for the transfer, so no walk through the terminal and press interviews there either.
 
BRJ
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 12:57 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 5):
Surprised they didn't fly nonstop from Rome to JFK then to SEA.
Quoting Viscount724 (Reply 6):
Why do that when it's much faster and more convenient to connect in Europe and take a nonstop to SEA than to connect at an east coast US airport, especially JFK which is one of the most delay-prone airports in the US. FCO-LHR-SEA is almost 900 nm shorter than FCO-JFK-SEA. In flying time alone that's a saving of at least 2 hours.


Transit in Europe makes complete sense, as she would not have had to clear immigration and customs until she arrived in Seattle. A transfer at JFK would have resulted in both these formalities and offering exposure to media in the arrivals hall during transit, correct?

Quoting notaxonrotax (Reply 30):
Sorry to bang on about this, but sending 20+ people Business Class; WHO on earth paid for that?
Please correct me, but we're talking US$ 35.000+ here, probably a lot more.


Do we know if she actually had 20+ people traveling with her though? Could have just been 5 or 6 of her family, and as others have said, BA could have made the decision to section off the upper deck for privacy and to avoid possible confrontation with other passengers.

As for who paid for the tickets...
Given the acquittal, the Italian gov't, though highly unlikely?
Or maybe whichever media outlet she has promised her first interview? (This could be a real possibility)
Or a big name celeb or politician who has believed in her innocence? I imagine it could be a number of different scenarios.
 
qf002
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:01 pm

Quoting notaxonrotax (Reply 30):

Sorry to bang on about this, but sending 20+ people Business Class; WHO on earth paid for that?
Please correct me, but we're talking US$ 35.000+ here, probably a lot more.

The Knox-family apparently mortgaged all they own; up to the dog-house in the yard......
They went over budget for a 4 year Italian language course; shall we say.
"Rosetta" would have been more economic.
Yet they fly home business??

Something doesn't add up......

Agreed... I guess it's important to consider first that she will be a multimillionaire by the end of the month. The US Authorities would probably also have been involved in security details and arranging everything -- they are probably involved in some way either footing the bill for their men or more...It could also possibly be the Italian Authorities footing the bill.
 
Bongodog1964
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:07 pm

Google is our friend !!

Who released the Amanda Knox story with exclusive interviews with the family a few months back - answer ABC. Good chance they received the ticket invoice.
 
flyingdoctorwu
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:10 pm

I read somewhere that there was an offer from many media companies of a private plane for the return flight.. But that the Knoxes turned it down...

In fact, according to the prosecutor, Giuliano Mignini, the Knoxes has a private jet ready to whisk her back to the states.

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/213661/Amanda-Knox-s-jet-deal-/

I think BA has been the Knoxes airline of choice. They apparently have a friend who helped provide standby tickets for the frequent flights...

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...news/2016396416_amandaknox04m.html

FDW
 
bjorn14
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:23 pm

It could be as simple as BA wanting to avoid a circus and updgraded them to the upper deck.
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BA174
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:41 pm

Quoting crosswinds21 (Reply 1):

It is also interesting that the group flew BA given that the victim in the case was British and that many people in the UK apparently believe that A. Knox was guilty (at least based on what I've read). Anyway, there were quite a few options to fly from FCO to LHR with one stop that didn't involve BA (such as LH, AA, etc.) so I wonder why they went with BA.


Most people in the UK seem to think she is guilty. Which person who is sane cartweels through police stations when they have just been arrested for murder? BA would have gained more publicity for refusing to carry her. Having her close to the flight deck door on the UD worries me.
 
jfk777
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:42 pm

Quoting Gunsontheroof (Reply 13):
Initial rumors indicated that this was the case. As far as I know, the fact that she was on a BA flight didn't surface until the plane arrived at SEA. I saw BA49 approaching final today and had no idea that it was the "celebrity" flight at the time...

Transiting the UK with a murdered Brit in this case could have lead to her arrest in LHR if a UK warrant was out for her. Transiting JFK to SEA is a pain but once she left FCO she would have been on US soil, avoiding the possible "surprise" in London. I will take JFK's pain given those circumstances.

Quoting ORDBOSEWR (Reply 25):
The passport would have been issued by the US Embassy, given she is a US citizen. Given the high profile nature of the case the US embassy would have put a rush on the request and it can be done very quickly if they need or want it to be.
I am guessing that the request for the passport was made immediately following the verdict announcement (by other members of the Knox family or support team). This would have given the embassy overnight to do what needed to be done with the italian authorities.

She probably had her orignal passport fro when she left. Even if she was in an Italian prison would that have stopped the State Department from issuing her a new passport while the Italian court sorted all this out ? In all the press this case has received I have never heard of the US Government trying to influence the case or exert influence. Nothing ever came out of President Obama or Hilary Clinton's mouth saying " free Amanda this is a travesty of justice". They kept quiet.
 
airbazar
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:46 pm

Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 22):
BA won't have been doing this for the publicity, as far as the UK media is concerned we only saw fleeting glimpses, enough for aviation enthusiasts to know who the carrier was, but no sight of tailplanes etc.

Really? You think BA is only interested in publicity in the UK?
I guarantee you BA bent over backwards to accomodate her and her party on the upper deck, most likely even at a heavy discount, if not totally free, especially if they were not fully booked. What's $35K in publicity for a company like BA? Peanuts. I bet every airline was clamoring to be the one flying her back.

Quoting JEKY (Reply 23):
apart from all the guessing on who paid what for her flight home, how comes she obtained new passport (old beeing expired) in just 2/3 hours at FCO (according to the media), when we have to wait the holy bible time for ours to be renewed here in Italy?

Well, one thing was clear from this whole circus is that Italy is not really a model of efficiency   
It took me only 3 days to renew my Portuguese passport. I would be shocked if she didn't already have a new passport waiting for her the minute she was freed.
 
bojangles
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:58 pm

My understanding is that neither Knox nor Solecitto are entitled to any meaningful compensation for wrongful conviction, unless it can be proved that the prosecution was found to be maliciously motivated. I guess in the US, as in the UK, she could be entitled to large compensation. But then in the US, she could well have been on Death Row for 15 to 20 years. Frankly, I applaud Italy for rather swiftly rectifying a miscarriage of justice. Remember, three of the four years she served are for the upheld charge of serious slander against Patrick Lumumba.
 
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SOBHI51
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:01 pm

She could have been issued one of this, it only take a picture and a stamp.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Travel_document


A laissez-passer (from the French let pass) is a travel document issued by a national government or certain international organizations, such as the United Nations, European Union and the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC). A laissez-passer is often for one-way travel to the issuing country for humanitarian reasons only. Some national governments issue laissez-passers to their own nationals as emergency passports. Others issue them to people who are stateless, or who are unable to obtain a passport from their own government, or whose government is not recognized by the issuing country.
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vv701
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:10 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 5):
Surprised they didn't fly nonstop from Rome to JFK then to SEA.

That would have been a total wasete of time and probably more costly.

BA553 FCO-LHR is scheduled at LHR at 1330. BA49 LHR-SEA has a scheduled departure time of 1435. So only 65 minutes on the ground at LHR.

The great circle route FCO-LHR-SEA is (899 + 4,800) 5,699 miles. Compare this with FCO-JFK-SEA (4,277 + 2,421) 6,698 miles. At almost exactly 1.000 miles longer the flying time through JFK would likely be around 150 minutes longer. I also assume that a flight 999 miles or more than 17 per cent further is likely to be of the order of 17 per cent more expensive.

If you go to the Great Circle Mapper at

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=fco-sea

you will see that the logical intermediate points for this journey are LHR followed by AMS. JFK is simply just a huge diversion.
 
bojangles
Posts: 41
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:16 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 38):
Transiting the UK with a murdered Brit in this case could have lead to her arrest in LHR if a UK warrant was out for her.

Er, but there was no such warrant issued. She was acquitted of murder, in the country where she was accused of committing the crime.
 
bralo20
Posts: 435
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:30 pm

Quoting BA174 (Reply 37):
Most people in the UK seem to think she is guilty. Which person who is sane cartweels through police stations when they have just been arrested for murder? BA would have gained more publicity for refusing to carry her. Having her close to the flight deck door on the UD worries me.

There is somewhere on the internet a quite resonable story about her online. About how she acted, etc... You may forget that she was 20 at the time being and that she was innocent (wetter one likes to believe it or not, this is wat the court said after her acquittal, they acquitted her and her ex-boyfriend because they didn't commit the crime they were charged with). Apparently she believed in the justice system and that all would be cleared very shortly so she had nothing to worry. Which clearly didn't happen until last monday. Yes cartweeling may be a little over the top but I've seen people doing stranger things, even in a police station.

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 38):

Transiting the UK with a murdered Brit in this case could have lead to her arrest in LHR if a UK warrant was out for her. Transiting JFK to SEA is a pain but once she left FCO she would have been on US soil, avoiding the possible "surprise" in London. I will take JFK's pain given those circumstances.

There isn't and wasn't an UK warrant for her arrest. Even though a Brit was involved as a victim, they could originally only been an Italian arrest warrant and an European/worldwide arrest warrant. Great-Brittain couldn't issue an arrest warrant for a crime that didn't happen on British soil. Any arrest warant originaly issued would have been revoked the moment she was arrested. After her acquittal there wasn't any reason for an arrest warrant. Yes she was convicted for slander but she did serve this sentence in full, so again, no reason for an arrest warrant. So she could safely fly any carrier or even transfer through any country of choice.

Quoting brj (Reply 32):
As for who paid for the tickets...
Given the acquittal, the Italian gov't, though highly unlikely?

Considering that she can start a case against the Italian state and get 500.000 EUR for wrongfull imprisonment the chance exists that Italy indeed paid "with a smile" to have everything go away. Legally they have to pay all fees for this trial (except for the 22.000 EUR? of the slander case) thus this can include airtravel (though I doubt any government would pay premium tickets). But more likely either the family paid for themself or anybody else paid the bill. But does it really matter? Even if they got the tickets for free (which is btw also a posibility, you never know that BA had a deal with the family or that the family travelled during those 4 years exclusively with BA and had enough points/miles to get award tickets), it doesn't matter. Amanda Knox is now back at home after 4 years wrongfull imprisonment and that's one of the most important parts... Another important part is that -maybe- accomplices of the crime are still fugitive and that Meredith family still doesn't have any closure...

Quoting nighthawk (Reply 17):
It was indeed well known, at least here in the UK. It was on the BBC Radio 1 news all day that she was flying through Heathrow, even before her flight had left Rome.

Affirmative, it was all over the news quite soon, including flightnumbers.
 
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Plainplane
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:32 pm

Quoting notaxonrotax (Reply 28):
Sorry to bang on about this, but sending 20+ people Business Class; WHO on earth paid for that?
Please correct me, but we're talking US$ 35.000+ here, probably a lot more.

The Knox-family apparently mortgaged all they own; up to the dog-house in the yard......
They went over budget for a 4 year Italian language course; shall we say.
"Rosetta" would have been more economic.
Yet they fly home business??

Something doesn't add up......

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On CNN the other day, Donald Trump said he had been providing the Knox family with financial support, so could have something to do with it I think.
 
vv701
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:38 pm

Quoting jfk777 (Reply 38):
Transiting the UK with a murdered Brit in this case could have lead to her arrest in LHR if a UK warrant was out for her.

The British courts have no jurisdiction over crimes committed outside the UK. The only circumstances that could have resulted in her being arrested at LHR were if the Italian authorities had issued an extradition warrant requesting her return to Italy. On past form such an application would have taken between nine months and a year to be processed through the British legal system.

As an aside that illustrates the above point two British citizens married in the UK and went on honeymoon to South Africa. The bride was murdered. The South African authorities accused the husband of arranging the murder. By that time he had returned to the UK.

Just before Christmas last year the South African authorities issued an extradition request for the British husband accused of arranging the murder of his British wife in South Africa (where British courts have no jurisdiction) to b e returned to South Africa.

The British corts have authorised the extradition on the basis of evidence supplied by the South African authorities. The British Home Secretary has endorsed the court's findings:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...Shrien-Dewani-to-South-Africa.html

Now we are awaiting the husband's appeal. If he is extradited it looks as if it will be more than a year after extradition was requested.
 
Grid
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Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 4:26 am

RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 2:48 pm

Quoting JEKY (Reply 20):
apart from all the guessing on who paid what for her flight home, how comes she obtained new passport (old beeing expired) in just 2/3 hours at FCO (according to the media), when we have to wait the holy bible time for ours to be renewed here in Italy?
All in all it smells of another mess from italian autorithies....
Quoting ORDBOSEWR (Reply 22):
The passport would have been issued by the US Embassy, given she is a US citizen. Given the high profile nature of the case the US embassy would have put a rush on the request and it can be done very quickly if they need or want it to be.
I am guessing that the request for the passport was made immediately following the verdict announcement (by other members of the Knox family or support team). This would have given the embassy overnight to do what needed to be done with the italian authorities.

Why couldn't it have been done in advance, as soon as her old one was expired? Is being incarcerated in a foreign prison some sort of a impediment to that? You still have access to consular officials (unless you are in Texas and they really want to execute you).

Quoting notaxonrotax (Reply 27):
Sorry to bang on about this, but sending 20+ people Business Class; WHO on earth paid for that?
Please correct me, but we're talking US$ 35.000+ here, probably a lot more.

The Knox-family apparently mortgaged all they own; up to the dog-house in the yard......
They went over budget for a 4 year Italian language course; shall we say.
"Rosetta" would have been more economic.
Yet they fly home business??

Something doesn't add up......

The Italians paid several million to the victim's family members; it would not be a stretch to think that they paid for the Knox entourage flight home, given that it was their incompetence and bumbling that led Knox to spend a few years in prison.
ATR72 E120 E140 E170 E190 Q200 717 727 737 747 757 767 777 A319 A320 A321 A330 A340 MD11 MD82 MD83 MD88 MD90
 
usafret
Posts: 26
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RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:28 pm

I applaud them for having privacy from everyone else, less disturbance for the other passengers. I worked passport issues at a military base and the Embassy's "Consul" can issue a passport in just a few hours, even from scratch. Not sure of all the hubbub about the flight, etc., I'm sure BAA and TSA preferred a low profile and avoiding JFK was smart.
 
qf002
Posts: 3083
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2011 11:14 am

RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:43 pm

Does anyone know which flight the party took from FCO-LHR? I imagine that they curtained off the front of the plane in Club or something? (We've had very little coverage of this story here in Australia so it's probably an obvious question for most who have seen footage?)
 
777ord
Posts: 677
Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 12:04 pm

RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:48 pm

Not that it may make a difference. But, does anyone know what seat she sat in/ tail number? It'd be kind of interesting to be that next guy to sit in her seat without knowing it. Just a thought.
 
janmnastami
Posts: 379
Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 3:49 pm

RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 4:02 pm

The Italian press reported that she had standby tickets, requested by a friend that works for BA.

Quoting JEKY (Reply 20):
Side toughts:

apart from all the guessing on who paid what for her flight home, how comes she obtained new passport (old beeing expired) in just 2/3 hours at FCO (according to the media), when we have to wait the holy bible time for ours to be renewed here in Italy?
All in all it smells of another mess from italian autorithies....

Italian authorities can release a passport in a few hours, if it's urgent. The ordinary procedure obviously takes more time. Moreover, Knox's passport was released by U.S. authorities, not by the Italian ones.

Quoting Grid (Reply 44):
The Italians paid several million to the victim's family members

?
 
qf002
Posts: 3083
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2011 11:14 am

RE: A. Knox Flight Home; Took Up Whole 744 Upper Deck?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 4:10 pm

Quoting 777ord (Reply 47):
Not that it may make a difference. But, does anyone know what seat she sat in/ tail number? It'd be kind of interesting to be that next guy to sit in her seat without knowing it. Just a thought.

Aircraft was G-BNLK, I doubt we'll ever know the seat...

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