Gonzalo
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CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Fri Oct 14, 2011 1:32 pm

During an interview in the handover ceremony for their first A380 at Tolouse, the chairman of CZ stated that they will only use the aircraft in the domestic routes between Shanghai, Beijing and Guangzhou.
Later he said "the A380 will help us to improve our competitiveness on international routes"....

Can someone please clarify how, when and where this airline will use the A380 ??

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/art...uthern-receives-first-a380-363431/


Rgds.

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Stitch
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Fri Oct 14, 2011 1:36 pm

Quoting Gonzalo (Thread starter):
Can someone please clarify how, when and where this airline will use the A380?

CZ will need time to familiarize pilots, cabin crew and ground staff with the plane, so the easiest way to do that is fly a lot of short hops. That way, when they receive additional planes, everyone is ready for long-haul missions.

SQ did the same (SIN-SYD) as did AF (CDG-LHR) with their first A380 before they sent them on long-haul missions.
 
mogandoCI
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Fri Oct 14, 2011 1:57 pm

Quoting Stitch (Reply 1):
SQ did the same (SIN-SYD)

SIN-SYD is nearly 450 miles longer than JFK-LHR ... that's a fair bit more than a "short hop", but your point holds for AF
 
LondonCity
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:01 pm

Quoting Stitch (Reply 1):
as did AF (CDG-LHR) with their first A380 before they sent them on long-haul missions.

AF was already operating its A380 on long-haul routes before it rostered the super jumbo for LHR-CDG. But, I agree, the idea of LHR-CDG was to speed up crew training and showcase its long-haul product to the UK market.
 
330lover
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:13 pm

On their website, they show a seat map of the 380 with 4 classes. So far nothing strange.

But then they call them: Economy Class, Premium Economy, First Class and Luxurious First Class...
What's wrong with the normal Business Class?
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MadameConcorde
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:25 pm

I looked at the ceremony on the Airbus site this morning thinking of the Singapore Airlines delivery 4 years ago.

The only words in French during the ceremony were from the Chinese ambassador to the country in absolutely perfect French without any accent. He said "We welcome the first China Southern A320". I almost fell off my chair!

 

The good man probably knows very little about airplanes.
Tom Enders will be flying to Beijing on board the new aircraft along with the China Southern team and crew.

They really have showy handovers in Toulouse.

I much preferred Everett with the 787 it was so nice and simple and real with the rain and all the Boeing staff wearing the blue and white 787 scarves.

Wishing the China Southern brand new A380 a safe and happy flying career

  
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
330lover
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:48 pm

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 5):
We welcome the first China Southern A320

Well, the difference between "trois cents quatre-vingts" and "trois cents vingt"
is only "quatre".
Clearly a lapsus if you ask me  
Britten Norman Islander VP-FBR on Falkland Islands. THAT'S FLYING!
 
EddieDude
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Fri Oct 14, 2011 3:16 pm

Quoting mogandoCI (Reply 2):
SIN-SYD is nearly 450 miles longer than JFK-LHR ... that's a fair bit more than a "short hop", but your point holds for AF

KE did that too: ICN-HKG before sending the superjumbo to JFK.
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
LJ
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Fri Oct 14, 2011 5:23 pm

Quoting 330lover (Reply 4):

But then they call them: Economy Class, Premium Economy, First Class and Luxurious First Class...
What's wrong with the normal Business Class?

Business class probably doesn't sound classy enough for CZ...

Quoting Gonzalo (Thread starter):

Can someone please clarify how, when and where this airline will use the A380 ??

As mentioned before on Anet, CDG will be the first international destination.
 
jayeshrulz
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Fri Oct 14, 2011 8:21 pm

Quoting Stitch (Reply 1):
SQ did the same (SIN-SYD)

SIN-KUL you mean  
Keep flying, because the sky is no limit!
 
bonusonus
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Fri Oct 14, 2011 9:06 pm

I wonder if we will see CZ putting an A380 on their LAX flight any time soon.
I also heard a rumor that they are looking into starting JFK service. How much autonomy do Chinese airlines have for the routes they choose (since they are all owned by the government)? Since China Eastern and Air China both fly to JFK, I could see CZ not being allowed to fly there.

Anyone have details?
 
wn700driver
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Sat Oct 15, 2011 8:50 am

Quoting 330lover (Reply 4):

But then they call them: Economy Class, Premium Economy, First Class and Luxurious First Class...
What's wrong with the normal Business Class?

Well, it's accurate at any rate. Few companies (well, responsible ones anyway) still spring for "business" class anyway these days, so that name is less accurate than ever.
Base not your happiness on the deeds of others, for what is given can be taken away. No Hope = No Fear
 
goldorak
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Sat Oct 15, 2011 9:17 am

CZ said CDG was a likely A380 destination.
 
mdavies06
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:35 pm

One of the original use of the A380 was 'suppose' to be for the Beijing Olympics (yes, back in 2008). In any case, looking at the current CZ network across the board in terms of frequency and capacity, A380 on any of their existing long haul route equates to a massive jump in capacity. CAN is still an emerging hub and the premium market for long haul flights ex-CAN does not support A380. Incidentally I think EK may be able to do it at DXB-CAN because it can probably maintain the route just on a single daily and that could be an A380, but I doubt CZ can fly it anywhere ex-CAN because using A380 would put too much emphasis on capacity and sacrificed frequency.

However, they are right to put them to SHA, PVG and PEK - those are the busiest routes in their network. I think they should consider flying them to ICN, NRT as well. I think these two markets can support the A380 from CAN.
 
FSDan
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:48 pm

Quoting bonusonus (Reply 10):
I also heard a rumor that they are looking into starting JFK service.

I would think that would be a 787 route.
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
A388
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Sun Oct 16, 2011 12:42 pm

AMS was also mentioned as one of CZ's A380 destination, I remember at the time it was even considered to be their first European A380 destination. Now that CDG is also a potential A380 destination I don't know how much of a chance AMS will have at receiving the CZ A380. AMS really doesn't have any luck with the A380 as MH's plans for the A380 is also uncertain with them not joining SkyTeam. At least that is the latest I read.

A388
 
rutankrd
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Sun Oct 16, 2011 1:00 pm

Quoting 330lover (Reply 6):
Well, the difference between "trois cents quatre-vingts" and "trois cents vingt"
is only "quatre".
Clearly a lapsus if you ask me  

Why does french not have a word for eighty (80) but rather say four twenties ?
 
smi0006
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Sun Oct 16, 2011 1:01 pm

Any photos of the CZ interior? CZ really have a massive way to go back of house before they will truly be able to capitalize on CAN as a hub... Their IT systems are atrocious!

I wish CZ the best of luck in establishing CAN as an international hub, but I really do feel they need to pause and reorganize before the continue with their current rapid expansion!

The question was brought up above, how much autonomy do Chinese airlines enjoy, and how much do they compete against each other? Valid question with a no doubt fascinating answer!!

Just like CA and CX CZ Has been hiring Australian pilots for their routes out of Australia due to pilot shortages in China has this been happening else where in their international network?
 
rutankrd
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Sun Oct 16, 2011 1:06 pm

Quoting mdavies06 (Reply 13):

One of the original use of the A380 was 'suppose' to be for the Beijing Olympics (yes, back in 2008). In any case, looking at the current CZ network across the board in terms of frequency and capacity, A380 on any of their existing long haul route equates to a massive jump in capacity. CAN is still an emerging hub and the premium market for long haul flights ex-CAN does not support A380. Incidentally I think EK may be able to do it at DXB-CAN because it can probably maintain the route just on a single daily and that could be an A380, but I doubt CZ can fly it anywhere ex-CAN because using A380 would put too much emphasis on capacity and sacrificed frequency.

However, they are right to put them to SHA, PVG and PEK - those are the busiest routes in their network. I think they should consider flying them to ICN, NRT as well. I think these two markets can support the A380 from CAN.

The CAAC will determine where these birds go.

Although there are several colours on the outside these Chinese airlines are still state controlled !
 
HiJazzey
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Sun Oct 16, 2011 2:04 pm

Quoting rutankrd (Reply 16):
Why does french not have a word for eighty (80) but rather say four twenties ?

In some countries they do. They call it "huitante".
 
EddieDude
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Sun Oct 16, 2011 3:47 pm

In Switzerland I think. In Quebec and Belgium it is also quatre-vingt.

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 17):
and how much do they compete against each other?

I am not entirely sure, but it seems the CZ and MU cooperation goes beyond simply being in the same alliance. I think they are working very closely now in the domestic market, but hopefully someone more knowledgeable of the situation can tell us.
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
rutankrd
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Sun Oct 16, 2011 5:40 pm

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 20):
I am not entirely sure, but it seems the CZ and MU cooperation goes beyond simply being in the same alliance. I think they are working very closely now in the domestic market, but hopefully someone more knowledgeable of the situation can tell us.

Internal fares are largely set by the CAAC and as I said beyond the paint outside they are essentially still just regional divisions .

There are just a few small independent carriers and these still need CAAC approvals on their buying/leasing and route network.
As soon as they get big enough the CAAC sets off another round of consolidations.

Make no mistake Chinese aviation is still quite a long way from being a truly market driven competitive and commercial environment.
 
AustrianZRH
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Mon Oct 17, 2011 7:53 am

Quoting HiJazzey (Reply 19):
They call it "huitante".

Isn't it octante and nonante as opposed to huitante and neufante?
WARNING! The post above should be taken with a grain of salt! Furthermore, it may be slightly biased towards A.
 
Carpethead
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Tue Oct 18, 2011 3:50 am

Quoting wn700driver (Reply 11):
Few companies (well, responsible ones anyway) still spring for "business" class anyway these days, so that name is less accurate than ever.

You'd be surprised to see the number of responsible (and non-responsible too) companies that send their employees to far-flung destination in comfort of first or business-class in Asia.

The term 'bizjet' can be as foreign a word in Asia similar to US domestic widebody service.  
 
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mariner
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Tue Oct 18, 2011 3:53 am

Here's an article about the first flight:

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/cndy/2011-10/18/content_13920864.htm

"After October, the aircraft will still operate on the two domestic routes until the airline's second A380 is delivered, which is expected to be in December. Then it will begin flying international routes. China Southern ordered five A380s, which will all be delivered by 2013."

mariner
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B2443
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Tue Oct 18, 2011 4:16 am

Quoting smi0006 (Reply 17):
Any photos of the CZ interior? CZ really have a massive way to go back of house before they will truly be able to capitalize on CAN as a hub... Their IT systems are atrocious!

Agreed. Their websites (and CA/MU in that matter) are horrible.

Still being updated but here's the inaugural flight PEK-CAN http://pic.feeyo.com/posts/546/5467878.html
Yao Ming's on it too.

http://news.carnoc.com/list/202/202943.html shows the luxury first class.

It's been rumored that the 380 will be based in PEK, not CAN. It's doing single daily PEK-CAN-PEK till Oct 26 then PEK-PVG-PEK Oct 27-29. After that PEK-CDG most likely.
 
B2443
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Tue Oct 18, 2011 2:04 pm

more Interior pix of China Southern 380 http://bbs.feeyo.com/posts/524/topic-0011-5244644.html
 
Gonzalo
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Tue Oct 18, 2011 3:37 pm

Quoting B2443 (Reply 26):
more Interior pix of China Southern 380

Nice Pics !!! Thanks for posting.

Rgds.
G.
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SEA
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Tue Oct 18, 2011 3:41 pm

Quoting B2443 (Reply 26):

The reeds on the bulkheads are a really nice touch!
 
330lover
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Tue Oct 18, 2011 3:56 pm

Quoting SEA (Reply 28):
The reeds on the bulkheads are a really nice touch!

Agree with that.

But their First Class suites look very plastic to me! Give me the new LX and LH First at all times.
Britten Norman Islander VP-FBR on Falkland Islands. THAT'S FLYING!
 
smi0006
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RE: CZ's A380 Only For Domestic Routes?

Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:19 pm

In my opinion the uggliest least stylish, most cluttered looking A380 interrior to date. The reeds on the bulkheads are ugly and make the cabin look so much smaller, the F and J seats are tacky and ugly. The carpet and seat covers are very very busy! Fail CZ I'm afraid! Although perhaps all of this is very stylish in the Chineese domestice market?

Like the CZ crew uniforms, when do they wear those hats and scarfes? Are they for premotional activities only? I see the Scarves every once in a while but never the hats. Hahah at my airport the CZ ground staff don't even have CZ uniforms lol just any old suite they want...

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