dsuairptman
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Second Airline Likely For IWA

Sat Dec 03, 2011 4:09 am

GEAUX SAINTS!
 
BA744PHX
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Sat Dec 03, 2011 6:04 pm

I would think NK as well but now that G4 has started LAS and soon OAK where would they fly to? LAX, SAN, DFW, ORD, DTW? Will be interesting to see who and what they announce
 
mli717fan
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Sat Dec 03, 2011 6:50 pm

Quoting BA744PHX (Reply 3):
I would think NK as well but now that G4 has started LAS and soon OAK where would they fly to? LAX, SAN, DFW, ORD, DTW? Will be interesting to see who and what they announce

I think G4 launched OAK and LAS because:
1. They have a decent local following at IWA.
2. Protect their turf from another carrier.
3. (LAS only) Operational efficiencies of connecting two focus cities.

Any thoughts that this could be Vision or DirectAir? They seem to be going after the same traffic in the southeastern US, maybe one of them is looking to venture out into the western US.
 
dbo861
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Sat Dec 03, 2011 7:42 pm

"Two years ago, the airport urged its customers and supporters to lobby San Francisco-based Virgin America to set up shop there, but that effort went by the boards."

Read more: http://www.azcentral.com/community/m...-second-carrier.html#ixzz1fVCRHjcc

I thought this was interesting. It's only a matter of time before Virgin America will enter the Phoenix market, maybe this announcement will be them.
 
PlanesNTrains
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Sat Dec 03, 2011 9:10 pm

Spirit would seem the most logical option. Not sure who else would fit the bill?

-Dave
-Dave
 
FWAERJ
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Sat Dec 03, 2011 9:11 pm

Quoting MLI717fan (Reply 4):
Any thoughts that this could be Vision or DirectAir? They seem to be going after the same traffic in the southeastern US, maybe one of them is looking to venture out into the western US.

I could see Direct Air, as they seem to be successfully tapping markets that G4 left/won't touch. And IWA has had a track record with public charters in the past ("New" Western and SkyValue being two examples).

But I don't think it's NK... I think they will enter PHX.
"Did he really need the triple bypass? Or was it the miles?"
 
sunking737
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Sat Dec 03, 2011 10:55 pm

Quoting FWAERJ (Reply 8):
I could see Direct Air

They are having some problems, so I don't think it will be them. They are having problems with some of the airlines they use. A/C mx issues. IIRC they were to start flights to San Juan from Lakeland Fla. last month but pushed it back to spring. Lack of interest?? Hagerstown MD was good during summer and then dried up, they dropped the town.
Just an MSPAVGEEK
 
PlanesNTrains
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Sun Dec 04, 2011 7:47 am

Hey sunking737, how about SunCountry?  

-Dave
-Dave
 
EricR
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Mon Dec 05, 2011 4:02 pm

The top requested (not currently served) destinations out of IWA are:
1.) SAN
2.) LAX
3.) HNL
4.) DEN
5.) ORD
6.) SFO
7.) SEA
8.) MSP
9.) JFK
http://www.phxmesagateway.org/content/Marketing/SurveyResults.pdf

Based on this information, I'll throw out a few scenarios (though some would involve carriers that already serve PHX).
1.) B6 to LGB. Fills the demand for service to LAX, but is it a good use of an LGB slot?
2.) SY to MSP on a seasonal basis - a lot of seasonal visitors to Arizona are from the Upper Midwest
3.) NK to LAX/ORD - fullfills the #2 and #5 most requested destinations.
4.) DL - yes, this one is a stretch. But it is interesting to note the following: DL has been expanding LAX (#2 requested destination), has a hub in MSP (#8 requested destination), has a hub in JFK (#9 requested destination), and the upper midwest (a DL stronghold) draws a lot of visitors to AZ.

I do not think it will be Virgin because IWA does not fit their model of airports served and they do not seem to have the ability to "test" a smaller sized airport such as IWA.

Also, I do not think it is a charter carrier because the press release states "a significant announcement regarding new passenger service". If charter service is defined as "significant announcement", then I would like to know how they define regularly scheduled service.

Interestingly enough, WN is the best positioned to fill the demand of the top requested. Due to their sizable share in many of the desired destinations, WN would be able to get feed on both ends. However, there is risk of cannabilizing their flights out of PHX.
 
mli717fan
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Mon Dec 05, 2011 4:30 pm

Quoting EricR (Reply 8):
2.) SY to MSP on a seasonal basis - a lot of seasonal visitors to Arizona are from the Upper Midwest

I could see that.

Quoting EricR (Reply 8):
3.) NK to LAX/ORD - fullfills the #2 and #5 most requested destinations.

I could also see that.

Quoting EricR (Reply 8):
4.) DL - yes, this one is a stretch. But it is interesting to note the following: DL has been expanding LAX (#2 requested destination), has a hub in MSP (#8 requested destination), has a hub in JFK (#9 requested destination), and the upper midwest (a DL stronghold) draws a lot of visitors to AZ.

This is an interesting one, I didn't even consider it. I think it's unlikely but plausable. DL serves secodary airports that some of the other (hub & spoke) majors don't, such as MDW, HOU, DAL, so it wouldn't be too different for them here... Also, G4 has picked up a lot of passengers flying to the Pheonix area from the upper midwest.
 
Coronado990
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Mon Dec 05, 2011 5:47 pm

What about F9? Seems like something they would do. DEN is #4 on EricR's list.
Uncle SAN at your service!
 
Pe@rson
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:12 pm

Here's their profile in The Route Shop: http://www.therouteshop.com/phoenix-mesa-airport/
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
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mariner
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:32 pm

Quoting Coronado990 (Reply 10):
What about F9? Seems like something they would do. DEN is #4 on EricR's list.

i've wondered about that. It would take some pressure away from the airline, not so much at DEN, but at other places.

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
dlramp4life
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Mon Dec 05, 2011 7:35 pm

Quoting EricR (Reply 8):
2.) SY to MSP on a seasonal basis - a lot of seasonal visitors to Arizona are from the Upper Midwest

SY all ready serves PHX and unless they are setting up a focus city at AZA which I do not think will happen. But I could be wrong

Quoting EricR (Reply 8):
4.) DL - yes, this one is a stretch. But it is interesting to note the following: DL has been expanding LAX (#2 requested destination), has a hub in MSP (#8 requested destination), has a hub in JFK (#9 requested destination), and the upper midwest (a DL stronghold) draws a lot of visitors to AZ.

It may be a stretch but it could work...DL runs connection flights to LAX, SLC, and mainline to MSP. In fact any airline that flies MSP from AZA will compete with G4 on the AZA-FAR route because most people on that flight are from MN
SEA Ramp, wettest place on earth
 
EricR
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Mon Dec 05, 2011 8:05 pm

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 11):

Here's their profile in The Route Shop: http://www.therouteshop.com/phoenix-...port/

We can check off LAS from the list. Service to LAS launched recently and has since been expanded. Also, depending on your viewpoint, you can place "half a check" next to SFO. Service to OAK was announced around the same time as LAS.

I completely forgot about the dedicated freighter service. I know they have been trying to lure cargo operators for a while now.

[Edited 2011-12-05 12:14:52]
 
93Sierra
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Mon Dec 05, 2011 8:23 pm

What about Horizon via Lax?
 
ridgid727
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Mon Dec 05, 2011 8:34 pm

If it isn't Vision or Spirt, maybe someone is trying to set something up like that retry with the Western Airlines name, and use Xtra Airways or something like that.
 
FWAERJ
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 12:50 am

Quoting EricR (Reply 14):
I completely forgot about the dedicated freighter service. I know they have been trying to lure cargo operators for a while now.

The announcement invitation specifically states new passenger service.

Quoting EricR (Reply 8):
I do not think it is a charter carrier because the press release states "a significant announcement regarding new passenger service". If charter service is defined as "significant announcement", then I would like to know how they define regularly scheduled service.

Airports have made "significant announcements" regarding public (scheduled) charters before. And IWA management only said "new passenger service", so it could very well be charters of some sort.
"Did he really need the triple bypass? Or was it the miles?"
 
flyboynk
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:29 am

NK's West Coast expansion in full swing... enjoy the "gateway" to the desert southwest and just like
IAG and PBG how many Canucks will drive the 25 miles or so further south  
Flyboynk
 
ridgid727
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 10:04 am

It is apparently NK that will be making the announcement. AZA is now a choice on their "Book Travel" list of cities at their reservation site, although there are no flights posted.
 
AWACSooner
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 12:29 pm

CONFIRMED by looking at their website:
Beginning 9 February...
LAS 2x daily
dep 1223 arr 1228
dep 2050 arr 2055

Fares showing $129 one-way...

Somehow, I think that G4 is gonna win this battle. They should've picked something like DFW or FLL to fly to instead of LAS.

[Edited 2011-12-06 04:31:36]
 
BD338
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:07 pm

Quoting AWACSooner (Reply 20):
CONFIRMED by looking at their website:
Beginning 9 February...
LAS 2x daily
dep 1223 arr 1228
dep 2050 arr 2055

Fares showing $129 one-way...


Seems expensive. i picked a couple of random mdweek days in March and WN was $59 - $136 OW from PHX and that includes a free carry on and a free checked bag. Alegiant started at $40 for the day i picked. Plus extras of course. $129 must be a dummy fare until the official announcement.
 
BA744PHX
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:08 pm

Also DFW-AZA is bookable starting March 23rd

1 daily
dep 12:45am arr 05:00am AZA-DFW

dep 10:55pm arr 11:10pm DFW-AZA
 
Pe@rson
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:20 pm

I wonder the cost differential (and any enticements) of serving AZA versus PHX given that NK serves LGA, DCA, LAX, SAN, ORD, DFW, DTW, etc. Unless it’s less about that and more about market opportunity, vis-à-vis a highly dominant WN at PHX, or infrastructure availability, e.g. gates.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
SurfandSnow
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:21 pm

Quoting flyboynk (Reply 18):
NK's West Coast expansion in full swing... enjoy the "gateway" to the desert southwest and just like
IAG and PBG how many Canucks will drive the 25 miles or so further south

Exactly! BLI and IWA/AZA have been heavily rumored additions from NK's booming LAS focus city for quite some time now. BLI captures both Seattle and Vancouver in one fell swoop, whilst IWA/AZA brings the major Phoenix market online for NK.

Sounds like IWA/AZA will see service from LAS as well as DFW. I wonder if they'd be willing to give LAX and ORD a try too?
Flying in the middle seat of coach is much better than not flying at all!
 
93Sierra
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 4:37 pm

What time is the announcement? Will NK fly a plane in for the press release?
 
Pe@rson
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 4:41 pm

Just rechecked its fares on AZA-LAS and AZA-DFW, and they're now appearing from $29 and $69 respectively.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
93Sierra
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Joined: Sat Apr 17, 2010 11:01 pm

RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 4:49 pm

I just tried to book gateway (Iwa aza ) to dfw and it stated service begins feb 9th 2012! Per their website...
Awesome news for gateway!
 
93Sierra
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 4:57 pm

Suggest we change the title of thread to confirmed..... Or start a new topic on the effect of NK at Iwa. Their are no jetways their and I am curious as to the height difference between a Md 80 and an Airbus. G4 uses those ramp things ( sorry don't know the official name ) and would want to know if NK will use them or bring in airstairs. Thanks!
 
skyharborshome
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 5:38 pm

I almost hate to bring this up (but I will anyway), however the Dallas option on NK is REALLY appealing. I usually fly WN (not a fan of US) but IWA is much closer than PHX and a non-stop to Dallas vs WN with Wright Amendment restrictions is a no-brainer. Especially at those fares. Wright is set to expire in what, 2013? So this could be a money maker for Spirit especially if they market it against Southwest.
Fly CHD!
 
ScottB
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 5:50 pm

Quoting skyharborshome (Reply 29):
the Dallas option on NK is REALLY appealing.

...if you don't mind a 12:45 AM departure and 5 AM arrival, 28" seating pitch, "passenger usage fees" of $17 each way, baggage fees for checked and carry-on bags, and any other fees Spirit might dream up.
 
midex461
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 5:51 pm

Quoting AWACSooner (Reply 20):
Somehow, I think that G4 is gonna win this battle.

I don't know that I'd give the battle to G4 just yet. G4 and NK are similar, but still radically different. NK is more of a "traditional" airline in that they offer connecting flights, have a frequent flier program, etc. G4, on the other hand, is more in the package deal business - they're more about bringing people from small towns into big tourist destinations and setting up vacation packages.

Quoting 93Sierra (Reply 28):
would want to know if NK will use them or bring in airstairs

Seeing as how the ramps can be used with a 319 (I know US uses them at BUR), I would think they will. Plus, I'm not sure you can use the stairs and comply with ACAA.
Opinions and views expressed are MINE and do NOT represent the views of US Airways
 
AWACSooner
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 6:14 pm

Quoting skyharborshome (Reply 29):
but IWA is much closer than PHX

Are you talking about distance to Phoenix? If so, I think you are mistaken...
 
EricR
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 6:48 pm

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 23):
I wonder the cost differential (and any enticements) of serving AZA versus PHX given that NK serves LGA, DCA, LAX, SAN, ORD, DFW, DTW, etc. Unless it’s less about that and more about market opportunity, vis-à-vis a highly dominant WN at PHX,

Combined, US & WN offer 22 daily N/S flights from PHX-LAS. I think NK saw a unique opportunity to serve the 1+ million people that live closer to IWA than PHX. I don't think NK would have succeeded on a PHX-LAS flight, but they have a much better chance of making this route work from IWA.

Quoting Pe@rson (Reply 23):
Unless it’s less about that and more about market opportunity, vis-à-vis a highly dominant WN at PHX, or infrastructure availability, e.g. gates.

PHX has several unused gates. However, IWA is gate constrainined at certain times of the day. Construction is under way to expand the terminal and add two gates, but it will not be completed until Novermber, 2012.

The interesting route is the DFW route. Fares from PHX-DFW tended to be on the higher side with only AA and US flying the route. It will be nice to see lower fares on this route.
 
 
skyharborshome
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 9:18 pm

Quoting AWACSooner (Reply 32):
Are you talking about distance to Phoenix? If so, I think you are mistaken...

Left out a few words. Meant closer to many people in the SE Valley which boasts a pretty large population.
Fly CHD!
 
B6JFKH81
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 9:34 pm

Looks like someone opened up a thread with the official announcement:

Spirit Announces IWA-FLL/DFW/LAS (by globalflyer Dec 6 2011 in Civil Aviation)
"If you do not learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it"
 
aztrainer
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 9:55 pm

It would be nice to go the six miles ot IWA than the 22 to PHX. Now I am waiting for the NIMBY to pop up and say the noise is killing their home values. They bought a house next to an old USAF base with three runways that is a dream for expansion.
 
dlramp4life
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 10:03 pm

I am happy for AZA, it was fun when I was working there watching the airport grow
SEA Ramp, wettest place on earth
 
Pe@rson
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RE: Second Airline Likely For IWA

Tue Dec 06, 2011 10:11 pm

I was just searching and found that if you purchase a round-trip of AZA-DFW-AZA, you can get it from $39.40 including taxes, fees, and its service fee. (Obviously any check-in luggage or carry-on baggage that doesn't it beneath the seat in front would be extra.)
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."