ikramerica
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What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 9:35 pm

Just wondering if anyone has the inside skinny on what NH (ANA) has been doing with the 787. Have they been running training flights, using it to train maintenance workers, etc.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
mffoda
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 10:27 pm

Might not be exactly the next place the 787 goes... But, you asked news.  

From the street.com

"Mark the day -- Saturday, Jan. 21, 2012. That's when the first commercial European flight by the Boeing 787 will arrive in Frankfurt."

http://www.thestreet.com/story/11269...-dreamliner-heads-for-germany.html
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ikramerica
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 10:35 pm

Quoting mffoda (Reply 1):
Might not be exactly the next place the 787 goes... But, you asked news.

No, this really is not what I'm interested in at all. Nor is it anywhere on topic.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
mffoda
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:35 pm

Quoting ikramerica (Reply 2):

Just trying to be helpful    ...
harder than woodpecker lips...
 
Carpethead
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 3:10 am

I am pretty much sure it’s not just sitting at Haneda idly. There haven’t been reports of the 787 flying around Japan, yet so all the engineers at ANA are tinkering with all the new features.
 
PM
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 4:07 am

I was at Haneda twice on Monday and looked hard for it. But no sign.  

Good news is that I'll almost certainly be flying on it next month!
 
koruman
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 4:44 am

Do we know what its actual range is? I keep hearing stories that it has massively under-performed, but do they have any veracity?
 
KPDX
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 4:50 am

Quoting PM (Reply 5):
I was at Haneda twice on Monday and looked hard for it. But no sign.  

Good news is that I'll almost certainly be flying on it next month!

Shame you couldn't see it, but I'm sure you'll enjoy listening to the music of those new Rolls-Royce Trent 1000s on your flight!   
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PM
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 5:47 am

Quoting KPDX (Reply 7):
I'm sure you'll enjoy listening to the music of those new Rolls-Royce Trent 1000s

Oh yes!   
 
zkeoj
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 8:10 am

Quoting PM (Reply 5):
Good news is that I'll almost certainly be flying on it next month!

me too - YAY! Can't wait!

Re topic: I assume that crews and tech staff get familiarised with it on the ground, before the first internal test/comemrcial flights.  

Cheers
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Revelation
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:13 pm

Quoting ZKEOJ (Reply 9):
Re topic: I assume that crews and tech staff get familiarised with it on the ground, before the first internal test/comemrcial flights.

And enjoying the "new car smell" before the pax come along and mess everything up! 
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EK413
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:38 pm

Quoting ikramerica (Thread starter):
Just wondering if anyone has the inside skinny on what NH (ANA) has been doing with the 787.

Sorry for asking but I've away for 2 weeks... Has NH taken delivery of the long awaited B787???

EK413
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drerx7
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 1:09 pm

Quoting EK413 (Reply 11):
Sorry for asking but I've away for 2 weeks... Has NH taken delivery of the long awaited B787???

Away as in off the grid or planet? Yes is the answer to your question.
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EK413
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 1:48 pm

Quoting Drerx7 (Reply 12):
Away as in off the grid or planet? Yes is the answer to your question.

Away as in holidaying or VACATION as the Americans call it  

Cheers...

EK413
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
JAAlbert
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 2:28 pm

When does ANA get its second 787? And who else gets them this year? Anybody?

Does Boeing have staff assisting ANA during the familiarization period, or is ANA on its own from this point forward?
 
fpetrutiu
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 5:54 pm

Quoting koruman (Reply 6):
Do we know what its actual range is? I keep hearing stories that it has massively under-performed, but do they have any veracity?

It made it to Japan, didn't it? LOL

Quoting JAAlbert (Reply 14):
Does Boeing have staff assisting ANA during the familiarization period, or is ANA on its own from this point forward?

I believe it's the 16th or something like that.
 
jacobin777
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 6:25 pm

Quoting koruman (Reply 6):
Do we know what its actual range is? I keep hearing stories that it has massively under-performed, but do they have any veracity?

I'm hearing even the "massively under-performing" frames will be more efficient than its closest competitors. Hearing lots of good stuff about the plane..  
"Up the Irons!"
 
KELPkid
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 6:34 pm

Quoting fpetrutiu (Reply 15):

It made it to Japan, didn't it? LOL

I'm sure a 737 could do it with no pax and no cargo and full tanks   How often do airliners get to do that, though...
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fpetrutiu
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 7:44 pm

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 17):
I'm sure a 737 could do it with no pax and no cargo and full tanks How often do airliners get to do that, though...

It made it to Japan on full load as well before. The test flight to Japan was simulating ETOPS with full load as well.
 
ha763
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 9:30 pm

Quoting KELPkid (Reply 17):
I'm sure a 737 could do it with no pax and no cargo and full tanks How often do airliners get to do that, though...

If a regular 737NG could, it would be doing it on every delivery flight for ANA and JAL. However, it cannot so they stop off in Alaska or Hawaii. Probably the only 737s that did fly non-stop to Japan from Seattle were the 737-700ERs that ANA ordered.
 
canoecarrier
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 10:20 pm

Quoting ZKEOJ (Reply 9):
me too - YAY! Can't wait!

You two should get together and do a trip report.

Quoting fpetrutiu (Reply 18):
It made it to Japan on full load as well before. The test flight to Japan was simulating ETOPS with full load as well.

Were they ANA employees or Boeing employees? None of the 787 program people I know have a recent passport stamp from Japan that I know of.
The beatings will continue until morale improves
 
dave2
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 10:31 pm

The plan that NH announced was they would be doing training, test hops, etc. till the planned first scheduled flight. I would assume that Boeing would get there if there was some kind of problem.
 
PM
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Thu Oct 06, 2011 11:50 pm

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 16):
I'm hearing even the "massively under-performing" frames will be more efficient than its closest competitors.

Well, one would rather hope so. After all, wasn't that the point?

I doubt, however, that early customers will be much consoled by that. These early-builds are not what they originally signed for.
 
jacobin777
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Fri Oct 07, 2011 12:14 am

Quoting PM (Reply 24):
I doubt, however, that early customers will be much consoled by that. These early-builds are not what they originally signed for.

Probably not, but that's the risk one takes and early customers are probably going to be compensated for it.

Quoting PM (Reply 24):
Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 16):
I'm hearing even the "massively under-performing" frames will be more efficient than its closest competitors.

Well, one would rather hope so. After all, wasn't that the point?

The point was for the B787 "on spec" or "close to spec" to be the so-called "game changer". The fact its a bit out of spec in terms of weight and SFC yet performing "well" on multiple levels is good news for the program.
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PM
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Fri Oct 07, 2011 12:34 am

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 25):
Probably not, but that's the risk one takes and early customers are probably going to be compensated for it.

True enough.

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 25):
The point was for the B787 "on spec" or "close to spec" to be the so-called "game changer". The fact its a bit out of spec in terms of weight and SFC yet performing "well" on multiple levels is good news for the program.

Oh, I think the 'program' is, at last, getting back on track and I've never doubted the long-term success of the plane. Doubtless, airlines will love it.

I just find it mildly amusing that we're invited to celebrate the fact that after all this time - and almost three and a half years late - Boeing have managed to deliver a plane that isn't worse than the A330-200!  
Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 16):
I'm hearing even the "massively under-performing" frames will be more efficient than its closest competitors.
 
KELPkid
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Fri Oct 07, 2011 1:29 am

To answer the original question:

I believe Japan requires actual time in type for their pilots, as opposed to pure sim time, so I would imagine that NH's check airmen (who most likely checked out with Boeing's pilots and instructors) are probably getting the first batch of 787 pilots through their differences training (if Japan allows the common 777/787 type rating) or even through the 787 type rating if Japan is going to require a separate type rating for the 787.

Lots of assumptions here, so correct me if I'm wrong...  
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fpetrutiu
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Fri Oct 07, 2011 2:44 am

Quoting canoecarrier (Reply 22):
Were they ANA employees or Boeing employees? None of the 787 program people I know have a recent passport stamp from Japan that I know of.

No, water bottles... They simulate loads with containers filled with water. Like so:

 
jacobin777
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Fri Oct 07, 2011 3:01 am

Quoting PM (Reply 26):
I just find it mildly amusing that we're invited to celebrate the fact that after all this time - and almost three and a half years late - Boeing have managed to deliver a plane that isn't worse than the A330-200!

I think it has hurt Boeing's credibility quite a bit. Not to mention, has put a "dent" on their plans (such as launching the NSA project).

At least the plane is out there.  
"Up the Irons!"
 
starrion
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Fri Oct 07, 2011 3:48 am

Quoting fpetrutiu (Reply 28):
Quoting canoecarrier (Reply 22):
Were they ANA employees or Boeing employees? None of the 787 program people I know have a recent passport stamp from Japan that I know of.

No, water bottles... They simulate loads with containers filled with water. Like so:

That's a test config though. The delivered aircraft has a full interior. ANA wouldn't pull out the interior to rerig the plane to simulate load.

If they just wanted to simulate passenger load, I would expect they would use employees or put weights on the seats.

If it were my airline, I would have every seat filled with an employee testing every aspect of the aircraft to ferret out problems before I put it into service.
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PM
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Fri Oct 07, 2011 4:40 am

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 29):
At least the plane is out there.

        

An' I'm gonna be on it next month!   
 
jacobin777
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Fri Oct 07, 2011 4:50 am

Quoting PM (Reply 31):
An' I'm gonna be on it next month!


Grrrrrrrrrrr-lucky you......  
"Up the Irons!"
 
fpetrutiu
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RE: What's NH Been Doing With Their 787 So Far?

Fri Oct 07, 2011 12:00 pm

Quoting starrion (Reply 28):
That's a test config though. The delivered aircraft has a full interior. ANA wouldn't pull out the interior to rerig the plane to simulate load.

I know, not the same aircraft demonstrated range. It was the test aircrafts and the second ANA plane, the one that visited Japan previously.

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