snn2003
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A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 4:38 pm

I did not see this posted anywhere. I guess this would be good news for those that want some more A380 action in the US.

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/gener...comm&id=news/avd/2011/12/02/01.xml

SNN
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tcasalert
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 4:45 pm

Interesting if it happens, and good news for Airbus getting a potential foothold in the Americas. Looks like they will deployed across UA's Asian network though, presumably to replace some of the 747s?

Do UA still base aircraft out in Japan or are they all operated on an extension of flights from the US?
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STT757
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 4:50 pm

Quote:
Airbus considers Boeing 747 operators as likely A380 customers, and in North America that means United and Delta Air Lines are candidates. However, Delta is no longer a target, having told Airbus it wants to focus on smaller widebodies, says Leahy. “That leaves United as our target,” he added.

Makes sense as the market for the A380 from the US is definitely Asia, specifically West Coast-Asia. DL is not going to be able to make an A380 work to Asia from SEA, SFO, LAX, DTW, JFK or ATL. UA could make them work from SFO and LAX. The A350-900s make more sense as replacements for non ER PMUA 777s. I could see a UA order for approximately 12-15 A380s as well as an order for 12-15 77Ws to replace the 747-400 fleet.
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Rdh3e
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:01 pm

I would probably expect to see the ORD-Asia flights go 77W (if they did a dual order) and SFO/LAX-Asia/Australia go 388 if this actually happens.

[Edited 2011-12-02 09:01:58]
 
kl911
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:04 pm

That would be absolutely wonderfull news. The strategy many US airlines use, frequency instead over larger planes, is not possible forever. Like many people know many irports are getting to their max, and espacially longhaul frequency doesnt really matter due to the timezones. Often flights are landing all together in either the evening or the morning.

Besides Asia flights I can see UA using the A380 on flights to LHR.
 
fpetrutiu
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:08 pm

Airbus considers Boeing 747 operators as likely A380 customers, and in North America that means United and Delta Air Lines are candidates. However, Delta is no longer a target, having told Airbus it wants to focus on smaller widebodies, says Leahy. “That leaves United as our target,” he added.

It's an Airbus and Leahy pipe dream. UA has no need or interest in the A380, they are interested in narrow bodies and Airbus is trying to upsell the A380. UA is playing like they are interested to drive the price lower for the narrowbodies they are interested in...
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Rdh3e
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:14 pm

Quoting fpetrutiu (Reply 5):
UA is playing like they are interested to drive the price lower for the narrowbodies they are interested in...

I would think Leahy fully understands this. But it could be the opposite. He could be promising good deals on the A380 in return for a narrowbody order.
 
tpaewr
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:22 pm

Oh I am so glad this is public now! I knew this shortly after getting in MNL. But I knew if I said such here I'd get nothing but scorn. What has changed in the post-merger company is seeing routes that can support the 380. So yeah, size matters  

So yeah it is true. Nothing def yet, but very poss. Frankly I am more of an 748i fan
 
mt99
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:31 pm

Quoting fpetrutiu (Reply 5):
It's an Airbus and Leahy pipe dream

Just like selling A320s to AA?
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ytz
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:35 pm

I see it as a way of getting out of the A359 order. Switch those to A380s. Then they can build the rest of their long-haul fleet around the 787. If my theory comes to pass, then it might be confirmation that Boeing will launch the -10X.
 
kl911
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:37 pm

This would be absolutely cool and a dream come true:

UA with A380, A350 and A320NEO
 
Ronaldo747
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:37 pm

Quoting fpetrutiu (Reply 5):
It's an Airbus and Leahy pipe dream.

  

I would call it a wet dream of Mr. Leahy.
 
lucky777
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:39 pm

Quoting kl911 (Reply 4):
The strategy many US airlines use, frequency instead over larger planes, is not possible forever.

Newsflash.....airports will do what they've always done if/when they near capacity issues. They'll expand. I'll take frequency any day over cramming 500 people into 1 flight per day thank you very much.
 
ytz
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:39 pm

Quoting tpaewr (Reply 7):
Oh I am so glad this is public now! I knew this shortly after getting in MNL. But I knew if I said such here I'd get nothing but scorn. What has changed in the post-merger company is seeing routes that can support the 380. So yeah, size matters

I've been saying this too. The post-merger company is bound to have a few routes where an A380 would make sense.
 
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Stitch
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:44 pm

Clearly one can never say never about these things.

At the moment, the number of international gateways the United States offers to US flag carriers favors more flights with smaller planes, for even slot-restricted destinations can be scheduled to maximize what slots are available to said carriers.

But if UA begins to consolidate those gateways and increases the traffic flow at what gateways remains to the point where slot allocations are insufficient to meet traffic demands, then going bigger is the only option and VLAs like the A380-800 and 747-8 become more relevant to fleet and route planning decisions.

[Edited 2011-12-02 09:45:54]
 
as739x
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:44 pm

Quoting STT757 (Reply 2):

This makes no sense and people in the UAL SOC were getting a chuckle at the article last night. The A380 doesn't fit the model of where UA is going. The 380 is fine if UA continued to route all traffic in Asia via NRT. But this is what the airline is getting away from. This is more a posturing thing to try and get the 150 narrow body order.
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sulley
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:45 pm

An A380 fleet with the globe on the tail. Nice  

Though I too like the 747-8i...
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huaiwei
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:48 pm

Quoting STT757 (Reply 2):
UA could make them work from SFO and LAX.

Yes, and if they muster the courage to fly the A380 SIN-HKG-LAX, then I might actually try to fly UA for the first time in my life!
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DfwRevolution
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:48 pm

Quoting kl911 (Reply 4):
The strategy many US airlines use, frequency instead over larger planes, is not possible forever. Like many people know many irports are getting to their max, and espacially longhaul frequency doesnt really matter due to the timezones. Often flights are landing all together in either the evening or the morning.

The diffusion of U.S. gateways is as much a factor as the preference for frequencies. There is less and less reason to route passengers through a handful of major hubs for the purpose of filling VLAs. The U.S. has both a growing population and economy, which over time turns secondary gateways into plausible international gateways in their own right. That couples with newer aircraft that makes longer/thinner routes more viable.

Granted the O&D traffic of major hub cities is growing, too. This is just speaking in general terms, not to a particular reason why UA should or should not order VLAs. Two other side notes:

1. Maybe it is possible to add frequencies "forever." Unlike London or Tokyo, U.S. cities do tend to have the political will to expand airports or develop new ones.

2. You can add lots of capacity before adding VLAs just my upgauging from 763s to 788/789/A359s and A333/772 to 77W/A351s. I don't have the time to run the numbers based on U.S. airline fleets, but that could go a long way towards the growth in capacity that JL forecasts.
 
blueflyer
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:50 pm

Quoting fpetrutiu (Reply 5):
UA is playing like they are interested to drive the price lower for the narrowbodies they are interested in...

Because faking interest in one product to get a deal on another is a brand new trick no one has used before and Airbus will not see it coming... For Airbus to believe that United is interested, it takes a lot more than a note on the back of a postcard sent to Toulose. It takes genuine, costly, work on behalf of United that Airbus would spot in a millisecond if it was faked and that Untied wouldn't undertake just on the vague hope of a discount on a narrowbody order.

Quoting lucky777 (Reply 12):
They'll expand.

Expand EWR for us. Or SFO. Reclaiming land is far more expensive and complicated, from an engineering, political and environmental point of view, than adding a few A380-capable gates.
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gdg9
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:50 pm

I thought United was getting A350s to 'replace' the 744s... now they are talking 380s?

No 748s?
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roseflyer
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:51 pm

PMUA management felt that operating very large aircraft provided too much risk to outweigh the benefit of lower operating costs. The routes identified as justifying an airplane larger than the A350-900 were SFO-SYD, LAX-SYD, SFO-NRT, ORD-NRT, & ORD-HKG. At times in the year it is truly justified operating a 747 and an A380 would likely deliver seats that would not be detrimental to revenue. However, the problem is that 747s (and A380s) always cost more to operate than the smaller planes.

UA just did not have the continous loads to justify the larger planes. These peak routes went out with close to 100% load factor during peak times and capacity of the 747 was not enough. However with the exception of SFO-NRT, the rest of the routes struggled to fill 374 seats on a daily basis without dumping discount seats on the market. UA shrunk the 747 fleet because of this and has moved towards adding a second flight on SFO-NRT, ORD-HKG, & LAX-SYD when it is justified. It works much better to right size the markets by supplementing the routes with extra aircraft only when needed despite the CASM penalty over operating the larger airplane. UA does a pretty good job of adapting their international fleet to match desired capacity. Almost every destination from SFO to Asia sees variability in either frequency or capacity over the course of the year as the airline adjusts supply with demand. The A380 does not allow the airline to do that as easily.

One note is that although load factors may not show the struggle to fill a 747 on the routes, RASM does. RASM took a hit due to the larger planes and having to adjust the fare structure because of the available seats.

UA in general is not setup to support very large aircraft. With the number of international gateways, larger planes aren't as successful as smaller planes to the same destination. The model for the A380 works well with airlines that have a single major hub. It doesn't work well for airlines with split hubs and large domestic networks. UA's international network is too fragmented for the plane.

As far as the article goes, I think the following quote is marketing non-sense:

However, the Airbus executive issued a caveat when pressed on a pending United deal, noting, “I’m not saying there is an order soon, but United understands that if it wants to have a major presence in Asia it needs the A380.”

United already is the biggest transpacific carrier, so I don't believe that "United understands that if it wants to have a major presense in asia it needs the A380". UA understands how to maximize profitability by right sizing its transpacific flying. The A380 could be squeezed into the network, but it would be a challenge. I'd expect an airplane order for A350-1000 or 777x to be the largest on their potential radar, but I know I have been wrong before.
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africawings
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:52 pm

Seriously, no votes for the 7478i here?

Isn't it a more natural progression and upgrade for United? What am I missing?
 
babybus
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:54 pm

I don't think any airline in USA is ready for an A380. Just not going to happen.

I'd like to see those larger US airlines order the 748-i. They should stick with their home product and secure jobs for the local population.

The A380 is a prestigious aircraft for prestigious airlines.
and with that..cabin crew, seats for landing please.
 
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Stitch
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:57 pm

Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 21):
As far as the article goes, I think the following quote is marketing non-sense:

However, the Airbus executive issued a caveat when pressed on a pending United deal, noting, “I’m not saying there is an order soon, but United understands that if it wants to have a major presence in Asia it needs the A380.”

United already is the biggest transpacific carrier, so I don't believe that "United understands that if it wants to have a major presense in asia it needs the A380".

Well Airbus says nonsense like that because you have people saying nonsense like this:

Quoting Babybus (Reply 23):
I don't think any airline in USA is ready for an A380. Just not going to happen.

I'd like to see those larger US airlines order the 748-i. They should stick with their home product and secure jobs for the local population.

The A380 is a prestigious aircraft for prestigious airlines.
 
sulley
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:57 pm

Quoting Babybus (Reply 23):
The A380 is a prestigious aircraft for prestigious airlines.

Even Air Austral? 
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par13del
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:59 pm

Quoting mt99 (Reply 8):
Just like selling A320s to AA?

Well AA did operate Airbus a/c before, like the A300 so why is that such a stretch, or are you saying there really was a bust up after the crahs in NYC, I thought the general consensus that there was no issue.

Quoting dfwrevolution (Reply 18):
Unlike London or Tokyo, U.S. cities do tend to have the political will to expand airports or develop new ones.

Don't forget the space, but I guess now that they can build airports in the sea that's not much of an issue, except in LHR 
Quoting dfwrevolution (Reply 18):
You can add lots of capacity before adding VLAs just my upgauging from 763s to 788/789/A359s and A333/772 to 77W/A351s. I don't have the time to run the numbers based on U.S. airline fleets,

I think you started a wee bit late, start with the Dash8 (turbo props) then the RJ's then the 737/A32XX then move up to the 763 et al, lots of capacity  
 
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Stitch
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:03 pm

Quoting dfwrevolution (Reply 18):
1. Maybe it is possible to add frequencies "forever." Unlike London or Tokyo, U.S. cities do tend to have the political will to expand airports or develop new ones.

I'll spot you London, but Japan's government seems to be quite content to use Public Works projects like new airports to spur job growth/retainment.  
 
bmacleod
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:04 pm

AC or DL will order the A380 before UA ever does....

UA has indicated when it ordered the A350XWB to replace the 744s it really has no use for VLA (very large aircraft) in its market.
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United787
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:07 pm

I think there is room in the new UA for the 748i or the A380, especially on most of the current 744 routes to Asia. If the A380 is seriously being considered by UA, then you can bet your APU that the 748i is also being considered...but UA has already stated that when they ordered the 787 and A350, they wanted the newest technology and the 748i isn't it.

Quoting kl911 (Reply 4):
The strategy many US airlines use, frequency instead over larger planes, is not possible forever.

Myth...the strategy for US airlines to Asia and Australia isn't frequency...UA and DL for the most part have one daily flight between any two city pairs. The strategy is they fly to Asia from multiple hubs. UA flies to Asia from 5 hubs! Most Asian A380 operators fly to the US from ONE hub! That is the difference. If ANA wasn't going to fly NRT-DEN, then you can bet once the 787 arrives at UA, the next added frequency to NRT for UA would be from DEN, not from an existing hub...
 
roseflyer
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:10 pm

“I flew into JFK [John F. Kennedy International Airport] and it looked pretty crowded,” Leahy said during the presentation, which predicts a doubling of U.S. and Canadian demand in the next 15 years. “Are we going to double movements? That is why we are offering our A380,” he noted.

Airbus’s 20-year forecast is optimistic that North American carriers will realize this predicament and order 206 ultra-widebody aircraft (i.e. the A380) between 2011 and 2031 to relieve some of the pressure being placed on the largest, namely U.S., airports.


This is another quote that I don't understand. First off JFK has nothing to do with UA ordering widebodies. EWR and SFO are the most congested, yet EWR has about 35% of its flights on aircraft with fewer than 70 seats. Going form 2 787/A350s to one A380 is going to do virtually nothing for runway congestion.

206 is also an incredibly high number of VLA in the next 20 years. That's about the number of medium and large widebodies combined delivered in the last 20 years. If you add all the 777s, A330s & 747s in the United States fleet between UA, DL, AA, HA & US, it adds to just over 200 planes. Proposing that all of those will be replaced with ultra-widebody aircraft is ridiculous in my mind.

I understand marketing gimmicks, but some of these claims are preposterous and not backed up by realistic market research.
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Centre
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:20 pm

Quoting Ronaldo747 (Reply 11):
Quoting fpetrutiu (Reply 5):
It's an Airbus and Leahy pipe dream.

  

I would call it a wet dream of Mr. Leahy.

Mark your words guys !!!
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airportugal310
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:23 pm

Quoting par13del (Reply 26):


Quoting mt99 (Reply 8):
Just like selling A320s to AA?

Well AA did operate Airbus a/c before, like the A300 so why is that such a stretch, or are you saying there really was a bust up after the crahs in NYC, I thought the general consensus that there was no issue.

I'm pretty sure that was aimed at the "no US airline would ever order and A380" crowd...

Everyone always said AA was loyal only to Boeing (which Im sure you know...), but looky now...
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United_fan
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:26 pm

An A380 order would be nice , but do they have room and gates to park them at thier destinations?
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Stitch
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:29 pm

Quoting United_fan (Reply 33):
An A380 order would be nice , but do they have room and gates to park them at thier destinations?

At least SFO and LAX are A380-ready. I imagine a number of other UA gateways can accommodate the plane, especially if it's just one movement a day.
 
Rdh3e
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:32 pm

Quoting bmacleod (Reply 28):
UA has indicated when it ordered the A350XWB to replace the 744s it really has no use for VLA (very large aircraft) in its market.

Granted though, that was UA pre-merger. I'd bet there is a lot more traffic to be generated now.

Quoting United787 (Reply 29):
The strategy is they fly to Asia from multiple hubs. UA flies to Asia from 5 hubs!
IAD, EWR, ORD, IAH, SFO, LAX + SEA, and a half point for HNL. 6 Hubs, +1.5

[Edited 2011-12-02 10:33:36]
 
na
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:33 pm

Lets hope so. I have recently illustrated an UA A380 for a press project so I wasnt too far off I think.

Quoting Africawings (Reply 22):
Seriously, no votes for the 7478i here?
Isn't it a more natural progression and upgrade for United? What am I missing?

I agree with you, a UA 748I would be just as nice, to keep it neutral.   
Anything but the bread-and-butter choice 77W    is welcome!
 
warreng24
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:34 pm

Quoting TCASAlert (Reply 1):
Do UA still base aircraft out in Japan or are they all operated on an extension of flights from the US?

UA does not base any 744's out of NRT. All 744's rotate daily from the USA.

UA does sometimes "base" 772's out of NRT. Example, the same aircraft may do the NRT-SIN-NRT-BKK-NRT-SIN-NRT several days in a row before heading back to the USA.
 
T5towbar
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:37 pm

Quoting United787 (Reply 29):
The strategy many US airlines use, frequency instead over larger planes, is not possible forever.

Myth...the strategy for US airlines to Asia and Australia isn't frequency...UA and DL for the most part have one daily flight between any two city pairs. The strategy is they fly to Asia from multiple hubs. UA flies to Asia from 5 hubs! Most Asian A380 operators fly to the US from ONE hub! That is the difference. If ANA wasn't going to fly NRT-DEN, then you can bet once the 787 arrives at UA, the next added frequency to NRT for UA would be from DEN, not from an existing hub...
Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 30):
“I flew into JFK [John F. Kennedy International Airport] and it looked pretty crowded,” Leahy said during the presentation, which predicts a doubling of U.S. and Canadian demand in the next 15 years. “Are we going to double movements? That is why we are offering our A380,” he noted.

Airbus’s 20-year forecast is optimistic that North American carriers will realize this predicament and order 206 ultra-widebody aircraft (i.e. the A380) between 2011 and 2031 to relieve some of the pressure being placed on the largest, namely U.S., airports.

This is another quote that I don't understand. First off JFK has nothing to do with UA ordering widebodies. EWR and SFO are the most congested, yet EWR has about 35% of its flights on aircraft with fewer than 70 seats. Going form 2 787/A350s to one A380 is going to do virtually nothing for runway congestion.

As I said in another post about the 380, EWR isn't infrastructurally ready to handle a 380. JFK is. Do you know how much it's going to cost to make those things happen? It's not just about the real estate (IE: gates; AC zones; and jetways, the taxiways that run parallel with the main two runways are too narrow. You don't want what happened earlier this year when that Delta Connection CR7 got spun around by a 380. So if you are a UA EWR customer, you will have to go to IAD to take a 380 to NRT or HKG. Makes no sense to funnell everybody to IAD, when you can go non-stop on a 777. Or just go double daily if that's the case. Unless Airbus has a few billion of spare dollars that the PA do not have, to do all of this work...........
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kiwiandrew

RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:42 pm

Quoting rdh3e (Reply 35):
AD, EWR, ORD, IAH, SFO, LAX + SEA, and a half point for HNL. 6 Hubs, +1.5

When did SEA suddenly become a hub for UA? A single daily SEA-NRT flight does not make a hub in my opinion.
 
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United787
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:44 pm

Quoting rdh3e (Reply 35):
IAD, EWR, ORD, IAH, SFO, LAX + SEA, and a half point for HNL. 6 Hubs, +1.5

I stand corrected, can't believe I forgot about IAH and SEA...but you forgot about GUM, that has to count for another half point at least to bring it to 7!
 
Burkhard
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:45 pm

I would also expect FRA to see them once or twice daily,
 
warden145
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:45 pm

Quoting blueflyer (Reply 19):
Expand EWR for us. Or SFO. Reclaiming land is far more expensive and complicated, from an engineering, political and environmental point of view, than adding a few A380-capable gates.

   I remember when SFO was talking about building new runways so they could meet the minimum poor-visibility spacing requirements that currently causes so many delays when the weather gets bad. The environmentalists threw such a hissey-fit about filling in the bay that the plan ended up being a non-starter. Based on that and the fact that it would take quite a bit of creativity to add gates to the current terminal buildings, I don't see SFO's infrastructure expanding anytime soon...which could be an argument for UA eventually needing to go to larger aircraft...
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ER757
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:46 pm

Quoting bmacleod (Reply 28):
UA has indicated when it ordered the A350XWB to replace the 744s it really has no use for VLA (very large aircraft) in its market.

Then why aren't all the 747's retired to the desert?   

Maybe it's just me being sentimental, but UA without the 747 doesn't seem right. Since I was an ORD boy back in the day, the two are joined in my mind. So while I'd like to see the 748i find a home there, the A380 would be more logical I guess since it's the biggest thing out there and if you need a VLA, why not get the most capacity? I believe that UA does have a place in their fleet for a VLA, never bought that line about the A350's replacing the 747's.
 
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United787
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:46 pm

Quoting RoseFlyer (Reply 30):
Going form 2 787/A350s to one A380 is going to do virtually nothing for runway congestion.

Totally agree! The RJs are the problem with US airports, they A380 and 748i aren't going to solve that problem.

That said, I still think UA could use 10-15 of either!
 
Rdh3e
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:49 pm

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 39):
When did SEA suddenly become a hub for UA? A single daily SEA-NRT flight does not make a hub in my opinion.

It's not, hence I said 6 hubs, +1.5. the 1.5 being SEA and HNL.

To Leahy's point and other's opinions, we'll probably see more guage increasing, but it'll probably be mostly on the RJ side, 50's to 70s, 70s to 100's.

[Edited 2011-12-02 10:52:06]
 
slider
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 7:11 pm

Quoting kl911 (Reply 4):
That would be absolutely wonderfull news. The strategy many US airlines use, frequency instead over larger planes, is not possible forever.

I've already read the responses to this by others and concur---I think you might be makign this a mutually exclusive argument when it's not. There is room for both strategies, really. There is fragmentation and room for a long haul midsize gauge 787 AND a superjumbo for high density long haul runs. Old CO was already seemingly under a gauge on many routes already; certainly a smart capacity move to maintain discipline. But with Asia being so big for the new UA, it's plausible.

Quoting fpetrutiu (Reply 5):
UA has no need or interest in the A380

See above and all the posts earlier. There *could* be a need and there might very well be interest,

Quoting YTZ (Reply 9):
I see it as a way of getting out of the A359 order. Switch those to A380s

Quite a good point....we'll see how it shakes out.
 
YULWinterSkies
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 7:15 pm

Quoting rdh3e (Reply 3):
I would probably expect to see the ORD-Asia flights go 77W (if they did a dual order) and SFO/LAX-Asia/Australia go 388 if this actually happens.

I think the 77W will never make it into UA's fleet, because the A350 is on order. But never never exists when it comes to aviation industry.
I've been going against the mainstream thought when saying US carriers WILL order the A380, I guess we aren't at this stage yet, but the unlikelihood has just decreased slightly. Good for UA if it happens.

Quoting Stitch (Reply 34):
At least SFO and LAX are A380-ready. I imagine a number of other UA gateways can accommodate the plane, especially if it's just one movement a day.

IAD is already operating the A380 with AF, so it must be ready somehow.

Quoting bmacleod (Reply 28):
UA has indicated when it ordered the A350XWB to replace the 744s it really has no use for VLA (very large aircraft) in its market.

Well, only stubborn people never change their minds. BA also said they had no use for the A380 before. I'll let you dream about your AC A380 order, however... There's a limit to my 'never-say-never' way of thinking.
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chrisa330
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 7:18 pm

Quoting bmacleod (Reply 28):
AC or DL will order the A380 before UA ever does....

If UA doesn't need this kind of capacity, there is no way AC needs this kind of capacity. Even the B77Ws are too big for some of their routes.
 
roseflyer
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RE: A United A380 May Be On The Way

Fri Dec 02, 2011 7:21 pm

Quoting slider (Reply 46):

Quoting fpetrutiu (Reply 5):
UA has no need or interest in the A380

See above and all the posts earlier. There *could* be a need and there might very well be interest,

There definitely is need for capacity at UA, the problem is that it is only during part of the year. Due to seasonal fluctuation, it makes more sense to operate more frequencies during peak time. UA could easily fill the A380 and enjoy great CASM on some routes during peak season, but during the off season they would be stuck operating the most expensive commercial airline in operation without enough revenue to sustain it. It's a quandry that UA is in and we all know what John Leahey thinks the solution is, but his opinion may not be the best for UA shareholders. Buying the airplane that has the highest list price and is the most expensive to operate is not a decision to be taken lightly. We all know what can happen to airlines that operate large prestige aircraft, but don't have the underlying route structure to support them. However if they can make it work with their new merged structure, then the A380 would be a great plane to have. I'm sure they are salivating at the proposed CASM costs, but that's only half the story.
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