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Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 1:33 pm

Hi,
Unconfirmed rumours say that Emirates is planning to start a route Dubai - Stockholm in October 2012. The route Dubai - Copenhagen was a success for Emirates so they think there is a market for further expansion in Scandinavia. According to rumours the route to Stockholm is planned initially with A330. What do you think about this?
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Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 1:44 pm

That is definitely great news for Stockholm and LFV in Sweden. The F pier could do with a new tail at the gates  .

I have to admit that I would have though OSL would be on the list for Emirates as well as ARN... Maybe that will come later on but the 332 sounds like the best aircraft to start up the route.
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CXfirst
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Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 1:49 pm

Well, with EK, any destination in any remote part of the world could be a believable rumour, so I'll wait until something a bit more concrete.

The only thing that I find odd about the rumour, is that it is still a whole year until October 2012, but then again, October has been a popular start up time for Middle East Carriers to Scandinavia lately.

Personally, I was hoping that EK would expand to OSL and ARN by then.

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Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 1:53 pm

Quoting SKAirbus (Reply 1):
I have to admit that I would have though OSL would be on the list for Emirates as well as ARN..

Maybe it is too. But maybe with all the new routes from OSL maybe ARN is better after all. Even if OSL has large airport much of the traffic is domestic and ARN is larger when it comes to international traffic. But I think Emirates will start routes to both ARN and OSL it is just that we have rumours going on right now coming out of Dubai with dates, aircraft type etc on a route to ARN. It says startup at ARN Oct 2012...
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Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 1:56 pm

That´s great news. Hopefully the A332

Just read that Vueling are to fly BCN-ARN next year

Yeah baby, keep ém coming!

//Mike      
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Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 2:03 pm

Just to be clear, the rumour is only saying the route to Stockholm will start. It says nothing about a route to OSL. But that does not mean a route to OSL may not be started by Emirates in 2012, that may happen as well, it is just that nothing is said about OSL.
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Richie72
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Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 2:09 pm

Excellent news if true!

I can say that without doubt one of the most booked routes will be ARN -DXB -MLE from Sweden!
 
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Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 2:20 pm

Quoting Richie72 (Reply 6):
I can say that without doubt one of the most booked routes will be ARN -DXB -MLE from Sweden!

I think we will see much the same pattern as with Qatar from ARN... Transit to Singapore, Sydney, Kuala Lumpur and perhaps even Hong Kong. Time will tell but lets see the route started first  
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Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 2:50 pm

Quoting Navigator (Reply 7):

Does anybody know were all pax go to from Doha? I meen besides BKK. Which airports come next? Anyhow.....EK is just a rumor. I belive it when I se it.
 
deltamartin
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Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 4:25 pm

Great news if ture, but like some others I'll wait for an announcement of some sort before being too excited. But ofcourse EK will fly to ARN and OSL one day, it's a question of when, not if.
 
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Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 4:34 pm

Belgian media have been reporting an imminent launch of EK flights to Brussels as well. With the addition of so much new capacity, it is likely that EK will announce a number of new service soon.
 
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Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 7:12 pm

Quoting F28 (Reply 8):
Does anybody know were all pax go to from Doha? I meen besides BKK. Which airports come next? Anyhow.....EK is just a rumor. I belive it when I se it.

Isn't there a big population in Sweden of Iranian, Pakistani and other S. Asian descent? QR has extensive routes to both these countries (as well as many others).

Then, of course, there is Singapore, KL, HK as well, possibly even E and S. Africa.

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 10):
Belgian media have been reporting an imminent launch of EK flights to Brussels as well. With the addition of so much new capacity, it is likely that EK will announce a number of new service soon.

Good news (though not for Jet and Etihad!)

EK is taking another eight 77Ws over the next few months and in addition to these, there will also be a good few more A380s; as these A380s are sent to the larger markets, they will also release the 77Ws to add new services. EK is certainly on a major expansion drive now; great to see it!
 
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Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 8:08 pm

Quoting kaitak (Reply 11):
as these A380s are sent to the larger markets, they will also release the 77Ws to add new services.

or replace A330s on some routes where a 3rd daily flight has been added.
 
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Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 8:36 pm

Quoting HB-IWC (Reply 10):
Belgian media have been reporting an imminent launch of EK flights to Brussels as well. With the addition of so much new capacity, it is likely that EK will announce a number of new service soon.

With how many aircraft EK is receiving, they have to expand somewhere.  
Quoting kaitak (Reply 11):
EK is taking another eight 77Ws over the next few months and in addition to these, there will also be a good few more A380s; as these A380s are sent to the larger markets, they will also release the 77Ws to add new services.

I've forgotten EK's deliveries for the next year. Does anyone have a list of:
1. 8 77Ws (time frame? I'll assume 'near term)
2. 3 more A388s in 2011 (per A380 production thread #10, latest update)
3. 9 more A388s in 2012 (Mostly later in year.)
4. X number of 77Ws not in the above list.

That is a huge number of new potential routes and frequencies just among the 20 aircraft quickly identified.

I wonder if any routes will go 7X/week A388 vs. 10X/week 77W. The 7X/week A388 should be more profitable...
This could allow further new route introductions.

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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Tue Nov 08, 2011 8:54 pm

Quoting kaitak (Reply 11):
Isn't there a big population in Sweden of Iranian, Pakistani and other S. Asian descent? QR has extensive routes to both these countries (as well as many others).

Actually not that big groups of South Asians (I think you're thinking of Norway). The Iranian population on the other hand is huge. IR used to fly 747s even on IKA-GOT before they were banned.

Other than that, both QR and EK would be able to fill the majority of seats with swedes traveling to BKK.

//Alex
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:37 am

Quoting cityairline (Reply 14):
Actually not that big groups of South Asians (I think you're thinking of Norway). The Iranian population on the other hand is huge. IR used to fly 747s even on IKA-GOT before they were banned.

Yes, Norway has a quite large Pakistani community since the early 1970's (especially Oslo area).

PIA Pakistan even operates direct flights from Oslo to Islamabad and Lahore 2/3 times a week with B777 the last 10 years or so...

[Edited 2011-11-09 01:38:03]
 
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:02 am

EK is present nearly anywhere else - so why not ARN

I think that would make a great addition to the internation destination list

I just found the following statement on the EK website:

Quote:
Emirates flies to 12 of the EU’s 27 Member States (UK, France, Germany, Italy, Austria, Greece, Malta, Cyprus, Czech Republic, Netherlands, Sweden and Spain) operating a total of 37 passenger flights to and from the EU each day, as well as 22 all-cargo flights per week.

does the "Sweden" in there only count for cargo or is that a hint for coming passenger service?

[Edited 2011-11-09 02:05:03]
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:17 am

Quoting photophil (Reply 16):
Emirates flies to 12 of the EU’s 27 Member States (UK, France, Germany, Italy, Austria, Greece, Malta, Cyprus, Czech Republic, Netherlands, Sweden and Spain) operating a total of 37 passenger flights to and from the EU each day, as well as 22 all-cargo flights per week.

does the "Sweden" in there only count for cargo or is that a hint for coming passenger service?

Not sure what that refers to, but EK does fly to Denmark and is not on that list. It would be helpful if you provided us with a link so we could see for ourselves.
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Wed Nov 09, 2011 10:36 am

Expect more surpises for Emirates planned expantion into Scandinavia 
 
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Wed Nov 09, 2011 11:01 am

According to reliable sources I am told that Emirates will also start up OSL with A330-200 at about the same time as Stockholm next year. Gulf Air will according to the same sources also start up a route to Stockholm - ARN in 2012. Etihad is also looking at Stockholm (but not OSL). According to the same sources Qatar and Etihad are also looking at Gothenburg - GOT... puhhh

Obviously a lot will happen next year.
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Wed Nov 09, 2011 11:17 am

Quoting Navigator (Reply 19):
According to reliable sources I am told that Emirates will also start up OSL with A330-200 at about the same time as Stockholm next year. Gulf Air will according to the same sources also start up a route to Stockholm - ARN in 2012. Etihad is also looking at Stockholm (but not OSL). According to the same sources Qatar and Etihad are also looking at Gothenburg - GOT... puhhh

Hope this is true! Would be great for GOT and ARN with some new international destinations!
 
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Wed Nov 09, 2011 11:58 am

Quoting deltamartin (Reply 20):
Hope this is true! Would be great for GOT and ARN with some new international destinations!

Some of those routes are probably being negotiated now with the airports involved and with governments for traffic rights.
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Wed Nov 09, 2011 12:59 pm

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 13):
I've forgotten EK's deliveries for the next year. Does anyone have a list of:
1. 8 77Ws (time frame? I'll assume 'near term)
2. 3 more A388s in 2011 (per A380 production thread #10, latest update)
3. 9 more A388s in 2012 (Mostly later in year.)
4. X number of 77Ws not in the above list.

That is a huge number of new potential routes and frequencies just among the 20 aircraft quickly identified.

I wonder if any routes will go 7X/week A388 vs. 10X/week 77W. The 7X/week A388 should be more profitable...
This could allow further new route introductions.

Lightsaber

EK will receive 52 aircraft over the next 18-20 months. All 77Ws ans A380s.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/htm...hnology/2016349190_emirates29.html
 
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Wed Nov 09, 2011 3:11 pm

Quoting Raptor1090 (Reply 22):
EK will receive 52 aircraft over the next 18-20 months. All 77Ws ans A380s.

   Thank you. I've read that link before, but forgot the 52 aircraft in 20 months.    That is a staggering expansion.

I guess the question, that won't be answered here, is how many aircraft will they retire?   

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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Wed Nov 09, 2011 3:27 pm

Quoting Raptor1090 (Reply 22):
EK will receive 52 aircraft over the next 18-20 months. All 77Ws ans A380s.

That makes things exciting. Should be a lot of new routes and added frequencies to current routes. The only problem is, it seems destinations like ARN, OSL, GOT, and many other European destinations would be best started with something A330 size, but with the lack of A330, some new routes must be started with 77W's, and I'm not too sure that will be easy, even for the likes of EK.

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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Wed Nov 09, 2011 3:56 pm

Quoting CXfirst (Reply 24):
That makes things exciting. Should be a lot of new routes and added frequencies to current routes. The only problem is, it seems destinations like ARN, OSL, GOT, and many other European destinations would be best started with something A330 size, but with the lack of A330, some new routes must be started with 77W's, and I'm not too sure that will be easy, even for the likes of EK.

I think Emirates will upgrade some other routes from A330 to 77W to free A330-200:s for use on routes to ARN and OSL. I think it is highly unlikely that they start those routes with 77W.
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Wed Nov 09, 2011 4:02 pm

Quoting Navigator (Reply 25):
I think Emirates will upgrade some other routes from A330 to 77W to free A330-200:s

For sure, But even if they upgauged every single A330 route, there would still be many more 77W's coming in. But I guess we'll see the end of the 777-300, 777-200ER and the A340's soon.

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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Wed Nov 09, 2011 5:15 pm

Quoting CXfirst (Reply 26):
For sure, But even if they upgauged every single A330 route, there would still be many more 77W's coming in. But I guess we'll see the end of the 777-300, 777-200ER and the A340's soon.

The 77W is an economists dream!! The reason the 748 is doing so badly is because of the extreme performance of the 77W. Who needs the 748 when the 77W is performing better. Just a bit smaller but soo good performance. Seatmile costs are extremely low on a 77W...
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Wed Nov 09, 2011 5:26 pm

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 13):
3. 9 more A388s in 2012 (Mostly later in year.)

According to Spottingworld's A380 production list, it is 10 for 2012 (with 8 of them being delivered in the second half).


Quoting lightsaber (Reply 23):
I guess the question, that won't be answered here, is how many aircraft will they retire?

Around 15 is my guess. I remember an article (*) where EK had planned to have 185 aircraft in its fleet by March 2013, considering they had 150 aircraft in sept '11 and with those 52 coming in, that makes around 15 leaving the fleet.

(*) I don't know where I read it, but I'll do a search...  

OK, found!

"The current order backlog stands at just over 200 aircraft, and the influx of new equipment combined with the roll-over will see the Emirates passenger fleet grow to around 185 aircraft by March 2013."
http://www.flightglobal.com/page/interviews/tim-clark/the-interview/

[Edited 2011-11-09 09:41:36]
 
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Thu Nov 10, 2011 5:20 pm

Quoting Navigator (Reply 19):
According to reliable sources I am told that Emirates will also start up OSL with A330-200 at about the same time as Stockholm next year. Gulf Air will according to the same sources also start up a route to Stockholm - ARN in 2012. Etihad is also looking at Stockholm (but not OSL). According to the same sources Qatar and Etihad are also looking at Gothenburg - GOT... puhhh

that would bring Qatar, Emirates, Gulf and Etihad into ARN ... that a lot of carriers from the same area, isn't it? Especially if you compare with how few connections there are to north america ...

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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Thu Nov 10, 2011 5:23 pm

Quoting solnabo (Reply 4):
That´s great news. Hopefully the A332

Seriously, you'd wish its NOT the A332. It has by far the worst and oldest cabin of the EK fleet.
But new EU routes are almost always opened with the A332, so highly likely.

Quoting lightsaber (Reply 13):
That is a huge number of new potential routes and frequencies just among the 20 aircraft quickly identified.
Quoting lightsaber (Reply 23):
That is a staggering expansion.

Dont forget, that EK also plans to retire some old aircrafts (actually meaning: ending the lease).
 
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Thu Nov 10, 2011 6:56 pm

Quoting hal9213 (Reply 30):
But new EU routes are almost always opened with the A332, so highly likely.

AMS and GVA were started with B77W/B77L, MAD was started with A343 and LED will operate with A343/A345. So not always an A332 to start with. CPH has started with A332 but quickly upgauge to B772. PRG started with A332 and will move to B773. DUB will start with A332.
 
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Fri Nov 11, 2011 5:35 am

Quoting hal9213 (Reply 30):
Seriously, you'd wish its NOT the A332. It has by far the worst and oldest cabin of the EK fleet.
But new EU routes are almost always opened with the A332, so highly likely.

IFE wise you're right. But comfort wise, I much more enjoyed the EK A332 than the EK 77W. One of the main reasons I haven't flown EK in Y lately, it feels too cramped. Can't wait for them to get A350's (and hoping they will keep to industry standard). Haven't been on the A380 with EK, but I would assume that would be quite comfortable.

-CXfirst
 
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Fri Nov 11, 2011 10:52 am

Quoting photophil (Reply 29):
that would bring Qatar, Emirates, Gulf and Etihad into ARN ... that a lot of carriers from the same area, isn't it? Especially if you compare with how few connections there are to north america ...

PHILIP

It is demand that drives this expansion. A lot of traffic from Stockholm to Asia goes via HEL due to lack of direct routes to serve all markets in Asia. Currently there is Thai and Qatar. I think the demand is clearly there for most of those new airlines. North America is another market and any comparison will be hard to do. Too much differs. Traffic to Stockholm is increasing sharply now and we will see if all this new traffic works. But always remember that Stockholm is unique in having no homecarrier serving intercontinental Asian routes so foreingn carriers are badly needed as long as SAS only serves CPH and also doing it less well compared to Finnair.
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Fri Nov 11, 2011 10:53 am

Quoting CXfirst (Reply 32):
But comfort wise, I much more enjoyed the EK A332 than the EK 77W.

I wonder why... Maybe its some time ago and you caught a 77W still with old seats? Pitch is less, the cushions are harder, everything is dirty, worn out or even broken, and the overhead is much smaller. The only thing coming to my mind really is just the smaller overall aircraft size resulting in less "cattle-cage-feeling".
 
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Fri Nov 11, 2011 12:46 pm

Quoting hal9213 (Reply 34):
I wonder why... Maybe its some time ago and you caught a 77W still with old seats?

Airlines tend to refurbish their cabins at certain intervals. If you are lucky to fly in a completely refurbished or even new plane one day, the next you may end up in an older example with different style while still with the same airline and aircraft type. And also what happened a year ago may no longer be valid  
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Fri Nov 11, 2011 1:08 pm

Quoting Navigator (Reply 33):
It is demand that drives this expansion. A lot of traffic from Stockholm to Asia goes via HEL due to lack of direct routes to serve all markets in Asia. Currently there is Thai and Qatar. I think the demand is clearly there for most of those new airlines. North America is another market and any comparison will be hard to do. Too much differs. Traffic to Stockholm is increasing sharply now and we will see if all this new traffic works. But always remember that Stockholm is unique in having no homecarrier serving intercontinental Asian routes so foreingn carriers are badly needed as long as SAS only serves CPH and also doing it less well compared to Finnair.

But I think Finnair has a huge advantage for asian routes against Emirates & Co ... they are in the right direction. All these "new" connections will be quite long as they start "the wrong direction"

But I would anyway enjoy a more diverse longhaul traffic at ARN

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CXfirst
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RE: Rumor: Emirates To Stockholm In 2012

Fri Nov 11, 2011 2:09 pm

Quoting hal9213 (Reply 34):
I wonder why... Maybe its some time ago and you caught a 77W still with old seats? Pitch is less, the cushions are harder, everything is dirty, worn out or even broken, and the overhead is much smaller.

Well pitch on the A330 is 32 inches, which isn't the best, but still is quite standard, compared to 33 inches on the 777-200LR (which flies the route I would be taking, which is PER-DXB), and 34 inches on the 77W (which is pretty good). But the real killer for me is seat width, with the 777 series having only 17 inches, and the A330 having 17.5 (which to me makes a difference). The A380 wins at this with 18 inches.

My experience on the A330 was a clean aircraft, whose cushions were just as soft as the 77W I flew on during the same trip. And although the overhead is smaller, I see this as a small inconvenience. I always find space, and keep in mind, with 10 abreast seating, the 777 needs larger overheads.

IFE on the 777 was a clear winner. But the seats narrowness dampened the experience on EK in comparison to other 777 operators that I've flown on including SQ, TG among others.

I don't think the experience is enough to keep me from flying EK, but if I could get a similar price and schedule, I would much rather use QR, SQ, TG, EY among others.

-CXfirst

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